Rifle Scopes Bolt Action comp rifle with Red Dot offset?

[StrayDog]

Anybody use an offset RDS on their comp bolt rifle?
Did it help you improve NPA and shave off time, or did it become a distraction?
I like the idea of dropping into a strong position using a dot and then quickly switching my eye to 20x to fire and spot, but, I'm satisfied with my NPA right now scanning and engaging from 10-20+ magnification.
Curious if y'all have tried a dot, and whether you stuck with it or not.
FWIW, I'm considering an RMR dot at 45 deg on my strong side for an easy head nod to the scope at a higher mag.
Thanks Hide.

 

[Birddog6424]

I think you are better served by getting a fix on the target locations with the naked eye. Then running at a magnification level that allows you to quickly acquire the target as you find the target over your scope, then drop behind the scope.

I dont need a 1x device to locate my target as I already have a pair of 1x eyes to do it. In short, I think the red dot is unneccessary.

 

[StrayDog]

I tend to agree, but have you tried it?

 

[SRPowah]

Not comp use but for ground squirrels... I prefer the red dot at the 12 o'clock position if its meant to get a bearing, but I also tend to just use the turret housing as an ugly ass iron sight without much issue on targets that are normally smaller than a PRS target.

Likely one of those things that can help split the difference in the the top 3, but won't make a weaker shooter leapfrog anyone.

 

[Birddog6424]

I tend to agree, but have you tried it?

To a fairly large extent I have. I've ran an offset red dot in 3 Gun on both AR15 and AR10 platforms. So I have a pretty good feel for transition times and usage.

 

[StrayDog]

Thanks for the input.
Thinking I need to try it on my bolt rifle and see if it works for me.
Dot on my strong side, at 45° on a front ring, so I wouldn't cant or transition the rifle like an AR in 3G.
I'd just position up solid behind the dot and then slightly angle my head to normal cheek weld with the scope already at 20x.
Part of the reason I'm so curious is the reticle I want to use is clearest at a higher power, and less so at 10-15x where I usually engage steel with my Razor2.
Crap, I'm gonna just have to try it.

 

[Kjp616]

Just my 2¢
If your running 3gun then it's an obvious advantage, or PRS in the gas gun division with an AR variant.
Now in bolt PRS my opinion is there are times when it could come in handy if your not comfortable finding the target at low mag and dialing up but feel it's offset by some negatives I'll mention as well.
Some of these times it may come in handy I feel are:

• When your at that 600 and above mark and trying to spot a small target.
• A not well painted target (possibly from being hit by multiple shooters before you)
• Those odd positions where it's hard to get your head positioned as well as you like.
• The stages with smaller targets set in a wide arc that have a big transition.

Having said that, I don't currently run one as I don't want to have "a crutch", for lack of a better word, that could fail due to it being an electronic item. I also noticed that the small tilt of the head to acquire a site picture in the rdr had a tendency to also bring my rifle out of lvl, (where the head moves the body travels) even if it's just by a degree or two it could be devastating at long range. I can quickly see my level with my weak side without moving. If being able to see through a rdr was as easy and caused me not to move from my set position (no matter how little) I'd be more apt to use it. But any time gained from the rdr I feel is lost by getting back on my rifle.
Not to mention adding a $600 msrp rdr could bring you over the total allowance in production class as it would be considered adding to the overall accuracy to the gun, at least I would think. Please correct me on that if I'm wrong because now that I'm typing it I'm wondering if it would count against the total or not.

Okay so that was more like a $1.02 worth of input lol.

 

[hic28]

Run it at 12 right above your elevation turret, the natural movement is to look over your scope, find the target and come down to look through the scope. Having a 1moa red dot 100% increases speed on target.

I never come off 25 power and can go from port arms to shots on target at pretty much any distance in less than 10 seconds.

 

[StrayDog]

Thanks all, I'm gonna dive in and experiment, I shoot Tactical (.308) but switching to Open next season, drinking the Creed Koolaid for less recoil and more speed.
I do recognize a RDS could become a crutch habit, bu, it's really for those awkward stages where I can't get directly behind the rifle on weird props with a wide range of small target transition that I've felt this might help shave time. Or, like hic28, to quickly engage at 25x, sounds crafty.
I do like the 12:00 idea, and will start there.
It's been a goal of mine to shoot at higher mag and this seems helpful to drop into the eyebox without dialing up.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not ignoring the fundamentals--I'm just considering this another match tool to help me engage/spot on high mag in less time in awkward positions.
I have seen RDSs on rifles out there but hadn't heard much feedback--thanks for weighing in!

 

[308pirate]

How does a reflex sight, with no magnification, make finding a target faster?

Also, NPA has nothing to do with finding the target.

 

[SRPowah]

How does a reflex sight, with no magnification, make finding a target faster?

Not sure if sarcasm or actually managed to go over your head. We are talking about finding the target with the optic at 20x+ magnification. Narrow FOV can be a bitch, where as dot can point you almost directly on target before you even look through the magnified optic. It can definitely help depending on a shooter's style.

 

[308pirate]

Not sure if sarcasm or actually managed to go over your head. We are talking about finding the target with the optic at 20x+ magnification. Narrow FOV can be a bitch, where as dot can point you almost directly at the target before you even look through the magnified optic. It can definitely help depending on a shooter's style.

Let me spell it out for you then. How is a reflex sight that has NO magnification any better than the naked eye (which also has no magnification) at finding the target when you just lift up your head to look over the scope?

 

[SRPowah]

Let me spell it out for you then. How is a reflex sight that has NO magnification any better than the naked eye (which also has no magnification) at finding the target when you just lift up your head to look over the scope?

By putting the dot on the target, you will be putting your very limited FOV magnified optic almost directly over the target or at least within the FOV. If you read my first response im in the naked eye camp, but that doesn't mean the red dot idea doesn't work. That is why you see them slapped on spotting scopes. You should try it sometime.

 

[hic28]

Let me spell it out for you then. How is a reflex sight that has NO magnification any better than the naked eye (which also has no magnification) at finding the target when you just lift up your head to look over the scope?

does your naked eye have a precise aiming point like a red dot has? I looked over the scope for years and am super confident shooting like that and using a red dot is faster.

I have a 1 MOA dot That is matched to my scope reticle at 600 yards.

if the dot is covering the target, my scope will be within 1-2 mils of the target.

 

[Kjp616]

Let me spell it out for you then. How is a reflex sight that has NO magnification any better than the naked eye (which also has no magnification) at finding the target when you just lift up your head to look over the scope?

I personally do not use 25x power unless I'm reaching out to 1200 or more. Anything 1000 in I was taught in the Corp, and still abide by, 10-12x is more then sufficient.
Having said that during PRS comps you are sometimes shooting at small targets that can be hard for some to see at 10x. As you know your FOV is extremely hampered at 25x, so trying to track/spot a 12“ steel at 1000 can be a daunting task if its something you have not practiced a lot.
We also have to remember that your not tracking/spotting a military E-type silhouette that is roughly 40x20, giving you a huge 4 minute of angle elevation window for ranging at 1,000 yards and a 2 MOA wide target to allow for errors in wind calls.
Perhaps your able to run to a point, get your body in a stable and proper NPA for the barrier you have been presented and then quickly (under 20sec) find a 12" or smaller, target at 1000 @ 25x, majority can not. Remember that at 1000 yards, an actual MIL of deviation equates to 36"
I will not tout my marksman abilities, but I will say that trough the prior service and LEO I have plenty of experience in PLR shots and I would not be able to find it that quciky at that power. I can very quickly find it 10x and then zoom if needed. To the statement of NPA has nothing to with finding a target, I would respectfully disagree. Without proper mechanics and NPA one cannot, or rather would have a lot of difficulty finding and maintaining a target at 1000+yds at that high of mag.
In the end it doesn't matter, what works for you works, all that matters is that your on target and the rifle goes boom.

 

[Beardsli]

I have tried it with a 12 o'clock and a offset 45 degree mount but I found that it moves my head a bit too much, even with a low profile reflex dot.

I watch a lot of much better shooters on Instagram and a few of them don't use the the RDS at all to get on target, and I have a feeling it's just through sheer practice - seems like this might be a better route since you can use it on any rifle.

I wish there was more data out for who uses it and doesn't however.