Bartlein New Barrel Material 400MODBB

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
2 minutes ago
Bartlein Barrels is pleased to announce the release of a new barrel material. Working with the mill and testing different types of material and tweaking the material over the last few years and with testing having been performed by ammunition makers we now have a different grade of material that we have had made and is proprietary to us.

The material has been proven in lab testing and in outside real world testing to provide a barrel life that is 1.5 to 2 times longer than the standard 416 grade of material.

We are calling the material 400MODBB. Pricing for this barrel material in standard diameters/contours etc...will be $555.

As always there are a list of things that effect barrel life and we cannot guarantee everything a 100% but for an example as I know it will be asked....in 6.5CM ammunition pressure test barrels are normally pulled from service at around 1700 rounds. The new material doing the same type of ammunition test work the barrel was pulled from service after it had 3500 rounds on it. We've had several 6mm's in calibers that the barrel normally is pulled around 1500 rounds go 3000 rounds.

We and or the customers that have done the threading and chamber work have had no issues with machining. I will say your reamers will not last as long but nothing that would really concern me. It does machine a little different but it's not horrible to work with.

So you will have a choice of the standard 416 material from us and the 400MODBB material.

Any questions it would be a lot easier if you emailed us at info@bartleinbarrels.com or called in directly at 262-677-1717 but I can only imagine the amount of questions we will be getting and with everything going on in the world currently I'll ask you to be patient for the replies.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels
 

Supersubes

This is Sniper’s Hide, not the Benchrest Boutique!
Belligerents
Sep 6, 2006
4,928
3,753
219
Rural Nevada
Very cool stuff. You gotta sexy up that name though Frank!

Edit: I know you said email, but people are gonna be here to look which might save you future emails. Are there any limitations with the new material? All bore diameters, twist rates, gain twist etc. are available?
 

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
Available in carbon wrapped barrels?
Yes

The only thing different is the material. We have already made several barrels out of the new material for carbon fiber wrapping.

We did make two barrels for Mark here in the office for his two LV benchguns in 6PPC. They shoot in the .1xx's and no issues.
 

Attachments

Krob95

TFG
Hessian
Belligerents
Minuteman
Sep 7, 2019
652
571
99
NoCo
Yes

The only thing different is the material. We have already made several barrels out of the new material for carbon fiber wrapping.

We did make two barrels for Mark here in the office for his two LV benchguns in 6PPC. They shoot in the .1xx's and no issues.
This is awesome news!! Thanks Frank!
 

Hoyt7mm

Bow Shooter
Belligerents
Apr 6, 2017
416
75
34
West Bend, Wisconsin
Just picked up a standard stainless blank from Jeff Saturday.
Now I just put in an order for another with this material.
Definitely curious to see how they stack up against one another.
 

trophyhunter

Gun Father
Belligerents
Feb 13, 2011
1,044
473
189
41
Brownsville, Tx
I just told this to the guys, so glad your claims on prior 6.5cm & 6 round counts are very realistic. To many times I hear from way to many people “mine gets 4000rds”. I feel serviceable life for most is a very different quantity. But your claims seem correct from what most are pulling barrels.

when will these barrels be available and what contours, calibers will be first available ?

thank you
Gilbert
 

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
Very cool stuff. You gotta sexy up that name though Frank!

Edit: I know you said email, but people are gonna be here to look which might save you future emails. Are there any limitations with the new material? All bore diameters, twist rates, gain twist etc. are available?
I know guys will come to the hide and I'll do my best to make posts but I need to do work in the shop and office as well. So just keep that in mind that you cannot be everywhere.

No limitations on the new material. We've done 6mm, 6.5mm, 30cal, 416caliber, .375 etc...

Haven't done a 50bmg as of yet but I guess it will happen.

Later, Frank
 
  • Like
Reactions: 338dude

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
I just told this to the guys, so glad your claims on prior 6.5cm & 6 round counts are very realistic. To many times I hear from way to many people “mine gets 4000rds”. I feel serviceable life for most is a very different quantity. But your claims seem correct from what most are pulling barrels.

when will these barrels be available and what contours, calibers will be first available ?

thank you
Gilbert
Caliber and contours are pretty much available in everything. We have 1.312" diameter material and 2.125" diameter material.

We use the 1.312" diameter for standard bolt gun stuff etc...

The 2.125" diameter is primarily for ammunition test barrels. Those finish at 1.998" o.d. typically on the breech end. So we make a one piece test barrel. So if a guy wanted a 1.9" o.d. bolt gun barrel for a BAT 50cal action we can do it. In fact we've already done it.

The numbers I posted for barrel life are real world and based on ......ammunition test barrels where they have to shoot for pressure and velocity.....once the barrel starts giving up velocity or there is change in pressure (they don't want to see a pressure correction of over 2k psi). Once this happens they can no longer use the test barrel for making box ammo. They have to hit the velocity and pressure numbers. So the ammunition and bullet makers keep very detailed data on the loads, very consistent on cleaning and the intervals between cleaning and keep round count data and it's done in a controlled environment and controlled conditions. So a lot of the variables are removed. That's why the first barrels we made went to ammunition and bullet makers. I would get more accurate data from them then from just sending them out to anyone etc...

Now that don't mean the barrel still won't shoot accurately and a lot of the time they still do for a longer period of time. You can bump your load, chase the lands with seating the bullet out further etc....and retune the load basically to get the gun back in tune and shooting accurately but again the pressure and velocity testing they have to maintain those two parameters for loading safe and proper ammunition for the public and once they cannot they pull the barrels from service.

Later, Frank
 

pmclaine

Gunny Sergeant
Belligerents
Nov 6, 2011
18,530
25,237
219
52
MA
Will it take parkerizing/bluing?

The most modern steel with the most traditional finishes.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: 16 Gauge

steve123

Lt. Colonel
Belligerents
Mar 16, 2008
8,775
1,272
219
Flagstaff, AZ
These 400Mo's might be a good candidate for a set back compared to regular barrel steel???

I'm assuming pre-fits will be available too?
 

6brshooter

Sergeant
Banned !
Belligerents
Oct 2, 2012
2,242
899
219
Illinois
Frank, is this similar or harder/tougher than LW50? I'd always heard that lw50 was very tough, my lothar walthar prefit in 243 has 2500rds and still shoots in the .3s. I was impressed with that steel.
 

orkan

Primal Rights, Inc.
Commercial Supporter
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2008
3,231
934
219
South Dakota, USA
I've been long awaiting an announcement like this from a barrel manufacturer. Back when I published the "actual cause of barrel wear" video... I started looking to source a different material, but it was not an easy path to try to navigate. An actual barrel maker will have the throughput to make the conversations worthwhile.

We've long since needed an advancement in this area, and while it remains to be seen if it will be significant, I'm excited for the prospect.
 

GBMaryland

Sergeant
Belligerents
Feb 24, 2008
1,354
1,235
219
Maryland, US
Email sent... asked for a 30cal for the TRG-42 in 300WM. Bahahaha... Killed the first one, more or less, in 800rnds. Be curious to see that Frank and team have come up with!
 

Meety Peety

It's possible
Hessian
Belligerents
Minuteman
Dec 15, 2017
176
111
49
San Diego
Interesting, I'm looking forward to seeing what kind of longevity guys will get out of these, especially with some of the more "barrel burner" calibers. I just picked up two new bartlein blanks including a CFW barrel literally this morning, so maybe by the time I'm due for another one there will be some of these out there with high round counts in match use for comparison. Very cool
 

seansmd

In a minute man
Belligerents
Minuteman
Aug 8, 2018
1,465
1,036
119
San Jose, CA
Could one of these experts contrast this with the sleeved technology I heard shared on the PRM podcast, Dracos Straightjacket barrels? I believe the core barrels were Bartlien as well.
 

paraiso

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 14, 2008
123
2
22
FL
This is very interesting. It may have me taking another look at 6 Creed or XC. I'm very interested to hear the reports when people start shooting them.
 

Forgetful Coyote

Sergeant
Belligerents
Dec 13, 2011
1,984
376
189
Georgia
2 minutes ago
Bartlein Barrels is pleased to announce the release of a new barrel material. Working with the mill and testing different types of material and tweaking the material over the last few years and with testing having been performed by ammunition makers we now have a different grade of material that we have had made and is proprietary to us.

The material has been proven in lab testing and in outside real world testing to provide a barrel life that is 1.5 to 2 times longer than the standard 416 grade of material.

We are calling the material 400MODBB. Pricing for this barrel material in standard diameters/contours etc...will be $555.

As always there are a list of things that effect barrel life and we cannot guarantee everything a 100% but for an example as I know it will be asked....in 6.5CM ammunition pressure test barrels are normally pulled from service at around 1700 rounds. The new material doing the same type of ammunition test work the barrel was pulled from service after it had 3500 rounds on it. We've had several 6mm's in calibers that the barrel normally is pulled around 1500 rounds go 3000 rounds.

We and or the customers that have done the threading and chamber work have had no issues with machining. I will say your reamers will not last as long but nothing that would really concern me. It does machine a little different but it's not horrible to work with.

So you will have a choice of the standard 416 material from us and the 400MODBB material.

Any questions it would be a lot easier if you emailed us at info@bartleinbarrels.com or called in directly at 262-677-1717 but I can only imagine the amount of questions we will be getting and with everything going on in the world currently I'll ask you to be patient for the replies.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels
What type of steel would you say its most similar to? Is it still a 400-series stainless steel?
 

trophyhunter

Gun Father
Belligerents
Feb 13, 2011
1,044
473
189
41
Brownsville, Tx
Caliber and contours are pretty much available in everything. We have 1.312" diameter material and 2.125" diameter material.

We use the 1.312" diameter for standard bolt gun stuff etc...

The 2.125" diameter is primarily for ammunition test barrels. Those finish at 1.998" o.d. typically on the breech end. So we make a one piece test barrel. So if a guy wanted a 1.9" o.d. bolt gun barrel for a BAT 50cal action we can do it. In fact we've already done it.

The numbers I posted for barrel life are real world and based on ......ammunition test barrels where they have to shoot for pressure and velocity.....once the barrel starts giving up velocity or there is change in pressure (they don't want to see a pressure correction of over 2k psi). Once this happens they can no longer use the test barrel for making box ammo. They have to hit the velocity and pressure numbers. So the ammunition and bullet makers keep very detailed data on the loads, very consistent on cleaning and the intervals between cleaning and keep round count data and it's done in a controlled environment and controlled conditions. So a lot of the variables are removed. That's why the first barrels we made went to ammunition and bullet makers. I would get more accurate data from them then from just sending them out to anyone etc...

Now that don't mean the barrel still won't shoot accurately and a lot of the time they still do for a longer period of time. You can bump your load, chase the lands with seating the bullet out further etc....and retune the load basically to get the gun back in tune and shooting accurately but again the pressure and velocity testing they have to maintain those two parameters for loading safe and proper ammunition for the public and once they cannot they pull the barrels from service.

Later, Frank
All of what you stated makes perfect sense and in ideal conditions is what most of the shooters I know are striving for. I can definitely appreciate realistic data and real world conditions for test. To many times I’m sure you’ve heard it, “my barrel hasn’t dropped speed in over 4000rds”. And that person is shooting 6.5creed 🙄. Little do they mention that the barrel has been set back twice, powder has been added and everything has been tweaked multiple times. I for one as many I know, will develop a good load, and shoot the shit out of your barrels till we lose that first major speed loss. I buy enough bullets, powder, primers and everything needed for that barrel to not have to change anything over its life, and track its performance. I want to get away from the loading bench and out to shoot, have the consistency we’ve all come to love from a great barrel.

sure most barrels will accurately shoot for many more rounds, but as we all know, in PRS or long distance shooting, consistency is key, we want that same speed shot after shot.

Super excited to get one of these barrels. I’ll get with Greg at Bugholes to see what he’s ordering. My current favorites are 6mm heavy Palma 1:7.5 or Heavy varmint.

again super excited to see the strive in barrel science being made here
 

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
Can you share what the RC hardness is?
The lot came in at like 30RC. I’d have to pull the information again. We’ve had it for a year now in house waiting for test data back from various places before we would come out with it.

The hardness does play a part but not as critical as one would think.
 

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
All of what you stated makes perfect sense and in ideal conditions is what most of the shooters I know are striving for. I can definitely appreciate realistic data and real world conditions for test. To many times I’m sure you’ve heard it, “my barrel hasn’t dropped speed in over 4000rds”. And that person is shooting 6.5creed 🙄. Little do they mention that the barrel has been set back twice, powder has been added and everything has been tweaked multiple times. I for one as many I know, will develop a good load, and shoot the shit out of your barrels till we lose that first major speed loss. I buy enough bullets, powder, primers and everything needed for that barrel to not have to change anything over its life, and track its performance. I want to get away from the loading bench and out to shoot, have the consistency we’ve all come to love from a great barrel.

sure most barrels will accurately shoot for many more rounds, but as we all know, in PRS or long distance shooting, consistency is key, we want that same speed shot after shot.

Super excited to get one of these barrels. I’ll get with Greg at Bugholes to see what he’s ordering. My current favorites are 6mm heavy Palma 1:7.5 or Heavy varmint.

again super excited to see the strive in barrel science being made here
Yep I get what your saying in the first paragraph.

In your 2nd short paragraph....not just PRS but other disciplines as well. I like shooting F class when time permits as well.

Always have looked at finding different material that would last longer to any extent but still has to be machined with out any real headaches per say. We had a real small batch of material and in testing it lasted longer. US ARMY tested two barrels in 300wm and at 3000+ rounds still shot sub moa where as most 300wm barrels are dying around 1000 to 1200 rounds. The testing had to be suspended because of testing issues in the set up but it gave us enough data to pursue it even further and put us down a better path. The longest one the test facility ever had go prior to this testing was 1800 rounds. When they tested those two pieces we made them as we only had two pieces left. So we took the cut off pieces we had left of the solid material and sat down with the mill and the metallurgist and tweaked the formula from there. That’s where we are at now. By the way those last two test pieces didn’t get thrown out....there in my office.
 

Frank Green

Sergeant
Belligerents
Oct 27, 2006
1,139
753
219
wisconsin
www.bartleinbarrels.com
Sounds like a perfect barrel material for a 264 Win Mag or 26 Nosler build.
I’ll take the 264wm over the 26N. The WM was actually the first custom rifle I ever built. That was back around 1987.

Not to beat on Nosler but the 26 from what I‘ve seen you cannot get the velocity you think you should be able to get out of the heavier bullets. I’ve seen the 26N burn up test barrels in under 500 rounds.
 

trophyhunter

Gun Father
Belligerents
Feb 13, 2011
1,044
473
189
41
Brownsville, Tx
Yep I get what your saying in the first paragraph.

In your 2nd short paragraph....not just PRS but other disciplines as well. I like shooting F class when time permits as well.

Always have looked at finding different material that would last longer to any extent but still has to be machined with out any real headaches per say. We had a real small batch of material and in testing it lasted longer. US ARMY tested two barrels in 300wm and at 3000+ rounds still shot sub moa where as most 300wm barrels are dying around 1000 to 1200 rounds. The testing had to be suspended because of testing issues in the set up but it gave us enough data to pursue it even further and put us down a better path. The longest one the test facility ever had go prior to this testing was 1800 rounds. When they tested those two pieces we made them as we only had two pieces left. So we took the cut off pieces we had left of the solid material and sat down with the mill and the metallurgist and tweaked the formula from there. That’s where we are at now. By the way those last two test pieces didn’t get thrown out....there in my office.
Ya all shooting in general, but PRS is more important 🤣. For any discipline where consistency is key. I feel now is/has been huge leaps in rifle ballistics, cartridge designs, powders and now barrels in this sport. For the longest time, powders were the limiting factor and burn rates weren’t as tolerant as they are now. Bullets were shaped like footballs and flew well but extreme measures were needed to ensure X’s. Scales were calibrated with quarters and left to seesaw on the table, now we use pharmaceutical type scales. And now barrels made from lightning bolts from Zeus.

such strides in changing the game, keep it up