The perfect suppressor host for hunting

[Bakwa]

Hear me out,
Why isn't there a desire [or enough of a desire] for a light, packable, big bore, suppressor host?

For people that chase "quiet" and also want to hunt with said quiet system, most are left with 300blk which is not ideal.
Why is there not an ideal caliber designed for throwing ~400gr pils at 1000fps out of a bolt action or single shot to get the most out of a quiet subsonic system meant for taking down game in swamps, thick woods, or near neighborhoods [where you don't want to bother people with muzzle report or a bleeding deer running through their yard]?
Why is there not an easily packable package that breaks down into a backpack to host such an ideal caliber and its can?

The best attempts I've seen recently are 338ARC, 8.6BO and the like. The best still isn't ideal. They're always in calibers that favor gas guns [which isn't ideal for maximizing quiet], and the calibers/barrel twist always sacrifice for both subs and supers, and aren't typically optimized for heavy subs. Most of these calibers aren't even factory loaded heavier than ~305gr either. Not to mention overall bullet diameter in 30cal or 338cal isn't anything to write home about at subsonic speeds. If you're going to go slow, then go big! We need a 45cal or 50cal heavy hitter, but where are they at?

I'm starting a project to put together something which fits this criteria, but I'm on a budget and I don't reload. What to do?
The best idea that I have is chopping down a Handi-Rifle in 45LC to 16" and having it threaded, then running it with heavies and my Fly45.
I just wish there were better options.

 

[Old Man with Gun]

What is the value of a subsonic hunting round? The trajectory is like a rainbow and the sound of a heavy bullet impacting is as loud as a crack from a suppressed supersonic round.

Big and slow is fun, I have 458 SOCOM 500gr from an AR and a Contender in 44 Mag with subs also.

But for hunting I'd shoot supersonic. Some subsonic bullet designs are almost as good as the supersonic equivalent, but the trajectory is miserable.

 

[Maurygold]

Skip the subs

I hunt an 18” 300 win mag with a LTI. Manners stick and straight taper carbon proof. It’s a very versatile do it all gun.

It’s also extremely accurate at distance.

 

[powdahound76]

Buddy is building a .510 Whisper to run a 1000 gr Maker Solid……..


Another buddy sent a vid of him shooting a .338 ARC bolt gun out of his garage.
Very quiet and more than accurate for 200 yd and less.


Im looking at a 458 SOCOM bolt gun for the same.
Run a light folding chassis and just shoot off a tripod if not off hand.

Yes. A 300 WM is quiet…..

 

[Maurygold]

Buddy is building a .510 Whisper to run a 1000 gr Maker Solid……..


Another buddy sent a vid of him shooting a .338 ARC bolt gun out of his garage.
Very quiet and more than accurate for 200 yd and less.


Im looking at a 458 SOCOM bolt gun for the same.
Run a light folding chassis and just shoot off a tripod if not off hand.

Yes. A 300 WM is quiet…..

It’s very quiet. Can easily shoot it without ear pro for hunting. Theres no advantage to subsonic rounds

 

[Bakwa]

Skip the subs

I hunt an 18” 300 win mag with a LTI. Manners stick and straight taper carbon proof. It’s a very versatile do it all gun.

View attachment 8772924

It’s also extremely accurate at distance.

View attachment 8772925

Alas, this is probably why my desired combo hasn't been produced commercially. Not everyone hunts in areas that have 25yd shots as the rule and want to be quiet.

 

[powdahound76]

The purpose of subs is so no one else can hear anything.
Not just so its ear safe for you.

Lotta people hunt in areas that are legal, and being movie quiet is advantageous.


There is a post on here of a guy with a 1/10 twist .458 socom doing exactly what you are talking about @Bakwa
Just cant remember where.

 

[Bakwa]

The purpose of subs is so no one else can hear anything.
Not just so its ear safe for you.

Lotta people hunt in areas that are legal, and being movie quiet is advantageous.


There is a post on here of a guy with a 1/10 twist .458 socom doing exactly what you are talking about @Bakwa
Just cant remember where.

Thanks. Searching now.

 

[Av8radam]

458 Socom is a great round for this project. Problem is factory loaded ammo is limited and expensive. Subs are probably not easily available. Easy button would be the 450 bushmaster. Factory subsonic ammo is readily available. The Ruger American 450 bushmaster can be had for less than $500. It’s already threaded.

 

[camotoe]

Check out air guns to. And black powder

 

[Bakwa]

Check out air guns to. And black powder

I even thought about air guns. I know they've gained a ton of popularity in Europe.
I don't have the patience for black powder. Too much time and too much cleaning.

 

[wvfarrier]

"Not ideal" varies depending on your target animal. I have had zero complains using 300blk subs on coyote, deer and black bear.

 

[Bakwa]

"Not ideal" varies depending on your target animal. I have had zero complains using 300blk subs on coyote, deer and black bear.

Ideal for dropping them sooner than later would be my stick. I know of plenty of guys that have killed deer with 300BO just fine, but had trouble tracking them. Same with any other small caliber.
I hunt in a swamp when I'm in FL, so in a perfect world, no deer would run farther than 10yds and drop. After that, tracking can be easy or hard depending on a number of factors.

 

[Maurygold]

Ideal for dropping them sooner than later would be my stick. I know of plenty of guys that have killed deer with 300BO just fine, but had trouble tracking them. Same with any other small caliber.
I hunt in a swamp when I'm in FL, so in a perfect world, no deer would run farther than 10yds and drop. After that, tracking can be easy or hard depending on a number of factors.

Berger 215 hybrid is the best bullet on game I’ve ever seen.

 

[Supersubes]

A Q Fix in 8.6 blk with a 12” barrel. 19” long when folded, and 5.5 pounds. Pretty sure there are some 400 gr loads for it.

 

[powdahound76]

@Bakwa

Rem 700 SA based SBR

Hello Folks, I'm thinking about a cute lil Truck gun and would love to tap your minds in this reguard. What i have: R700 SA .223 10.5" Rem Chassis Pistol stock Easy accessible: Supressors What i would like: A compact thumper for fun and hunting (min 740ft/lbs at 100y) Option for supersonic...

www.snipershide.com

 

[UpSideDown]

Because:
1. there’s zero reason to beat yourself up with a 400gr bullet that’s less effective than a 77gr .223
2. Suppressors over .30cal tend to be enormous and extremely expensive
3. Subs suck at killing things

If it’s hunting season and you’re following the rules, who cares if you shoot one or two rounds? Use a suppressor on a supersonic round and it’s fine. Subs sucks, terminally.

 

[Bakwa]

Because:
1. there’s zero reason to beat yourself up with a 400gr bullet that’s less effective than a 77gr .223
2. Suppressors over .30cal tend to be enormous and extremely expensive
3. Subs suck at killing things

If it’s hunting season and you’re following the rules, who cares if you shoot one or two rounds? Use a suppressor on a supersonic round and it’s fine. Subs sucks, terminally.

Not to be argumentative, but literally nothing you said is objectively true.
I’m really not the type, but misinformation is a peeve of mine.
1. Yeah, a 400gr pill moving at supersonic speeds is likely to recoil a decent amount, but have you shot a 400gr subsonic 45-70, 400gr muzzleloader, or 350gr 45LC? Maybe you’re more frail than I, but I’m not a big dude. They do not recoil hard.
And less effective than a 77gr 223? Have your shot game with both to verify this claim?
2. My FLY 45 cost me $1k when I bought it. YHM R45’s aren’t that expensive, Dead Air & SCO make decent options well under $1k the past time I checked, and if you’re only shooting subs there are a number of pistol cans that would work just fine.
3. Maybe a 77gr 223 would suck at killing things at subsonic speeds, but I think you need to do some research before saying this on a public forum.
4. On your last point, there are a number of reasons one could be legally hunting and not want people to know you’re shooting at game, or want other animals in the area to know either. I happen to have a few reasons myself.
Cheers friend

 

[carbonbased]

This doesn’t fit your criteria, but think of it more as inspiration. The DeLisle Commando Carbine.

https://usarmamentmfg.com/delisle-commando-carbine-rifle-silencer/

I want something like this (only scoped) to shoot ground squirrels lol. Gets a little boring hitting them with standard velocity subs in 22LR, and some 45acp smackdown would be hilarious.

 

[Old Man with Gun]

This doesn’t fit your criteria, but think of it more as inspiration. The DeLisle Commando Carbine.

https://usarmamentmfg.com/delisle-commando-carbine-rifle-silencer/

I want something like this (only scoped) to shoot ground squirrels lol. Gets a little boring hitting them with standard velocity subs in 22LR, and some 45acp smackdown would be hilarious.

A 300BO bolt gun is basically the same thing, but quieter.

 

[roostercogburn98]

A 300BO bolt gun is basically the same thing, but quieter.

Wanna put money on the quieter part? This one might get taken to the deer woods this year

 

[Old Man with Gun]

Not to be argumentative, but literally nothing you said is objectively true.
I’m really not the type, but misinformation is a peeve of mine.
1. Yeah, a 400gr pill moving at supersonic speeds is likely to recoil a decent amount, but have you shot a 400gr subsonic 45-70, 400gr muzzleloader, or 350gr 45LC? Maybe you’re more frail than I, but I’m not a big dude. They do not recoil hard.
And less effective than a 77gr 223? Have your shot game with both to verify this claim?
2. My FLY 45 cost me $1k when I bought it. YHM R45’s aren’t that expensive, Dead Air & SCO make decent options well under $1k the past time I checked, and if you’re only shooting subs there are a number of pistol cans that would work just fine.
3. Maybe a 77gr 223 would suck at killing things at subsonic speeds, but I think you need to do some research before saying this on a public forum.
4. On your last point, there are a number of reasons one could be legally hunting and not want people to know you’re shooting at game, or want other animals in the area to know either. I happen to have a few reasons myself.
Cheers friend

I agree, I think this really needs to be discussed by type of animal hunted. I wouldn't want 77gr supers for a big hog, 300BO subs can do it, but a big 458 SOCOM sub will put it down fast and hard. On the same note a 308 super will also do a great job as well, not much difference in noise when you consider things like bullet impacting, animal noise, etc. and flatter trajectory.

 

[Old Man with Gun]

Wanna put money on the quieter part? This one might get taken to the deer woods this year View attachment 8773196

I probably would, especially if I use an oversized can like my Nomax 33 and load down to the same energy as a 45 ACP.

Nice gun, I got to shoot one a long time ago before I had much suppressor experience. Closest I have to it today is a contender 16" rifle in 44 Mag. I shoot 240g subs through a hybrid and it is wonderfully quiet. But my Tikka 300BO with a Rugged Surge sounds better side by side. I use 7.7g of Lil Gun @ 1022 fps and 200g Makers REX Expanding for it, that load will not cycle an AR.

 

[roostercogburn98]

I probably would, especially if I use an oversized can like my Nomax 33 and load down to the same energy as a 45 ACP.

Nice gun, I got to shoot one a long time ago before I had much suppressor experience. Closet I have to it today is a contender 16" rifle in 44 Mag. I shoot 240g subs through a hybrid and it is wonderfully quiet. But my Tikka 300BO with a Rugged Surge sounds better side by side. I use 7.7g of Lil Gun @ 1022 fps and 200g Makers REX Expanding for it, that load will not cycle an AR.

I’d have to hear them side by side loaded as you want to load the 300BO. It would be too close to call by ear I bet.

This thing is scary quiet with the large volume suppressor it wears, it’s 12 inches long and 1.75 OD. Barrel is 4.5 inches, one day I’m gonna play with some +P ammo or stuff just a little hotter than standard ball.

 

[StephenShivers]

You want a BIG, HEAVY, subsonic projectile give this a try with a threaded slug barrel and a 12 gauge suppressor. I imagine it packs a punch....

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug | Gum Gully Provision

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug - The 2 1/2-ounce Seismic Quakemaker Slug is the heaviest 12-gauge slug on the market.

gumgully.com

 

[TheJeanyus]

Other than the breaking down part, doesn't a Ruger American Ranch in 450 Bushmaster cover your "400+ grain subsonic from a bolt action" criteria? Someone probably makes a folding chassis for a Ruger American, too?

There's also the Gunsite Scout in 450 BM, though I've never seen one in person. https://ruger.com/products/scoutRifle/specSheets/6837.html

 

[hlee]

Why? Because, for a century or more, hunters have been fed- by the shovel full- that they need at least a 300 weatherby mag to take a 90 lb S Texas doe from under a corn feeder at 60 yards. And, in order to maximize said cartridge they need at least a 24” barrel. And, and, to tame said beast they need a heavy rifle, and a limbsaver pad, and a brake, and and and.

There is no market for a short range thumper b/c everyone thinks the epitome of hunting is setting up a shooting position, complete with poured slab and f class rifle supports, and shooting an elk from 800 yards.

Finally, hunters are primarily Fudds, and silencers are only for assassins.

 

[Bakwa]

You want a BIG, HEAVY, subsonic projectile give this a try with a threaded slug barrel and a 12 gauge suppressor. I imagine it packs a punch....

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug | Gum Gully Provision

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug - The 2 1/2-ounce Seismic Quakemaker Slug is the heaviest 12-gauge slug on the market.

gumgully.com

Woe, I bet it does!
I unfortunately don’t have a 12ga can though.

 

[Bakwa]

Other than the breaking down part, doesn't a Ruger American Ranch in 450 Bushmaster cover your "400+ grain subsonic from a bolt action" criteria? Someone probably makes a folding chassis for a Ruger American, too?

There's also the Gunsite Scout in 450 BM, though I've never seen one in person. https://ruger.com/products/scoutRifle/specSheets/6837.html

Av8radam said as much as well.
That does seem to be the easy button, though a bit longer than I wanted.
Even with a folding chassis, it would still be over 26” though. Wish they made a 11” pistol for the same price.

Why? Because, for a century or more, hunters have been fed- by the shovel full- that they need at least a 300 weatherby mag to take a 90 lb S Texas doe from under a corn feeder at 60 yards. And, in order to maximize said cartridge they need at least a 24” barrel. And, and, to tame said beast they need a heavy rifle, and a limbsaver pad, and a brake, and and and.

There is no market for a short range thumper b/c everyone thinks the epitome of hunting is setting up a shooting position, complete with poured slab and f class rifle supports, and shooting an elk from 800 yards.

Finally, hunters are primarily Fudds, and silencers are only for assassins.

This is true. I used to be one of them. lol
I wanted to be a “hunter sniper” so bad.
But alas, I’m far more successful in thick nasty areas that no one else is willing to go to. That, and sometimes hunting close to residential areas seems to work well in my AO.
All of which inspired this idea.

 

[Old Man with Gun]

Other than the breaking down part, doesn't a Ruger American Ranch in 450 Bushmaster cover your "400+ grain subsonic from a bolt action" criteria? Someone probably makes a folding chassis for a Ruger American, too?

There's also the Gunsite Scout in 450 BM, though I've never seen one in person. https://ruger.com/products/scoutRifle/specSheets/6837.html

If you really want to hunt with it, the 450 is straight walled and can be used in some states where the 458 SOCOM isn't allowed.

 

[TheBigCountry]

Bro

45-70 lever gun. The new marlin/rugers all come threaded.

 

[Bakwa]

Bro

45-70 lever gun. The new marlin/rugers all come threaded.

Yes! That is a great option.
I just wish they packed down smaller.
Why does no one but Chiappa do a takedown lever in 45-70 anymore?

 

[UpSideDown]

Not to be argumentative, but literally nothing you said is objectively true.
I’m really not the type, but misinformation is a peeve of mine.
1. Yeah, a 400gr pill moving at supersonic speeds is likely to recoil a decent amount, but have you shot a 400gr subsonic 45-70, 400gr muzzleloader, or 350gr 45LC? Maybe you’re more frail than I, but I’m not a big dude. They do not recoil hard.
And less effective than a 77gr 223? Have your shot game with both to verify this claim?
2. My FLY 45 cost me $1k when I bought it. YHM R45’s aren’t that expensive, Dead Air & SCO make decent options well under $1k the past time I checked, and if you’re only shooting subs there are a number of pistol cans that would work just fine.
3. Maybe a 77gr 223 would suck at killing things at subsonic speeds, but I think you need to do some research before saying this on a public forum.
4. On your last point, there are a number of reasons one could be legally hunting and not want people to know you’re shooting at game, or want other animals in the area to know either. I happen to have a few reasons myself.
Cheers friend

I agree, I don’t really want to argue. Shooting really heavy subs for hunting doesn’t tickle my fancy but it seems to be interesting to other guys.

Anyone who has ever shot a 7/8oz slug out of a 12ga has essentially shot a 400gr sub.

Good point about the cans more focused on, say, .45 lever guns, vs the big expensive cans designed for .50BMG. I forget those were available and affordable.

 

[Bakwa]

I agree, I don’t really want to argue. Shooting really heavy subs for hunting doesn’t tickle my fancy but it seems to be interesting to other guys.

Anyone who has ever shot a 7/8oz slug out of a 12ga has essentially shot a 400gr sub.

Good point about the cans more focused on, say, .45 lever guns, vs the big expensive cans designed for .50BMG. I forget those were available and affordable.

I didn't mean to blow you up this morning, I had just woken up and was in an aggressive mood.
I appreciate your input nonetheless.

 

[Holliday]

The purpose of subs is so no one else can hear anything.
Not just so its ear safe for you.

Dinner bell….

 

[Old Man with Gun]

45-70 can be Subsonic, but too much case capacity. You can get very heavy bullets, but few designed to expand at lower velocity. A 45LC is a better fit if subsonic is the goal

 

[carbonbased]

Wanna put money on the quieter part? This one might get taken to the deer woods this year View attachment 8773196

 

[carbonbased]

You want a BIG, HEAVY, subsonic projectile give this a try with a threaded slug barrel and a 12 gauge suppressor. I imagine it packs a punch....

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug | Gum Gully Provision

Seismic 12 Gauge 2 1/2 oz Quakemaker Slug - The 2 1/2-ounce Seismic Quakemaker Slug is the heaviest 12-gauge slug on the market.

gumgully.com

There’s also the screw on barrel extensions for in-town professional deer shooters that are contracted to reduce deer populations. And for other hunters that need to be quiet so to not spook nearby prey; apparently, like dove hunters?

https://www.metrogun.com/

Excuse the Fuddly pic. Just needs a NRA hat lol. They don’t have many decent pics on their site.

 

[flogxal]

Bakwa -- sounds like a situation needing a complex solution. I don't know jack about fat heavy subsonics in any caliber but the discussion above seems sorta complex. Why not archery instead for this situation? Not enough range?

 

[jabonra]

Ultradyne makes their chassis to fit the Ruger American, takes an ar buffer tube

 

[Bakwa]

Bakwa -- sounds like a situation needing a complex solution. I don't know jack about fat heavy subsonics in any caliber but the discussion above seems sorta complex. Why not archery instead for this situation? Not enough range?

Archery hunting is a reasonable solution, but for two factors.
Most archery hits don't make them DRT. In my experience after the shot, you wait and blood trail them after. The idea behind the big bore hit is that they won't go far.
Second, and maybe more importantly, I'm a novice when it comes to archery with little time to train. I train just enough to take sub 30yd ethical shots during season and that's about it. I'd have to give up something else to train like I should.

 

[flogxal]

I suggested it since a guy I know hunts with bow now, but rifle earlier in his life. I asked him why, he preferred the silence as well as the closeness. I haven't done archery since elem school over 50 yrs ago and I would struggle getting "up to speed" relative to rifle marksmanship, for sure. But it might be a fun process trying!

 

[dk17hmr]

I have a 45acp barrel on a savage action set up as a single shot. I have tested 165gr bullets at 1950fps in 45 Super brass up to 300gr at about 780fps (if I recall correctly).

It's one of my favorite rifles to get out and plink with. If I were use it for subsonic deer sized game hunting I'd look at loading 265-275gr at 1050fps and keep my shots fairly close. It's not legal here for big game but it really blows up pdogs with the high velocity loads.

 

[joe777]

OP you're basically describing suppressed lever guns in the .357, 45 colt, 45-70 areas. Just not necessarily packable

 

[rdinak]

As a man with tinnitus, I wish I had hunted with a suppressor years ago. Hunting Alaska with magnum rifles took a toll on my hearing.

 

[Bakwa]

OP you're basically describing suppressed lever guns in the .357, 45 colt, 45-70 areas. Just not necessarily packable

I agree. I've owned a few lever guns and single shots in 45-70, 44, and 45LC, but never had the balls to cut them and thread them. They've come into my collection and they've since gone.
Also, I get it's not life or death necessary, but I really would like something packable for covert transport, for leaving under the seat of my truck, etc.. As well, I always prefer to move my stuff around without others knowing what I'm doing. Besides, I have a fantasy of commuting on my motorcycle to a hunting spot and setting up out of a pack.

 

[carbonbased]

I agree. I've owned a few lever guns and single shots in 45-70, 44, and 45LC, but never had the balls to cut them and thread them. They've come into my collection and they've since gone.
Also, I get it's not life or death necessary, but I really would like something packable for covert transport, for leaving under the seat of my truck, etc.. As well, I always prefer to move my stuff around without others knowing what I'm doing. Besides, I have a fantasy of commuting on my motorcycle to a hunting spot and setting up out of a pack.

You’ve got me loooking all day for a 45cal ACP bolt action or lever action. The former caliber are basically almost nonexistent, but there’s some levers in 45LC.

Henry has some interesting ones. Here’s a pic from the user gallery of the Big Boy X, which comes in 45 LC.

Not sure if I like that modern rendition, as I’m more of a blue steel and wood kind of guy. Have to get those threaded, however.

Their SPD HUSH model also has a threaded barrel fwiw.

 

[Old Man with Gun]

You can get some light weight chassis with folding stocks. If it were me I'd go MPA ultralight in 375 Raptor.

 

[nobbie333actual]

My idea hunting rifle would be a sig cross in 8.6 blackout with a 15.5 in barrel in and weld plan b to make it 16"

 

[WindstormSCR]

Hear me out,
Why isn't there a desire [or enough of a desire] for a light, packable, big bore, suppressor host?

For people that chase "quiet" and also want to hunt with said quiet system, most are left with 300blk which is not ideal.
Why is there not an ideal caliber designed for throwing ~400gr pils at 1000fps out of a bolt action or single shot to get the most out of a quiet subsonic system meant for taking down game in swamps, thick woods, or near neighborhoods [where you don't want to bother people with muzzle report or a bleeding deer running through their yard]?
Why is there not an easily packable package that breaks down into a backpack to host such an ideal caliber and its can?

The best attempts I've seen recently are 338ARC, 8.6BO and the like. The best still isn't ideal. They're always in calibers that favor gas guns [which isn't ideal for maximizing quiet], and the calibers/barrel twist always sacrifice for both subs and supers, and aren't typically optimized for heavy subs. Most of these calibers aren't even factory loaded heavier than ~305gr either. Not to mention overall bullet diameter in 30cal or 338cal isn't anything to write home about at subsonic speeds. If you're going to go slow, then go big! We need a 45cal or 50cal heavy hitter, but where are they at?

I'm starting a project to put together something which fits this criteria, but I'm on a budget and I don't reload. What to do?
The best idea that I have is chopping down a Handi-Rifle in 45LC to 16" and having it threaded, then running it with heavies and my Fly45.
I just wish there were better options.

have you considered an AR in 450BM with either no gas block or one that can be cut off? I did exactly that since I hunt in a state with straight wall restrictions, in dense brush, and it has worked out wonderfully.

if you're after pure factory offerings, hornday's sub-X works well, but if you handload, Maker offers some truly excellent subsonic expanders.