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Colorado shooting at batman premire

Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

One could argue that on balance we tend to be more reactive as a people than proactive, and that much of our national/state/local decision making has not been up to the task. In my view it seems to be more of a non-stop rugby scrum than anything else.

Greg, I would suggest that your thoughtful call for clear and thorough thinking could also be extended to include consideration of how we structure and guide our analysis and decision making. Although I feel that now is the time for compassionate support for those so brutally harmed, it will soon be upon us to offer wisdom and foresight in the shadow of this heart wrenching tragedy.

Last year I read “The Watchman’s Rattle” by Rebecca Costa. It has been informative in contrasting the complexity of our society’s problems with the toolkit we normally use to solve those problems. The book, in a nutshell, illustrates that as our problems and issues have become more and more complex, we have not really stepped up, as a society, in revising our problem solving approach, either reactively or proactively. Costa posits that complexity has evolved much faster than our problem solving ability. We tend to fall back on what is easy, familiar, and perhaps satisfying in the moment: taking names, laying blame, kicking ass. Bandaids. More often than not, when attempting to definitively solve more complex issues, this approach does not lead to a better future.

I am certain that my thinking, and powers of persuasion, are not up to the level needed to solve the kinds of issues inherent in the Aurora tragedy. I am, however, aware that much more is needed than we typically deliver.

The question of whether or not to limit our liberties in order to attempt to prevent inexplicable and unpredictable acts is certainly valid. It is probable that agreeing to limit liberties will not prevent all tragedies. How to agree on what level of tragedy is acceptable? At what point does the limitation of liberty become the tragedy? This point differs widely from one group to another.

My wife and I had a long discussion about this. My conclusion was a simple analogy. There are sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs. Where there are no sheepdogs, the wolves have free rein. So, I vote for more sheepdogs. An informed, talented, capable population is a better bet than hoping that the bad guys will heed the law and not take advantage or our good nature. Godspeed in defining what ‘informed, talented, and capable’ mean to everyone’s satisfaction. And there you have it. I know it is more complex than this, yet I, unable to solve the complexity of it, arrive at a simplified analogy that makes me feel safer. Frankly I don’t have sufficient foresight to know that this is the best long-term solution. Meanwhile, during the non-stop rugby scrum, it makes sense to me.

Thinking of Cormac McCarthy’s novels, and life in general, I am reminded that good and evil are ever present. The good should have the option to do their best, without undue limitation; evil will invariably, inexplicably, attempt its worst.

My apologies for the ramble...had I taken more time this would have been much shorter and to the point.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gunfighter14e2</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Organleggers?

Tengu;

I get your meaning, but I'm not clear how it applies. </div></div>
For murder,...
Monitor 1 has photos or videos of the victim with family, pets, and friends.
Monitor 2 has the courts finding an jury verdict,
Monitor 3 has the harvesting.
Monitor 4 has the story an life events of the intended organ recipient.

All other organ removable/harvesting would be based upon the crime. Folks can live w/o eyes, kidneys, sex organs, hands, feet, ears, teeth, ect. The crime would dictate how many of what/each that would be taken at one time. Steal with a pin or by force (none weapon)the total amount harvested would equate to one or both hands and a eye or two. As the crimes worst-en, well you know.

Some would still weight the table against their actions, their choice. My money says most would rethink their way's. Either way it's a win-win for everyone except those making money off of crime.
Much talk about this, but who other than the shooter is the blame. I suggest everyone look into the mirror, as we the voting public, has allowed this to happen. Easy choices are made by children,... and not every voter is an adult either.

</div></div>
And this is different then the "Taliban" mentality??
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I personally think any calls for stricter gun laws will only result in harming law abiding citizens and maintain the status quo of kicking the can down the road and not truly discussion the true problems.

I think we need to have a national debate on bringing back personal responsibility for health, actions, lifestyles, the whole nine yards. Also a discussion should be started on mental health, that there is no shame in having a problem and seeking help for it, but there should be shame in not getting the help. There needs to be a change, not just with mental health issues, but in others as well, where we need to get rid of the victim mentality, the "I'm not responsible for my actions because I have a condition."

Now I get it, its not the person's fault if they are bipolar or schizophrenic (although one could argue the opposite for many obese people out there) however once the person recognizes they have a problem, or are told that they do, then they must seek treatment ASAP. Those who know they are troubled and yet refuse to seek help all while blaming all their problems, failures, issues on the condition are disgusting.

I think in general we as a nation need to man up and stop being such wimps when it comes to this, no shame in seeking help, and there should be no problem with going to your friend, co-worker or family member and saying "Hey, somethings not right, you should go see a doctor about ____ " and then ensure that they do, and not stop until they do.

I personally took a really bad blow to the head two months ago when I got hit by a car, suffering from some memory and concentration issues. One of my big concerns was personality changes. I told my girlfriend to tell me if she noticed any change in my attitude, behavior, anything. I have an appointment with the TBI clinic in a few weeks to fully investigate it all
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Please cease hijacking this topic.

Greg </div></div>

The 'topic' is Shooting in Colorado movie theater. What *should* the discussion be Greg? 8 pages of ' Oh I feel sorry for those poor people'?? Would THAT be more productive?
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Also I think a reevaluation of the treatment of mental conditions need to be done as well, seems like too many doctors just throw a handful of pills at the patient and thats it, I think a much more rounded approach, meds when appropriate, lifestyle, diet, living conditions, everything I'm sure plays a part in either helping or retarding the recovery and treatment process.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rero360</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I personally think any calls for stricter gun laws will only result in harming law abiding citizens and maintain the status quo of kicking the can down the road and not truly discussion the true problems.

I think we need to have a national debate on bringing back personal responsibility for health, actions, lifestyles, the whole nine yards. Also a discussion should be started on mental health, that there is no shame in having a problem and seeking help for it, but there should be shame in not getting the help. There needs to be a change, not just with mental health issues, but in others as well, where we need to get rid of the victim mentality, the "I'm not responsible for my actions because I have a condition."

Now I get it, its not the person's fault if they are bipolar or schizophrenic (although one could argue the opposite for many obese people out there) however once the person recognizes they have a problem, or are told that they do, then they must seek treatment ASAP. Those who know they are troubled and yet refuse to seek help all while blaming all their problems, failures, issues on the condition are disgusting.

I think in general we as a nation need to man up and stop being such wimps when it comes to this, no shame in seeking help, and there should be no problem with going to your friend, co-worker or family member and saying "Hey, somethings not right, you should go see a doctor about ____ " and then ensure that they do, and not stop until they do.

I personally took a really bad blow to the head two months ago when I got hit by a car, suffering from some memory and concentration issues. One of my big concerns was personality changes. I told my girlfriend to tell me if she noticed any change in my attitude, behavior, anything. I have an appointment with the TBI clinic in a few weeks to fully investigate it all </div></div>

the only issue I have with this is that the only way we have to measure our mental health is against our own experience. So if some one has a mental disorder that is developed slowly they may not think they have a problem and are normal. Thus the people who are diagnosed as mentally ill and refuse treatment. As for a solution for the problems i have no idea what to do. However as to the current situation regarding personal responsibility we need to man the fuck up and take responsibility for ourselves and quit blaming others for our problems.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SniperCJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Please cease hijacking this topic.

Greg </div></div>

The 'topic' is Shooting in Colorado movie theater. What *should* the discussion be Greg? 8 pages of ' Oh I feel sorry for those poor people'?? Would THAT be more productive? </div></div>

Amen!! And as someone mentioned earlier in this thread, get off your high horse Greg. Geezuz.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

It may benefit you to read before you post.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Consider this:

This is a public forum, and a lot of otherwise uncommitted folks come here looking for our thoughts on such tragedies, to see if folks like us can be trusted to exercise those very rights we so fervently wish to defend. Wringing hands and lamented losses just aren't going to cut it anymore. These folks want to see valid proposals, and they have a right to.
</div></div>


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Consider this:

We <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> be using this topic as a work space where proactive and constructive talking points in favor of an effective and equitible solution to the gun violence issue can be better dealt with, and in a manner that neither penalizes the innocent and responsible gun owner for the excesses of sociopaths, nor terminates the centuries old legacy of the American marksman.

We can either seek to widen the dispute, or to narrow the differences. We can start working on what we, as law abiding and responsible gun owners, can live with, and what we can't. We can refuse to let ourselves get bogged down arguing side issues.
</div></div>

You don't like this?

Then make your own <span style="font-style: italic">positive</span> contribution to the dialogue.

Nobody's demanding you participate, and If all you've come here to do is sling mud, maybe you shouldn't. You <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> start or join another topic that's more to your liking. I'll leave it to the other actual participants to help you with your decision.

This topic is not the only thing in my life that I need to be concerned with these days. I think it could do at least as well without me as it could with me. I rather think it would be interesting to see where it could go without me.

If you feel you're better suited to take a lead in the discussion, then lead away. I've been hoping someone would please do just that.

Anyone?

Anyone?

...Beuler...?

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

This the sort of thinking I'd like to encourage forther.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Greg, I would suggest that your thoughtful call for clear and thorough thinking could also be extended to include consideration of how we structure and guide our analysis and decision making. Although I feel that now is the time for compassionate support for those so brutally harmed, it will soon be upon us to offer wisdom and foresight in the shadow of this heart wrenching tragedy.
</div></div>

I agree. I'd like to see where others here could take this line of thought, either here or within its own topic.

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

What mistifies me is how this dude got from the parking lot into the movie house wihtout someone seeing him. I mean come on, a guy wearing tommy tactical and holding a few guns really stands out by any strip mall or mall or moveie house mall. He didn't just sneak into the place all ninja like.
This is more likened to the breakdown in A-Stan where the dude just walked off the base and out the gate...no one saw the guy? please!
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I've noticed the ammunition tally keeps going up. It was first "5,000 rounds of high powered ammunition". This morning the Today show reported 7,000 rounds on his person. So youre telling me this guy was carring 230+ 30 round magazines? Ooops I mean "Assualt Clips".
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Quick check of shipping weights puts 1000rd at around 28lb. That comes out around 200lb for 7000 rounds.

He musta been some kinda wiry dude.

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dbateman™</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not sure if this has been posted or not.

He wasn't wearing armour. </div></div>

Seems to me that a couple of center mass hits from a legally carried snubby 38 or pocket 380 or wtf ever you want to insert here wouldve ended this fuckwad's plans early and most likely saved some lives. But what do I know because all I hear is the "experts" saying that having CCW in the theater wouldve only made this situation worse.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Listen to Tom Gresham's Podcast on Guntalk.com. If you have iTunes go to the store and search for either Tom Gresham or Guntalk. Yesterday had a really good podcast on it.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gofaster23</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've noticed the ammunition tally keeps going up. It was first "5,000 rounds of high powered ammunition". This morning the Today show reported 7,000 rounds on his person. So youre telling me this guy was carring 230+ 30 round magazines? Ooops I mean "Assualt Clips". </div></div>

Call. Your move CNN.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Having a CCW in the theatre would have been better. Having three or four would have been even better still. One person returning fire would draw his fire... He would probably get smoked by a guy in armor with a rifle unless he was able to get one in the head with the first shot (think about what happened to that guy at the Tacoma Mall shooting). But two or three, and he can only focus on one at a time, and then you can probably take him out. But it seems, if anyone did have a permit, they either didn't use it or left it in the car or at home, which is basically the same thing. BTW, this all happened in a minute or two, and even though the cops got there in record time, it had already happened. It goes to show that you are responsible for your own safety, that you can't depend on others to defend you. This event and others like them are why I carry everywhere I go. It also finally prompted my wife to understand why she shouldn't leave it in the car "sometimes". The victims always say, "I felt safe" or "I didn't think it could happen to me" and they always happen in the most unlikely of places. Malls. Theatres. Classrooms. Restaurants. Places people go to unwind or spend time with family or do peaceful things. Pray for peace, prepare for war, that is what I was told in the army. It seems to me that the victims have, for the most part, been simply preparing for peace.

It should also be mentioned his weapon jammed and he didn't know how to unfuck it. He apparently bought a bunch of ammo to test it out and practice with, but the range he tried to join denied him because he was, quote, "weird and bizarre" and they questioned his motives for wanting to join. It was "Lead" gun club in CO. The owner represented responsible gun owners well I think.

It seems none of the politicians want gun control at this moment, but this is a major election year. The silence, I fear, is the calm before the storm.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I have read thru all this I did not see an answer to my question

all the news on Friday morning was saying he bought all his ammunition online

is this possible to track the purchases that quick, don't know if they found receipts in the car, but they had not even got into his apartment yet when they were saying he about all the ammo online
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Listening to a talk show today about the Penn. State NCAA sanctions. One guy calls in and says, yes he knows the actual perpatrator is dead, but somebody has to pay for this. It didn't matter if they had no actual involvement, they have to pay anyway.
He was addament, and so were many of the callers that followed.

I think this is the mentallity we are up against with this incident. They can only execute this guy once, so somebody else has to pay too. Mob mentallity.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I seen the video of this nutcase in the courtroom... looked like he had either been up for 3 days straight, or had been mind raped. Definitely wasn't all there.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: zmann</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I seen the video of this nutcase in the courtroom... looked like he had either been up for 3 days straight, or had been mind raped. Definitely wasn't all there. </div></div>

We'll never see the real person. From here on out all we'll ever see is a highly coached puppet. His attys are going to coach him on everything he does and in this case it looks like (from what his atty said in court and his behavior) that they're with an insanity defense.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Strykervet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One person returning fire would draw his fire... He would probably get smoked by a guy in armor with a rifle unless he was able to get one in the head with the first shot (think about what happened to that guy at the Tacoma Mall shooting). But two or three, and he can only focus on one at a time, and then you can probably take him out. </div></div>

I heard something similar today from my friends wife. I told her I would have rather died in a gun fight with this guy or any other psycho who decides to do something like this than to be forced tell my wife I love you one last time trying to just shield her from bullets.

I have heard the oh it was dark in there, there was smoke. There is a reason I have a 120 lumen light on my P226 to go with the 20 round mag as well and another 2 15's. There always be the possibility that I did hit an innocent, but if he would have been taking fire in the beginning things would have probably been different.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Did anyone hear the statement today from the mother????????

According to her statement, she NEVER said "you've got the right person" in the context of knowing her son was, he perp. She says she took a call at 5:45, asking if she was so-and-so, mother of so-and-so...to which she replied "you've got the right person", referring to herself.

If true, the media has MASSIVELY mischaracterized, the situation. Hope she sues the dogs it out of them all.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricF517</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I have heard the oh it was dark in there, there was smoke. There is a reason I have a 120 lumen light on my P226 to go with the 20 round mag as well and another 2 15's. There always be the possibility that I did hit an innocent, but if he would have been taking fire in the beginning things would have probably been different. </div></div>

I always have my small 357 LCR at the movies and after reading this I have to ask if you really carry all that on you in the summer when you go to the theatre
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

So what if he was wearing a vest? I know it will stop him from dying, but the day I turn 21 I'm going to start carrying a 9mm AT LEAST, probably a .40 and maybe a .45

Personally, if in that situation, if I was carrying..

Put 2-5 in the torso, he will not be on his feet and most likely not able to shoot anymore..
Then make sure he can't shoot again.

All it would have taken was one person with a decent weapon and capability to make a few accurate shots to take this maniac out..

Let's think about it. He is not a trained soldier, he is not a tough or strong person. He does not know how to respond under fire, and he was probably just shooting and not looking for anyone with a gun, someone could have used a seat as a rest / cover and made a few lethal shots and saved many lives.

I am sorry, I can't even carry yet, but I don't think a little baby .380 is enough.. I think something along the lines of a Glock 19 or 23 is perfect..

 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Post edited. I am just trying to communicate, the whole vest thing is being over thought, unless this was a hard plate, a few shots from a .40 into a soft vest would most likely break ribs and surely put you on the floor.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I'm not going to get into it I guess.. I am just saying.. This guy was not a trained professional and if someone shot him several times even with his armor it would stop him at least temporarily..

Prayers go out to the families and victims.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

A bunch of would bes howtos would it ifs buts etc...

Facts:

-anyone who makes his mind can kill others
-anyone who makes his mind can acquire firearms even in fully regulated societies
-anyone can use kitchen utensils to do damage albeit in most cases not as big as with firearms or if brains are used even bigger (serial killers for example)
-noone can prevent anyone from deciding to go on a killing spree (precrime atm is still fiction...)
-it happened, it happens and it will happen again
-police is always late
-even if you have CCW with the latest mix of ammo to stop anything but pissed off elephant on meth you might get killed and do absolutely nothing to save others


Question:
-when something bad happens do you want to be able to protect yourself even if that is/might be futile (ccw) or not (no ccw/firearms regulations)


Its very simple once you remove all the mumbo jumbo media and retards throw around and persons with direct agendas (attempts to remove 2nd A.). Are you a person who goes down without a voice or do you attempt to fight for your life? Are you a person who will deny others their right to choose how to die/fight(all the antis)?
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Better to fight and die than sit and die is it not?

Somebody could have stopped him. He was a coward. He most likely would not have been able to continue his assault if he was hit in the throat or even in the pelvis or legs..

Getting shot through soft body armor is like being kicked by a horse from what I've heard.

HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: .308Shadow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Better to fight and die than sit and die is it not?

Somebody could have stopped him. He was a coward. He most likely would not have been able to continue his assault if he was hit in the throat or even in the pelvis or legs..

Getting shot through soft body armor is like being kicked by a horse from what I've heard.

HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.</div></div> You're off to a great start. Did you also know that this site is one heck of a repository for information already stated and stored in convenient threads?

There is so much information here, already. Thank you for contributing.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

I can see it now. I've just been pissing upwind. I was wrong, you guys were right.

It's only a bad day if I don't learn something. This day I learned another thing.

Do it your way...

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

The thing that bother me most is that for decades, the politicians have been cluttering the law books with laws that do nothing that helps anyone but themselves and their (re)election campaigns. The advocacy groups on both sides are no less culpable; they all failed to do what they advocate, but was the failure all that unintentional?

What they all could have been doing is drafting laws that make it clear in no uncertain terms that misusing a firearm for invalid purposes, like mayhem and murder, is something that even the most dimwitted amongst our bretheren could undestand is a really dumb and undesirable thing.

They wasted those decades serving their own needs and not the peoples'; penalizing everyone but the perpetrators of the violence they claim to abhor.

For that, I put the blame for these deaths squarely on the politicans' shoulders, each and every one of them that stood by and either did the deed, or silently, passively watched the big shows in the peoples' big houses.

Damn them.

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wfjames22</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dbateman™</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not sure if this has been posted or not.

He wasn't wearing armour. </div></div>

Seems to me that a couple of center mass hits from a legally carried snubby 38 or pocket 380 or wtf ever you want to insert here wouldve ended this fuckwad's plans early and most likely saved some lives. But what do I know because all I hear is the "experts" saying that having CCW in the theater wouldve only made this situation worse. </div></div>

From the AURORA PD website:
"He was outfitted in complete ballistic gear included a ballistic helmet, vest, shin guards, groin and throat protector." I didn't find it written but I remember the Police Chief saying that he also had a "tactical vest to hold ammunition" on top.

Link where you can read the press release

http://apps.auroragov.org/newsupdates/news/InformationTimeLines_7_20_1830.htm
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

If I can think of it, a politican shuld be able to as well.

Consider this.

A federal sentencing madate.

Any murder conviction involving more than one murder, or following a prior murder conviction, qualifies as either a mass murder or a serial murder.

Persons convicted of murder with either special circumstance are mandated a death penalty, and said death penalty may not include the administration of any sedation.

Three strikes already follows a similar logic.

Won't solve the problem. No law can solve the problem. But this could help.

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: .308Shadow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.</div></div>
You're kidding...right...?
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I can see it now. I've just been pissing upwind. I was wrong, you guys were right.

It's only a bad day if I don't learn something. This day I learned another thing.

Do it your way...

Greg </div></div>

Ignore the kid Greg, his youth and lack of knowledge or experience is apparent in his posts.

I completely agree with what you are saying, we need to figure out if there is a path to take that will prevent these incidents from becoming as large as they do.

Basically you are asking people to ignore everything they have learned in the past 40 or 50 years and think of a new way, I think it is much more than laws, law enforcement and the judiciary.

I wish I knew the answer, I'm pretty dumb when it comes to these things I'll admit. However I'll none the less give it my best, maybe I come up with something that someone else improves upon.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

My idea: 1:Forbid any media from posting his name or photo. 2:Refer to him not as "the alleged shooter", but the "alleged scumwad loser" Damn, I'm sick of the coverage already!!!
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdogsbeware</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: .308Shadow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.</div></div>
You're kidding...right...? </div></div>

Allegedly he kicked in the exit door, towards the bottom of the theater...which means he would have entered from a different place?
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: zmann</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdogsbeware</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: .308Shadow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.</div></div>
You're kidding...right...? </div></div>

Allegedly he kicked in the exit door, towards the bottom of the theater...which means he would have entered from a different place? </div></div>

He must have been kicking on it for a good while.....

Any exit door in a theater is under fire code to open out from the inside with a panic bar. These are metal doors with metal frames and unless you drive an f250 through it, won't just "kick in".
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: xs hedspace</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My idea: 1:Forbid any media from posting his name or photo. 2:Refer to him not as "the alleged shooter", but the "alleged scumwad loser" Damn, I'm sick of the coverage already!!! </div></div>

The father of one of the victims was interviewed by Anderson Cooper and he railed against the media and essentially blamed them for things like this. In other words, he claimed these people are seeking fame, and the media gives it to them. It's probably true, somewhat.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

OK, I'll admit I was wrong.

It's unlikely that someone with a CCW weapon would have been able to stop the event.. Maybe someone would have been able to hit him where he was not covered but it's unlikely..

Anti-gunners are going to play this card for a while..

Seems like his mother has known he was crazy for a while and didn't do anything about it...

I read somewhere, something that gave me a new thought on it..
It stated that 3-6 people could have rushed him and he would not have been able to fight all of them off, taken him to the ground and stopped him.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If I can think of it, a politican shuld be able to as well.

Consider this.

A federal sentencing madate.

Any murder conviction involving more than one murder, or following a prior murder conviction, qualifies as either a mass murder or a serial murder.

Persons convicted of murder with either special circumstance are mandated a death penalty, and said death penalty may not include the administration of any sedation.

Three strikes already follows a similar logic.

Won't solve the problem. No law can solve the problem. But this could help.

Greg </div></div>

I'm all about tough punishments for firearm related crimes as a detterent, and I think that for an "average" criminal it might have that effect to a degree.

In this case though, no law was going to stop this person. No regulation, rule or any other kind of preventive "code" would stop a person like this.You could stack 100 death sentances and he would not have been deterred.

I say this because most of these people have gotten past fear of any punishment and even death. Like in the VT shooting these types shooters are so out of touch with reality they will do it no matter the repurcussions. Many commit suicide by cop or do it themselves.

Since you are so worried about not delving into what-if's (unless it's your own opinion of what would have stopped this) I will put forward a proposal concerning gun related legislation.

If someone has a history of mental health issues, that have NOT led to a crime, those issues should be fair game when it comes to purchasing a firearm. With VT, Cho had a long history of mental health issues and should not have been able to buy the Glock 19 he used as the main weapon.(per federal law, this is not just my opinion.) He was able to pass a background check because of Federal Privacy laws keeping his in-school mental health records private, even when applying to purchase a firearm.

Wouldn't surprise me if the Colorado Scum is the same way. He was smart, yes, but most likely had some warning signs, as indicated by his mom.

Let this be a warning to parents, siblings etc. If you think someone you care about is at a point where they could be cabable of harming themselves or others talk to a counselor, pastor, or whoever. That's preventitive. You are only going to do more harm to the person you care about and possibly many others by keeping quiet.

These are preventitive things we could do moving forward.

A non-preventitive solution for when all other things have failed is good people being armed and competent in the use of those arms.

This is not dogmatic. This is a real world solution that is completely appropriate for this discussion, as the CCW policy at the theater may have directly influenced the outcome of this particular shooting.

This is a message that anyone consulting this forum can take away: Good people that are armed make a difference in many violent encounters. It may or may not have in this one, we won't know until we learn more real facts about the tactical situation, but it couldn't have been much worse. Not all guns are used for bad. Most are used for good, but these occurrences are under-reported by the media who has a blatent anti-gun agenda. This does not mean gun-owners have a chip on their shoulder. It just gets old being mis-represented and to hear blatent lies constantly by a biased media.

Greg, go ahead and check in with mod's on trolling. Since you didn't start the thread and have claimed that you don't have any more right to guide the discussion than anyone else here, I don't think much will be done there.

Doc, you are very insightful and I think on the right track with most your ideas. Well said.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Ha, thank you Pdogs!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdogsbeware</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: .308Shadow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
HOW did this guy get in the theater? There should be metal detectors or armed security at any public place where large amounts of people flock to.</div></div>
You're kidding...right...? </div></div>
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Consider this.

A federal sentencing madate.

Any murder conviction involving more than one murder, or following a prior murder conviction, qualifies as either a mass murder or a serial murder.

Persons convicted of murder with either special circumstance are mandated a death penalty, and said death penalty may not include the administration of any sedation.

Three strikes already follows a similar logic.

Won't solve the problem. No law can solve the problem. But this could help.

Greg</div></div>

This would solve problems in a small way each time it is applied. No criminal executed for his crime ever committed it again.
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

Anyone see Chris Hanson from Dateline camera up the guy he sent into Gander Mountain to buy a S&W AR15.. Chris Hanson said see you can buy this kind of Assault Weapon in 1 hour. Send that asshole to my shop, I will have you in and out in 15 mins. I wonder is he is going to camera up someone and see how long it takes to buy 2 fishing line and 2 liter pop bottles. Chris Hanson your an ASSHOLE!!!!
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

No.

For this to work, either somebody else picks up the ball and runs with it, or this is all just a daydream.

As for the last 40 or 50 years, I guess it takes an old fart like me to remember back before all that. Not so many of us left now. Nobody ever lives long enough to see how it all turns out anyway.

This is the youngfolks' world now. It's up to them to kickstart a new page.

Let's see what someone younger can come up with. My race is run.

Greg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

<span style="font-weight: bold">I bet this guy is a Sniper's Hide member:</span>


kTmUz.jpg
 
Re: Colorado shooting at batman premire

So in keeping with actually doing something I submit the following.

I am not a lawyer, legislator or even a para-legal which means what I say will actually make sense to the common man.

If you are a lawyer, legislator, para-legal or have experience drafting legislation cut and paste and improve upon this

The Aurora Automatic Act of 2012.

Where in

If a suspect is tried and convicted of a violent crime as defined by US Code XYZ which involved the use of a firearm (as defined by BATFE definition XYZ) the defendant will be remanded to the custody of the nearest Federal Penitentiary while awaiting the determination of the following by a Federal Circuit Court Judge:

Was the defendant in possession of a firearm?

Did the defendant use said firearm to affect the commission of the crime?

If the Federal Circuit Court Judge finds the defendant guilty of both questions the defendant will be immediately provided three options which must be answered within a 12 hour period following the determination of the Federal Circuit Court Judge.

1. Immediate execution via the currently accepted Federal standards at a Federal Penitentiary. Execution will be conducted within seven business days following the Supreme Court of the United States certification of the ruling of the Federal Circuit Court Judge.

2. Surrender of the defendant’s person to medical science as determined by XYZ for a period of not to exceed two years where in the final disposition of the defendant’s person will be execution at the two year mark following the determination for the Federal Circuit Court Judge.

3. Life in federal prison in solitary confinement with the minimum of habitability standards as defined by current law with no parole.

The defendant may choose any of the three punishments. The defendant may elect to accept immediate execution at any time.

If the defendant fails to choose a sentence the sentence of immediate execution will be carried out at a Federal Penitentiary within seven business days.

Where in
The Federal Circuit Court Judge need only review the final findings of the criminal trial and need not have the defendant present for ruling; determination will be made within 2 business days from the ruling by the criminal court.

If the Federal Circuit Court Judge is found to have ruled contrary to the evidence presented at the criminal trial the Supreme Court of the United States will remove the Federal Circuit Court Judges from the Bench and disbar that Federal Circuit Court Judge within seven business days from the Federal Circuit Court Judge’s ruling.

All cases will be reviewed by the Supreme Court on the next business day following the Federal Circuit Court Judge’s ruling and a certification of the Federal Circuit Court Judge’s finding shall be determined by a simple majority within 2 business days.

Signed: The Law Abiding Gun Owners of America

One page, no more no less, no BS, no addendum's, attachments or the naming of a post office shall be included.

Let's watch the rats squirm when you put teeth into the laws.

Cheers,

Doc