I have never been in a union.Have you personaly ever held a union job?
Have you ever worked at the
same facility on the same project as union labor?
Also some of you are le.
Are you also in a union?
And is your opinion of the workers the same?
Interesting vewpoint all of a sudden isn't it.
It's too bad the days of the carrier being the dominant ship of a Naval force are at an end...While I would keep an eye on the Chinese--make sure its an apples to apples comparison. Dropping a coastal vessel is not the same as dropping a capital ship. Capital Ships and Submarines win wars.
Also wrt to Aircraft Carriers, air operations is not something you manufacter--its something learned over long periods of time and a very important part of carrier group operations.
I'm not an engineer, but I am fairly confident that constructing the largest, most technologically advanced aircraft carrier is more involved than making pry bars and hammers.Let me tell you what I do know..... My son was in Iraq (Photo).... Me and my welding crew were building hammers, pry bars and entry tools so they could make entry in some bad places and shipping it to them... Funny thing... The US Government spends billions on a boat and can't get a pry bar for a grunt in a war zone... Once again, I hope America does not have to fight a war.
Hobo
What did you do before you were blessed with the union? And after?I'll tell you one of the worst things about the union leadership.
The stupid basterds still support democrats.
And that was my demise in the end.
Most Euro manufacturing, auto builders and shipyards run with unionized workforces not only that workers and unions often have a seat on company bards and they are still quite successful .
I worry like hell that is the case. Of course our subs are pretty good as well, so between them and missle tech, we are probably ok. But only an idiot has full confidence.It's too bad the days of the carrier being the dominant ship of a Naval force are at an end...
Im pretty sure they do tests of this type on most navy vessels. Post 4 is a video talking about ship shock trials and the vessel in it isn't a carrier.I wonder if this is standard testing for new carriers.
Or if its a test against some anti ship missile or torpedo.
I worked T-33, F4, F-15 and F-111's for our Uncle.What did you do before you were blessed with the union? And after?
Understood.... In your opinion... Would an EMP disable this boat ?I'm not an engineer, but I am fairly confident that constructing the largest, most technologically advanced aircraft carrier is more involved than making pry bars and hammers.
However, two big thumbs up for supporting your son and his fellow warfighters.
That carrier will enable the Navy to bring the hate on our enemies that are attacking those Marines.
Having been in mine warfare (the underwater type) for 24 years of my 24 years of active duty, I understand why these tests are done.
The way the government does budgets encourages fraud, waste and abuse.
Sorry to say that the Marine Corps is second only to the Coast Guard when it comes to funding.
Lol do you not read the news.There are police unions from one end of the country to the other.
So you lump all those people as lousy, lazy and unskilled at thier job.
So another opinion without basis.
There are police unions from one end of the country to the other.
So you lump all those people as lousy, lazy and unskilled at thier job.
Nice going.
You also don't know shit about union workers.
I did underwater mines, not electronic warfare. I also punched out of the Navy back in 06.Understood.... In your opinion... Would an EMP disable this boat ?
IDK... Seems like they spend a lot of time in the boat yardI did underwater mines, not electronic warfare. I also punched out of the Navy back in 06.
I know they harden them against EMP and other electronic attacks.
I don't know why you have such a hard-on for this vessel.
Shock tests are done on any new class of vessel.
Here is a shock test of the USS Avenger, all 224 feet of her wooden hull:
View attachment 7652429
Well, operating in Salt water for extended periods is hard on shit.IDK... Seems like they spend a lot of time in the boat yard
Over Half of US Aircraft Carriers in Dry Dock for Repairs – Report
Aircraft carriers are one of the key weapons in the US arsenal and which it often uses in strike groups deployed to regions where Washington wants to project its military might. They are frequent guests in the Persian Gulf and South China...sputniknews.com
Sure, they are great for the people who benefit from them. Not unlike a multi level marketing scheme is.I always have initial doubts with absolute statements. Having heard horror stories on both sides of the debate, it leaves me wondering. Are there any modern benefits to unions?
It's too bad the days of the carrier being the dominant ship of a Naval force are at an end...
I did underwater mines, not electronic warfare. I also punched out of the Navy back in 06.
I know they harden them against EMP and other electronic attacks.
I don't know why you have such a hard-on for this vessel.
Shock tests are done on any new class of vessel.
Here is a shock test of the USS Avenger, all 224 feet of her wooden hull:
View attachment 7652429
That's the reality of them these days. Probably the best statement on this thread.I always have initial doubts with absolute statements. Having heard horror stories on both sides of the debate, it leaves me wondering. Are there any modern benefits to unions?
This is patently ridiculous and the kind of stupidity you get when you consider labor to be an undifferentiated product. Without unions people would be hired and paid based on marginal utility, as happens in other industries. Yes, some people would make less, but also some people would make more.Without unions all jobs would be filled with the lowest bidder sheep regardless of experience and ran by incompetent management also lowest bidder.
So, unions are basically an extortion racket? Awesome. I mean, back in the day you guys farmed this part out, but now I see you are out of the closet.Reality these days is the union is the cheapest way the company has to protect itself from lawsuits.
Those same people will want to exempt police nurses other emergency services from the same scrutiny and blanket caims of lazy overpaid ect.
In your opinion... Would an EMP disable this boat ?
Without unions all jobs would be filled with the lowest bidder sheep regardless of experience and ran by incompetent management also lowest bidder.
Oh wait? We allready do that and look at the fucking mess we have.
Without unions all jobs would be filled with the lowest bidder sheep regardless of experience and ran by incompetent management also lowest bidder.
This is patently ridiculous and the kind of stupidity you get when you consider labor to be an undifferentiated product. Without unions people would be hired and paid based on marginal utility, as happens in other industries. Yes, some people would make less, but also some people would make more.
So, unions are basically an extortion racket? Awesome. I mean, back in the day you guys farmed this part out, but now I see you are out of the closet.
This is a strawman. Literally everybody in this thread is against public employee unions, which includes police. There is simply no justification for them. They are a terrible mix of conflict of interest plus extortion.
It's too bad the days of the carrier being the dominant ship of a Naval force are at an end...
Fine for beating up on stone age man but wont last long when coming to terms with technology from this century.
It may be a marginal benefit, but only because it is the system that exists. We live in a world where it is easy to find anything. You can find a dominatrix in seconds from the comfort of your home. Finding a qualified welder shouldn't pose significant problems after some readjustment of the marketplace.It seems you are merely thinking of the collective bargaining aspect of unions. Not having to deal with unions, I have nothing to add to that element of the discussion, but I can see merit in your arguments.
What I was curious about was the benefit from an organization providing a pool of qualified candidates outside of formal educational institutions, similar to trade guilds of the preindustrial period.
You can find a dominatrix in seconds
IDK... Seems like they spend a lot of time in the boat yard
Over Half of US Aircraft Carriers in Dry Dock for Repairs – Report
Aircraft carriers are one of the key weapons in the US arsenal and which it often uses in strike groups deployed to regions where Washington wants to project its military might. They are frequent guests in the Persian Gulf and South China...sputniknews.com
AKA: PravdaAbout Us
Sputnik is a modern news agency whose products include newsfeeds, websites, social networks, mobile apps, radio broadcasts and multimedia press centers.
Sputnik HQ is located in Moscow. Regional offices are located in key regions and countries around the world, including the United States (Washington, DC), China (Beijing), France (Paris), Germany (Berlin), Egypt (Cairo) and the UK (London and Edinburgh).
I think licensure is generally a scheme for people currently in a business to keep other people out of business in order to keep rates up. The best exposition on this is in Milton Friedman's Capitalism and Freedom. Technology, subcontracting etc are all good ideas. These are eminently soluble problems, nothing like putting a man on the moon. We already solve them for all sorts of non union labor.Perhaps, but is she good enough for a NY City Councilman? <--Joking of course.
So technology and licensure is the is answer or just relying upon subcontracting through brokers and vendors for large construction jobs?
My main customer for the last 10+ years has been the Navy. Make no mistake, nothing is taking its place. But a peer adversary has made the carrier a relic. When missile ranges and engagement times out strip the carrier's ability to support the fleet via air assets...then it has become outdated. As pmclaine stated, they're great for parking off the coast of a 3rd world country, and pounding them with air strikes. But that's not the kind of war you fight with a peer adversary.I'd be interested in hearing what took its place and how.
That is another story. I served on that ship, not when it ran aground though.Maybe that ship class should have had a reef test....
USS Guardian (MCM-5) - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
When missile ranges and engagement times out strip the carrier's ability to support the fleet via air assets...then it has become outdated.
I'd love to hear this too, if it is OK for open forum.We had a peer adversary at sea all through the mid 80s to the late 90s. Today's missiles aren't that much faster and longer ranged than the ones my generation faced.
Help me understand. Are you saying that missile flight times and profiles have defeated our current detection and engagement cycle time? Sorties aren't launched after weapons are inbound, so................feel free to PM if needed.
I think licensure is generally a scheme for people currently in a business to keep other people out of business in order to keep rates up. The best exposition on this is in Milton Friedman's Capitalism and Freedom.
True, but nowadays, the loss of a carrier would be catastrophic. 5K loss of live, versus 115 on a CRUDES. Math is pretty simple then; so the carriers will hang back. With the advent of drones and such, area defense/area denial has changed dramatically.@MarinePMI
Don't forget, area defense/area denial capability is nothing new. We faced it during the cold war as well and it was pretty damned potent then too.
True, but nowadays, the loss of a carrier would be catastrophic. 5K loss of live, versus 115 on a CRUDES. Math is pretty simple then; so the carriers will hang back. With the advent of drones and such, area defense/area denial has changed dramatically.
A lot sooner than you think...they're called large deck Amphibs. And there's a lot more of them than CVN's.I was curious when we will start to see dedicated drone carriers.