Who DOES NOT clean the copper out of the bore?

[Shooter0311]

If you are talking purely about getting the best accuracy I wouldn't mix jacket types in the bore without a cleaning, nor would I shoot different powders without a cleaning. That said, my accuracy demands are not so rigid that I need worry about those things.

In what situation? Having never 'cut the pie' or crossed a 'fatal funnel'? I can show you how to do it in ten minutes; and then you've done it. The fact that there was never a real person in the room while you did it makes no difference.

That was merely an example. We are off topic and I don't wish to argue. Suffice to say, a 10 minute school circle with a guy (NOT YOU) who has never been in a gunfight means diddly in your percentage chance of living through CQB with a trained/armed enemy. Lots of folks have spilled a lot more blood and have the experence and know how where some of these guys market training for being a "gunfighter" when they themselves don't even know what they would do in said situation because they have never been on a 2 way range.
I am not speaking of Tubbs or Hodnett here. A lot of these guys making big bucks off "gunfighter" schools are questionable at best. I have even worked with some more experienced folks that a simple arty sim, IED sim and mini bang really wreaks havoc just adding a little chaos. Again, it has not a thing to do with you Graham, just a little venting on swollen marketing.

 

[jcrist]

On a different application, high power competition. One of our High Master shooters who shot for the AMU when he was younger, installed a new Krieger barrel in his AR service rifle. He wanted to see at what point would the rifle quit shooting, he shot the rifle in competition and in practice till the rifle did not go bang. The rifle lasted 3700 rounds with no cleaning. He thoroughly cleaned the rifle and shot it again without cleaning any thing, including the BCG. At out state service rifle championship his rifle did not go bang during the standing stage. He took out the BCG, oiled and freed the firing pin, barrel was not cleaned and finished the stage. This time the rifle lasted 3500. The rifle went through 7200 rounds and I would say with no degradation in accuracy - the shooter won the 600 yard event over a field of a few HMs among the 90+ shooters. His X count at 600 was still over 50%.

A few more matches after the state match the barrel gave up. He replaced it and went back to his normal cleaning routine after each 80 shot match. His new barrel did not last any longer than the one that was cleaned twice, when new and after 3700.


nez rongero

Wow
So where do you guys put this post? I don't remember seeing a "completely off-topic and not related to the OP's question but wanted to post anyway and say AMU."

 

[81STFACP]

Wow
So where do you guys put this post? I don't remember seeing a "completely off-topic and not related to the OP's question but wanted to post anyway and say AMU."

The topic is about cleaning the copper out. One crazy guy in our group decided to push the limit of barrel cleaning - in this case not cleaning. Lighten up, junior.

 

[ronnl001]

I do not use a copper solvent on any of my rifles. With respect to carbon cleaning, the rifles vary in what they like. My KAC MK11 runs best about 10-15 rounds into a clean bore. My precision AR (20" ss barrel with a 556 chamber and fairly high round count) will see groups totally fall apart for almost a hundred rounds after cleaning. I just verified this -- it went from a .6 MOA 5-shot group with Norma match to a 1.4 MOA group with the same ammo in better conditions after cleaning. Other loads showed a similar degradation, so I'm going to run some speed drills with it to get it dirty again now.