.223 - 5.56
- Thread starter Two Shoes
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Hornady .224 FMJ-BT 55gr. How bad can it be?
Has anyone used the FMJ-BT 55gr bullets in their bolt guns? I know the store bought ammo gives around >1 MOA. What sort of grouping/precision do you get when fired from a 1:8" twist barrel? What does the grouping look like when proper load development has been done?
I'm trying to figure out if it is worth it to buy.
Has anyone used the FMJ-BT 55gr bullets in their bolt guns? I know the store bought ammo gives around >1 MOA. What sort of grouping/precision do you get when fired from a 1:8" twist barrel? What does the grouping look like when proper load development has been done?
I'm trying to figure out if it is worth it to buy.
My personal opinion is you are wasting powder, primers and time trying to get 55g Hornady bullets to preform.
Many better choices.
I get them as gifts sometimes.
I will use them to expand some pre conditioned brass I have that is below my shoulder requirements.
Many better choices.
I get them as gifts sometimes.
I will use them to expand some pre conditioned brass I have that is below my shoulder requirements.
Get 100 and see what you can do. I had a gun with a Bartlien shoot 55gr winchester xm195 really well.
H335 has produced .5 moa and occasionally 3/8 moa with 52g, and 55g but when I tried 69g bullets groups hovered around 1 moa.
That's in a heavy 20 inch 1/8 t barrel.
Just a reference point.
If it doesn't like the 62g you can use it on the lighter bullets, has been a standard for years that took me a while to realise.
It just doesn't get much hype these days . Meters very well.
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5.56 AR Only Loads
Post your 5.56 AR Loads here Ill Start off 23.6gr 8208XBR 77 SMK 1xLC Brass 205M 2710 20" WOA
www.snipershide.com
Reloading Equipment - Lapua 223 Brass 1x Fired - 500 pieces
Just like title says 500 pieces of 1x fired lapua 223 Remington brass available. Fired out of proof prefit 223 Remington barrel 500 pieces for $380 shipped
www.snipershide.com
Thinking about a bolt action 26” 223 wylde chamber and Berger 85.5gr hybrids, anyone played with this bullet on a 223?
Too heavy IMHO. 85.5 are perfect in 22BR. Can't get enough powder in a 223 case with 85.5
Cool, I have a spare action ( would need a 223 bolt), trigger, scope, manners stock, will just need to get a barrel. I shoot lots of 223/556 ammo in my ARs so I have brass. Thinking it would be a great lite rifle. Thanks
I have shot a lot of 85.5s. 2900 will be the ragged edge of pressure with Varget, 2850 is realistic with 26+" barrel. Make sure you throat the chamber long enough to get the boat tail above the neck shoulder junction. A chamber for 90gr bullets should be fine. It's a fine bullet and you can shoot it a long way. Still a 223.
2900 with a 85.5 in a 223 Wylde chamber with Varget is hot and down in the case.
2900 is max speed in 10+ 223 Wylde barrels of mine with an 80 VLD or 80 SMK or 80 ELD with Varget. More than that and I have pressure signs. Also running into max case capacity issues with no more room for varget in the case at 2900 without compressed loads which is why pressure shows.
Now, with a much longer freebore you could probably get there, but not with a 223 Wylde....
With a Wylde chamber I'd agree but he specifically say "Make sure you throat the chamber long enough to get the boat tail above the neck shoulder junction." If the OP is looking to run only 80gr+ bullets I'd recommend a chamber with the Manson 223 T15 fullbore reamer.
Yeah, the barrel is a 26 HV and will have a .080FB. In all honesty not sure what the Wylde FB is. I asked the him for a wylde he asked what bullets and I told him and he put this in( I know stupid).
Nice ! Wylde is 0.62" FB. 0.080 is what my 223 custom match reamer is and it's perfect for 80 smk, and other 80gr pills
Sorry definitely not a wylde shouldve clarified. Think it's .169 freebore.
I shoot the 75g ELDMs at 3000 with 24.7g N540 from a R700 223 Wylde with around an extra .020" FB from a 28" 8 twist bartlein. Shoots 3/4 to 1 MOA out to 1K, prone with a bipod and rear bag easy.
Is N540 roughly the varget equivalent ? I'm about out of varget and my recent experience with Vihtavouri powder in a 300winmag has me wanting to try it in my 223/308, and I'm thinking about adding a 6bra to the mix. One powder for all of them would be nice.
N140 & N150 are very close to Varget depending on the cartridge its used in. I've had good luck with N150 and 85.5 & 88 grain bullets but you'll likely run out of room if you are looking for max velocity, N140 may be the better fit for speed. I haven't used any of the N5xx series high energy powders.
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N540 is quite a bit slower than varget actually, and it's a high energy double base powder. Like was mentioned, N140/150 are close to Varget.
I've never played with any Vihta powders in my 25 years of handloading until a few months ago. And that's only because for some odd reason, it's been readily available, and cheaper than anything else.
I was going to shoot H4895 in the 223, but you can't find it for years now. I also didn't entertain the idea of Varget, since that's what everyone uses in the 223/6 BR/308s. So that's what led me to N540 after looking at Vihtas data and QL data. It gets me 3050-3075fps at the top end from the 28" Bartlein. But I did drop down to 2975-3000fps just to be safe, since we have triple digit summer's, and be a little easier on the Lapua brass.
Here it is with the new to me S&B PMII 12-50x56 p4f-moa
I've never played with any Vihta powders in my 25 years of handloading until a few months ago. And that's only because for some odd reason, it's been readily available, and cheaper than anything else.
I was going to shoot H4895 in the 223, but you can't find it for years now. I also didn't entertain the idea of Varget, since that's what everyone uses in the 223/6 BR/308s. So that's what led me to N540 after looking at Vihtas data and QL data. It gets me 3050-3075fps at the top end from the 28" Bartlein. But I did drop down to 2975-3000fps just to be safe, since we have triple digit summer's, and be a little easier on the Lapua brass.
Here it is with the new to me S&B PMII 12-50x56 p4f-moa
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By the time I got to that box I was just shooting at steel. An moa plate at 500 yards wasn't a problem. Seemed to shoot a good group on steel at 600. Next time I go out I'll try them on paper at 100 and compare to the other loads.
I seat the 77 SMKs to 1.950 CBTO. According to my novice work with the Hornady tool.. "jam" at ~ 2.035...but other times it reads "jam" at ~1.96-1.99
Hi all, I'm going to be making up some reloads for a .223 bolt gun (.223 Wylde chamber) I bought used in the marketplace a few months ago.
I just want to get a reality check to make sure I'm not doing anything grossly wrong.
My experience is that I've been reloading pistol for about 20 years on Dillon 550s and 650s.
I've been making .223 on my 650 to AR magazine length using COALs out of reloading manuals for roughly 10 years.
I've reloaded .308 to very high precision but honestly, I seem to have gotten lucky. Ha.
This is my first time making a precision .223 load.
This is where I am and this is my logic. Any and all input is appreciated.
I put a 75 gr A-max in a sized and trimmed case and ran it into the lands.
The round measured 2.429 COAL.
.062" seems to be a freebore that several people in this thread have said they use. So if we subtract .062 we get a COAL of 2.367.
As far as powder, I have Varget and Tac available. I've had great luck with TAC and will make my first loads with this.
Hodgedon's website shows this
So for powder, I figure I'll start out at the 21.7 grain starting load. Although pressures will be lower than normal because my COAL at 2.367 is substantially longer than their COAL of 2.260
As an aside, I've made up some dummy rounds at both the 2.429 and 2.367 COAL and they fed fine from my MDT mag.
I completely understand that optimizing things will involve adjustments to COAL, powder type, and powder quantity. I'm just interested in a starting point that is safe and reasonably accurate.
Thank you in advance for your thoughts.
Don
I just want to get a reality check to make sure I'm not doing anything grossly wrong.
My experience is that I've been reloading pistol for about 20 years on Dillon 550s and 650s.
I've been making .223 on my 650 to AR magazine length using COALs out of reloading manuals for roughly 10 years.
I've reloaded .308 to very high precision but honestly, I seem to have gotten lucky. Ha.
This is my first time making a precision .223 load.
This is where I am and this is my logic. Any and all input is appreciated.
I put a 75 gr A-max in a sized and trimmed case and ran it into the lands.
The round measured 2.429 COAL.
.062" seems to be a freebore that several people in this thread have said they use. So if we subtract .062 we get a COAL of 2.367.
As far as powder, I have Varget and Tac available. I've had great luck with TAC and will make my first loads with this.
Hodgedon's website shows this
So for powder, I figure I'll start out at the 21.7 grain starting load. Although pressures will be lower than normal because my COAL at 2.367 is substantially longer than their COAL of 2.260
As an aside, I've made up some dummy rounds at both the 2.429 and 2.367 COAL and they fed fine from my MDT mag.
I completely understand that optimizing things will involve adjustments to COAL, powder type, and powder quantity. I'm just interested in a starting point that is safe and reasonably accurate.
Thank you in advance for your thoughts.
Don
Freebore and jump to lands are two different things. Freebore is a single dimension of a chamber. Distance to lands is impacted by freebore diameter, freebore length and leade angle.
That load data is probably for a 223 chamber and 223 SAAMI pressure. 223 Wylde will build pressure slower than a 223 rem. Also, 75 amax and 75 bthp aint the same and will build pressure a little differently.
More pointedly - i wouldn't start at 21.7 if you care at all about velocity. I probably wouldn't start any lower than 23.0 but I have a decent feel for the factors and risk involved. Follow the manual if that is what you do to be safe.
Before i start please remember I have been out of the reloading game for 21 years, just getting back into it. I thought that you measured the length of the round that touches the lands and then back off somewhere around .020 (variable based on what the bullet likes to jump). Is this not the way, I did not think you subtracted the Freebore.
@dcmdon
The 75 Amax is a good bullet. I would figure out where the lands are and come back .010". That has been a good starting point for me when I shot them years ago.
For the powder charge, I would use the 75 GR. JLK VLD data as it more resembles the the 75 Amax.
The 75 Amax is a good bullet. I would figure out where the lands are and come back .010". That has been a good starting point for me when I shot them years ago.
For the powder charge, I would use the 75 GR. JLK VLD data as it more resembles the the 75 Amax.
You are 100% correct.
I didn't know that the term freebore referenced a chamber dimension. I thought it was another term for "jump" or how far back from the lands the bullet is set.
Because of my ignorance (it's not an insult. Ignorance is curable and I'm on the right path) my rounds had excessive "jump" of .062" rather than something around .010"
The funny thing is that my round is still far longer than SAAMI spec. So with that in mind, I headed off to the range with my out of spec rounds. I didn't realize that I was wrong about freebore vs jump until shortly before I went to the range. So I just ran with what I had.
I was very pleased. Since this is a new to me gun with a new scope and new stock, I started at 50 to sight it in.
This is my first and only 3 shot group at 50
So I moved out to 100 yards and shot one more group. This was the result.
So far so good. So I moved out to 300 yards.
At 300 I switched to 5 shot groups.
My groups at 300 ran from a bit under 2" to 3". All of the 3" groups were the result of a called flyer (or two).
Sorry, no pics, the guys next to me were shooting and I didn't want to ask to have the range go cold so I could just retrieve my targets.
I was very very pleased. This was my first time shooting a barreled action I purchased at the beginning of the summer for a very very good price. As a Left Handed shooter, I don't have many factory options configured how I wanted, and I was putting off buying a custom gun because of the cost. So this is really fantastic. I've got a GRAIL quality gun (Bighorn action, Bartlein barrel) for the cost of a factory gun. I don't normally get this lucky. ha. Christmas in September.
I'm going to disassemble the rest of the rounds I made up with a .62" jump and reload them with more powder and a longer COAL and see how things go next week.
Thank you all for your assistance here. I've been shooting and reloading for years. The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know. Ha.
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That was ignorance on my part. See above post. Thank you for the correction.
Thank you.
I was given 800 of these bullets by someone who bought them to use in his AR and then found that they didn't really like to be loaded to AR magazine length.
Based on today's results, I'm going to make some common sense changes to try to wring out some more accuracy. Obviously, this was a starting powder charge. Today's rounds
1. Were too short.
2. Were mixed brass
3. Were loaded on a Dillon 550 using the Dillon powder drop
4) Were loaded with Dillon dies
I'll gather up some same year Lake City brass, size it, trim it, uniform the flash hole and measure each charge for next week and see how it goes.
Does anyone have recommendations for match dies?
I've used both Redding and Hornady micrometer seating dies and don't really have an opinion on them.
By the way. I'm not crimping. Just using neck tension.
In the past I've spun down the expander ball by a couple of thousandths to provide for more neck tension (that is how my Dillon sizing die is set up).
Is this a good thing to continue, or should I crimp? Ammo will be used in a bolt gun only.
I've used both Redding and Hornady micrometer seating dies and don't really have an opinion on them.
By the way. I'm not crimping. Just using neck tension.
In the past I've spun down the expander ball by a couple of thousandths to provide for more neck tension (that is how my Dillon sizing die is set up).
Is this a good thing to continue, or should I crimp? Ammo will be used in a bolt gun only.
Looking at your groups, the dies you are using are not holding you back. If you were seeing the occasional flyer, I would adjust neck tension, but make sure it is the ammo and not the gun, shooter, or wind.
Wind can be a factor at any distance, but even more so when you go past 100 yards. Learning to read wind can really help you.
I do not crimp bolt gun ammo.
Wind can be a factor at any distance, but even more so when you go past 100 yards. Learning to read wind can really help you.
I do not crimp bolt gun ammo.
