My 9 twist 338 Norma should be ready fairly soon and I'm shopping bullets. My range goes to a mile and I'm wondering if it's worth the expense of solids at that distance? I know Bergers will work but some of the solids have my attention.
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338 Norma Bergers vs solids
- Thread starter WeiserBucks
- Start date
Run the numbers. How much of a wind advantage do you want? There’s no doubt that the Bergers are bested by the solids
Hi,
IMO with the 9 twist you will be pretty limited on the monos you could actually utilize.
What mono's are you interested in?
Sincerely,
Theis
IMO with the 9 twist you will be pretty limited on the monos you could actually utilize.
What mono's are you interested in?
Sincerely,
Theis
I'm specifically looking at the CEB 265 Lazer and 275 MTH. There's not a very big difference in BC at these weights, but the monkey wrench in this whole thing is that this rifle will be used for hunting at reasonable range and will absolutely be taken to a mile every time I go to the range. My train of thought on the solids is better bullet consistency and more predictable performance on game.
I'm not an ELR competitor at all, just looking maximize performance under the given constraints.
I'm not an ELR competitor at all, just looking maximize performance under the given constraints.
These will stabilize in a 9. They also make a really good hunting bullet.
badlandsprecision.com
.338 265gr ICBM-2 - Badlands precision, LLC
Length: 1.957 BC (G1): 0.910 Twist: 1:9″ Price: 50/BOX
badlandsprecision.com
Through my research it looks like the ICBM's are not an expanding bullet, but the Bulldozer's are. Haven't heard much about either of them myself but I'm just getting started researching solids.
That’s correct. The bulldozer is their hunting bullet. The icbm is the target bullet. They’re very consistent and the bulldozers perform great on game
I’m curious of your results with the solids.
been thinking of going that route.
Performance with the 300’s at a mile is quite good and that cartridge is really friendly to reload.
been thinking of going that route.
Performance with the 300’s at a mile is quite good and that cartridge is really friendly to reload.
Solids are always going to be better and you want to stick to a slightly lighter bullet to keep the speeds up, solids like fast. You don't want to fall into the too heavy trap with the 338.
I demonstrated this last month with a student shooting an AI 338LM, he had Berger 300s only going about 2700fps vs 250s going closer to 3000fps, the drift, drop, and results downrange were better across the board with the 250s and he was more consistent as a shooter with the lighter bullet. (less recoil) the numbers and results all favored the 250s even though everyone screams heavies.
You don't need anything crazy to be consistent at a mile bullet wise, just keep the speeds reasonably higher, the sweet spot for a 338 is 2850fps or higher, the 338NM should give you about 50fps over a LapuaMag, so that extra speed should be a positive for you. You get the bullets going over 2850fps and it's an easy day.
If I was you, I would stick to 285gr bullets or lighter you'll dine at mile all day long.
I demonstrated this last month with a student shooting an AI 338LM, he had Berger 300s only going about 2700fps vs 250s going closer to 3000fps, the drift, drop, and results downrange were better across the board with the 250s and he was more consistent as a shooter with the lighter bullet. (less recoil) the numbers and results all favored the 250s even though everyone screams heavies.
You don't need anything crazy to be consistent at a mile bullet wise, just keep the speeds reasonably higher, the sweet spot for a 338 is 2850fps or higher, the 338NM should give you about 50fps over a LapuaMag, so that extra speed should be a positive for you. You get the bullets going over 2850fps and it's an easy day.
If I was you, I would stick to 285gr bullets or lighter you'll dine at mile all day long.
Go hunt Africa
solids are king, they aren’t needed in Notth America
plus they are harder to work with loading is not always as easy, some work better than others and you can’t mix jacketed and solids unless the solids are just copper. The brass mixed ones can’t be shot in the same barrel at the same time. Has to be hard cleaned for them.
most are too expensive fir casual shooting
solids are king, they aren’t needed in Notth America
plus they are harder to work with loading is not always as easy, some work better than others and you can’t mix jacketed and solids unless the solids are just copper. The brass mixed ones can’t be shot in the same barrel at the same time. Has to be hard cleaned for them.
most are too expensive fir casual shooting
Ask around about the CEB just breaking then plastic tip off and poking a tiny hole through and animal... expanding solids can be made to be reliable, but I wouldn’t trust a plastic tip to not break off and make it act like a fmj. The aluminum tip on the bulldozer is better from my experience.
That's exactly why I started this thread! Asking around for others experience with the solids. I know from my experience that Bergers work great, the solids are peaking my curiosity.
Sounds similar to what Frank said, mo speed mo better. Hopefully we'll get a few more comments in this thread and others will report their results. I'm not afraid to spend money on bullets if there's a legitimate advantage, but I'm well aware of the effectiveness traditional cup and core offerings.
i hunted out of my tower this year with my 300 NM pushing berger 230s. i have historically used my 300wm pushing 220 sierras on game. i took a nice cull at about 300 yds but it had to be taken at a less than ideal angle. shot went in just rear of rib cage but hit ribs just below front shoulder on way out. huge huge hole. could make a high five and put my hand thru it. 300wm usually doeent do that
338 nm has a lot of energy too. if your shooting big body animals maynot be too bad, but if its a texas whitetail you hate to loose more meat than you need to
338 nm has a lot of energy too. if your shooting big body animals maynot be too bad, but if its a texas whitetail you hate to loose more meat than you need to
Appreciate your input sir, I also use a 300 NM with 230s to great effect. Bull elk are over 4x the size of TX Whitetail bucks and that's the driving factor behind a good 338.
I would agree 99% of the time. I was the spotter for something that is a 1% scenario this fall, 338 build is already underway.
Frank,
Have you seen this as well in the 30 calibers/300 Norma , Do you feel the 198gr Flatline will be a better performer than the Seneca 241gr.?
I haven’t gone over 230gr in the 300nm.
disn’t see any real advantage vs the 215gr both seem about equal to me
disn’t see any real advantage vs the 215gr both seem about equal to me
On the faster lighter thinking, I'm running a .300wm with 215 bergers at 2840. Would it be worth while to use a lighter bullet?
I would look at the 212 Seneca. A G1 BC of almost 1, and that's a perfect weight projectile for the .300NM.
I think 241 is a bit on the heavy side for .300NM.
If you have the twist for it... PVA is recommending 8 twist min, which is very fast for 30cal. The 198s require 9 twist, still fast for 30cal.
PVA is in the process of threading a 7 twist 31” Hawk Hill barrel for me, I’ll be objectively trying all three of the bullets, again the chambering will be in a 300 Norma.
Regarding the 338 and the 256 grain Flatline, a buddy of mine that is 74 years young, has a 338 Lapua improved 40deg built on a Defensive Edge bull pup, with a 32” barrel with a Bartline exit twist of 1:8, he is/was pushing the 256 grain Flat line bullets at 3404 fps, giving credit to Frank’s statement, that pushing them Fast was the key, it was the best performance at 1634 yards that I have seen to date, as he was holding a 1/2 MOA at that distance with 12 mph switching winds. The same day He also tested/compared 300 grain Berger’s and 277 CE bullets against the Flatlines, which were noticeably the best performer. I think he has since backed off to around 3300fps with that load. He also mentioned the other day that he has settled on the Badland’s 270 bulldozer for the remaining life of the barrel for a hunting/target load.
Regarding the 338 and the 256 grain Flatline, a buddy of mine that is 74 years young, has a 338 Lapua improved 40deg built on a Defensive Edge bull pup, with a 32” barrel with a Bartline exit twist of 1:8, he is/was pushing the 256 grain Flat line bullets at 3404 fps, giving credit to Frank’s statement, that pushing them Fast was the key, it was the best performance at 1634 yards that I have seen to date, as he was holding a 1/2 MOA at that distance with 12 mph switching winds. The same day He also tested/compared 300 grain Berger’s and 277 CE bullets against the Flatlines, which were noticeably the best performer. I think he has since backed off to around 3300fps with that load. He also mentioned the other day that he has settled on the Badland’s 270 bulldozer for the remaining life of the barrel for a hunting/target load.
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Jbailey,
I plan on objectivity trying the 198-212 and the 241’s to see which it likes best. I post the results once I get started.
the 198s are beasts in my 9 twist 308. 1 mile, not a problem. 2000yds if you are at the higher D.A.s
