I shoot mine in a short action. I have to seat 168's deeeeeeeep but found an accuracy node. Push by 4831sc
PR has the Redding Type-S FL bushing back in stock finally. Bunch of the common titanium bushings too.
For the guys shooting 22” are you satisfied with your speeds? Thinking of grabbing a 22” proof pre fit for my TL3 for suppressed hunting in a smaller lighter package.
Put some rounds through my M70, 180 VLD @2850 should be easy street.
Got my 400MOD barrel in finally and it’s fucking exquisite, data to follow next week. Be shooting exclusively 184 Hybrids and H1000 @ 3.10ish coal on this one.
Put some rounds through my M70, 180 VLD @2850 should be easy street.
Got my 400MOD barrel in finally and it’s fucking exquisite, data to follow next week. Be shooting exclusively 184 Hybrids and H1000 @ 3.10ish coal on this one.
Anyone Loading for a short barrel 7 Saum? I have a 17 inch 1:8 carbon6 barrel being made for my r700 short action. I plan to run the 180 eldms and the 168lrx for California hunts. The powders I have are Rl26, Rl16, h4350 and h1000. Any other powder I should keep an eye out for?
I know rl26 will give me the most velocity which I will need with a short barrel. but I would love to find something a little more temp stable and consistent. that gets me close to the same speeds.
Also Sammi chamber for the 180s or will I need to have them throat it out a bit? They said they will do a custom throat if its needed, my max Coal is 2.950
I know rl26 will give me the most velocity which I will need with a short barrel. but I would love to find something a little more temp stable and consistent. that gets me close to the same speeds.
Also Sammi chamber for the 180s or will I need to have them throat it out a bit? They said they will do a custom throat if its needed, my max Coal is 2.950
I use 26 but in your case I would try 16. 16 is temp stable and obviously faster which will help you in that short barrel. I would expect good accuracy with 16.
Looking really good with H4831SC. I’m going to try 60-60.5 with a 210M should be able to dial it in better. Probably end up closer to 60 gr all said and done.
M70 w/26” 1/8 Brux suppressed, round count 48.
Nosler brass 1x
WLRM
H4831SC
180 VLD
2.950
60 gr 2860 avg better accuracy
60.5 gr 2894 avg best accuracy very slight ejector swipe
61 gr 2909 avg good accuracy ejector swipe sticky lift too hot
M70 w/26” 1/8 Brux suppressed, round count 48.
Nosler brass 1x
WLRM
H4831SC
180 VLD
2.950
60 gr 2860 avg better accuracy
60.5 gr 2894 avg best accuracy very slight ejector swipe
61 gr 2909 avg good accuracy ejector swipe sticky lift too hot
I’ve always ran between 60.5-60.9g rl26 with great results. But after some wild velocity drops in 10-20 degree weather I decided to give rl23 a shot on the new barrel
After 50 shots of virgin brass and seating tests, I started at 58.5 and worked to 60.7.
60 grain me 2905 with an es around 5. Shot.343 MOA on a gusty day with wind reading around 23mph. I think I’ll roll with it
After 50 shots of virgin brass and seating tests, I started at 58.5 and worked to 60.7.
60 grain me 2905 with an es around 5. Shot.343 MOA on a gusty day with wind reading around 23mph. I think I’ll roll with it
What brass are you using? I'm at 58.5 grains R-23 in ADG brass running just under 2,800 in a 22" bartlein. gonna increase the powder charge and see what I can get. Thx
ADG brass in 24” barrel. Are you short action or long. On a long with bullets seated longer you should be able to get around 61.5g, I made it to 60.7 with no pressure. And I think you should find accurate node around 2880..the next node seems to be up at 2970 for me but pretty hard on brass so I’m not going to pursue it. I’m shooting 175 elite hunters but they seem to run the same velocity as 180 hybrids
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Has ADG 7 SAUM brass came around yet? I wish Lapua or Peterson would offer the 7 SAUM.
Anyone made 7 saum from 6.5 saum brass? Usually happens the other way around but desperate times…
When components are scarce I like to tinker. Few pieces of old brass with loose pockets I keep around for dummies or die setting, lubed the necks then ran a 7mm mandrel and seated a 180 VLD. Loaded necks are .311. No crushing or deformation noted.
Function tests fine in my rifle, going to load a few and see how they do just to have the option.
When components are scarce I like to tinker. Few pieces of old brass with loose pockets I keep around for dummies or die setting, lubed the necks then ran a 7mm mandrel and seated a 180 VLD. Loaded necks are .311. No crushing or deformation noted.
Function tests fine in my rifle, going to load a few and see how they do just to have the option.
Supposed to be next month. I just did a survey with Lapua and told em 7 Saum is what they need to make. Hopefully others do too!
My 7 SAUM build is finished & I’ll finally have time for load development this weekend.
So here’s my question: Out of curiosity, what are you guys using for seating depth with the 190gr Bergers & the 183gr SMK’s. Knowing I was wanting to shoot the heavier bullets, my smith baked in a pretty good amount of freebore. I believe I’ll still be jumping the 190s at least .150 if they are just barely inside max coal for these MDT mid length mags.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Also curious as to how much I might expect to adjust powder charge between those different brands of brass. Hopefully my back order for more ADG fills sometime soon & I can just sell the other 2 brands.
- Lone Peak Fuzion Mid length action
- XLR Element 4.0 Magnesium chassis
- Bartlein 26” 1-8 CF barrel
- TriggerTech Diamond
- APA Gen III Fat bastard brake (may also experiment w/ my TBAC Dominus)
- Leica PRS w/ PRB reticle, in Spuhr mount. (I’ll probably just run this for the NF ELR event in June, and use a lighter optic for hunting)
- Ckye-Pod
So here’s my question: Out of curiosity, what are you guys using for seating depth with the 190gr Bergers & the 183gr SMK’s. Knowing I was wanting to shoot the heavier bullets, my smith baked in a pretty good amount of freebore. I believe I’ll still be jumping the 190s at least .150 if they are just barely inside max coal for these MDT mid length mags.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
Also curious as to how much I might expect to adjust powder charge between those different brands of brass. Hopefully my back order for more ADG fills sometime soon & I can just sell the other 2 brands.
Details on rifle and speeds? I have a shitload of both of those.
Its running 2857 average, slower than with RL 26 but I believe i have room to go up.
What barrel length you running?
No can do brother, team never sell these days.
Came across your comment while gathering data for my 7 SAUM build. Your setup sounds very similar to mine. Do you mind me asking what your load data looks like as far as powder, charge weight, primer, brass, seating depth, etc?
I’m running a 28” Bartlein HV
62.7 H1000. Fed215m. 190 berger hybrid. Adg brass. Idk what my seating depth is.
speed?
51* and pissing rain out but lucked into an hour of free time so I snuck off to the range to get some data. 4 rounds each load w/180 VLD @ 2.940 Win M70 w/26" Brux 1/8. Round count is now 76 rounds picked up about 20 fps from last time out. Probably a waste to develop right now with it still speeding up but was curious to track the increase over time. Made it through 5/7 loads before my MS V3 battery died. Note to self: get your shit together.
Hdy 6.5 SAUM brass necked up to 7 with 21st mandrel
59.5 H4831 SC
210M
Avg: 2798 SD: 13.4
Notes: Proof of concept, these were 8x fired in my 6.5 SAUM before rebarrel to 7 and on their last loading not bad for the shitty gen 1 brass. have 40 1x might try and hot rod these a bit to see how fast I can go without ruining my better brass.
Nosler 2x w/210M and H4831SC:
60 Avg: 2880 SD 14.7 very slight swipe
60.2 Avg 2894 SD 8.6 small swipe
60.4 Avg 2915 SD 9.8 swipe
Notes: Accuracy is definitely there but I think H4831SC is bit too fast for the 180s in this rifle. As the barrel speeds up I had just a slight swipe at 60 and more pronounced at 60.4. I would like to end up in the 2950 range so I think I will save it for 168s.
Nosler 2x w/210M and IMR7977:
62.5 Avg 2885 SD 2.2
63 2909 only 1 shot recorded
Notes: Had 8 brass left to load so randomly decided to try 62.5 and 63 gr of IMR 7977 just to see the speed and was pleased to shoot the best groups of the morning with solid velocity and SD, no pressure. 7977/H1000 burn rate is where I'll end up with 180s I think.
Hdy 6.5 SAUM brass necked up to 7 with 21st mandrel
59.5 H4831 SC
210M
Avg: 2798 SD: 13.4
Notes: Proof of concept, these were 8x fired in my 6.5 SAUM before rebarrel to 7 and on their last loading not bad for the shitty gen 1 brass. have 40 1x might try and hot rod these a bit to see how fast I can go without ruining my better brass.
Nosler 2x w/210M and H4831SC:
60 Avg: 2880 SD 14.7 very slight swipe
60.2 Avg 2894 SD 8.6 small swipe
60.4 Avg 2915 SD 9.8 swipe
Notes: Accuracy is definitely there but I think H4831SC is bit too fast for the 180s in this rifle. As the barrel speeds up I had just a slight swipe at 60 and more pronounced at 60.4. I would like to end up in the 2950 range so I think I will save it for 168s.
Nosler 2x w/210M and IMR7977:
62.5 Avg 2885 SD 2.2
63 2909 only 1 shot recorded
Notes: Had 8 brass left to load so randomly decided to try 62.5 and 63 gr of IMR 7977 just to see the speed and was pleased to shoot the best groups of the morning with solid velocity and SD, no pressure. 7977/H1000 burn rate is where I'll end up with 180s I think.
Going to load up a couple dozen of these and run them at distance in my M70. Need to start tracking cold bore and get a larger sample size so planning on 12 with the Magneto Speed and 12 without for next time. Wanted more speed but can’t argue with this.
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 100
Conditions: 19 May 22, 51* sunny, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Nosler 3x
210M
180 VLD
62.3 gr IMR 7977
2.940 .010 jump
Avg 2868 SD 5.6
No pressure signs
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 100
Conditions: 19 May 22, 51* sunny, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Nosler 3x
210M
180 VLD
62.3 gr IMR 7977
2.940 .010 jump
Avg 2868 SD 5.6
No pressure signs
180 and 190 berger shoot well for me .020 off the lands.
Just some info that I figured I might share here so that it might benefit somebody else in their process.
Finally got my new 7 SAUM this weekend to put the 1st rounds thru the pipe. Surprised to see the speeds I did with this being a brand new Bartlein CF 26” barrel. This is on a Lone Peak mid-length action & I had my gunsmith chamber the barrel specifically for the 190gr Berger LRHT, so it probably has a bit more freebore than most.
Tested 3 types of brass, R-P, Norma, and ADG, all prepped identically. Only worked with 190gr Berger LRHTs seated .150 off the lands.
Started with the R-P brass at a pretty conservative 60.4 gr RL-26 load which averaged 2765 fps. Worked up in .4gr increments and got up to 63.6gr (averaging 2929 fps) before finally starting to see some very slight ejector slot marks on the R-P brass. Much faster than I expected given the barrel has a ways to go before it’s broken in.
Backed down to 62.0 gr to test the Norma & ADG brass side by side with the R-P. Velocities for each at 62.0gr RL-26 as follows:
R-P @ 2840 fps
Norma @ 2905 fps
ADG @ 2850 fps
The Norma brass started showing pressure signs at 62.4gr RL-26.
Took both the R-P & ADG brass back up to 63.6 gr just to verify some bc data at distance. By the end of my session the barrel had about 70 rounds thru it and the R-P & ADG loads both were averaging around 2965 fps with the 63.6 gr RL-26 charge. The ADG brass never showed any pressure signs.
A couple of interesting observations:
1) Genuinely surprised to see these speeds with just a 26” barrel, especially prior to being fully sped up. I’m guessing 3000 fps is gonna be pretty easily attainable.
2) when I measured case capacity prior to this testing, the R-P & Norma brass were nearly identical, and the ADG brass was about 2.0 gr more on average. Surprised to see the R-P brass perform closer to the ADG rather than the Norma.
Again, just some data points that I thought might be helpful for others.
Finally got my new 7 SAUM this weekend to put the 1st rounds thru the pipe. Surprised to see the speeds I did with this being a brand new Bartlein CF 26” barrel. This is on a Lone Peak mid-length action & I had my gunsmith chamber the barrel specifically for the 190gr Berger LRHT, so it probably has a bit more freebore than most.
Tested 3 types of brass, R-P, Norma, and ADG, all prepped identically. Only worked with 190gr Berger LRHTs seated .150 off the lands.
Started with the R-P brass at a pretty conservative 60.4 gr RL-26 load which averaged 2765 fps. Worked up in .4gr increments and got up to 63.6gr (averaging 2929 fps) before finally starting to see some very slight ejector slot marks on the R-P brass. Much faster than I expected given the barrel has a ways to go before it’s broken in.
Backed down to 62.0 gr to test the Norma & ADG brass side by side with the R-P. Velocities for each at 62.0gr RL-26 as follows:
R-P @ 2840 fps
Norma @ 2905 fps
ADG @ 2850 fps
The Norma brass started showing pressure signs at 62.4gr RL-26.
Took both the R-P & ADG brass back up to 63.6 gr just to verify some bc data at distance. By the end of my session the barrel had about 70 rounds thru it and the R-P & ADG loads both were averaging around 2965 fps with the 63.6 gr RL-26 charge. The ADG brass never showed any pressure signs.
A couple of interesting observations:
1) Genuinely surprised to see these speeds with just a 26” barrel, especially prior to being fully sped up. I’m guessing 3000 fps is gonna be pretty easily attainable.
2) when I measured case capacity prior to this testing, the R-P & Norma brass were nearly identical, and the ADG brass was about 2.0 gr more on average. Surprised to see the R-P brass perform closer to the ADG rather than the Norma.
Again, just some data points that I thought might be helpful for others.
Alright. I did some digging but want to verify what I think. Long action 7 saum 190s adg brass and h1000. Start around 60 grains? What do you guys step in? I'm use to alot of short action stuff where I increase in .2 grains but should I move .50 grains at a time?
Thanks everyone
Thanks everyone
What was the velocity
I'm running the same components in a medium action. I ended up using 62.7 H1000. 24 inch 8 twist @ 2885. I moved up in .2 gr increments.
If you really need brass it looks like Gunwerks has a 100 pack of 1x fired SAUM brass for $132. Appears to be Gunwerks headstamp so ADG is the the oem.
https://www.gunwerks.com/shop/once-fired-brass-100-count-22119?category=13
https://www.gunwerks.com/shop/once-fired-brass-100-count-22119?category=13
Hit the range for about an hour to check speeds with 168 ABLR and H4831SC and IMR7977.
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 117
Conditions: 09 Jun 22, 54* pissing rain, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Hdy 1x converted from 6.5 Gap 4S
WLRM
168 ABLR
2.950 .025 jump
1 rd per charge just for baseline
IMR 7977
62.0 - 2821
62.3 - 2823
62.6 - 2887
62.9 - 2903
63.2 - 2910
No pressure signs noted, powder is too slow for 168s.
H4831SC
60 - 2854
61.5 - 2926
61.8 - 2943
62.1 - 2960
Faint ejector channel imprint on the 62.1, will throw in a 210M next time and back down a couple tenths to try and end up at 2950. Nosler load data (ver 8.3) was spot on for 60 gr @ 2850.
I still haven't had time to go to my LR spot but grabbed just a few of my 180 VLD loads to test my batch to batch consistency. I modified my process and now lube the inside of the neck with One-Shot on a Q-Tip, then expander mandrel/charge/seat. I think it's in the "dont fuck with it" stage. Only have 24 pcs of Nosler brass so I wont be pushing this load any further to try and make them last.
Nosler 4x
210M
180 VLD
62.3 gr IMR 7977
2.940 .010 jump
2872, 2870, 2866 Avg 2869 SD 3.0
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 117
Conditions: 09 Jun 22, 54* pissing rain, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Hdy 1x converted from 6.5 Gap 4S
WLRM
168 ABLR
2.950 .025 jump
1 rd per charge just for baseline
IMR 7977
62.0 - 2821
62.3 - 2823
62.6 - 2887
62.9 - 2903
63.2 - 2910
No pressure signs noted, powder is too slow for 168s.
H4831SC
60 - 2854
61.5 - 2926
61.8 - 2943
62.1 - 2960
Faint ejector channel imprint on the 62.1, will throw in a 210M next time and back down a couple tenths to try and end up at 2950. Nosler load data (ver 8.3) was spot on for 60 gr @ 2850.
I still haven't had time to go to my LR spot but grabbed just a few of my 180 VLD loads to test my batch to batch consistency. I modified my process and now lube the inside of the neck with One-Shot on a Q-Tip, then expander mandrel/charge/seat. I think it's in the "dont fuck with it" stage. Only have 24 pcs of Nosler brass so I wont be pushing this load any further to try and make them last.
Nosler 4x
210M
180 VLD
62.3 gr IMR 7977
2.940 .010 jump
2872, 2870, 2866 Avg 2869 SD 3.0
This barrel seems to like 2850-2900. Nosler load data (ver 8.3) turned out to be spot on again with 60 gr H4831SC being the "most accurate powder tested". At this point not going to waste any more time/components, loading up my last 15 1x brass with 60 gr to test a larger sample size. If that checks out then I'm calling it good on load development with this rifle.
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 149
Conditions: 16 Jun 22, 65* sunny, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Hdy 1x converted from 6.5 Gap 4S
H4831SC
WLRM
168 ABLR
2.950 .025 jump
60 - 2892 avg SD 6.4
61.5 - 2952 avg SD 5.0
61.8 - 2966 avg SD 12.4
62.1 - 2975 avg SD 11.0 pressure
62.4 - 2990 avg SD 4.2 pressure
Gun: M70, 26” 1/8 Brux #5, Sandman-S, round count: 149
Conditions: 16 Jun 22, 65* sunny, 100 yd, sea level (ish)
Hdy 1x converted from 6.5 Gap 4S
H4831SC
WLRM
168 ABLR
2.950 .025 jump
60 - 2892 avg SD 6.4
61.5 - 2952 avg SD 5.0
61.8 - 2966 avg SD 12.4
62.1 - 2975 avg SD 11.0 pressure
62.4 - 2990 avg SD 4.2 pressure
Definitely post up your results. Thinking of doing something like that with the zermatt medium I have laying in the safe...
Update on my 18 inch Saum… 60 rounds down the pipe with 180 hyb/55.8gn H4350/210M/V.Brass. 105 Thou off seated deep into the case. Very short action magazine compatible. Averaging low 2680s now and with very windy conditions the other evening it was very very consistent at 1100 yards.
Attachments
Right on. If memory serves I think I had 180 hybrids about 100 thou jump also shooting real well in a 26" barrel from a TL3 and mag fed.
Here's some data from my 18in 7 SAUM running a Dead Air Nomad LT. I'm working on a load using 3841SC and 150gr Berger Classic Hunters at 20 thou jump. Right now, I was only looking at initial speeds as it only has 25 rounds or so down the pipe. Temp today was 75 degrees.
58.5Gr gave me 2673 for 7 shot average.
60.5 gave me 2774 5 shot average.
62 gave me 2848 for 4 shot average. My Magentospeed failed to pick up 1 for some reason.
58.5Gr gave me 2673 for 7 shot average.
60.5 gave me 2774 5 shot average.
62 gave me 2848 for 4 shot average. My Magentospeed failed to pick up 1 for some reason.
