I know, I know, it sounds pointless and highly improbable but its something I've wanted to try just to say I did. I'm wondering if anyone has any load data for anything out that far. Ive had great luck with 168gr smk out to a grand but I know that I'll need to go heavier. I know that the farther I push it, generally the heavier the better. However, if Im guessing that will eventually have a down side. Does anyone know, of a mile being done with a .308, if so anything about the load used? I'll be using a savage 10-fp 20". The elevation is around 1500 and the temp is usually in the 70s with >8mph wind.
- Thread starter Reaper21
- Start date
Re: .308 @ 1760....
get a ballistics calculator or use a free one on the web... the good ones will tell you that you'll be way subsonic at that speed. Your biggest challenge will be spotting and calling the misses at that distance.
get a ballistics calculator or use a free one on the web... the good ones will tell you that you'll be way subsonic at that speed. Your biggest challenge will be spotting and calling the misses at that distance.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Dont think its possible at your asl. Maybe at 10000ft. The 178amax at 2560fps goes subsonic at 1170 yards. You will need 126moa of elevation to make it there and you better have some serious spotting scopes. Its only bringing 270.5 ft lbs of energy with a 178 amax at a mile. But if you try it bring a camera and good luck.
Dont think its possible at your asl. Maybe at 10000ft. The 178amax at 2560fps goes subsonic at 1170 yards. You will need 126moa of elevation to make it there and you better have some serious spotting scopes. Its only bringing 270.5 ft lbs of energy with a 178 amax at a mile. But if you try it bring a camera and good luck.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I watched it get done with a Surgeon built 308 at 1580M on a 16 inch plate, however this was at about 9400 DA. I don't know how well it will work at your altitude.
He was using 175 SMK at about 2680. The bullet seemed to be transitioning into subsonic really well. It took something like 16 or 17 shots to do it. Most of the misses were left or right. It doesn't take a lot of wind to mess you up at that range. Have fun trying.
I watched it get done with a Surgeon built 308 at 1580M on a 16 inch plate, however this was at about 9400 DA. I don't know how well it will work at your altitude.
He was using 175 SMK at about 2680. The bullet seemed to be transitioning into subsonic really well. It took something like 16 or 17 shots to do it. Most of the misses were left or right. It doesn't take a lot of wind to mess you up at that range. Have fun trying.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
It has been done many times with M118lr and well built rifles, even near sea level.
Preston and Steve have both done it. I will very soon.
It has been done many times with M118lr and well built rifles, even near sea level.
Preston and Steve have both done it. I will very soon.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
20in barrel 308 win at a mile ? no fucking way, shooting in a 8mph wind at 1500 ft doesnt help either. Maybe if you had a ridiculous LOS angle to target combined high elevation maybe.
your wasting your time even thinking about it. Even if you had a 50 bmg i wouldnt guarentee you'll hit shit at a mile.
you'll never get on target , if you did , you wouldn't stay on target ,
roughly looking at jbm ballisitcs with a 175 gr berger vld moving at 2800fps ( which is faster then what you'll be doing with a 20in barrel) , at 1700y every mile per hour of wind equates to 30-40 inchs , meaning if you were not 100% correct in your wind call you'd get a 40inch group ,( not including your rifle spread , becuase its unlikely your gun shoots 20 shot 1/4 moa groups) assuming you are 90% correct or +/- 1mph across the entire 1760y ( well , probably more like 400-1500y) you'd be looking at an 80in group , as a best case senario ,
we aren't even talking about ES/SD and other factors , you see why your not going to be able to do this ?
thats not to say i dont believe its possible , i seen some unbelievable stuff.
IMO If you are serious about shooting things at a mile you need a much more ballistically superior round. probably 338,300mag ,375/416, 50 cal , 6.5mm , shit like that , stuff with either high bc's , high velocities or ideally both.
but hey , i'd love for you to prove me wrong , i really would.
you should check out JBM ballisitics and get a good understand of exterior ballisitics if you want to shoot that far.
20in barrel 308 win at a mile ? no fucking way, shooting in a 8mph wind at 1500 ft doesnt help either. Maybe if you had a ridiculous LOS angle to target combined high elevation maybe.
your wasting your time even thinking about it. Even if you had a 50 bmg i wouldnt guarentee you'll hit shit at a mile.
you'll never get on target , if you did , you wouldn't stay on target ,
roughly looking at jbm ballisitcs with a 175 gr berger vld moving at 2800fps ( which is faster then what you'll be doing with a 20in barrel) , at 1700y every mile per hour of wind equates to 30-40 inchs , meaning if you were not 100% correct in your wind call you'd get a 40inch group ,( not including your rifle spread , becuase its unlikely your gun shoots 20 shot 1/4 moa groups) assuming you are 90% correct or +/- 1mph across the entire 1760y ( well , probably more like 400-1500y) you'd be looking at an 80in group , as a best case senario ,
we aren't even talking about ES/SD and other factors , you see why your not going to be able to do this ?
thats not to say i dont believe its possible , i seen some unbelievable stuff.
IMO If you are serious about shooting things at a mile you need a much more ballistically superior round. probably 338,300mag ,375/416, 50 cal , 6.5mm , shit like that , stuff with either high bc's , high velocities or ideally both.
but hey , i'd love for you to prove me wrong , i really would.
you should check out JBM ballisitics and get a good understand of exterior ballisitics if you want to shoot that far.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I've gone to a mile with my 20.5" 308. First thing I'll emphasize is I'm not suggesting the 308 is a viable chambering for regular mile shooting. My pursuits are/were purely recreational.
Here are some specifics pertaining to the load/atmo/corrections.
Rifle:
Rem 700 308 1/12 twist Varmint barrel cut to 20.5", Super Sniper 16X scope on 45 moa Badger Ord base.
Atmo:
FP 4800 ft ASL, target 4200 ft ASL
Temp 50-80F
Winds typically 2-10 mph
Loads:
208 AMax, 2600 fps
220 SMK, 2550 fps
155 Scenar 2900 fps
Corrections are surprisingly close on all three loads at a mile, usually aroud 90 moa, give or take 5 moa for load, atmo.
It's fun to stretch the 308 to that kind of distance, but expect more misses than hits, on a torso size target. First round hit probability is low.
I've gone to a mile with my 20.5" 308. First thing I'll emphasize is I'm not suggesting the 308 is a viable chambering for regular mile shooting. My pursuits are/were purely recreational.
Here are some specifics pertaining to the load/atmo/corrections.
Rifle:
Rem 700 308 1/12 twist Varmint barrel cut to 20.5", Super Sniper 16X scope on 45 moa Badger Ord base.
Atmo:
FP 4800 ft ASL, target 4200 ft ASL
Temp 50-80F
Winds typically 2-10 mph
Loads:
208 AMax, 2600 fps
220 SMK, 2550 fps
155 Scenar 2900 fps
Corrections are surprisingly close on all three loads at a mile, usually aroud 90 moa, give or take 5 moa for load, atmo.
It's fun to stretch the 308 to that kind of distance, but expect more misses than hits, on a torso size target. First round hit probability is low.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
The wind drift at a mile with m118lr is only 40% more than my 300 norma 220 smk load that is an absolute hammer at a mile. I agree that the 308 is not the optimum mile cartridge, but I fail to see how wind drift makes it anywhere near impossible.
The wind drift at a mile with m118lr is only 40% more than my 300 norma 220 smk load that is an absolute hammer at a mile. I agree that the 308 is not the optimum mile cartridge, but I fail to see how wind drift makes it anywhere near impossible.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Lot of guys are certain that it cant be done, but I have played a lot with my TRG and my sons PA 308 running 155s at 2900+ and I can guarantee I would not want to let Him fire on me at a mile with either rifle.
Lot of guys are certain that it cant be done, but I have played a lot with my TRG and my sons PA 308 running 155s at 2900+ and I can guarantee I would not want to let Him fire on me at a mile with either rifle.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mallard is right. 24" Remington M24 with M118 LR 173gr wind correction at 1700m for 8mph wind is 13.6 MOA = 231" or 19 feet!
Don't forget to add a MOA or even two for the spin of the bullet.
If you are shooting North to South or S to N you may want to check Coriolis drift for you location mainly because your bullet will be so slow that the flight time will be more that 4 seconds.
</div></div>
M118LR is a 175gr, HPBT (SMK).
The M118 you are referring to is not the "LR", a 173 Special Ball.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mallard is right. 24" Remington M24 with M118 LR 173gr wind correction at 1700m for 8mph wind is 13.6 MOA = 231" or 19 feet!
Don't forget to add a MOA or even two for the spin of the bullet.
If you are shooting North to South or S to N you may want to check Coriolis drift for you location mainly because your bullet will be so slow that the flight time will be more that 4 seconds.
M118LR is a 175gr, HPBT (SMK).
The M118 you are referring to is not the "LR", a 173 Special Ball.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mallard is right. 24" Remington M24 with M118 LR 173gr wind correction at 1700m for 8mph wind is 13.6 MOA = 231" or 19 feet!
Don't forget to add a MOA or even two for the spin of the bullet.
If you are shooting North to South or S to N you may want to check Coriolis drift for you location mainly because your bullet will be so slow that the flight time will be more that 4 seconds.
</div></div>
And a mile is not 1700 meters either.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mallard is right. 24" Remington M24 with M118 LR 173gr wind correction at 1700m for 8mph wind is 13.6 MOA = 231" or 19 feet!
Don't forget to add a MOA or even two for the spin of the bullet.
If you are shooting North to South or S to N you may want to check Coriolis drift for you location mainly because your bullet will be so slow that the flight time will be more that 4 seconds.
And a mile is not 1700 meters either.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Better bring alot of bullets, big eyes, and alot of luck.
Better bring alot of bullets, big eyes, and alot of luck.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
The one mile club is getting fuller with every post... with smaller calibers, less scope, more wind, less barrel, etc... I am waiting for the inevitable "I just joined the mile club with my 9mm pistol, it's a tack driver at two miles cold bore".
The one mile club is getting fuller with every post... with smaller calibers, less scope, more wind, less barrel, etc... I am waiting for the inevitable "I just joined the mile club with my 9mm pistol, it's a tack driver at two miles cold bore".
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I saw a guy hit a 4ft x 4ft gong at a mile yesterday with a .308
Needed 98moa up from 100 yards
hit it once in out of 5 shots
208amax at 2520fps
45F
27.5Hg
I saw a guy hit a 4ft x 4ft gong at a mile yesterday with a .308
Needed 98moa up from 100 yards
hit it once in out of 5 shots
208amax at 2520fps
45F
27.5Hg
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK. The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118.
Maybe it's 175gr not 173gr, not sure, I'm not a paper sniper wanna be nerd. I just shoot the shit I'm issued.
1 mile is 1609m / 1760y.
What's with the sarcastic comments?
The fact is that if you don't make a super precise wind call (at around 8 mph for a 1609m shot)or the wind fluctuates even a small amount, you will almost certainly miss.
</div></div>
Your not a paper sniper wanna be nerd? Well Im not sure what that is but I do know that it may be a good thing to know exactly what bullet you are using.
Any Sniper should be able to tell the difference between a 173 SB and a 175 HPBT.
Those two bullets are quite different in appearance and flight. May be something you want to look into. If you cant tell, ask whoever is issuing it to you.
From the looks of your pics my guess would be that you are using a Ballistic Calc to get data, and that you dont have much solid dope on your rifle. If this is true, you really need to know what bullet you have. Especially if you are being issued them to do accomplish a task.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">OK. The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118.
Maybe it's 175gr not 173gr, not sure, I'm not a paper sniper wanna be nerd. I just shoot the shit I'm issued.
1 mile is 1609m / 1760y.
What's with the sarcastic comments?
The fact is that if you don't make a super precise wind call (at around 8 mph for a 1609m shot)or the wind fluctuates even a small amount, you will almost certainly miss.
</div></div>
Your not a paper sniper wanna be nerd? Well Im not sure what that is but I do know that it may be a good thing to know exactly what bullet you are using.
Any Sniper should be able to tell the difference between a 173 SB and a 175 HPBT.
Those two bullets are quite different in appearance and flight. May be something you want to look into. If you cant tell, ask whoever is issuing it to you.
From the looks of your pics my guess would be that you are using a Ballistic Calc to get data, and that you dont have much solid dope on your rifle. If this is true, you really need to know what bullet you have. Especially if you are being issued them to do accomplish a task.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just told you what bullets I'm being issued.
They are M118 LR and they ARE HPBT. That I do know.
What I am not sure of, is if they are 175gr or 173gr.
In the military schools I was always told that M118LR was 173gr.
For wind correction I use formula from military sniper school not a "Ballistic Calc"
If you need explaining what a paper sniper wanna be means then I can't help you.
Keep shooting at your fixed distance 1 mile target.
I'm sure that you have your come ups figured out just right after shooting the same distance for couple of months.
Try moving your target 40-60m closer or farther and then hitting it with the first shot.....
</div></div>
Dude you have no idea the quality of shooter that you are disrespecting.....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just told you what bullets I'm being issued.
They are M118 LR and they ARE HPBT. That I do know.
What I am not sure of, is if they are 175gr or 173gr.
In the military schools I was always told that M118LR was 173gr.
For wind correction I use formula from military sniper school not a "Ballistic Calc"
If you need explaining what a paper sniper wanna be means then I can't help you.
Keep shooting at your fixed distance 1 mile target.
I'm sure that you have your come ups figured out just right after shooting the same distance for couple of months.
Try moving your target 40-60m closer or farther and then hitting it with the first shot.....
</div></div>
Dude you have no idea the quality of shooter that you are disrespecting.....
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Listen Stud,
You have no idea who I, what I do, or what type of shooting I do.
However, I do know who you are...
You are the "Sniper" that doesn't know that they never made a 173 BTHP for M118. Its either a M118 (173 Special Ball) or M118LR (175 HPBT).
So write this down... your shooting a 175gr SMK. Your welcome.
There was no need to act tough and attempt to insult me. Your efforts have failed miserably and you again showed your lack of experience and knowledge.
Listen Stud,
You have no idea who I, what I do, or what type of shooting I do.
However, I do know who you are...
You are the "Sniper" that doesn't know that they never made a 173 BTHP for M118. Its either a M118 (173 Special Ball) or M118LR (175 HPBT).
So write this down... your shooting a 175gr SMK. Your welcome.
There was no need to act tough and attempt to insult me. Your efforts have failed miserably and you again showed your lack of experience and knowledge.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting <span style="font-weight: bold">that I do not
know what ammo I am issued</span> and questioning my training.
</div></div>
Which you don't.
I'm sure it's possible, but you'd probably want a longer barrel than the 20" on your rifle currently. Repeatable, probably not.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting <span style="font-weight: bold">that I do not
know what ammo I am issued</span> and questioning my training.
</div></div>
Which you don't.
I'm sure it's possible, but you'd probably want a longer barrel than the 20" on your rifle currently. Repeatable, probably not.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
the point is that if you don't know what bullet your " M118LR " uses, then your training is seriously lacking.
what you need to understand is that you're talking to people on here who instructed YOUR instuctors, or their's, and were surprised they passed school.
this is not your average forum, w/ your average members
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
the point is that if you don't know what bullet your " M118LR " uses, then your training is seriously lacking.
what you need to understand is that you're talking to people on here who instructed YOUR instuctors, or their's, and were surprised they passed school.
this is not your average forum, w/ your average members
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
You are missing the point. While I would love to dig into this further, its not within the topic of this thread. I wont bore others by showing how flawed your logic is. But I will say, there is a big difference between the 173 and the 175... And any true deployed Sniper better know the facts about the equipment they use, especially when claiming shots like you posted in your other thread.
Kick Rocks.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
You are missing the point. While I would love to dig into this further, its not within the topic of this thread. I wont bore others by showing how flawed your logic is. But I will say, there is a big difference between the 173 and the 175... And any true deployed Sniper better know the facts about the equipment they use, especially when claiming shots like you posted in your other thread.
Kick Rocks.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Once again:
"The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118."
The round is HPBT! I have always been issued that kind of ammo.
I know it well. If you insist i can take a picture of a box and a round.
Perhaps it is 175gr not 173gr. I suppose that's what the whole argument was about...
Thank you for that correction.
However 2 gr doesn't make me much difference in shooting here.
Also - you have no idea who I am, how long I have been here and what training and accomplishments I have. </div></div>
I'm pretty sure there's a fair difference in bullet design between the 175gr HPBT and the 173gr SB........
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Once again:
"The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118."
The round is HPBT! I have always been issued that kind of ammo.
I know it well. If you insist i can take a picture of a box and a round.
Perhaps it is 175gr not 173gr. I suppose that's what the whole argument was about...
Thank you for that correction.
However 2 gr doesn't make me much difference in shooting here.
Also - you have no idea who I am, how long I have been here and what training and accomplishments I have. </div></div>
I'm pretty sure there's a fair difference in bullet design between the 175gr HPBT and the 173gr SB........
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: force_multiplier</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
the point is that if you don't know what bullet your " M118LR " uses, then your training is seriously lacking.
what you need to understand is that you're talking to people on here who instructed YOUR instuctors, or their's, and were surprised they passed school.
<span style="font-weight: bold">this is not your average forum, w/ your average members</span></div></div>
What I highlighted in bold couldn't be more accurate, Sid13.
One thing that you will find is required on the Hide is a thick skin because many have already spent time in Hell's Sandbox (mid-east) and lived to tell about it. Then, there are those on here who have slung mud and blood through Vietnam and/or Korea.
These men I speak of can probably teach you more than your current instructors because they've <span style="font-style: italic">been there, done that, got the t-shirt</span>.
An humble attitude will take you far, especially when it is <span style="font-style: italic">you</span> that is asking for help.
Just a thought....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: force_multiplier</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is disrespecting who? Dude!
It was KNIGHT11B4 suggesting that I do not
know what ammo I am issued and questioning my training.
From my first post I said - M118 LR (not any SB)
regardless of if it is 173 or 175gr!
(Sorry for not busting out a scale out of my ass here in Afghanistan and weighting the round for sake of this sorry argument!)
I was always told by military instructors that M118LR HPBT was 173gr.
If they and I are wrong then I apologize.
My intention was not to disrespecting anyone but I don't look kindly om mean spirited sarcasm either.
</div></div>
the point is that if you don't know what bullet your " M118LR " uses, then your training is seriously lacking.
what you need to understand is that you're talking to people on here who instructed YOUR instuctors, or their's, and were surprised they passed school.
<span style="font-weight: bold">this is not your average forum, w/ your average members</span></div></div>
What I highlighted in bold couldn't be more accurate, Sid13.
One thing that you will find is required on the Hide is a thick skin because many have already spent time in Hell's Sandbox (mid-east) and lived to tell about it. Then, there are those on here who have slung mud and blood through Vietnam and/or Korea.
These men I speak of can probably teach you more than your current instructors because they've <span style="font-style: italic">been there, done that, got the t-shirt</span>.
An humble attitude will take you far, especially when it is <span style="font-style: italic">you</span> that is asking for help.
Just a thought....
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I am not a real sniper, just a recreational shooter. That said, I have spent a ton of time putting thousands of rounds through my .308, doing load development, ETC, and I know that it is enough of a challenge with good data and good equipment to make hits at 950-1100 yards that there is no way that you are making it to 1760 without knowing what fucking bullet you are shooting.
I am not a real sniper, just a recreational shooter. That said, I have spent a ton of time putting thousands of rounds through my .308, doing load development, ETC, and I know that it is enough of a challenge with good data and good equipment to make hits at 950-1100 yards that there is no way that you are making it to 1760 without knowing what fucking bullet you are shooting.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm done with this argument....
We are shooting M118LR HPBT, always were.
It is because of the shoots like the ones on the pictures
in other threat "Afgan 13 Sep 1250m shots from M24s, 7,62mm"
that I tried to put my 2 cents about difficulty of proper windage
adjustment for 1 mile shots with 308 in 8mph wind.
I'm not gonna bother posting any more pictures here.
Get your news from CNN. </div></div>
News from CNN is probably more accurate then the bullshit your peddling.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm done with this argument....
We are shooting M118LR HPBT, always were.
It is because of the shoots like the ones on the pictures
in other threat "Afgan 13 Sep 1250m shots from M24s, 7,62mm"
that I tried to put my 2 cents about difficulty of proper windage
adjustment for 1 mile shots with 308 in 8mph wind.
I'm not gonna bother posting any more pictures here.
Get your news from CNN. </div></div>
News from CNN is probably more accurate then the bullshit your peddling.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Once again:
"The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118."
The round is HPBT! I have always been issued that kind of ammo.
I know it well. If you insist i can take a picture of a box and a round.
Perhaps it is 175gr not 173gr. I suppose that's what the whole argument was about...
Thank you for that correction.
However 2 gr doesn't make me much difference in shooting here.
Also - you have no idea who I am, how long I have been here and what training and accomplishments I have. </div></div>
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
I think your lying about your schooling....
Knight would hand you your ass in long range engagements, trust me on that!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Once again:
"The box I'm looking at right now says 20 CRTG. 7.62 MM
Long Range M118."
The round is HPBT! I have always been issued that kind of ammo.
I know it well. If you insist i can take a picture of a box and a round.
Perhaps it is 175gr not 173gr. I suppose that's what the whole argument was about...
Thank you for that correction.
However 2 gr doesn't make me much difference in shooting here.
Also - you have no idea who I am, how long I have been here and what training and accomplishments I have. </div></div>
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
I think your lying about your schooling....
Knight would hand you your ass in long range engagements, trust me on that!
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Point I think you seem to be missing with your dismissing of the importance of knowing your bullet- at 1500 density altitude, my rifle running a 155 Scenar at 2825 and my buddies 175 SMK running at 2600:
Drop for the 155 is 1969 inches
Drop for the 175 is 2152 inches
The difference between two good loads is 183.5 inches of drop. That is 15 feet of difference, and you are trying to hit a target of what size?
Point I think you seem to be missing with your dismissing of the importance of knowing your bullet- at 1500 density altitude, my rifle running a 155 Scenar at 2825 and my buddies 175 SMK running at 2600:
Drop for the 155 is 1969 inches
Drop for the 175 is 2152 inches
The difference between two good loads is 183.5 inches of drop. That is 15 feet of difference, and you are trying to hit a target of what size?
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
News from CNN is probably more accurate then the bullshit your peddling. </div></div>
lol
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
News from CNN is probably more accurate then the bullshit your peddling. </div></div>
lol
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I always do my best shooting on the internetz...........
I always do my best shooting on the internetz...........
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
How is that for a bullshit? It's still not M118 LR BTHP?
All my posts will be deleted in 10 minutes. I'm not risking my job for the sake of dumb argument with team honey badger or whatever. </div></div> If you were really an "operator" you would know better than to post things that violate OPSEC, someone should find out who you work for and report you for violations....and being a complete idiot.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
How is that for a bullshit? It's still not M118 LR BTHP?
All my posts will be deleted in 10 minutes. I'm not risking my job for the sake of dumb argument with team honey badger or whatever. </div></div> If you were really an "operator" you would know better than to post things that violate OPSEC, someone should find out who you work for and report you for violations....and being a complete idiot.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CrazyDonkey</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
How is that for a bullshit? It's still not M118 LR BTHP?
All my posts will be deleted in 10 minutes. I'm not risking my job for the sake of dumb argument with team honey badger or whatever. </div></div> If you were really an "operator" you would know better than to post things that violate OPSEC, someone should find out who you work for and report you for violations....and being a complete idiot. </div></div>
His IP is already logged.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CrazyDonkey</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sid13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
How is that for a bullshit? It's still not M118 LR BTHP?
All my posts will be deleted in 10 minutes. I'm not risking my job for the sake of dumb argument with team honey badger or whatever. </div></div> If you were really an "operator" you would know better than to post things that violate OPSEC, someone should find out who you work for and report you for violations....and being a complete idiot. </div></div>
His IP is already logged.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Annnnd Rehosted.
Annnnd Rehosted.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
You wont be able to delete everything. If posting put your job at risk, well you shouldn't have posted.
You wont be able to delete everything. If posting put your job at risk, well you shouldn't have posted.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
besides people saving and rehosting images and posts there is always the cached pages you can get off google.
besides people saving and rehosting images and posts there is always the cached pages you can get off google.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Well atleast he brings comedy!!
Well atleast he brings comedy!!
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Damn one of the best as of late! Thanks very entertaining.
If you dont mind me asking, what instructors at whos school told you 118LR uses 173g round? Please dont get offended by the question, just intrested.
Damn one of the best as of late! Thanks very entertaining.
If you dont mind me asking, what instructors at whos school told you 118LR uses 173g round? Please dont get offended by the question, just intrested.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Risking your job!!? Over what? You have said nothing that everyone and their window licking brother dosent already know. Now your just being silly.
Risking your job!!? Over what? You have said nothing that everyone and their window licking brother dosent already know. Now your just being silly.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Bob, got any more Guinness?
Bob, got any more Guinness?
Re: .308 @ 1760....
When I want to shoot a mile I line my ammo up like this first.
When I want to shoot a mile I line my ammo up like this first.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When I want to shoot a mile I line my ammo up like this first.
</div></div>
So thats how a real "SNIPER" does it!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When I want to shoot a mile I line my ammo up like this first.
So thats how a real "SNIPER" does it!
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Well I thought this would be intresting, here is what the Army school house at Benning has to say:
173g 7.62mm NATO (M118SB/A136) @ 2550fps / BC = .498
100 yd zero total drop to 1500 yd = 1430.5"
175g 7.62mm NATO (M118LR/AA11) @ 2580fps / BC = .496
100 yd zero total drop to 1500 yd = 1400.7"
Im no expert but I are smart enough to know that would proably matter, just sayn.
Well I thought this would be intresting, here is what the Army school house at Benning has to say:
173g 7.62mm NATO (M118SB/A136) @ 2550fps / BC = .498
100 yd zero total drop to 1500 yd = 1430.5"
175g 7.62mm NATO (M118LR/AA11) @ 2580fps / BC = .496
100 yd zero total drop to 1500 yd = 1400.7"
Im no expert but I are smart enough to know that would proably matter, just sayn.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
well shit gentelmen, i didnt want to incite a riot. i was sure i would get plenty of shit for wanting to shoot a mile with .308 (trust me, i know how crazy it sounds) but i didnt really think i would make other people argue.
However, i do understand the how hard this is going to be, thats why i want to do it. someone said it best, someone will somday do it with a 9mm. funny, but if we didnt keep pushing the limits of our weapons, rounds or selfs,we wouldnt be moving forward.
that being said, thank you for the intel and sorry for starting a little domestic violence. If anyone comes across some good load data, pm me, that would be great.
well shit gentelmen, i didnt want to incite a riot. i was sure i would get plenty of shit for wanting to shoot a mile with .308 (trust me, i know how crazy it sounds) but i didnt really think i would make other people argue.
However, i do understand the how hard this is going to be, thats why i want to do it. someone said it best, someone will somday do it with a 9mm. funny, but if we didnt keep pushing the limits of our weapons, rounds or selfs,we wouldnt be moving forward.
that being said, thank you for the intel and sorry for starting a little domestic violence. If anyone comes across some good load data, pm me, that would be great.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I have a load that gets to 1350yds but I never got to try for any longer. 43.5gr varget, 175gr smk, lapua case, fed 210m loaded at 2.810". Shot from a chopped and suppressed 700p at 22" in the hills of WV. Could load it hotter and maybe push it farther but it didn't leave much of a mark on a 66% (I think) ipsc steel target at that distance.
I have a load that gets to 1350yds but I never got to try for any longer. 43.5gr varget, 175gr smk, lapua case, fed 210m loaded at 2.810". Shot from a chopped and suppressed 700p at 22" in the hills of WV. Could load it hotter and maybe push it farther but it didn't leave much of a mark on a 66% (I think) ipsc steel target at that distance.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I was running 43.2 varget with 178amax in a gas gun. Surely you can push a bolt gun harder.
I was running 43.2 varget with 178amax in a gas gun. Surely you can push a bolt gun harder.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a load that gets to 1350yds but I never got to try for any longer. 43.5gr varget, 175gr smk, lapua case, fed 210m loaded at 2.810". Shot from a chopped and suppressed 700p at 22" in the hills of WV. Could load it hotter and maybe push it farther but it didn't leave much of a mark on a 66% (I think) ipsc steel target at that distance. </div></div>
Same load Im running, good for me out to 1140 or so with very low DA.
As far as the other stuff you didnt cause anything, the comments and arrogance of some caused that. Some people just think they know it all. Kinda funny.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a load that gets to 1350yds but I never got to try for any longer. 43.5gr varget, 175gr smk, lapua case, fed 210m loaded at 2.810". Shot from a chopped and suppressed 700p at 22" in the hills of WV. Could load it hotter and maybe push it farther but it didn't leave much of a mark on a 66% (I think) ipsc steel target at that distance. </div></div>
Same load Im running, good for me out to 1140 or so with very low DA.
As far as the other stuff you didnt cause anything, the comments and arrogance of some caused that. Some people just think they know it all. Kinda funny.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
I've tried 30 or 40 times with a 175smk @~2800fps. Never could get ahold of that 10"x10" plate. Sometimes the splash would be close...only a foot or two away. Other times it would be 50 feet high, 20 feet low or 40 feet wide...and the wind was pretty steady 3-4 mph 1/2 value. this was at a DA of ~3500ft. I'm sure it can be done - but I'm yet to witness it. Either way, it'll be sheer luck and not able to be reproduced often - at least with a 175smk.
I've tried 30 or 40 times with a 175smk @~2800fps. Never could get ahold of that 10"x10" plate. Sometimes the splash would be close...only a foot or two away. Other times it would be 50 feet high, 20 feet low or 40 feet wide...and the wind was pretty steady 3-4 mph 1/2 value. this was at a DA of ~3500ft. I'm sure it can be done - but I'm yet to witness it. Either way, it'll be sheer luck and not able to be reproduced often - at least with a 175smk.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
Hey, I hope you can do it. Anything is possible. We shot a Savage model 212 slug gun at 633yds and hit and also we tried at 750yds and threw dirt on it several times. Everybody said it would never happen but it did. Now, when that bullet gets there, it won`t have much energy but we are just shooting targets. Keep shooting, you will eventually hit it. Keep us posted.
Hey, I hope you can do it. Anything is possible. We shot a Savage model 212 slug gun at 633yds and hit and also we tried at 750yds and threw dirt on it several times. Everybody said it would never happen but it did. Now, when that bullet gets there, it won`t have much energy but we are just shooting targets. Keep shooting, you will eventually hit it. Keep us posted.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
One issue you are going to run into is hold over. A 2600 fps 175 smk, traveling in 1500 density altitute to a target 1760 yards away needs 34 mils of elevation.
You would most likely need an extreme travel SFP scope mounted in a 45 moa mount, and still would have to dial it down to half power (so that each mil is actually two mils) and even then 34 mils is a stretch.
To clarify- I wasn't arguing with YOU, as I think its great that you want to give it a try. I would have an issue with it if you were going to argue that a 308 is a viable option at that distance, because it isn't.
My main argument was focused on the guy trying to do it will factory ammo (m118) and not even knowing what ammo it really was- because to make such an extreme distance shot, you need good data, above all.
Good luck.
One issue you are going to run into is hold over. A 2600 fps 175 smk, traveling in 1500 density altitute to a target 1760 yards away needs 34 mils of elevation.
You would most likely need an extreme travel SFP scope mounted in a 45 moa mount, and still would have to dial it down to half power (so that each mil is actually two mils) and even then 34 mils is a stretch.
To clarify- I wasn't arguing with YOU, as I think its great that you want to give it a try. I would have an issue with it if you were going to argue that a 308 is a viable option at that distance, because it isn't.
My main argument was focused on the guy trying to do it will factory ammo (m118) and not even knowing what ammo it really was- because to make such an extreme distance shot, you need good data, above all.
Good luck.
Re: .308 @ 1760....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've tried 30 or 40 times with a 175smk @~2800fps. Never could get ahold of that 10"x10" plate. Sometimes the splash would be close...only a foot or two away. Other times it would be 50 feet high, 20 feet low or 40 feet wide...and the wind was pretty steady 3-4 mph 1/2 value. this was at a DA of ~3500ft. I'm sure it can be done - but I'm yet to witness it. Either way, it'll be sheer luck and not able to be reproduced often - at least with a 175smk. </div></div>
Exactly. All these one milers get excited because they got lucky and one shot in the randomly dispersed group hit the steel, showing photos of the great achievement. My view is I haven't accomplished anything useful at a mile, until I can hit 24x24" cold bore, 9 times out of 10. I'll even give myself a no wind condition to make it easier. No group size, just hit that size steel. That would be something to feel good about.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: turbo54</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've tried 30 or 40 times with a 175smk @~2800fps. Never could get ahold of that 10"x10" plate. Sometimes the splash would be close...only a foot or two away. Other times it would be 50 feet high, 20 feet low or 40 feet wide...and the wind was pretty steady 3-4 mph 1/2 value. this was at a DA of ~3500ft. I'm sure it can be done - but I'm yet to witness it. Either way, it'll be sheer luck and not able to be reproduced often - at least with a 175smk. </div></div>
Exactly. All these one milers get excited because they got lucky and one shot in the randomly dispersed group hit the steel, showing photos of the great achievement. My view is I haven't accomplished anything useful at a mile, until I can hit 24x24" cold bore, 9 times out of 10. I'll even give myself a no wind condition to make it easier. No group size, just hit that size steel. That would be something to feel good about.
