Which rifle for me?

[ATC]

Spend my money for me if you will

I am new to the "long" range shooting....and I'm sure you guys are tired of us FNG's asking these questions over and over. The more I search and research rifles...the more options come up and the more confused I become!

It's hard to get much past 300yds here in the hills. The range I go to goes out to 250yds, so this will be 90% of my shooting. I have access to a 350-400yd field at a friends dads house...but it's rare I ever end up there to shoot.
Right now, I have a Savage 111LRH in 300WM with a Nikon Buckmaster 6-18x40 on it. I've only had it out once so far, and I am not impressed with it. After fixing a couple things (stock touching barrel, improperly torqued action screws), I am hoping that it changes for the better the next time out.

I have a little bit of money coming my way in a couple weeks, and have been wanting a smaller caliber to play with. That 300WM is not ideal for long range days
I will not be hunting with it. I will not be shooting competitions with it. Just me shooting paper and steel for fun.

On calibers, I'm thinking:
1) .260 Rem
2) .223
3) .243
4) .308 (maybe)

My price range is up to $800 for the rifle only.

Some I have looked at are (in no order):

-Rem 700 SPS .260
-Rem 700 VTR .223
-Savage 11BTH .223/.243
-Savage 25 Lightweight Varminter-T .223
-Savage 12 Long Range Precision .243/.260
I briefly glanced at the Tikka's...haven't checked on pricing or seen all their models yet.

I know the 12LRP is a little overbudget...but damn it's a sexy gun, and I've heard lots of good about it. And with the HS Precision stock...I'd already be ahead of the others.
I'm not looking to shoot dimes at 200yds...but at least MOA or a little better.

My buddy has a full reloading setup, so all I have to do is buy the bullets/powder/primers. He already has .223 and .243 dies.

So what are your thoughts?

 

[sib1948]

It sounds like in your situation, I'd go with a .223 for costs savings and ammo availability even if you're doing your own reloading! 243 or 260 are good for more than 1000 yards and are great rounds, but short barrel life on the 243.

 

[dsnipe]

Savage LRP all day out of that list. In 260 flavor. 260 you can shoot short range and then as you get better you can stretch it on out. And with the savage if you get a good one, it will out shoot you. Plus you have the option if you desire to switch calibers down the road just buy a new barrel and get with it. And the target accutrigger on the LRP is a great trigger and can be adjusted pretty low. Just my 3 cents. Best of luck bro.

 

[JJones75]

I'd spend that $800 on a new quality barrel and bolt head. You would have to single shot the rifle but for target work so what.
Chamber the new barrel for 223.
You will be able to use a gun that is the same fit and optic as your hunting rifle , this will help make you more proficient with you're hunting rifle.

 

[mxracer]

Just my .02 but take a look at the Savage 10 series. Most are available in .223 or .308 (and some in other calibers). I personally have the 10 Precision Carbine in .308 and it's been a great gun so far. Sub-Moa out of the box when I do my part.

 

[HOGTOOTH5R]

Since you're new at this I would assume that you're not reloading yet (But You Will Soon) lol. If that's the case I would not go the .260 Rem route as the Factory Match Ammo are EXPENSIVE and reloading is a bid more of a chore if you don't have .260 Rem brass to start with.

I would go with either a .308 or .243 depending on the distance you'll be shooting. 175 Gr Match ammo can get you out 1,000 yards no problems. .243/6mm Has Great Potential but you'll need to reload to take advantage of the Match Grade Bullets as the factory match ammos are very limited.

If you want a fun and accurate .223 then I suggest you build a SemiAuto SPR style AR15 in the .223 Wylde Chambering. It'll be a lot more fun and pratical for a .223.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I'd go with 223 as well, there's no reason to burn the barrel on a 243 or 260 for the short distances you're shooting. 308 has better barrel life but it's way more than is needed for your shooting. 223 will get you great barrel life, low recoil, and cheaper ammo.

 

[ATC]

Since you're new at this I would assume that you're not reloading yet (But You Will Soon) lol. If that's the case I would not go the .260 Rem route as the Factory Match Ammo are EXPENSIVE and reloading is a bid more of a chore if you don't have .260 Rem brass to start with.

I would go with either a .308 or .243 depending on the distance you'll be shooting. 175 Gr Match ammo can get you out 1,000 yards no problems. .243/6mm Has Great Potential but you'll need to reload to take advantage of the Match Grade Bullets as the factory match ammos are very limited.

If you want a fun and accurate .223 then I suggest you build a SemiAuto SPR style AR15 in the .223 Wylde Chambering. It'll be a lot more fun and pratical for a .223.

I am reloading using my buddies equipment. I'll have no problem working up a load for whatever I get.
And I do have a Rock River AR15 style "Coyote Rifle" they call it in .223 Wylde. I threw a Nikon M223 4-12x40 on it. Haven't taken it out yet.

So far, I am definately looking at .223 as my first choice. Barrel life doesn't concern me much, as I don't shoot near enough to worry about it. I've had a BCM AR15 for 3-4 years now and have under 500rds through it. I might only shoot a few hundred rounds through this new bolt gun a year.

Just my .02 but take a look at the Savage 10 series. Most are available in .223 or .308 (and some in other calibers). I personally have the 10 Precision Carbine in .308 and it's been a great gun so far. Sub-Moa out of the box when I do my part.

Very nice...I don't see how I missed the 10 Precision. Thanks.

So far I think I'm leaning towards the 10PC and the 12LRP I guess

 

[redneckbmxer24]

And I do have a Rock River AR15 style "Coyote Rifle" they call it in .223 Wylde. I threw a Nikon M223 4-12x40 on it. Haven't taken it out yet.

Why not spend the money you were going to spend on another rifle setup and invest in a better scope and ammo for that rifle? That rifle is more than capable of what you want to do. You also said you don't shoot much, this would allow more ammo for range time.

 

[tanda10506]

For what you want to do I would go .223. You could get a Rem 700 SPS Tactical in .223 for under $800, it would be easy to carry in the hills (20" barrel), pretty accurate for the ranges you want to shoot at, and will look pretty cool (come on, it matters a little bit). Long barrel life, cheap to reload and fairly cheap to buy off the shelf compared to larger calibers.

If you ever did want to hunt with it or take it out to further distances, that Savage LRP in .260 would be a good choice, and as you mentioned, you wouldn't need to change your stock or bolt. It's more gun for the money, but if your planning on sticking strictly to paper with this one then you might as well save the money for your glass and go with the .223.

 

[ATC]

Why not spend the money you were going to spend on another rifle setup and invest in a better scope and ammo for that rifle? That rifle is more than capable of what you want to do. You also said you don't shoot much, this would allow more ammo for range time.

I just bought that scope for it 2-3 weeks ago after hearing nothing but good about it. I do agree that your idea would be a good option, but I've got plenty of semi-autos, and only 2 bolt guns (one being a .22). I am wanting to expand into the bolt-gun scene a little.

Honestly, I think I made a mistake buying the 111LRH last year. I was planning on joining a club with a 500yd range, and at the time my buddy had a 7mm mag he was gonna be shooting...so I jumped on the big-boy gun bandwagon. Well he no longer has the 7mm and I am not a member if that club

I've got half a mind to sell the 111LRH and invest that into the new gun & glass of my choice.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Nikons are ok scopes but nothing to write home about and will not hold up to running the knobs for long. You've got a rifle perfectly capable of doing what you want and that scope would suffice for a bit.

I had a LRH 7mm mag and it didn't shoot for crap (5MOA). I bought it shortly after they came out and that was my last savage. If you've only got two bolt guns why not sell it and buy a target/hunting rifle in 308, something like a 20" heavy barrel? Then set up your AR for short range (what you're talking about here) target work.

If you've got this rifle you've never shot and other guns you say you rarely get to shoot it sounds to me like you need to get out and shoot more and not play musical guns. My guess is if you shot your rock river you probably wouldn't have posted this thread.

 

[ATC]

For what you want to do I would go .223. You could get a Rem 700 SPS Tactical in .223 for under $800, it would be easy to carry in the hills (20" barrel), pretty accurate for the ranges you want to shoot at, and will look pretty cool (come on, it matters a little bit). Long barrel life, cheap to reload and fairly cheap to buy off the shelf compared to larger calibers.

If you ever did want to hunt with it or take it out to further distances, that Savage LRP in .260 would be a good choice, and as you mentioned, you wouldn't need to change your stock or bolt. It's more gun for the money, but if your planning on sticking strictly to paper with this one then you might as well save the money for your glass and go with the .223.

Funny you should mention the SPS Tactical. My buddy has been eyeing one for a few months now. I can't steal his glory by getting it out from under him! Haha

I don't hunt, so there is no concern there. I don't carry it around the woods or anything...so weight and barrel length don't matter to me.

 

[Randoman5]

With what you have and what you're doing I'd recommend getting a real long range scope and sticking it on your AR. It's more than capable of shooting the distances you're planning to shoot and getting a quality scope with matching reticle and turrets that tracks well would be more beneficial to learning how to shoot longer ranges than getting another rifle and sticking another hunting scope on it.

 

[BillCh]

I say go with the LRP. Of course, I'm biased.
I've got the stainless version of that same receiver. The old LRPV repeater. The LRP is the best one Savage has to offer IMHO.
It currently has a 223AI barrel on it now but I can swap out with my 260AI barrel.

B

 

[ATC]

Nikons are ok scopes but nothing to write home about and will not hold up to running the knobs for long. You've got a rifle perfectly capable of doing what you want and that scope would suffice for a bit.

I had a LRH 7mm mag and it didn't shoot for crap (5MOA). I bought it shortly after they came out and that was my last savage. If you've only got two bolt guns why not sell it and buy a target/hunting rifle in 308, something like a 20" heavy barrel? Then set up your AR for short range (what you're talking about here) target work.

If you've got this rifle you've never shot and other guns you say you rarely get to shoot it sounds to me like you need to get out and shoot more and not play musical guns. My guess is if you shot your rock river you probably wouldn't have posted this thread.

I can't afford $600-$4000 scopes like some. I don't think I understand the whole scope thing yet. As long as the scope doesn't lose zero, all you're paying for is either more zoom, clearer glass, and maybe some durability for the bigger calibers? I certainly don't trust the cheaper, sub-$350 ones, but I'm at a loss as to why I would need a $800+ scope for 300yd shooting? If I had a 600+ yard range to go...my opinion might change.

I agree with setting up my AR for short range...but I still would like a nice bolt gun to play with. My LRH is shooting like yours. I've got some Hornady SST's, and some handloads to try. If they don't work for me with the fixes I've done so far, I'm getting rid of it.

And the reason I rarely got out to shoot is that I've never really had a place to do it. The closest public range (100yds) was an hour drive away. I used to go quite a bit, but after being swept by loaded guns every time I looked down the line, I stopped going. I live in the woods, so not much backyard shooting other than some pistol and .22's. I get my pistols out a lot though. Shot friendly competitions with a group of friends every weekend for 6 months last year. And most of the private ranges were either too far away or too expensive, and nothing past 200yds except for one range. My buddy just got a membership at the Izaak Walton range this year, so we finally have somewhere to go that's only 20 minutes away. I am going to join next year.

The reason it took me a year to shoot either my AR or the LRH...is that I didn't have the funds for optics. I have another, more expensive hobby I bounce back and forth with...

 

[ATC]

Crappy phone pic the day I put the scope on...

 

[redneckbmxer24]

If you can afford to have a rifle you don't shoot (LRH) laying around and another rifle setup that will run you at least $1k with cheap glass then you can afford a good optic. There's much more to a scope than just holding zero and pretty glass. A quality scope has the features that's optimal for the type of shooting that's being done and is reliable. You can get a good optic for under $1k.

 

[ATC]

If you can afford to have a rifle you don't shoot (LRH) laying around and another rifle setup that will run you at least $1k with cheap glass then you can afford a good optic. There's much more to a scope than just holding zero and pretty glass. A quality scope has the features that's optimal for the type of shooting that's being done and is reliable. You can get a good optic for under $1k.

Ah....well once I figure out which rifle I want I'm sure I'll be spending day after day on here trying to figure out a scope for it too. I'll certainly take your advice this time

 

[ATC]

Well, I've got my choice narrowed down to two.

Savage 12 VLP DBM
Savage 10 Precision Carbine

.308 is my choice now....most likely going with the VLP

I'm not looking anymore! Every time I do I go back and forth and change my mind every couple hours....

 

[alman1531]

Just curious as to why you crossed out the Rem 700? The aftermarket parts support for future upgrades is much better with the 700 because it has been around forever. The Savage parts are becoming a little more common place in recent years though. Back the the caliber, If you are not shooting past 400 yards per your original post; then .223 would be just fine for you. .308 is also great and you can go out to 1000 yards if you get a chance at that range. I know what it is like going back and forth on a possible buy.

 

[Onewolf42]

If you can afford to have a rifle you don't shoot (LRH) laying around and another rifle setup that will run you at least $1k with cheap glass then you can afford a good optic. There's much more to a scope than just holding zero and pretty glass. A quality scope has the features that's optimal for the type of shooting that's being done and is reliable. You can get a good optic for under $1k.

Like a Bushnell Elite 3200 10X for $200 or an SWFA 10X/12X for $300. Good way to get started in LR shooting 'on a budget'.

 

[Jack The Ripper]

I'd go with a 223 for those ranges. You could have some fun with it on the windy days when your wanting a little challenge. Check out the Savage 10. It's a little under your target price and is a awesome rifle. I grabbed one to be a dedicated predator gun and now it's a everything gun. 69 SMK with varget under it is giving me .22 moa groups at 550 yds. I've went to 700 yds with it but I'm holding on top of the target (I don't have a rail). I want to put one on it someday and go for 1k.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

Just my .02 but take a look at the Savage 10 series. Most are available in .223 or .308 (and some in other calibers). I personally have the 10 Precision Carbine in .308 and it's been a great gun so far. Sub-Moa out of the box when I do my part.

I agree. I don't own one but have shot more than a few. Very accurate with a good trigger out of the box. They also have box mags and come threaded. Go with .308 or .223. Those are the only 2 calibers you can find anywhere. I would stay away from .260 or 6.5. Just my advice.

 

[Cold_Bore_88]

For the price range you are look for, get a Vortex scope. Great scopes for the money. Value wise, they are on of the best. Are there better scopes out there? Of course. But as you said you dont want to spend a lot. I have upgraded since but I still have a vortex on my Sig 716. TOok her out this past weekend and shot 2 groups, 1/2" and 5/8" APPROX. YOu dont need a Nightforce or S&B for what you want to do.

 

[ATC]

Just curious as to why you crossed out the Rem 700? The aftermarket parts support for future upgrades is much better with the 700 because it has been around forever. The Savage parts are becoming a little more common place in recent years though. Back the the caliber, If you are not shooting past 400 yards per your original post; then .223 would be just fine for you. .308 is also great and you can go out to 1000 yards if you get a chance at that range. I know what it is like going back and forth on a possible buy.

Other than the SPS Tactical, I didn't see much in the way of heavy-barreled target guns that I cared for. My friend has been drooling over one for months now, so I'll leave it for him. He's in the process of selling a vehicle to get one as I type..Haha

As far as the 700's action, I do agree they are the equivalent of an AR15 in regards to what you can do to one.

 

[Zuul]

Other than the SPS Tactical, I didn't see much in the way of heavy-barreled target guns that I cared for. My friend has been drooling over one for months now, so I'll leave it for him. He's in the process of selling a vehicle to get one as I type..Haha

As far as the 700's action, I do agree they are the equivalent of an AR15 in regards to what you can do to one.

Get the 700 SPS and Krylon it, that way you both can have one. I have a 308 and 300 WM but bought the 700 SPS in .223 to work on the basics. It's cheap to shoot, I'm not "wasting" shots at the short local range (200 yds), it's easy to see shot impacts through the scope, and I can send rounds down range all day without blowing my shoulder out. You should be able to find a lightly used one in the $500 range, get a decent base/rings ($150), bipod ($100), and a SWFA 10 or 12x scope for $299. That will get you a great set up for around 1K, and you can always upgrade the stock/optics as funds allow. I would also look into getting a Lee single stage reloading press kit, tweaking loads for your gun will really help in the accuracy department.

Hell, if you can find a SPS barreled action I'll offer to save you a few bucks by sending you my factory take off stock and bottom metal, taken off of my gun as soon as I got it to upgrade to an AICS. Cover the shipping and it's yours.

 

[ATC]

Like a Bushnell Elite 3200 10X for $200 or an SWFA 10X/12X for $300. Good way to get started in LR shooting 'on a budget'.

For the price range you are look for, get a Vortex scope. Great scopes for the money. Value wise, they are on of the best. Are there better scopes out there? Of course. But as you said you dont want to spend a lot. I have upgraded since but I still have a vortex on my Sig 716. TOok her out this past weekend and shot 2 groups, 1/2" and 5/8" APPROX. YOu dont need a Nightforce or S&B for what you want to do.

I will definitely look into them. I hear a lot about the Vortex scopes here and on Arfcom.

 

[ATC]

Get the 700 SPS and Krylon it, that way you both can have one. I have a 308 and 300 WM but bought the 700 SPS in .223 to work on the basics. It's cheap to shoot, I'm not "wasting" shots at the short local range (200 yds), it's easy to see shot impacts through the scope, and I can send rounds down range all day without blowing my shoulder out. You should be able to find a lightly used one in the $500 range, get a decent base/rings ($150), bipod ($100), and a SWFA 10 or 12x scope for $299. That will get you a great set up for around 1K, and you can always upgrade the stock/optics as funds allow. I would also look into getting a Lee single stage reloading press kit, tweaking loads for your gun will really help in the accuracy department.

Hell, if you can find a SPS barreled action I'll offer to save you a few bucks by sending you my factory take off stock and bottom metal, taken off of my gun as soon as I got it to upgrade to an AICS. Cover the shipping and it's yours.

Is now a bad time to tell you that I really don't like painted guns? LOL I'll think on it some.
I really would like to get into the reloading side of things myself. I've been helping my buddy load for the past couple years whenever I get the chance. He's got 4 presses (one a Lee Loadmaster) and casts his own pistol bullets.
Once the sting from the gun/scope purchase wears off...I might look into it harder. I love doing it, and this way, I wouldn't have to work up loads for my guns on his time and equipment...
And thank you for your offer. I'll keep you in mind

 

[samnev]

My rifle for use in the ranges the OP mentions is a 223 PSS. For longer ranges my TRG or AIAW both in 308.

 

[ATC]

A little off topic, but I went to the range today and took the 111LRH out. Since last time, I double checked scope mounting, free floated the barrel, and torqued action screws. It could barely stay on a 12x12 target at 100yds.

I've tried Federal 150gr, Hornady 165gr BTSP, Hornady Superformance 180gr SST, and some handloads. The handloads were too hot. I started with 66.9gr of IMR 4831 under a Nosler 180gr ballistic (I don't have them in front of me), and Winchester primers. I had to hammer on the bolt handle with my fist to get it out.

It's for sale. I'm done with it. Money will go towards a scope.

 

[ATC]

My shooting buddy made the plunge and bought the Rem 700 Tactical AAC-SD .308 today.
I think I've settled on the Savage 10PC in .308. I'd like to find a store that has one I can fondle first.

 

[ATC]

I jumped in and ordered the Savage 12 VLP DBM in .308. I can't wait 'til it shows up!