Thinking of speeding up some of the process for brass prep. Mainly primer pocket uniforming, flash hole debur, chamfer/debur mouth. Wondering if should buy a case prep center power tool or buy a $70 Harbor Freight bench top drill press (760-3000 rpm range)?
- Thread starter bbowles
- Start date
Id start with a giraud so that when you trim to length debur and chamfer will be taken care of. Regards primer pocket cleaning and flash hole debur consider if your skills/needs will be able to take advantage of any possible benefit gained.
I trim with a Dilon RT 1200. The trimming process is lightening fast and convenient. I could probably stop there and be content shooting as good as my ability will allow.
My OCD requires that I chamfer and debur because the RT1200 does a good job but the mouth of the case will shave a little bit of copper when seating my BT bullets. This damage likely effects my rounds little if any but I bought a Hornady 3 in one case prep center anyway to chamfer/debur. The third station I use for primer pocket cleaning because it is there.
By far performing these steps on the 3in1 is the most time costly step of my brass prep. Does taking the time provide results on target - probably not - but I feel better and gives me a chance to do something mindless and just relax.
Pmclaine,
I forgot to mention I have the Sinclair Ultimate trimmer. Haven't used it yet but nice unit with the platform and micrometer. I agree speed isn't all important. I too enjoy the whole process. Just got new reloading equip. Haven't reloaded in 20 years but excited to get back into it. Best to get drill press or prep center or just do by hand?
I forgot to mention I have the Sinclair Ultimate trimmer. Haven't used it yet but nice unit with the platform and micrometer. I agree speed isn't all important. I too enjoy the whole process. Just got new reloading equip. Haven't reloaded in 20 years but excited to get back into it. Best to get drill press or prep center or just do by hand?
For my brass that goes through my AR I use a cordless drill and chuck up several different tools. Works great for bulk but for precision ammo I use the hand tools for better control. I prep 400-500 rounds of .223 brass at a time for my AR so speed is important but for my precision rifle I usually deal with 50-60 pieces of brass at a time so I use a Lyman trimmer, hand chamfer and de-burr and clean the primer pockets by hand. I enjoy the process of prepping brass for my precision rifle. It all comes down to checking run out on that finished round and seeing zero or near zero run out knowing that is the best ammo you can make.
It sounds like you are loading for a precision bolt rifle and I may have been in error for assuming everyone loads for an AR as I am doing. My apologies.
You know the steps you want to do and either tool will work for you. I bought the Hornady 3 in 1 because of its small footprint. The other prep centers seems to be a bit bigger but depending on which one offer more stations. If I were willing to commit to a peice of equipment of the size of either a drill press or a prep station Id go with the drill press because you could also use it for jobs other than case prep. Thats just my opinion.
I load on a Dillon, its a good machine but I think if ultimate consistency in ammo is required the more individualized function special purpose design of your tools the better quality your production.
M
milo 2.0
Guest
I'd steer clear of that cheap ass drill press, at 70.00, what do you think the tolerances are?
760 rpm is moving fast!!
760 rpm is moving fast!!
Maybe I just need to by hand as have before. Agree that drill press is cheap but gets me thinking case prep centers prob not great for accuracy either. Loading for ar right now but getting bolt gun for distance soon so going thru steps for precision and enjoy most of the reloading steps. Thanks!
I use a Wilson case trimmer with micrometer and drill bit adapter and a Lyman case prep center for chamfer, deburr, and primer pocket work. Everything comes out very clean. For the .308 I use the hand crank, for 5.56 I use the drill bit because I'm using it in a semi auto so I'm not too worried about being perfect. But the micrometer is amazingly accurate.
The spinning tools on my Hornady 3 in 1 rotate on an axis that varies a few degrees north than south. Not much precision there and there is little chance you will get consistent hand pressure case to case.
The Giraud will give you consistency.
Im thinking of getting the little crow gunwerks trimmer, looks like a solid performer and much cheaper!
Thought about the giraud but like the Sinclair micrometer version since can slow down if want to for more precision. Don't understand how chamfer/debur and primer pocket uniformity could be more accurate by hand.
How can we hold these hand tools straighter into case than holding in a case prep center or a drill press? Precision is more important to me. But do want to do these 3 brass steps faster and still have precision.
I would think that a cheap drill press would be as accurate as these case prep centers but that is what I want to know. Thanks.
How can we hold these hand tools straighter into case than holding in a case prep center or a drill press? Precision is more important to me. But do want to do these 3 brass steps faster and still have precision.
I would think that a cheap drill press would be as accurate as these case prep centers but that is what I want to know. Thanks.
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M
milo 2.0
Guest
You may be right, but buy a pen drilling vise to center case. Woodturning stores will have them, at 760rpm, you're not going to be able to hang on to the cases. Most prep centers should run 75-150 rpm tops.
I take the handle off the RCBS case trimmer and directly chuck a 18v Dewalt to it. No adapter, no nothing. The RCBS trim center, while seeming sort of silly, has been VERY handy. It'll spin 4 tools simultaneously and has fixed brushes too --very handy, you can do all prep at once with that thing including primer chamfer.
A drill press would take way too long for me. But I process lots at a time and load single stage only, so I need all the help I can get.
The powder/trickler/scale combo is a nice item too --cross between speeding things up, reducing error and increasing time to inspect steps (I seat and inspect while the dispenser drops the next load).
All that combined about doubles or triples (depending on round) the amount I can load vs. doing it the "basic way".
A drill press would take way too long for me. But I process lots at a time and load single stage only, so I need all the help I can get.
The powder/trickler/scale combo is a nice item too --cross between speeding things up, reducing error and increasing time to inspect steps (I seat and inspect while the dispenser drops the next load).
All that combined about doubles or triples (depending on round) the amount I can load vs. doing it the "basic way".
I have the Lyman case prepping drill setup. It is handheld and rechargeable. Comes with chamfer and debur. As well as primer pocket crimp remover and cleaner.
I'd steer clear of Harbor Freight period. Just from experience. Company I worked for tried to save a few shekels by getting tools there. Never seen one that wasn't junk or didn't fail on the job. Even their bungee cords failed faster than, say, ones from Auto Zone.
Thought about the WFT in addition to giraud but went with the Sinclair/Wilson. Might add a power trimmer in future but my question is other case prep and whether to use power or not.
If power, which version: cheap drill press, case prep center, etc? Thanks.
If power, which version: cheap drill press, case prep center, etc? Thanks.
Been thinking about the trimming operation now that some have mentioned the Giraud and some the Little Crow WFT.
Did I make a mistake paying $200 for Sinclair Ultimate Trimmer with micrometer? Especially comparing to the WFT. Per the video this seems very accurate.
Bought the Sinclair for absolute accuracy and don't need to have absolute speed but if I can have my cake and eat it to?
Did I make a mistake paying $200 for Sinclair Ultimate Trimmer with micrometer? Especially comparing to the WFT. Per the video this seems very accurate.
Bought the Sinclair for absolute accuracy and don't need to have absolute speed but if I can have my cake and eat it to?
Brux how do you like the WFT? Accurate?
You bought a dynamite tool. Sinclair makes nice stuff and usually due to their small scale they charge accordingly.
If you are making 20-30 rounds at a whack and want to have the ultimate in control your mini lathe is the tits. I wish I had one for load developement when I just dont want to prep the progressive press. I like to haves boxes of ammo when leaving the bench not that one perfect box.
Id use the mini lathe to figure out ideal trim length if you want to customize to your rifles chamber than set up a Giraud, Little Crow or Dillon for bulk production.
If you do trim to your chamber be wary of shooting your ammo in any other gun.
....but if your Sinclair is in the wrap suitable for return, I would send it back and put the money toward a Giraud.
Further note - RCBS makes a mini lathe type trimmer that has a cutting head that will trim, debur and chamfer in one operation. Maybe that cutter is adaptable to the Sinclair.
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I trim my high volume stuff on a Giraud, and my precision stuff on a Wilson/Sinclair. I use a cordless drill to power the tools like primer pocket uniformers and flash hole deburring. A friend uses one of those Harbor Freight drill presses for his case prep, but he wired a sewing machine foot control pedal to it so he could slow it down and use both hands. I always kinda wanted a mini-lathe, but I really don't have room for one.
I posted a thread last summer about having a case prep party. Several of us got together and divided up the work, where someone did one of the steps in case prep. IE, flash hole deburring, primer pocket uniforming, primer crimp removal, ect. One of the guys brought his case prep center and it worked fine. After trying it, most of us liked the cordless drills better.
I posted a thread last summer about having a case prep party. Several of us got together and divided up the work, where someone did one of the steps in case prep. IE, flash hole deburring, primer pocket uniforming, primer crimp removal, ect. One of the guys brought his case prep center and it worked fine. After trying it, most of us liked the cordless drills better.
A look at the respective web sites will tell you that.
I'd definitely say stay with the Sinclair. The time savings with the Giraud starts coming in when you have multiple hundreds of cases. I'm not saying there isn't any benefit; just that once you get used to it the Sinclair is 'fast enough' for what you're working with right now. I have both, and my general thumbrule is =<100pcs per caliber, I stick with the Sinclair/Wilson setup. >=300pcs I order the appropriate bits for my Giraud.
The Sinclair tools are good stuff. Use what you have now and see how it goes. You will be making some consistent trimmed ammo.
You will know when you want to get a Giraud.
That leaves you only to decide your first question drill press, case prep center or hand tools. Whatever you do if you buy quality stuff like your Sinclair trimmer you can realize back some of your cost on a resale or it remains in your collection of tools to be used.
No easy answer without knowing how much you shoot. Keep in mind if you are just starting to reload you will probably shoot double what you used to shoot.
You will know when you want to get a Giraud.
That leaves you only to decide your first question drill press, case prep center or hand tools. Whatever you do if you buy quality stuff like your Sinclair trimmer you can realize back some of your cost on a resale or it remains in your collection of tools to be used.
No easy answer without knowing how much you shoot. Keep in mind if you are just starting to reload you will probably shoot double what you used to shoot.
That's about what I do and I got tired of using the Lyman attached to a drill. You may like trimming brass tho ii
It depends on how much you hate brass prep. That is my least favorite aspect of reloading. I like the reloading part itself. Tumbling and ultrasonic cleaning don't bother me.
I just don't care to trim, remove military crimp, or clean the primer pockets.
I'm at your point now. Trying to decide on Giraud vs WFT.
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I just don't care to trim, remove military crimp, or clean the primer pockets.
I'm at your point now. Trying to decide on Giraud vs WFT.
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Yeah I chose the WFT because it's a lot cheaper, and if I get another one for my 300 WSM, it's only 70 and I don't have to change any of the settings, just chuck and go! It should be here Wednesday. All I care about is if it is precise.
I use the kwik case trimmers from Possum Hollow. Cheap and effective.
https://www.possumhollowproducts.com/KWICK_CASE_TRIMMERS.html
I process thousands of cases at a time when I'm making plinking ammo for AR-15s.
I process 200 at a time when I'm prepping Lapua brass for the precision rifles.
I have a tabletop milling machine (RF-30) but these could be used with a hand drill if necessary.
After several hundred cases it can become difficult to hold onto the cases to keep them from spinning, so I picked up a pair of rubber coated work glove from Home Depot.
I trim, then chuck up an OD chamfer tool, then the ID chamfer tool (actually opposite ends of the same tool).
A multi station tool would definitely save me time; there is a fair amount of productivity time lost to handling, so finishing all the operations on one case in one handling would be a plus.
Joe
https://www.possumhollowproducts.com/KWICK_CASE_TRIMMERS.html
I process thousands of cases at a time when I'm making plinking ammo for AR-15s.
I process 200 at a time when I'm prepping Lapua brass for the precision rifles.
I have a tabletop milling machine (RF-30) but these could be used with a hand drill if necessary.
After several hundred cases it can become difficult to hold onto the cases to keep them from spinning, so I picked up a pair of rubber coated work glove from Home Depot.
I trim, then chuck up an OD chamfer tool, then the ID chamfer tool (actually opposite ends of the same tool).
A multi station tool would definitely save me time; there is a fair amount of productivity time lost to handling, so finishing all the operations on one case in one handling would be a plus.
Joe
