So, the co-pilot moved the T handle to the up position instead of the one shaped like a little wheel/tire...
Basic position and feel should tell a blind man if he's got the correct handle...
Boeing down in India
- Thread starter Mr.BR
- Start date
So, the co-pilot moved the T handle to the up position instead of the one shaped like a little wheel/tire...
Basic position and feel should tell a blind man if he's got the correct handle...
There is a sump drain on the lowest point of each fuel tank. After refueling, the ground crew is supposed to do a sump check.
Typically, using a quart bottle on the drain tool, you'll get only a couple of tablespoons of water.
Actual contaminated fuel is super unlikely due to all of the pre-filtering in the distribution system.
Small amounts of water will just burn right off. The reason to remove any H2O is actually to prevent mold growth in the fuel tanks.
I have probably that many hours fixing that fucked up system.
I did love watching them take off. You could see exactly when the water ran out. The plane would drop a visible amount and then the engine exhaust would be visible.
I was sitting up front with the crew on a departure from Fallon NAS.
White top, tail number 0262, fully loaded. Water tank topped off to overflow, and an outside temp near 100°.
We used every bit of that runway getting off the ground.
I guess all of our R models were busy doing R model things that day.
I never understood why certain crews would start the pumps before making the turn.
Made a lot more sense to get the engines into spool up to get the most out of that 670 gallons.
Edti: changed 370 to 670 gallons.
370 is for a fighter external fuel tank.
Sue me. It's been a couple decades.
Last edited:
Not sure if your referring to military or civilian procedures but we do not do this after every refuel.
Military.
Probably due to the limited amount of ground time, your aircraft most likely don't sweat up inside the tanks.
I remember back in the day we would do fuel samples at regular intervals but not after every refuel. I think it was weekly but it’s been 25 years. The line shack took care of that.
You don’t do it straight after refuel as you need to leave time for the water to settle in the bottom of the tanks.
Boeing say you need to wait 4hrs after refuelling, or running the fuel pumps before doing fuel drains.
However large amounts of water isn’t usually an issue these days as all the newer aircraft have jet pumps that pull fuel out of the lowest part of the tank. I can’t remember how much unusable fuel is usually in each tank, but without these pumps (not really a pump, just a Venturi from the normal pumps) water does definitely collect and need the sump drains done daily.
The C-130 used jet pumps (venturi pumps) from the main boost pumps to pick up low areas and keep the sump box as full as possible.
F-16 uses little turbine pumps in the wings. They are powered by the boost pumps.
The F-15 didn't use any.
The 707/C-135 didn't use any extra scavenge type pumps.
The B-1B had a smaller scavenge pump at each wing tip and one in the Weapons bay tank. Transfer pumps were mounted at the aft end of each fuel tank since it flies slightly nose up
None on the H-53.
All of the aircraft were designed to allow suction feed in case of any primary boost pump failure. Then there's the crossfeed/crossover system which allows feeding any/all engines from the crossfeed manifold.
I don't doubt the civilian aircraft are much like this since the fuel systems operate on a lot of similar principles
Gravity feed is required for certification as the engines must be able to continue operating if a total electrical failure occurs.
And whatever they would say could only be critical of the crew, or negatively affect Boeing share price.
If it was an aircraft fault, Boeing stands to lose a lot. If it was a crew/maintenance fault, India ends up looking like a 3rd world shit hole. Sure, it could have been some incredibly rare occurrence that no one could possibly have predicted, but as a guy doing this job, you know for a fact it is almost always an error by operators or an equipment fault.
The manure left the barn a long time ago.
So this seems to be saying "Pilot Error" as opposed to a total Mechanical Failure. Meaning, a larger failure could have been avoided if the crew followed proper procedure on the "smaller" failure??? Like we say in cave diving, "fix the smaller problems first before they become larger ones: or turn into the dreaded "Charlie Foxtrot."
Another guy who talks a lot but doesn't actually know any details.
He's doesn't seem to work on larger aircraft as a lot of the words he used and all the examples he used doesn't apply to the 787.
The discussion about fuel contamination was strange, its basically impossible that the wrong fuel was used but there are many other ways fuel could've been contaminated.
I dunno. This guy seems SUS to me. I just watched his Epstein video. I think he's in it for the "clickbait." I await the final FDR report.
None of these guys are trained investigators...none of them are on their airline/union investigation/go teams.
You know how I know? Because they cant keep their fucking traps shut with all the speculation.
First rule of fight club: keep your fucking mouth shut. There is one mouth piece and thats the lead investigating authority. Every work group in an investigation has a head guy who is part of the lead investigating authority. If you are on his group you talk only to him if you find or suspect anything in your small world of the investigation. He talks to the guy running the big show. If you breach this you will get tossed. Hell Boeing almost got tossed from several investigations.
If you are a youtube jackoff you are not privy to anything that has been found unless you are there sorting out "airplane parts in dumpster A and body parts in dumpster B"... so shut the fuck up. Biggest gripe on youtube is the author can delete your comments so you cant even call these guys out and tell them to shut the fuck up as "one professional to another"...
I like the people who still speculate over the Malaysia 777 disappearance... you know...the one where they STILL have never found the aircraft, any evidence of the aircraft, etc...
You know how I know? Because they cant keep their fucking traps shut with all the speculation.
First rule of fight club: keep your fucking mouth shut. There is one mouth piece and thats the lead investigating authority. Every work group in an investigation has a head guy who is part of the lead investigating authority. If you are on his group you talk only to him if you find or suspect anything in your small world of the investigation. He talks to the guy running the big show. If you breach this you will get tossed. Hell Boeing almost got tossed from several investigations.
If you are a youtube jackoff you are not privy to anything that has been found unless you are there sorting out "airplane parts in dumpster A and body parts in dumpster B"... so shut the fuck up. Biggest gripe on youtube is the author can delete your comments so you cant even call these guys out and tell them to shut the fuck up as "one professional to another"...
I like the people who still speculate over the Malaysia 777 disappearance... you know...the one where they STILL have never found the aircraft, any evidence of the aircraft, etc...
They have found pieces of it off the coast of Africa, and other places. Some floating.
Mh-370 that is.
Last edited:
As far as I know even those pieces are "speculative". They have a part number for a 777, but nothing that actually identifies them as from that particular aircraft. Unless something has changed with some of the pieces found floating thousands of miles away from that aircrafts flight path.
My point was "nobody really knows what happened to that aircraft" in the grand scheme. Did it crash? hijacked? flown somewhere and hidden? Was it all on accident? On purpose? etc... Yet there are people out there still who will tell you with certainty what happened to it.
It deviated course, was flown out over the Indian ocean until it ran out of fuel and crashed into the water.
The basic location was tracked by the engine monitoring uppdates.
EDIT TO ADD:
I normally verify shit before posting but got ahead of myself, and cannot confirm the validity of the document in this link at this time. I have deleted the screen cap above, but will leave the link here for others to review.
It is possible this is some fanfic bullshit or could be 100% real, I am not sure at this time.
Last edited:
Is it possible that an extreme smell of curry overwhelmed all the cockpit sensors and caused the crash?
All good.
EDIT TO ADD:
I normally verify shit before posting but got ahead of myself, and cannot confirm the validity of the document in this link at this time. I have deleted the screen cap above, but will leave the link here for others to review.
It is possible this is some fanfic bullshit or could be 100% real, I am not sure at this time.
Here's the actual, no shit, from the India AAIB, preliminary report (takes a bit to load)
Saved locally.
But it’s really just a PDF full of midget porn pics.
But it’s really just a PDF full of midget porn pics.
It took my browser (Chrome) a few times to get this website to open, and it still took forever to load.
There is a link on the right side for the prelim.
If this ain't legit, its among the more elaborate hoaxes I've fell victim to
There is a link on the right side for the prelim.
If this ain't legit, its among the more elaborate hoaxes I've fell victim to
“Why did you cut off the fuel to both engines!?”
“I dinnt do nutin’”
For fuck sake.
“I dinnt do nutin’”
For fuck sake.
No idea the validity of this but it fits with a few posts above.
Could a software bug or error have done this? A virus? A sensor failure?
Seems like fuel feed cutoffs are the sort of thing that should be controlled by a real live toggle switch. With a cover on it. And a really strong spring to keep it from moving by itself?
Sirhr
Could a software bug or error have done this? A virus? A sensor failure?
Seems like fuel feed cutoffs are the sort of thing that should be controlled by a real live toggle switch. With a cover on it. And a really strong spring to keep it from moving by itself?
Sirhr
You have to physically pull the switches out in order to move them to run or cutoff. It takes deliberate action to manipulate them.
Also, how in the FUCK does it take 9 seconds to move the switches back to run??? I can get both cutoff switches in my jet from cutoff to run in 2 seconds or less without even looking at them and that's kinda a memory item in most airplanes for loss of all engines (off, then on).
I just saw this picture posted… looks like the same switches. You would have to grab the knob, lift it over a gate/stop and pull it down… if I am interpreting that switch right?
How the heck can that happen? Is there an electronic backup or way to actuate it with software???
Or did the pilot/co-pilot shut it off on purpose because he wanted to come back as a cow?
Bizarre!
Sirhr
How the heck can that happen? Is there an electronic backup or way to actuate it with software???
Or did the pilot/co-pilot shut it off on purpose because he wanted to come back as a cow?
Bizarre!
Sirhr
Last edited:
100% lift over a physical gate.
Aircraft health monitoring sees likely every system switch in that cockpit.
With one switch and then another being turned off one second apart, that absolutely indicates a human turned them off. The only question is, was it intentional or the brain fart to end all brain farts?
FO was pilot flying, just after rotation they are likely to have both hands on the yoke.
The preliminary conspicuously does not mention which pilot asked the other about shutting engines down.
There are nine critical seconds missing in the prelim between when the second fuel selector was moved to cut off, and the first fuel selector was moved back to run. I guarantee the Indian AAIB, Boeing, and GE Aircraft Engines knows…
Aircraft health monitoring sees likely every system switch in that cockpit.
With one switch and then another being turned off one second apart, that absolutely indicates a human turned them off. The only question is, was it intentional or the brain fart to end all brain farts?
FO was pilot flying, just after rotation they are likely to have both hands on the yoke.
The preliminary conspicuously does not mention which pilot asked the other about shutting engines down.
There are nine critical seconds missing in the prelim between when the second fuel selector was moved to cut off, and the first fuel selector was moved back to run. I guarantee the Indian AAIB, Boeing, and GE Aircraft Engines knows…
I’ve read there is a an alert about these switches.The active airline pilots will know.
The alert was for the 737 not sure which type.
Edit- was an FAA SAIB release in 2018
Last edited:
There is no situation I can imagine where one fuell cutoff switch is accidentally moved from Run to Cutoff, then one second later the other switch is also moved from Run to Cutoff.
The chances of both switches having defective locking gates and being accidentally bumped
to cutoff is 0% .
to cutoff is 0% .
