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My Mosin Nagant Project

experthunter017

experthunter017

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Aug 13, 2012
73
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Virginia beach VA
I am working on my mosin nagant project i still got some work to do to it but it is coming along very nicely. i am posting to see what you guys think of it. i know there is alot of people modifying these rifles and it is getting kinda like beating a dead horse but it is my first rifle project and i am just looking for advise and/or helpful criticism

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Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

That is a nice looking project, I'd be interested to see how it comes along & what kind of groups you get at different distances.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Mosins are perfect starter rifles for tinkering with. Not a fan of the ATI stock though. And with the 28-3/4" barrel unsupported like that you may have trouble getting decent groups. Go shoot it and see what you get. You might want to cut it down to 22". Seems to be the magic number
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DirtyDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mosins are perfect starter rifles for tinkering with. Not a fan of the ATI stock though. And with the 28-3/4" barrel unsupported like that you may have trouble getting decent groups. Go shoot it and see what you get. You might want to cut it down to 22". Seems to be the magic number </div></div>

I agree about length of the barrel. With additional weight of MB at the end, this long barrel will not shoot consistently. MN barrel heats up real quick, 2-3 shots, and it's going to be all over the place. Needs to be cut down or supported at least at the end of foreend.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Nice job! Congrats! What brand of bipod are you using?
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

First slug your barrel to see what size bore you have. Hopefully you have .312. I have not seen any MN with a bore smaller than that (other than a finn which run .308)

The size is important because you will have to feed the rifle ammo with the correct size projectile. Some MN ammo is .310, .311 or .312(Winchester). You want ammo that matches the bore, a smaller projectile in a loose bore makes for large groups.

If you reload you can make your own (match) ammo to work well in your specific rifle.

You can shoot it now and see how it groups at 100Y, most out of the box can group from 3 moa up to 6 moa. I do have a ex-sniper that will group about 3 moa with surplus and 1.5 with handloads. I can make it group smaller, but that is at very slow velocities.


Remember that your rifle has a sporter contour barrel, so it is going to whip around. If you look at many varmint rifles, they are supported at the end of the stock with a pressure pad. Yours may or may not need it, but I have yet to see a MN that benefited from free float. Most guys end up chopping, or corking.

So, slug your bbl and then shoot some groups. This way you dont end up spending a lot of cash chasing an accuracy dream. If it groups nice, then great. If not you can always make it into a hunting rifle.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Experthunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what would you recommend supporting it with ??? a longier stock or something else?? </div></div>

Shoot it first, while what I've posted is something I've observed on many occasions, and it may theoretically be also correct for your rifle, every rifle/stock combo may work in its own way. The good test would be to fire 5-10 shots, say, in 3-4 minutes, at 100 yard target, that would heat up the barrel all right, then see how group looks like. If you do not like what you see, then you got to support barrel by using what is known as "pressure point". With your stock configuration, you may try to put something at the end of forend between the barrel and the forened, so that when you tighten action screws, this "something" will be putting some pressure onto the barrel strictly in the "up direction". It's a tricky business to do it right, and I have no idea how ATI plastic stock would handle such setup, so it would require some experimentation. Many guys, including myself, prefer just to cut the barrel to 21"-23" and then completely free float it. If you want to keep the original length of the barrel, you got to learn about "pressure point" stuff, for example, search for info related to bedding of Lee Enfield (SMLE) sniper rifles and use pretty much the same approach.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

If you still have the original 91/30 stock, it might be interesting to see how it performs with the barrel wrapped in cloth (sigh, yeah, I mean duck-)tape at the same locations that line up where the two barrel bands are. Wrap enough it to make it a snug fit when the upper handguard and bands are in place. If that gets good results, maybe try bedding the action, too.

This was apparently a trick Mosin Snipers used.

Greg
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

On my sporter Mosin I cut the barrel to 22" and re-crowned it, free foated it, and bedded the action in a Modified OG stock. It shot right at 1 MOA. Not bad for a $100 rifle and a little time spent in the garage.

My Dads is set up just like yours and it shoots about 3 MOA
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

For the price of these rifles, its a good start. Yours looks like its coming along quite well. I have two of these rifles, but would rather leave them original. Keep up the good work on yours!
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Looking good!

As pointed out above, the ATI stock is not the best. Have you looked boyds? They make several styles, I have one on my Mosin Nagant. http://www.boydsgunstocks.com/Boyds-Mosin-Nagant-Socks-s/172.htm

here is my MN 91/30.

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I cut the barrel down to 26", she is a little finicky with ammo though. As pointed out above, 22" seems to be the magic number. Right now with my handloads (174 grain .311" SMK in front of 55 grains of IMR 4350) she will produce five shot sub MOA groups at 100yds. With that load, I'm shooting a bullet with a G1 B.C. of .499 at 2721 FPS.

Here is the full write up if you care to see what I did to her. http://www.surplusrifleforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=113024

 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

I took my Mosin out to the Range, and it did everthing you guys said it would do. i was hitting all over the place, even sometimes off paper, at a 100yds, so i called a gunsmith and i am going to go get the barrel cut to 22 inches and have him put a 11 degrees crown on it. i was really impressed with the muzzle break and ATI stock the recoil was redused by half. also if any one else is going to do a mosin project make sure you look into a Rock soild scope mount those things really are rock soild and the bolt body is great to from rocksoild.

Also i am going to put the muzzle brake back on to so the over all length will be 24inches
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

The original MN 91/30 PU snipers had a wrap of oil soaked canvas at the front barrel band. People I've talked with over the last year since I bought my first MN sniper have had mixed results with a full or partial wrap. Many use an oil soaked index card, canvas or thin leather. Like ammo, each rifle has an optimal placement and it takes experimentation. Whatever you do, make sure you keep the oil wet - and don't use material that melts. More than one person has had to clean melted foam, etc from their barrels.

I'm currently shooting hand loads using 43.5 gns of Varget with Winchester large rifle primers and Sierra 174 gn .311 boat tail bullets. I have not slugged my barrels (I've got 3 PUs) and need to do so.

I did have very good results at this weekend's Vintage Sniper match at Quantico - especially at 300 yards. I had some drifting at 600 but since this was my first time shooting at that distance, I'm thinking it was more me than the rifle or load. My partner was shooting .312s and we were pretty consistent - except when I pulled a bonehead move and didn't check my thumb screw.

Good luck with your project!!
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Oil was likely being used to prevent absorbtion of water by the filler. Can't think of any other reason.

If I were to build full barrel length MN "sniper", I would probably go with SMLE technique of using raised wood spot somewhere between the middle and the muzzle end of the barrel.
Or some kind of heat resistant polymer shim, which does not absorb water. Probably 5-6 lbs. of force to break contact with pressure point would be reasonable value for barrel preload, in analogy with SMLE. No other barrel contact with wood, of course.

 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

What kinda trigger, and bolt work are you guys doing to your custom MN's?
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BravoSector1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Russian ".30-06" look'in good!
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</div></div>

I think you meant 'Russian 308'.
wink.gif
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoosterShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BravoSector1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Russian ".30-06" look'in good!
grin.gif
</div></div>

I think you meant 'Russian 308'.
wink.gif

</div></div>
I think you meant "American 54r".
grin.gif
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Experthunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> i was hitting all over the place, even sometimes off paper, at a 100yds, </div></div>

check your bedding. Check your scope.

your in trouble if your all over the place.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kouki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What kinda trigger, and bolt work are you guys doing to your custom MN's? </div></div>

I polish the sear and work on the spring tension to reduce it from the standard 7-8lbs down to 4.5 or so. I have tried many ways, but the safest has been to polish and not remove material by sanding or filing. I also add a slack spring to make the trigger into a psuedo two stage. I never shim or anything like that, I have experimented with those methods in the past and do not find they are safe. The 4.5 lbs seems to be very consistent and repeatable than anything lower.

You can get a Timney, but you will have to remove "alot" of wood, and it will be a pain in the butt to do pillars. So unless you know how to bed, I would just work on polishing the sear surfaces(where it contacts the trigger body and where it contacts the bolt). Also if you can find a supply of triggers, I once picked up about 6 triggers and tried them all to get one that fit and functioned the best. Many of the triggers are shaped differently, and this effects how smooth the trigger breaks, when it breaks, and how much slack is in the movement. Any improvement is leaps and bounds over what comes on a stock MN. Just be very safe, once you remove metal, you cant put it back.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

i am ordering a timmey trigger for mine and for the bolt i have a rock solid industries bolt body and for the scope mount i have a rock soild industries mount as well they are GREAT product.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Experthunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i am ordering a timmey trigger for mine and for the bolt i have a rock solid industries bolt body and for the scope mount i have a rock soild industries mount as well they are GREAT product. </div></div>

Timney trigger in ATI stock, which is not a wood stock, may be a fun project by itself. You may want to secure services of decent mill operator to fit Timney into that ATI stock, which, I believe, is made from some variation of Zytel. Zytel is not as easy to shape/trim as wood.

But it would be certainly interesting to learn if you managed do it with hand tools by yourself.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kouki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What kinda trigger, and bolt work are you guys doing to your custom MN's? </div></div>

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I used a Timney trigger in mine. BEAUTIFUL! that's the only word I know to describe it. NO creep, adjustable for weight (I've got it set to 2 lbs. 8 oz.), and overtravel too. Since the Timney comes with a safety, I ground down the cocking peice. The bolt handle is from Rock Solid Industries. I lapped the lugs also, since this weapon system incorporates a floating bolt head I'm not sure if it did much.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Experthunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i am ordering a timmey trigger for mine and for the bolt i have a rock solid industries bolt body and for the scope mount i have a rock soild industries mount as well they are GREAT product. </div></div>

Timney trigger + ATI stock = BAD IDEA

There is not enough material on the side of the ATI stock to keep it rigid around the action. Here is a picture of the rear portion of inletting, you can see how much material I had to remove from the stock to inlet for the Timney. Helping hold the stock together are two steel pieces in the stock... one right behind the recoil lug, and one in between the magazine and trigger assembly.

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I did bed this rifle and use pillars. If you haven't done that, I would recommend doing that. You can notch the rear pillar for the Timney trigger, that's what I did. Just remember to wrapp the action screws in tape when you bed the pillars. Both pillar bedding, and skim bedding will help your accuracy. Both are relatively easy to do with the boyds stocks. I would recommend that you get one of them. http://www.boydsgunstocks.com/Boyds-Mosin-Nagant-Socks-s/172.htm They come in several styles and colors. If you are keeping your rifle black, they have a black/grey laminate. Otherwise you can paint it easily. The benifit to these also is a beefier forend. If you free float your barrel in the ATI stock and the shoot it from a bipod, there is enough weight for the barrel to make contact again with the forend. The Boyds stocks have enough rigidity that they won't do that.

Here are two five shot groups at 100 yds I shot with my sporterized MN 91/30.

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These were shot with re-loads. S&B neck sized brass, Remington LR primers, 55 grains of IMR 4350, and a .311" 174 grain SMK. Cartridge overall length is 3.000", and muzzle velocity was an average of 2721 FPS. These can be pretty accurate weapon systems, especially for a battle rifle designed 120 + years ago. You just have to put in a little work to see what they like.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Dang, Ive got a friend wanting to rid of his 1943 91/30 Mosin. I think Im going to scoop it up after seeing their is still some modern touches that can be done to help them out.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kortik</div><div class="ubbcode-body">0933, excelent! You're certainly thinking.

</div></div>

Thank you!
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kouki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Dang, Ive got a friend wanting to rid of his 1943 91/30 Mosin. I think Im going to scoop it up after seeing their is still some modern touches that can be done to help them out. </div></div>

You can actually do quite a bit with them. You just have be prepared to do most of the work yourself. Most gunsmiths won't mess with them... or charge extra. Here are a few projects that I found with google in a few min.

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<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/7D4ZqR_ckfQ&feature=related"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/7D4ZqR_ckfQ&feature=related" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

And a pdf file download.

Finn M39 Project

I know of a few people that have done bolt head modifications so that it will take a standard .473" case head. You can also move the bolt handle back and weld a bridge for a more conventional scope base. You're only limited by your imagination, skill, and money.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

I got my mosin to shoot 3in groups, with military ammo, (i just got all my reloading equipment for the mosin so i will be making hand loads for it). the problem why i could not hit anything was not the gun but it was me as the shooter. Here what i was doing wrong, i got in a habbit with my 22-250 when i was shooting on a bipod not to hold the the front of the gun down since there was no or little recoil on my 22-250 it didn't matter if i held the front of my gun, but when it came to my Mosin it as a much greatier round with a highier recoil. so with the longer barrel and highier recoil my gun would bounce before the round would leave the barrle and throw my shot off paper. so my dad told me to hold the front of the gun down while on a bipod and i shot 5 round and had a 3 inch group, i loaded again differnet target 3 inch group 5 more round again 3 inch group, so then i tried not holding my front down all over the place, 5 more rounds 3 inch group, so my problem was me not the gun and know my mosin is shooing 3 inch group with military ammo i will let you guys know what happens when i get back to the range with hand loades.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

I never knew people put that much effort into a mosin nagant. Sounds like a fun project though
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wes126</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I never knew people put that much effort into a mosin nagant. </div></div>

I see comments like this a lot - not trying to stir up anything. But, the 91/30 platform has been proven time and time again in competitions to be a very accurate rifle. The WWII PU sniper rifle, despite it being mass-produced and rough by US or Euro standards was deadly and in comparisons fared extremely well.

On top of that, they are now readily available and relatively inexpensive so they are a cheap investment to play with.

My restored ex-sniper is a tack driver and performed very well at both 300 and 600 yards against other vintage platforms. My first-time ever shooting in competition at 300 yards in a Vintage match I scored a 197 out of 200 with 7Xs. It clearly wasn't the rifle that was the problem.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Great thread with some great information. Decided to take the Mosin deer hunting this year for kicks. I had to get a scope on it quick, since I am horrible with irons. May not be the best quality, but I found 5 people running this LER scope. We'll see how it holds up, I go to sight it in tomorrow.

2012-09-18_21-19-33_255.jpg


For those who care I did this on the cheap. NCStar 2-7x32 pistol scope, UTG dovetail to Weaver rail and Burris Zee rings. Total cost was 66 dollars to my door. Gun also has a Timney trigger, so total investment was 266 bucks including the cost of the rifle.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Well i went back to the range today with a buddy, to shoot some reloads through it to see what shot well through my rifle and i could not get my scope to focus right so i shoot five rounds through it and well i found my problem, the scope broke. :-( my scope is a Ncstar 6x24x50, so i need to save some money and talk to the wife to get a new one, i want to get a nice one but i dont want to spend a fortune on one i guess i am looking for a medium price decent scope that will take a recoil from a Mosin Nagant (which is a .303) Any suggestions ????
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

What's your budget, and what size (1" or 30mm) are your rings?
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

That Bushy 10X is a great scope- have one on my son's K-31, but they're one inch tube.

Hunting application (I assume from your screen name)?
So you're looking for a variable, maybe a 3-9 or 4-12?

 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Yeah i need to hunt fields and light woods so a varuable scope would be nice i would be ok with a 3x9 but a 4x12 would be nicier.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Look into Redfield scopes. Owned by Leupold and holds similar quality and warranty. Great price for a hunting scope IMO.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Beautiful Custom in 59 Mosin. Really beautiful.
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

Why don't you shoot this in the Bolt Rifle 100 yard thread?

DISCLAIMER: My co-worker is a big, big mosin guy and is always giving me a hard-time about my new-money wonder-sticks. Seeing this run tight groups would just tickle him to death.

TTR
 
Re: My Mosin Nagant Project

i am on a stand still till i get a new scope my previous scope got a loose lens so i need to wait till i get a new scope or get my scope back from being fixed. But i have been working some hand loads for it. I loaded .311 150gr spitzer with 50gr IMR 4350, and .308 150 gr sp with 50 gr of IMR 4350. also i am going to try .312 170gr flat nose with 50gr IMR 4350 for fun just to see how they shoot. I will defently be posting resaults on here when i go back to the range with it.
 
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