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6.5 Creedmoor

Interesting range trip.

I am working up a load for my 6.5CM shooting the 140berger hybrids, Norma brass, FGMM 210M primers, H4350. 2.125 CBTO and jumping about 0.080.

My rifle is a Terminus Zeus action, Bartlien Med Palma cut to 19.4inches. I am shooting the ladder test with my TBAC Ultra 9 on it.

I got up to 44gr, 2,668fps, and no pressure signs. Bolt opened easy too. This is the first I’ve done for a 6.5CM. I’m very surprised. I feel like I saw a lot of folks saying they stopped lower. Heck, my 6.5x47L stopped at 40.3grs.

I am going to keep going up. I am trying to get 2,740fps to make the NRL Hunter Power factor.

Does anyone else have a load at like 45gr of H4350 for 140gr Berger hybrids?
 
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Interesting range trip.

I am working up a load for my 6.5CM shooting the 140berger hybrids, Norma brass, FGMM 210M primers, H4350. 2.125 CBTO and jumping about 0.080.

My rifle is a Terminus Zeus action, Bartlien Med Palma cut to 19.4inches. I am shooting the ladder test with my TBAC Ultra 9 on it.

I got up to 44gr, 2,668fps, and no pressure signs. Bolt opened easy too. This is the first I’ve done for a 6.5CM. I’m very surprised. I feel like I saw a lot of folks saying they stopped lower. Heck, my 6.5x47L stopped at 40.3grs.

I am going to keep going up. I am trying to get 2,740fps to make the NRL Hunter Power factor.

Does anyone else have a load at like 45gr of H4350 for 140gr Berger hybrids?
Popular load for the 140s in 6.5CM is around 41.8-42.0grs. Haha jeez you are up there. My load is 41.8gr AR2209 (H4350) I get 2850fps out of 26” barrel and Ultimatum action. Cheers
 
Interesting range trip.

I am working up a load for my 6.5CM shooting the 140berger hybrids, Norma brass, FGMM 210M primers, H4350. 2.125 CBTO and jumping about 0.080.

My rifle is a Terminus Zeus action, Bartlien Med Palma cut to 19.4inches. I am shooting the ladder test with my TBAC Ultra 9 on it.

I got up to 44gr, 2,668fps, and no pressure signs. Bolt opened easy too. This is the first I’ve done for a 6.5CM. I’m very surprised. I feel like I saw a lot of folks saying they stopped lower. Heck, my 6.5x47L stopped at 40.3grs.

I am going to keep going up. I am trying to get 2,740fps to make the NRL Hunter Power factor.

Does anyone else have a load at like 45gr of H4350 for 140gr Berger hybrids?

That is high for a SAAMI chamber. And very fast for a sub-20” barrel.

Unlikely - but possible explanations:

1) Could be that your chamber or freebore dimensions might be rather roomy. Could be the chamber is oversize, or the freebore is longer than normal, or a bit of both. Maybe check your twice fired brass (diameters and case head to shoulder datum) against fired brass from another factory rifle in the same caliber. Could also measure water volume with a scale as long as overall case length is identical. Range pickup might be a place to start if you don’t have a buddy running the same caliber.

2) Could be that your brass is thin skinned. Very unlikely as Norma is usually rather thick and strong brass, and tend to pressure out sooner.

3) You could be the lucky recipient of a “fast barrel”. Bartlein tends to produce a few of those every week. [It seems they don’t know how to reliably replicate this happy accident, so don’t call them and ask for a fast barrel...]

4) Your powder batch might be off on burn rate. Back off two or three grains and do another pressure test: Ask a buddy to load say a 5 round ladder for you using his (different) batch of H4350. Load a 5 round ladder test for his rifle using your powder. Should tell you somethig!

5) Your primer batch might be on the weak side. Very unlikely. Of you want to be sure, switch primers and repeat your pressure test. I would not bother with this.

6) Bullet diameters are generally very accurate because the dies that are used to make them are precision ground. [Major safety issue if these dimensions vary too much, so the QA folks watch these carefully]. Have seen some manufacturers that make sequential batches that vary 0.1 or 0.2 thousands of an inch. Could not detect a speed change as a result. Easy to check if you have a micrometer, but incredibly unlikely for Berger bullets.

7) Not to be insulting or anything like that, but you might have subtle pressure signs and you might be missing them. Many rifles need to be seriously over max pressure before bolt lift becomes tight. Extract say 10 primers, put them under a magnifying glass with good lighting, and see if you have “muffin tops”. You want to see good radius on the primer edges. Or take a sharp photo with a macro lens and zoom in, alternatively use your bore scope, that works well as a cheap macro lens. Primers often provide the first pressure sign. Some rifles will show primer cratering due to the firing pin hole not being a tight fit, some will not.

A cautionary tale: Have used Lapua brass for years now. Superb quality and very strong. Found a 41.5 gn load of H4350 that shot the 140 gn Hybrid very well. Never seen any pressure signs with that load and used it for months. Then on a whim decided to square the case heads as an experiment to see if that made a difference to my results, as i already had the equipment (LE Wilson mini lathe, and all the cutters). Case heads lost some of their lettering as the case heads were (apparently) not perfectly square. [Or the Wilson case holders are not perfectly concentric, a real possibility.] Post tumbling, i suddenly realized that half the cases had clear full circle ejector marks on them. Not bright shiny marks, but still a full round circle, but it was a very shallow indentation. These marks were too feint to be visible on the lettering before. Now they were very visible. The load was probably slightly over pressure, i just did not know it. Backed off 1.0 grains and the ejector marks went away (and sadly group size opened up to 0.7”), eventually found the next lower node around 50 fps lower down.

And nope - squaring off the case heads made zero difference to my group size…. I don’t think the Wilson setup is accurate/concentric enough to do this properly. [Messing with powder charge did make a (very negative) difference!]

Btw: Have three rifles in 6.5 CM, and when new, all of them hit max pressure below 42.0 gn of H4350. The older barrels with 2,500 rounds (or more) on them need 0.5 gn (or a bit less) to hit max pressure, and speed is mostly similar to what these barrels delivered after 200 rounds. More freebore lowers pressure due to the erosion of the lands, allowing for more powder.

Do you know your freebore, was the barrel throated for 140 Bergers Hybrids - or something else?
 
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Heffo
I’m just a beginner, but my Proof was shooting the 130 Berger’s with 41.8gr at a slow 2725 fps with SD 11.
I was storing the powder and reloading from my garage in FL.
Apparently, humidity consistency has quite an effect on measured weights amd velocity.
I don’t know where you live and where in your home you reload but it might be something worth controlling.
YMMV, happy shooting
 
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Heffo
I’m just a beginner, but my Proof was shooting the 130 Berger’s with 41.8gr at a slow 2725 fps with SD 11.
I was storing the powder and reloading from my garage in FL.
Apparently, humidity consistency has quite an effect on measured weights amd velocity.
I don’t know where you live and where in your home you reload but it might be something worth controlling.
YMMV, happy shooting

Interesting mate. I’m in Australia so fairly consistent where I am….average 20-25C mostly, but 10ish lowest at night in winter, 35 highest in summer. No real humidity. Cheers.
 
Here’s an update.

I went to the range today to find a for sure upper limit. I found it and I saw ejector marks. I didn’t get to the speed I was looking. I saw them at 45gr and around 2,730fps. I stopped.

I did load some ammo and adjusted the seating depth based on previous ladder test. It looks like I am going to shoot 43.9gr.

My powder and primers are about 2yrs old. They have been stored in my safe and in my air condition house. I know that can make a difference but I’m hoping it isn’t this time. I have almost a whole 8lb jug and 2k primers.

My barrel is a Terminus profit cut by Straight Jacket Armory and it’s their SAAMI chamber.

I am going to load my rounds and hopefully next trip sight in my rifle. Happy shooting.
 

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I'm in lower GA. Probably similar to FL. I built an insulated room just for reloading. I've got a window unit that runs almost all year. I also bought a dehumidifier that runs 365 from Amazon. So far, it seems to works.
There was a video on YouTube a couple of weeks ago about the effects of humidity in powder and loads. Might look around for that bid.
 
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Need some info on loading with ADG brass. I know they run a higher pressure so I don’t want to overdue it with my powder charge.
ADG Brass large primer
H4350
210M
140gr Berger Hybrid
Sounds like most people end up between 40-42ish grains with standard brass. I’m thinking I would run a ladder 39-41 but maybe that’s too high.
 
Winchester Match Large RIfle Primer
41.5 Gr H4350
Starline Brass
140 ELD-M Hornady
2750 FPS
24in Howa 'Brand' Barrel.

I went to 42 with no pressure signs, but my shooting was terrible so I don't have effective ladder results. I did use this to get a 10 round sub-MOA group (barely) @ 100.
 
Winchester Match Large RIfle Primer
41.5 Gr H4350
Starline Brass
140 ELD-M Hornady
2750 FPS
24in Howa 'Brand' Barrel.

I went to 42 with no pressure signs, but my shooting was terrible so I don't have effective ladder results. I did use this to get a 10 round sub-MOA group (barely) @ 100.
I’m interested in pressure signs specific to ADG brass. I don’t think Starline has that issue.
 
I was a bit late to get a 6.5CM but I happened upon a great deal on the Howa Oryx and it was just too good a deal to pass on.
My first range trip was a bit disappointing. The Howa is what i refer to as fidgety rifle. It's very sensitive to any shooter input and it will show any bad habits you have. For my second trip i decided to explore some new loads with Win 6.5 StaBall
I made the mistake of looking at Quickload and looked for a load that hits peak pressure @ about 95% fill and came up with a load of 44.5 Gr and a oal of 2.8
After making up a few I had second thoughts and checked the Winchester site and they listed peak pressure @ 44 Gr. and 61k
So I went back and made some more at lower charge weights.
At the range today the lower weight charges shot like crap so I got brave and decided to try my 44.5 loads and surprisingly no pressure signs on the primers and no extract issues and the only loads that shot reasonably well.
I will have to make more for my next trip that are closer to the 44.5
 
I was a bit late to get a 6.5CM but I happened upon a great deal on the Howa Oryx and it was just too good a deal to pass on.
My first range trip was a bit disappointing. The Howa is what i refer to as fidgety rifle. It's very sensitive to any shooter input and it will show any bad habits you have. For my second trip i decided to explore some new loads with Win 6.5 StaBall
I made the mistake of looking at Quickload and looked for a load that hits peak pressure @ about 95% fill and came up with a load of 44.5 Gr and a oal of 2.8
After making up a few I had second thoughts and checked the Winchester site and they listed peak pressure @ 44 Gr. and 61k
So I went back and made some more at lower charge weights.
At the range today the lower weight charges shot like crap so I got brave and decided to try my 44.5 loads and surprisingly no pressure signs on the primers and no extract issues and the only loads that shot reasonably well.
I will have to make more for my next trip that are closer to the 44.5
Just got some 6.5 Staball as well. Haven’t loaded any yet , but 4350 is a unicorn and have to explore other powders. I have heard Staball likes to be loaded hot. What kind of speed are you getting with it ?
 
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ladder test on new 26" Bartlein
H4350
140 Berger hybrid
Gunwerks brass
CCI BR2
seems fast compared to previous CM barrels
 

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I'm getting between 2950-3000 for 123gr ELDM and SST. With a less than max charge.

That's out of a 24" tube.

You should get high 2700s to low 2800 if I did my math correctly.

Doc
123 ELDM's for hunting ? just curious, always read that bthp's are not for hunting, but haven't read anything about the ELDM's, althought I don't think Bambi would know the difference ?
 
SO ?? DOC 68 said,123 ELDM, and THE WALKER said 120 ELDM for his hunting rifle

Hornady says ELMs are target orientated (non expanding) and ELDXs are hunting orientated (expanding).

No doubt you'll say "So?!" - well as the manufacturer they will have tested them extensively to verify they are indeed the best fit for the intended purpose.

Will ELDMs work? Maybe, maybe not (I wont even get into the ethics side of it), but some food for thought - if the ELDMs & ELDXs had the same availability & price wouldn't it be obvious which would be the better fit if hunting was the end goal?
 
Well i also prefer stout hunting bullets when chasing large critters in the woods. The lead core hunting projectiles have thicker jackets chemically bonded to the lead core that expand into a large mushroom shape, and retain most of their weight, so they usually punch through to the opposite side leaving a large exit wound. A clear blood trail is helpful for tracking purposes, especially if shot placement was less than ideal.

But if the component shortage forces you to consider target bullets for hunting, i can tell you they still kinda work: Animals like boar hogs that i shot behind the shoulder dropped within yards. Target bullets sometimes exit (and then there is a massive messy 2” exit wound), but sometimes not. Folks who have cut open animals shot with thin jacketed target bullets report that the bullet explode into tiny pieces once it is 2-3” inside the animal, and that the bullet does not hold together. Ballistic gell tests show the same, many such videos on u-tube. Bullet disintegration is less than ideal - but it still works if shot placement is ok. Hollow point Berger bullets do the same and they say their bullets are meant to be ‘explode’ inside the animal. Lots of meat damage thou.

My advice is shoot the best hunting bullet you have, but if you can’t find any, shoot the next best bullet you have. Heavy for caliber high BC bullets sometimes carry a little more energy, and as long as impact velocity is sufficient to expand the bullet, they work well enough. Lighter bullets are sometimes needed in short barrel rifles to keep impact velocity up.

When it gets to caliber, bigger is better: A 375 H&H will always outperform a 308Win on large African game animals like Eland and Zebra, and a 308Win will always outperform a 223Rem on elk. A 300 Winmag shooting a 225 grain ELDX bullet will also outperform a 308 shooting 165 Gamekings.

Aim for 2,200 fps minimum impact velocity (more is better), even if the bullet maker says 1,600 fps is ok. Marketing types make those statements - and one wonders about the ethics of that ‘profession’…. Same folks who will tell you how terrible a cheaper target bullet is for hunting purposes.

If you don’t have a stable position and your ‘wobble zone’ is bigger than the vitals of the animal, then don’t take the shot, sneak in closer, and try again.

I carry a small rice bag with me when i hunt, and it helps a lot. And if i break a leg miles away from a road, i can cook rice for 3 days waiting for the $75,000 helicopter rescue… 😁
 
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Hornady says ELMs are target orientated (non expanding) and ELDXs are hunting orientated (expanding).

No doubt you'll say "So?!" - well as the manufacturer they will have tested them extensively to verify they are indeed the best fit for the intended purpose.

Will ELDMs work? Maybe, maybe not (I wont even get into the ethics side of it), but some food for thought - if the ELDMs & ELDXs had the same availability & price wouldn't it be obvious which would be the better fit if hunting was the end goal?
There is quite a lot of reporting indicating the ELD-M has very similar on game performance as the ELD-X.

I need a lighter bullet out of a shorter barrel to obtain the desired velocity. ELD-X only has the 143, while ELD-Ms have various.

I haven't seen a review of someone dissecting the bullets to measure jacket thickness, but logic says the target bullet would have a thinner jacket. Even with cases of fragmentation, the target bullets still seem to retain 50-70% mass which would be acceptable to me on medium game plus the fragmentation into vitals.

For me, I don't think more is needed for medium game. I have different calibers for larger game.

There is also likely a marketing/corporate CYA marketing target bullets for hunting. At the distance/velocity I intend to use these on medium game, I personally think the target bullet may offer more than a slower hunting bullet for expansion.
 
Hornady says ELMs are target orientated (non expanding) and ELDXs are hunting orientated (expanding).

No doubt you'll say "So?!" - well as the manufacturer they will have tested them extensively to verify they are indeed the best fit for the intended purpose.

Will ELDMs work? Maybe, maybe not (I wont even get into the ethics side of it), but some food for thought - if the ELDMs & ELDXs had the same availability & price wouldn't it be obvious which would be the better fit if hunting was the end goal?

The ELD-M and TMK are both excellent hunting bullets that yield very consistent terminal performance down to relatively low velocities. There are plenty of results from the field on actual game that can be turned up with a search engine. A heavier for caliber ELD-M or TMK often makes an ideal all around choice because of its ability to fragment consistently when encountering different amounts of resistance (game weight and toughness) while maintaining adequate penetration.

"... but, the writing on the box/website says..."
You can chalk that up to the manufacturer jumping legal hoops or just having a mindset of a specific type of performance being ideal for the American market. Obviously, if your idea of ideal performance is a lot of wasted energy and a pretty mushroom with 95%+ retained weight, you won't be happy with match bullets.
 
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Anyone hit on a combination they like with 130 TMK and IMR 4451? I'm a little perplexed at the moment. I had a load I quite liked with H4350... nothing doing with the 4451 so far. I'm about 45 spent primers into load development with nothing to show for it.

As predicted here, the 130 TMK and 43 grains of H4350 yielded quite good performance from my rifle. Indeed, when I shot clean/cold bore with this (down to 40 rounds left), it did what it normally does. I kept the same same seating depth for the 4451 when doing pressure work-up... awful groups. Did a seating depth test over 30 thou... awful groups.

It's not a matter of fine tuning, I can't find a combo that shoots at all. The seating depth test I did this weekend started with 130 TMK over H4350 into a cloverleaf and ended with factory 147 ELD-M into a cloverleaf... every IMR 4451 load I tested in between those was well over 1 MOA.

On the bright side, 4451 seems to shoot just fine with the Berger 140 HTs... guess I can try to 130s... only another 10-15 cents per round or so, right?
 
The ELD-M and TMK are both excellent hunting bullets that yield very consistent terminal performance down to relatively low velocities. There are plenty of results from the field on actual game that can be turned up with a search engine. A heavier for caliber ELD-M or TMK often makes an ideal all around choice because of its ability to fragment consistently when encountering different amounts of resistance (game weight and toughness) while maintaining adequate penetration.

"... but, the writing on the box/website says..."
You can chalk that up to the manufacturer jumping legal hoops or just having a mindset of a specific type of performance being ideal for the American market. Obviously, if your idea of ideal performance is a lot of wasted energy and a pretty mushroom with 95%+ retained weight, you won't be happy with match bullets.
^^^^^^^ This is truth......
 
Anyone hit on a combination they like with 130 TMK and IMR 4451? I'm a little perplexed at the moment. I had a load I quite liked with H4350... nothing doing with the 4451 so far. I'm about 45 spent primers into load development with nothing to show for it.

As predicted here, the 130 TMK and 43 grains of H4350 yielded quite good performance from my rifle. Indeed, when I shot clean/cold bore with this (down to 40 rounds left), it did what it normally does. I kept the same same seating depth for the 4451 when doing pressure work-up... awful groups. Did a seating depth test over 30 thou... awful groups.

It's not a matter of fine tuning, I can't find a combo that shoots at all. The seating depth test I did this weekend started with 130 TMK over H4350 into a cloverleaf and ended with factory 147 ELD-M into a cloverleaf... every IMR 4451 load I tested in between those was well over 1 MOA.

On the bright side, 4451 seems to shoot just fine with the Berger 140 HTs... guess I can try to 130s... only another 10-15 cents per round or so, right?
Try a different primer, sometimes it's magic, not always but it's an easy test.
.02
 
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Any suggestions on a short 18” barrel load? I have 123gr SST on hand I’d like to use for this as furthest shot with this particular rifle would be ~250yds due to vegetation.

Powders I have on hand:
8208
varget
4350
RL26 (this stuff has been fairy dust for me in other 6.5 rifles but the all have had 26” or so barrels and heavier bullets)
 
Any suggestions on a short 18” barrel load? I have 123gr SST on hand I’d like to use for this as furthest shot with this particular rifle would be ~250yds due to vegetation.

Powders I have on hand:
8208
varget
4350
RL26 (this stuff has been fairy dust for me in other 6.5 rifles but the all have had 26” or so barrels and heavier bullets)
I have an 18", but I have not tried any 123 bullets, just 130 and heavier. Just loaded some 129 ABLR but haven't shot them yet. I am using Rl16 and getting 2780 with the 130 and 2715 with the 140 class bullets. I have heard Varget works well with light bullets. PVA recommends Varget with their lighter hunting solid bullets and they get really good velocity.
 
Any suggestions on a short 18” barrel load? I have 123gr SST on hand I’d like to use for this as furthest shot with this particular rifle would be ~250yds due to vegetation.

Powders I have on hand:
8208
varget
4350
RL26 (this stuff has been fairy dust for me in other 6.5 rifles but the all have had 26” or so barrels and heavier bullets)
i have a 20" barrel and with varget and 120gr bergers im getting 2817 with 38.7gr and 2950 with 40gr if that helps
 
Re: **6.5 Creedmoor Loads**

Does anybody have a load for the 130 Berger VLD or the 130 JLK? How fast are those leaving the muzzle? Are they able to jump a little or do they have to be in the lands, I've heard both?
I use Berger 130 gr VLDs.
42.5 gr of Hodgdon H4350 produces ~2850 fps out of a 24" Brux
La Pua small primer brass and Fed GMM primers

The VLDs like to be close to the lands. It's very easy to see with a ladder test.
I started with 5 rounds at 0.020" off as 0.010"off does not fit into my mags.


IMG_5462.jpeg
 
I use Berger 130 gr VLDs.
42.5 gr of Hodgdon H4350 produces ~2850 fps out of a 24" Brux
La Pua small primer brass and Fed GMM primers

The VLDs like to be close to the lands. It's very easy to see with a ladder test.
I started with 5 rounds at 0.020" off as 0.010"off does not fit into my mags.

Potentially dumb question - what chamber print/reamer? I've worked with a few 130s, including the Berger Hybrid (but, not the VLD). All my 130s jump upwards of 100 thou because I don't feel comfortable with how little bearing surface is in the neck otherwise. Chamber was spec'd as SAAMI with .199 free bore when it was new.
 
Potentially dumb question - what chamber print/reamer? I've worked with a few 130s, including the Berger Hybrid (but, not the VLD). All my 130s jump upwards of 100 thou because I don't feel comfortable with how little bearing surface is in the neck otherwise. Chamber was spec'd as SAAMI with .199 free bore when it was new.
Sorry, I don't know what print and reamer my smith used. I suspect he used SAAMI. I will ask. He is doing another one for me now.

I haven't had any trouble with the small bearing surface. Range use only, not field shooting hauling the ammo around.
 
I have a bunch of shot federal 6.5 cases marked FC on them. Is this good reloading brass, I wonder how it compares to the Hornady I usually reload.
I use FC small primer brass. I have had better luck with it over Hornady. I am on about 6 firings and primer pockets are. Good. Hornady primer pockets stretched way to early on lighter loads.
 
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New guy here. I have two loads for my Ruger Go Wild.

142 smk
42.6 gn of RL17
Federal OTM 120 small pocket brass
CCI SRM primers.
20 thou from lands
If I remember it's about 2800fps.
.75 MOA


140 HOT CORE
Same as above.

Still playing with seating u
It gets the job done.
 
I did a search on this - didn't get any hits. Anybody have experience with H-380 in 6.5cm? I've found some load info but haven't tried it yet. I have some H-380 on hand so thought I'd give it a shot.

Mostly I'm shooting 140gr ELD-M's, but have some 130 Bergers' too. Powder has been either RL-17 or H-4350.
 
I’ve had good luck with 123gr Scenars, 130gr VLDs, and 130gr AR Hybrids launched at 2900 - 2975 from my 24” Bartlein barrels. In those bullet weights, I prefer Varget, but did just recently work up an accurate load using R16 and 130gr AR Hybrids. Haven’t had the opportunity yet to verify velocity.

This is a ten shot group. Subtract 1” from shown BTO. That figure includes my Sinclair hex nut comparator.

75-F49-E30-FE26-4-FCD-A867-83-C0-EE4-CFFF6.jpg

Update to add velocity.

Took this load out to 900 yards and calculated the velocity with Ballistic AE. It worked out to 2883 and the group was stupid good, about 5” horizontal, and less than 2” vertical.

John
 
Doc any reason your coal is so short on those? All my stuff is just a hair under mag length
I was seating them 30 thousands off lands. Short bullet with the 123gr versus a 140 or so.
 
Can someone take a base to ogive reading off some factory hornandy ammo with the ELDM bullets with either a 123gr or 140gr bullet please?

Thanks

Doc
 
Can someone take a base to ogive reading off some factory hornandy ammo with the ELDM bullets with either a 123gr or 140gr bullet please?

Thanks

Doc

I actually just ordered the right comparator insert and should have it by Wednesday. If you can wait till then, I'll get you a measurement.
 
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Just tore my reloading room apart looking for some factory ammo
I have some eldm 147 factory that I found. I’m sure I have a box of 140 if so can find it. May have have to my buddy
 
Can someone take a base to ogive reading off some factory hornandy ammo with the ELDM bullets with either a 123gr or 140gr bullet please?

Thanks

Doc
Datum is 1.003" for my analog calipers.
147 ELD-M measured at: 3.188, 3.186, 3.1855, 3.186, 3.1845. Average of: 3.186 --> 2.1830"
140 BTHP measured at: 3.2045, 3.205, 3.204, 3.205, 3.203. Average of: 3.2043 --> 2.2013"
140 ELD-M measured at: 3.197, 3.197, 3.197, 3.198, 3.197, Average of: 3.1972 --> 2.1942"

ETA: damn it, did 147s by mistake... wait one... OK, fixed.

Measured five rounds of each, included the raw in case I fouled the math. The ten thousandths place was estimated as either a 0 or a .5, so effectively measured to the nearest .0005".

Odd note, had a 20" barrel out today. The 130 TMK H4350 loads I chrono'd at 2850 fps out of my 22" barrel chrono'd at 2775 fps from the 20". Struck me as a big drop, though it was colder today than when they were loaded (likely ~20-30 deg F). By comparison, the 140 Berger HT IMR4451 loads "plummeted" from 2675 to 2660 fps (22" to 20"). I suppose it could be a humidity issue, just wouldn't expect that to affect already loaded ammo.

Those 140 HTs are the most accurate thing I've loaded so far... and I hate it ;-).
 
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Having some concerns with the initial load development with my new AIAX in 6.5CM and asking for opinions.

I'm experiencing faint pressure sings (ejector swipe) with new Lapua small primer brass on every charge I've tried. Did 50 rounds, five rounds each in 0.3 grain increments from 40.0 to 42.7 grains. Obvious accuracy nodes were between 40.3-40.6 and 42.4-42.7 but I'm concerned with the higher charges based on what I'm seeing. I loaded another 5 at 40.6 and ran across the chrono and they averaged only 2,417 fps with the 140gr Amax and that just plain sucks. Am I just paproid? Should I focus more in the 42.4gr area and just expect fewer loadings on the brass?

Here's a pic of the faint pressure sign, semicircle thought the "LA" in Lapua.
And a pic of my groups, 5 rounds at 100 yards (those labeled 41.4 & 41.7 are actually 42.4 & 42.7, I'm a moron).
 

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I’d say you’ve got an issue unrelated to powder. Unless your bore is finished like sand paper and somehow manages to make huge amounts of pressure without any velocity to show for it, there’s something else at play here. Under “normal” circumstances, at 250 fps below spec you’re nowhere near MAP.

ETA:
You know, as I go back and look at this... I can't figure out where your powder is going when you ignite it. My experience with IMR 4451 is that is typically takes a little more powder to get the same effect as H4350. 42 grains of 4451 in Hornady brass pushes 140s around 2675 for me out of a 22" barrel. I'd guess that's about 41.5 grains of H4350 or equivalent. Which is a long way of saying that your powder charges are probably about where they should be - stout, a little above book max. Your velocity is waaaay off, and I don't know why.
 
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