223 build considerations

[buckskin52]

Getting ready to build a 223 trainer. Already have a mcmillan a5, deviant action, fluted Schneider tubb contour 1in 8 barrel, defiance dbm with aics 10 rd mags, Probably going to put a jewell trigger in it. I am mainly going to be shooting 75gr amaxes out of it. Any considerations I should take when having the gun chambered to make sure I get max value out of the gun and bullet combo. Also ensure everything works well at mag length. Gun will be threaded and a 30ba adapter and tbac can. Would like the gun to be good out to 800 (yes that is a stretch but doable and will ensure I get good at wind calls). Any advice is appreciated.
Thanks

 

[turbo54]

My advice is:

80gr amax >> 75gr amax

Go 223 Ackley improved.

 

[rrflyer]

If your gonna do it go AI

 

[RHutch]

Annnnnd a third on the AI.

 

[Gary223]

I used my tikka t3 semi custom build with 25" 1:8 true flight barrel with the 75gr amax.
Have taken it out to 846yds so far hit a 12" 5 times in a row and then a fox cub steel target at the same range with the 6th round..
No need to AI the .223 if you have it set up right, also shoot the 80gr berger vld's with even better results.
Gary

 

[buckskin52]

For standard 223 should I have my smith Just use a standard reamer? I want to stay with a standard 223 and not ai, I do appreciate the responses.

 

[JayCarver]

My advice is:

80gr amax >> 75gr amax

Go 223 Ackley improved.

Turbo nailed it!

 

[BoilerUP]

Here's some inspiration for you:
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-bolt-action-rifles/132761-223.html

IMO:
1. You're gonna want a lot more freebore than SAMMI 223 Rem provides to maximize 75gr+ VLD type bullets.
2. 80gr Amax > 75gr Amax, but for some reason 75s are WAY more popular.
3. 1:7 twist > 1:8. 1:8 will shoot 75s just fine, but if you wanna run 80s a 1:7 twist will provide a bit more stability margin when its cold.
4. Try Varget *and* 8208XBR

 

[GSRswapandslow]

you REALLLLY should consider AI....i went AI and I'll NEVER go back

 

[Cacciatore]

On my .223 bolt, I went with a 28" barrel. It is the most enjoyable gun I have ever shot. I don't know what recoil is with that gun.

 

[Archer762]

Like BoilerUP, I also say 1:7 for the 80gr might be best

 

[Boogaloo]

Yep. I agree with the others so far.

I have the luxury of having 2 barrels that are being completed right now. One of them (1:7) I went Ackley Improved on, and the other (1:8) I went with a Wylde chamber in .223 standard. I have not had a chance to shoot either one since they are with Chad right now being hung on a trued Remington action.

Based on all of my research, you may run into some stability issues with the 1:8 twist and anything over 75gr. bullets. 75gr. AMAX's are nice though and should allow you to get out to 7 or 800 yards without too much fuss at all I would think.

I waffled a bit on going Ackley, but in the end, it is easy to fire form cases, and the extra (nearly) 2 grains of powder will allow me some decent options with powder speed and bullet selection to make a significant difference. I spent roughly $200.00 on dies for reloading AI once the cases are fire formed, and I am really looking forward to getting started with it.

Good luck on yours brother, but I would say, do a little bit of research on going Ackley before you dismiss it completely.

 

[buckskin52]

Is there a significant decrease in barrel life to the AI?

 

[Pappasniper]

I run the standard 5R 1/9 twist with 77grainers all the time. I run the SMK's. I shoot the 80 g but I have to hand load them which I dont really like. Anyone getting away with feeding them out of a magazine?

Yep. I agree with the others so far.

I have the luxury of having 2 barrels that are being completed right now. One of them (1:7) I went Ackley Improved on, and the other (1:8) I went with a Wylde chamber in .223 standard. I have not had a chance to shoot either one since they are with Chad right now being hung on a trued Remington action.

Based on all of my research, you may run into some stability issues with the 1:8 twist and anything over 75gr. bullets. 75gr. AMAX's are nice though and should allow you to get out to 7 or 800 yards without too much fuss at all I would think.

I waffled a bit on going Ackley, but in the end, it is easy to fire form cases, and the extra (nearly) 2 grains of powder will allow me some decent options with powder speed and bullet selection to make a significant difference. I spent roughly $200.00 on dies for reloading AI once the cases are fire formed, and I am really looking forward to getting started with it.

Good luck on yours brother, but I would say, do a little bit of research on going Ackley before you dismiss it completely.

 

[BoilerUP]

I run the standard 5R 1/9 twist with 77grainers all the time. I run the SMK's.

Its less the weight of the bullet, than the shape of the bullet.

You might run 77gr SMKs in a 1:9 and be just fine, but switch to the 75gr A-Max and you'll VERY likely have accuracy issues.

Case in point: per stability formulas, the 80gr SMK is "more" stable in a 1:9 barrel than a 75gr A-Max.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

Is there a significant decrease in barrel life to the AI?

i would not think so, certainly not enough to warrant NOT doing it

 

[nexusfire]

I wouldn't mind fuck it too much. I have a surgeon that is chambered (not sure what they call the reamer) in a manner that it will shoot the match ammo or the re manufactured stuff (i.e fiocchi). I shoot everything from 40-75 grain bullets without a problem. It is a 22" inch 1:8 twist Kreiger barrel. Many p dogs have died at the hands of this gun LOL.

 

[Mgordon]

I would run around .080" freebore on your .223 reamer if you want max performance out of the magazine with 75-80 gr bullets. Here are some numbers with a SAAMI .223 reamer with some popular bullets.

Mark

69 Gr SMK COAL = 2.278 with Comparator 2.885
77 Gr SMK COAL = 2.265 with Comparator 2.882
75 Gr Hornady Match =2.286 with comparator 2.862
75 Gr Hornady A-Max = 2.418 with comparator 2.881
77 Gr Nosler Match = 2.275” with out

 

[BoilerUP]

I would run around .080" freebore on your .223 reamer if you want max performance out of the magazine with 75-80 gr bullets. Here are some numbers with a SAAMI .223 reamer with some popular bullets.

Mark

69 Gr SMK COAL = 2.278 with Comparator 2.885
77 Gr SMK COAL = 2.265 with Comparator 2.882
75 Gr Hornady Match =2.286 with comparator 2.862
75 Gr Hornady A-Max = 2.418 with comparator 2.881
77 Gr Nosler Match = 2.275” with out

Mark,

Would you happen to know 80gr A-Max figures to add to that list?

Many thanks!

 

[buster hindend]

Bugholes built me .223 AI with 0.80 FB and it LOVES the 75 amax
I haven't tried the 80's yet but I some came in last week and I may try a few

 

[John L]

Your 1-8 barrel will be fine out to 1000 with any 75-82 gr. bullet made.

To Papasniper:
I run the Berger 82 at mag length, it looks a bit funny but have shot them out to 600 and it works great. Many will tell you it can't be done but I know quite a few doing it and it does work. 23.5 H4895 works good, start lower and work you way up.

 

[buckskin52]

Thanks everyone. I am still going to stay with the standard 223. May go ai in the future but for now I think I will stick with standard 223 with .80 freebore as suggested above. If anyone else has any input please feel free to add. Still waiting on the barrel.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Late to the feast, have completed preliminary (on paper at 100yd) sighting in of my https://www.mossberg.com/product/rifles-bolt-action-centerfire-mvp-series-mvp-predator/27711, and results are still sketchy, but I think I'm going to like this rifle a lot. No evidence of keyholing with 75gr MatchKing handloads at 50yd, 24.0gr Varget shows very little evidence of pressure. Feeds and shoots nicely with just about anything I can fit in the magazine, and may prove compatible with some of my AR loads. This may turn out to be our family (2 teenage Grandkiddos) 223 trainer.

I still have an eye out for one of these https://www.mossberg.com/product/rifles-bolt-action-centerfire-mvp-series-mvp-varmint/27700?u_field_prod_rifle_stock=Laminate+-+Bench+Rest@348&nodeRef=2470,2471,2744,2745,2746,2747,2748&redirect=1&filterNodes=2470,2745,2746 as well, for FV250.

Greg

 

[Mgordon]

I do not have the info on the 80 Gr A-Max.

Mark

 

[buckskin52]

Ordered a 223 match reamer from Dave kiff at ptg. Gonna run .80 freebore as suggested barrel just got here stock is on the way as of yesterday. Thanks for the help.
Side note Dave at ptg is great to deal with

 

[218bee]

+1 on Dave Kiff....

 

[josephberry]

I have my barrel, (3 groove Lilja, 7 twist) stock, etc, etc. I just need my action. Anyone have a 700, with a 223 bolt face for sale?

 

[awp762]

Thanks everyone. I am still going to stay with the standard 223. May go ai in the future but for now I think I will stick with standard 223 with .80 freebore as suggested above. If anyone else has any input please feel free to add. Still waiting on the barrel.

I went with a .088" freebore but .080 should be fine as others have said. I ordered the reamer from PTG. I am running a Bartlein 4G 1-8 twist using the 80gr SMK's. Only had them out to 500yds so far but they are stable & grouping well.

 

[Boogaloo]

Is there a significant decrease in barrel life to the AI?

Based on many days of scouring the web and asking questions, it is my understanding that if anything, barrel life is improved with an Ackley Improved .223
The shoulder angle seems to have the effect of NOT blow torching the throat. Similar to what guys see with .243 AI I'm told. This is internet "knowledge" and feedback from some people I have spoken with who's judgement I trust completely. NOT my own personal experience.

What I do know is that .223 is not a barrel burner anyway, so Ackley improving the cartridge really should not degrade barrel life expectancy.

Time will tell however since i just received my 223 AI barreled action back from the Long Rifles group buy 2 days ago. Fire forming brass starts Saturday.