Fieldcraft Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

[gatorglockman]

Looking for pros/cons for using a non insulated/non nomex flight suit or set of coveralls for my ghillie suit build vs 2 piece (pants/jacket) uniform.

My pros: easier to build, faster to get on/off, maybe easier to pack, slightly cheaper to buy vs set of bdus/acus

My cons: worried about the zipper breaking down in usage vs buttons on bdus, hotter than bdus?

Anyone have advice or actually built one out with a coverall set up?

 

[earthquake]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

Depends on what you'll mostly use it for. I had a buddy in STA that made one out of a flight suit and he didn't like it much. Too hot and restricted movement. In low-crawl with arms extended out in front, it can draw up the pant legs. Most of the time too we only carried the top and the veil...made for a lighter load to carry. We didn't always need the pants. From my experience, the BDU route was more versatile. Not to say though that it can't be done with a flight suit. I have no experience with the zippers, but as you alluded too, crawling on your belly could damage a zipper easier than buttons I'd assume. Good luck.

 

[Genin]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COfox</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Depends on what you'll mostly use it for. I had a buddy in STA that made one out of a flight suit and he didn't like it much. Too hot and restricted movement. In low-crawl with arms extended out in front, it can draw up the pant legs. Most of the time too we only carried the top and the veil...made for a lighter load to carry. We didn't always need the pants. From my experience, the BDU route was more versatile. Not to say though that it can't be done with a flight suit. I have no experience with the zippers, but as you alluded too, crawling on your belly could damage a zipper easier than buttons I'd assume. Good luck. </div></div>

This gentleman's thoughts are along the line of mine. I just recently started my build but decided on a 2 piece for the reasons mentioned above. I thought it would be unholy hot and restrictive, plus I most likely will only be using the jacket and boonie most times. I think the pants will be used very sparingly.

 

[Strykervet]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

It is hotter than balls and the material isn't ripstop, so once you get a tear in those (and you will) it turns into a giant rip. This makes it nearly impossible to cut out and stitch in vents. The light non-nomex tanker overalls anyway. I was in a Stryker unit, they gave us these overalls (nomex and non-nomex) and one of the snipers in Batt. tried it and hated it. Plus you can't put skid plates on the coveralls that easy because of the zipper. Ripstop BDU's are the way to go, I liked the all cotton ones with the ripstop because they are cooler and thinner, but you HAVE to stitch on skids to the front or they'll tear up over time too. Replacing front buttons with industrial Velcro is more comfortable in my opinion as well.

Craigslist in places with army bases will generally have LOTS of gear for cheap. When soldiers get out, they want to get rid of most of that stuff.

There is a thread on here somewhere where guys were showing off their suits. There is one near the middle/bottom (when I saw it) that had a BDU with duffel bag material glued and sewn on the front with 1" or so netting on the back. Anyway, look at his and that is pretty much the ghillie du jour. That is how you are taught to make them, you can tweak the formula a bit (straps on the sleeves, Velcro, etc.) but that is the main recipe that just works for pretty much everyone.

In fact, I've never seen a sniper bring anything but to the field. But I'm sure there are some that may prefer the coverall, I just never met one.

 

[Victory]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

Everything everyone already said. Not rip stop, too heavy, holds too much water weight, doesn't dry out as fast.

Better options out there.

 

[Strykervet]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: victory</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Everything everyone already said. Not rip stop, too heavy, holds too much water weight, doesn't dry out as fast.

Better options out there.</div></div>

I'm talking about the shitty Propper BDU uniforms that are all cotton. They have a brighter green and stand out in a formation. You won't find a thinner, cooler uniform. It was why I used them. The only nylon was the ripstop threading (the little squares).

Downside is they aren't as rugged as issue BDU's are. They need full coverage in the front for crawling or they won't last long. But they are the coolest thing I found by far.

 

[Victory]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

BDU's aren't the greatest color to use for a ghilie, but they have been used for years, too much black.

Also do not use velcro on a ghillie. Its too loud and doesn't hold together on stalks and ghillie washes.

 

[gatorglockman]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

Thx boys! I appreciate the insight and prevention of making a mistake.

 

[earthquake]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

When I got to STA, I made mine out of the 3-color desert BDU for the top. The veil (headpiece) is a woodland boonie hat, and the trousers are the winter weight woodland pattern, but very faded. I still have it after 20 years! Kinda sentimental.

I only kept my dress blues and ghillie suit.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Flight suit/coveralls for ghillie build?

I used to help out with a friend selling his own brand (VAS Racing) of Nomex racing suits for Race Car Drivers.

He had two sets of designs; those for drivers, and those for crew.

Drivers, by the nature of their mission, perform very few activities that require an extended range of motion, and their fire suits are made in one piece.

Crew are all over the place, moving fast and performing broad motions, and their fire suits are made in two pieces, an upper, and a lower.

A ghillie requires two pieces, IMHO. One piece suits are too restrictive.

The Nomex, however makes good sense. the typical cotton/burlap ghillie is a dangerous firetrap. Not only the foundation garment, but the foliage would benefit from being made of Nomex. Not cheap, but how much does months in a burn ward cost?

Nomex is not fireproof, but it will not melt to add complexity to injuries (like Nylon and most other synthetics), and it will not feed combustion. It chars, slowly. It's primary advantage is to remain intact, shielding and insulating the wearer from direct flame.

Their ratings are based on the time they will withstand direct flame, preventing the degree of heat passage that begins producing burn injury; and the higher the rating, the more layers of Nomex.

To be truly effective, even the stitching must be composed of Nomex thread.

I no longer have access to such materials, and do not have a ghillie because of that lack. I flatly refuse to construct a ghillie that is not made of 100% Nomex.

My friend's suits began at $400 (Club/NASCAR Racing), to about $1K (Indy/F1 Racing), and went up to several $K (Land Speed Record attempts). Their prices undersold big name brands (Momo, Alpine Star, which he also sold.) by about 40%. He also produces custom fit replica vintage racings suits made of Nomex, where the originals provided zero fire protection.

The stated prices are/were just for what would be a one-piece ghillie foundation garment, two piece garments cost more to make.

What a racer pays for is protection time before their vehicle can come to rest and help can reach them. If you crash and burn doing 220MPH that's one duration (up to several minutes before deceleration to zero, extinguishment, and extrication, and not all race cars are as safe as NASCAR racers); if you're doing Mach1+, it's considerably longer. No suit will protect indefinitely.

Greg