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Range Report Horus Atrag: Kestrel vs. PDA ???

idaho1

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Oct 10, 2011
379
3
61
North Idaho
I'm looking for some feedback on using the Horus Atrag software in either/or the Kestrel 4500 or the PDA version.

Which one is more useful or rather easier to use in a practical scenario?
It seems after watching the various videos on youtube, the PDA might be a little more versatile??

Comments?
 
In a nutshell:

The kestrel does work, but:

- no G7 BC
- no firmware updates
- poor at best support from Horus
- Kestrel's support forum requires that any post you make be approved by the site owner, so if you ask something no exactly flattering about the product... Your question never gets answered....

I'm not sure of the current status "gun library" software, but I do have issues with any product that requires to to enter multiple velocities for the G1 BC... When the military version supports G7.
 
FYI

On the Horus website they indicate a kestrel with "AtragMX," but there is no indication on what the Atrag vs AtragMX kestrel differences are.

The pages only describe the "atrag" version....
 
I think the PDA will give you more options really the only benefit to a kestrel is that you get your DA from weather conditions so it does help in that aspect but for me I run the WHIZ wheel and I have had good luck with it.
 
Plus, Todd H. does 2 VERY in-depth looks into the PDA version and basically barney-style teaches you how to use it. However, I know people with the Kestrel version and they seem satisfied. But i'm a total PDA man.
 
And yet they still don't have an iPhone or other smart phone app for Atrag. I am still using this old POS tungsten PDA that is on its last leg and I really don't want to buy yet another obsolete piece of equipment to run the program.
 
I'd like to see a feature comparison of apps like Shooter/Applied Ballistics vs Kestrel/Atrag vs FFS
 
I snagged a Horus setup with the Trimble Recon and CF software at a gun show for a good price (< 700) and I also have a Kestrel with the Horus software.

The PDA is definitely easier to use.

The Kestrel works, but entering data is a bit arcane and takes some practice, and it takes much longer to punch through the data fields and pages on the Kestrel.

I try to duplicate my main gun database records to both devices to keep them synched, but I keep the Kestrel mostly as a last-ditch backup for the times when either I don't have the Recon or its batteries die. I believe in the rule of threes, so I also have a couple of programs on my iPhone.

The problem I have with the PDA is that the basic version didn't come with either bluetooth or wifi, or gps. I obtained a Trimble GPS SD card that I can use, but it's bulky and sticks out the top, requiring an extended top cap, and it eats batteries like crazy. I'm looking for a bluetooth SD that I might be able to use to link to the Kestrel to transfer the met data but haven't tried it yet.

The Recon will work with a stand-alone GPS like a Garmin GPS-60C if you have a serial to GPS cable for the GPS.

I also installed the Cold Bore software on the PDA so I can run either, but it took forever to figure out how to get Cold Bore to recognize my GPS. Turns out you have to have the port settings right and NOT use the "GPS manager" software in the PDA. Once it was configured properly it grabs locations just fine in Cold Bore, but because I don't have bluetooth I can't import met data from the Kestrel.

Seems like I need the bluetooth CF card (you can get the Recon with wifi and bluetooth built in on Ebay) and a stand-alone GPS like the Garmin to use Cold Bore with all the bells and whistles.

ATRAG doesn't accept GPS data (are you listening Horus?) so all I need is bluetooth for linking the Kestrel.

In sum, I like having both the Recon and the Kestrel with ATRAG. I can pick and choose which level of ease of use versus amount of equipment/weight I want to use for any given situation. I can grab the Kestrel, the Terrapin rangefinder and my rifle and have all the necessary gear with minimal weight, or I can bring the PDA system for full integration if I'm not trying to hump it all through the boonies.

Somebody makes a wristwatch with Horus ATRAG on it too, though I forget who. I was going to buy one of those a while back but they seem to have disappeared off the market.
 
5.11 makes the watch and it retailed for around 200 bucks. Amazon has them for 216 but I have not used one or know anyone that owns one. From the looks of it, the info would be limited and you would need to cycle through a bunch of info that is easily seen on a single PDA screen.
 
I have a Trimble recon with AtragMX and I have AE, Shooter, istrelok on iphone/ipad. As has been mentioned, it's a pain to input data on the kestrel. I prefer working on the PDA quiet honestly. It is bigger but I prefer the ease of use with the screens on the PDA. I also find Atrag on the PDA to be more user friendly than AE and the other programs I mentioned. The PDA version of Atrag also allows you to update the software, the kestrel doesn't. My vote is for PDA.
 
I've used the horus Kestrel and I'm honestly most happy with the kestrel 4000 or 4500 with a PDA with a bluetooth link between the two. I'm an Android user and I prefer the Applied Ballistics application. However shooter is just as good if you're willing to do the force balancing of velocities for actual data manually. Its kinda nice that Applied Ballistics will allow you to input actual yardages and drops and it will automatically force balance the velocity for you. In shooter you'd have to manually change the velocity to get the tables to match up. The Shooter application is like 10 bucks where as Applied Ballistics is around 30. I'm very happy with either but always keep around a laminated card with data on it as a backup.

~Brett
 
I've used the horus Kestrel and I'm honestly most happy with the kestrel 4000 or 4500 with a PDA with a bluetooth link between the two. I'm an Android user and I prefer the Applied Ballistics application. However shooter is just as good if you're willing to do the force balancing of velocities for actual data manually. Its kinda nice that Applied Ballistics will allow you to input actual yardages and drops and it will automatically force balance the velocity for you. In shooter you'd have to manually change the velocity to get the tables to match up. The Shooter application is like 10 bucks where as Applied Ballistics is around 30. I'm very happy with either but always keep around a laminated card with data on it as a backup.

~Brett

What data is the Kestrel sending to the PDA besides wind?

I have shot a few times with some guys who have this thing, not sure if it has any performance advantage besides maybe being rugged? It's physically large.
Horus Vision
 
Well I just attended another shooting school were I was able to run a kestrel atrag and above I mentioned how I just make the whiz wheel work. Don't get my wrong I love that thing but overall I would recommend the kestrel and for being slow the range card is adjustable to increments of 10 to 100 so finding your data is really quick. It takes longer to range the target with laser or milling it.
 
I'm going through this right now. Bought a 4500nv with Bluetooth and I think I'm gonna buy a google nexus 7 mini tablet to run some android software. About 230 bucks for the tablet. Recon pda is 1500-2k. Pda's are such old decrepit pieces of technology I would never even consider it. The nexus 7 is really light has great battery life micro SD access. Smart bluetooth. And a much larger and easier to use touch screen. I'm surprised this isn't a more popular option people recommend


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I'm going through this right now. Bought a 4500nv with Bluetooth and I think I'm gonna buy a google nexus 7 mini tablet to run some android software. About 230 bucks for the tablet. Recon pda is 1500-2k. Pda's are such old decrepit pieces of technology I would never even consider it. The nexus 7 is really light has great battery life micro SD access. Smart bluetooth. And a much larger and easier to use touch screen. I'm surprised this isn't a more popular option people recommend


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You can find gently used Recon and Nomad units for about 500-700 if you shop around. It is more than a nexus but you get a ruggedized unit that has a true GPS capability as well as BT and wifi (model dependent). If you buy just a plain old PDA you're looking at about a couple hundred bucks or less. Hell you can get one from Horus with Atrag on it for $500 in an Otter box. If going inexpensive is the goal, get an older ipod and put a ballistic software app on it. If you ever want to run software like FFS,coldbore , you'll need a windows based device. Just something to think about and options that are available.
 
Depends on the situation. In a match setting I would likely use the PDA (or just go with Shooter on an I-phone). For hunting, I like the Kestrel w/ ATRAG. In fact I used this setup to help my wife take a muley buck @ 507 yds this year.
 
You can find gently used Recon and Nomad units for about 500-700 if you shop around. It is more than a nexus but you get a ruggedized unit that has a true GPS capability as well as BT and wifi (model dependent). If you buy just a plain old PDA you're looking at about a couple hundred bucks or less. Hell you can get one from Horus with Atrag on it for $500 in an Otter box. If going inexpensive is the goal, get an older ipod and put a ballistic software app on it. If you ever want to run software like FFS,coldbore , you'll need a windows based device. Just something to think about and options that are available.

The idea behind the nexus is the bluetooth and android operating system to run the software. The hardware on the nexus absolutelyyyyy blows any of the other options out of the water in terms of speed and performance. It may not be as rugged as the nomad but you can buy a case waterproof for 5 meters for 20 bucks. Not to mention it also has wifi and I believe can connect to 3G and give you map and coordinate data. I can run rtballistic on it and get real time data sent from my kestrel including wind direction which many other apps don't offer. All this for less than the price of a used Trimble.


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You will have GPS as long as you have cell coverage, go out of cell signal range and you're hosed. PDAs also have GPS /map software thats useful when you don't have cell coverage

I think most people put more usefulness on the BT feature until they use it. Environmentally the only thing thats going to change quickly past initial set up for the day is the wind and its not really that big of a deal to have to manually input that reading as you put updated range info into the pda. The most you are looking at saving time on is hourly updating those other environmentals , if they change much at all from hour to hour. I've also seen people spend time trying to get the two devices to talk to one another than it would take to just do it manually.As for speed/performance, I don't know what you hope to gain as even an old generation ipod can kick out firing solutions incredibly quick. Wifi, pdas have it too but unless you're in wifi range and or have a need to check your email or surf the net, its not gonna help you ring steel.

Don't get me wrong, you can probably make that set up work for you if the kestrel will talk to the nexus. I'd check that in store with your kestrel before you buy the nexus. But I think your putting more emphasis on the nexus and the BT link than it's worth IMO.
 
You will have GPS as long as you have cell coverage, go out of cell signal range and you're hosed. PDAs also have GPS /map software thats useful when you don't have cell coverage

I think most people put more usefulness on the BT feature until they use it. Environmentally the only thing thats going to change quickly past initial set up for the day is the wind and its not really that big of a deal to have to manually input that reading as you put updated range info into the pda. The most you are looking at saving time on is hourly updating those other environmentals , if they change much at all from hour to hour. I've also seen people spend time trying to get the two devices to talk to one another than it would take to just do it manually.As for speed/performance, I don't know what you hope to gain as even an old generation ipod can kick out firing solutions incredibly quick. Wifi, pdas have it too but unless you're in wifi range and or have a need to check your email or surf the net, its not gonna help you ring steel.

Don't get me wrong, you can probably make that set up work for you if the kestrel will talk to the nexus. I'd check that in store with your kestrel before you buy the nexus. But I think your putting more emphasis on the nexus and the BT link than it's worth IMO.

There's no place I shoot where I don't have cell coverage. Also I have a rangefinder I use for ranging. If the batteries die I just mil. No big deal


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I have a kestrel save your money and download the bulletflight app to your I phone the Kestrel is not any better than a 35 dollar downloadable app and bulletflight is faster to use and it downloads your local weather conditions
 
The newer generation of cell phones should be capable of running even the most complex ballistic software assuming that t he software is ported to to the OS of the phone? I just picked up a Sony z2 that has a ridiculous onboard capacity as well as SD card. At 2.3ghz the processor is faster in theory than my laptop!

I would love to run FFS on this rather than dragging my Trimble brick around.
 
For the last two years I've been running Patagonia's ColdBore on a Trimble Juno and always had great performance out of the GPS module (Targeting) as well as from the Kestrel BT link. Not a single hicup. Setting up the GPS is very easy, just followed the User's manual and I was getting signals in less than 1 minute. It's really a very straightforward procedure. Now, I've moved to the Phone edition on a Nokia running Windows Phone and it's absolutely a new standard for me. Performance wise is absolutely stunning, calcs and recals take less than a split second, the GPS module now has new features including Mapping on real maps, etc, etc. The only thing I miss over the Trimble is the mil-spec package, having said that, ColdBore on the smartphone is truly outstanding, not to mention that I can sync all of my data back and forth from my PC running the Desktop version.