Can someone explain closed forearms to me...

[BLKWLFK9]

Lol at this thread.

Most in the competition realm that may utilize an enclosed forends and NV bridges use them for mirage mitigation and to hold the front end of the rifle for balance sake in alternate positions. If u don't shoot tactical style matches nor use any type of clip on devices infront of your optic then its pointless but the vast majority use them for a purpose.

 

[BLKWLFK9]

Ah. Just realized that the OP is the same new guy from Portland.

Antifa trying to figure out how they're suppose to set up their comrades rifles and what all those metal things around barrels are for.

 

[THEIS]

Lol at this thread.

Most in the competition realm that may utilize an enclosed forends and NV bridges use them for mirage mitigation and to hold the front end of the rifle for balance sake in alternate positions. If u don't shoot tactical style matches nor use any type of clip on devices infront of your optic then its pointless but the vast majority use them for a purpose.

 

[stefan73]

I remember the original "mall-ninja" thread on glocktalk or ar15.com, whatever it was... some literal mall cop duct taping bulletproof plates to his chest because the shopping mall wouldn't issue a vest to him... anyways, it became the definition of using useless bullshit for the sake of having tactical/operator equipment. Did dude have any immediate need for bulletproof plates? No. But fear and ignorance led the fool to tape them to his chest... not unlike half the accessories I see on a lot of rifles these days.

When I was in the infantry, I stripped everything off my rifle and vest. Literally everything that wasn't required by SOP... I even drilled the rivets to the KAC handguard and took the heat shield out of it... didn't have a vertical foregrip... only attached the stupid IR laser at night.. later I took the piece of shit Elcan off my SAW, and the bipod, and the heat shield... when you actually have to pack that shit around all day, every ounce matters, and you get rid every stupid fucking thing that can snag on a seat belt or hit the up-armor plating on the 200# hmmwv door...

So, are you saying you are "that guy" that bitches about how he can't see shit at night with his nods and can see better without his nods?

Obviously you fail to see the benefit of those systems and I suspect it is from a lack of training. I never had a problem exiting my HMMWV or MRAPs or later Strykers with my assigned kit/gear. Just saying

 

[BLKWLFK9]

View attachment 7618853

Aye, homey. i own nothing with shlongslots. MLOK for life

 

[DavidBoren]

So, are you saying you are "that guy" that bitches about how he can't see shit at night with his nods and can see better without his nods?

Obviously you fail to see the benefit of those systems and I suspect it is from a lack of training. I never had a problem exiting my HMMWV or MRAPs or later Strykers with my assigned kit/gear. Just saying

No, never had a problem seeing through my NVG's... don't know how much training you need... check the batteries, turn it on, look through it... it was kind of neat how everything turned purple when you take them off after wearing them all night. Always had the pvs14's on the rhino, though, never mounted on my gun... so I know nothing about how that all works out.

You may have had a different experience than I did as far as egressing military vehicles. In No Slack, some fobbit genius decided we needed side plates on our IBA's... and with the limiter straps on the hmmwv doors keeping them from opening any further than 45 degrees... you were squeezing through less than an 18" gap, every time. Don't know what gear you were required to wear, but that's a tight squeeze for a SAW gunner, and still not exactly easy for a rifleman, either.

Sure, you could cut the limiter straps, but then the extended armor plates on the up-armored rear doors block the front doors from opening. Yeah, it was all fucking stupid. Stupid nut protectors. Stupid throat protectors. Stupid side sheets, under the stupid side plates, that had elastic straps which cut off circulation to your arms. Stupid grenade pouches required to be on the stupid vest even though we didn't get any stupid grenades. Stupid BLU emitter/blocker device strapped to my back to stop remote IED's. 600rnds of ammo for my stupid SAW.

I'm not a big guy... 6'3" 200#... was packin a little more muscle back then, I'm closer to 180# now... and I had trouble getting in and out of the hmmwv's. It was all MUCH easier with a stripped down/naked IBA, maybe a few single row mag puches and the first aid kit, pouch for your NVG's... a wee M4 with nothing but an M68 or ACOG on it. Do cartwheels in and out of the trucks by comparison... but people that don't have to wear the gear every day decided it was "best" if we piled on all that extra bullshit.

Anyways, whoever made the comment about Antifa... yeah, your default state of mind should be anti-facism... everyone that isn't a facist should be against facism. You say it like it's a bad thing. Lol. Those Portland people don't like facists... no, we don't. You shouldn't either. Nazi's and bigots are bad, mmkay? Don't know why any of that is relevant to a topic on enclosed handguards, but thanks for paying enough attention to see that I am both relatively new to this forum AND from Portland. You get a gold star.

 

[Choid]

No, never had a problem seeing through my NVG's... don't know how much training you need... check the batteries, turn it on, look through it... it was kind of neat how everything turned purple when you take them off after wearing them all night. Always had the pvs14's on the rhino, though, never mounted on my gun... so I know nothing about how that all works out.

You may have had a different experience than I did as far as egressing military vehicles. In No Slack, some fobbit genius decided we needed side plates on our IBA's... and with the limiter straps on the hmmwv doors keeping them from opening any further than 45 degrees... you were squeezing through less than an 18" gap, every time. Don't know what gear you were required to wear, but that's a tight squeeze for a SAW gunner, and still not exactly easy for a rifleman, either.

Sure, you could cut the limiter straps, but then the extended armor plates on the up-armored rear doors block the front doors from opening. Yeah, it was all fucking stupid. Stupid nut protectors. Stupid throat protectors. Stupid side sheets, under the stupid side plates, that had elastic straps which cut off circulation to your arms. Stupid grenade pouches required to be on the stupid vest even though we didn't get any stupid grenades. Stupid BLU emitter/blocker device strapped to my back to stop remote IED's. 600rnds of ammo for my stupid SAW.

I'm not a big guy... 6'3" 200#... was packin a little more muscle back then, I'm closer to 180# now... and I had trouble getting in and out of the hmmwv's. It was all MUCH easier with a stripped down/naked IBA, maybe a few single row mag puches and the first aid kit, pouch for your NVG's... a wee M4 with nothing but an M68 or ACOG on it. Do cartwheels in and out of the trucks by comparison... but people that don't have to wear the gear every day decided it was "best" if we piled on all that extra bullshit.

Anyways, whoever made the comment about Antifa... yeah, your default state of mind should be anti-facism... everyone that isn't a facist should be against facism. You say it like it's a bad thing. Lol. Those Portland people don't like facists... no, we don't. You shouldn't either. Nazi's and bigots are bad, mmkay? Don't know why any of that is relevant to a topic on enclosed handguards, but thanks for paying enough attention to see that I am both relatively new to this forum AND from Portland. You get a gold star.

Sir, I recommend you to the Bear Pit.

 

[stefan73]

No, never had a problem seeing through my NVG's... don't know how much training you need... check the batteries, turn it on, look through it... it was kind of neat how everything turned purple when you take them off after wearing them all night. Always had the pvs14's on the rhino, though, never mounted on my gun... so I know nothing about how that all works out.

You may have had a different experience than I did as far as egressing military vehicles. In No Slack, some fobbit genius decided we needed side plates on our IBA's... and with the limiter straps on the hmmwv doors keeping them from opening any further than 45 degrees... you were squeezing through less than an 18" gap, every time. Don't know what gear you were required to wear, but that's a tight squeeze for a SAW gunner, and still not exactly easy for a rifleman, either.

Sure, you could cut the limiter straps, but then the extended armor plates on the up-armored rear doors block the front doors from opening. Yeah, it was all fucking stupid. Stupid nut protectors. Stupid throat protectors. Stupid side sheets, under the stupid side plates, that had elastic straps which cut off circulation to your arms. Stupid grenade pouches required to be on the stupid vest even though we didn't get any stupid grenades. Stupid BLU emitter/blocker device strapped to my back to stop remote IED's. 600rnds of ammo for my stupid SAW.

I'm not a big guy... 6'3" 200#... was packin a little more muscle back then, I'm closer to 180# now... and I had trouble getting in and out of the hmmwv's. It was all MUCH easier with a stripped down/naked IBA, maybe a few single row mag puches and the first aid kit, pouch for your NVG's... a wee M4 with nothing but an M68 or ACOG on it. Do cartwheels in and out of the trucks by comparison... but people that don't have to wear the gear every day decided it was "best" if we piled on all that extra bullshit.

Anyways, whoever made the comment about Antifa... yeah, your default state of mind should be anti-facism... everyone that isn't a facist should be against facism. You say it like it's a bad thing. Lol. Those Portland people don't like facists... no, we don't. You shouldn't either. Nazi's and bigots are bad, mmkay? Don't know why any of that is relevant to a topic on enclosed handguards, but thanks for paying enough attention to see that I am both relatively new to this forum AND from Portland. You get a gold star.

You're No Slack? I knew a guy or two from there. The weight of all that kit did suck and the side plates didn't stop EFPs. We didn't have the limiting straps on our HMMWV's (I think those had long broken off before the guys we replaced ripped out). Of course they were also on their 2nd or 3rd M2 because they never head spaced and timed them, but I digress.

The ballistic underwear in Afghanistan did save a lot of lives and guys junk even though it chafed like a son of a gun!

Point is, the systems that we employed gave us an advantage because we employed them, employed them correctly and employed them damn well. They are of no benefit if they are sitting in the bottom of a tuff box! Many of my hits were at night because we leased the night with an option to buy. So, having the systems correctly employed while clearing buildings, houses gave us the advantage.

Currahee

 

[Grant77]

Operator as fuck when you got a night vision bridge.

Hilarious

 

[NC_Libertarian]

Au contraire, I care not what others do. I was honestly wondering the purpose of the enclosed handguard, and have since seen its practical application in various shooting positions. Mirage mitigation also makes sense.

I, personally, will always consider excess rail space mall-ninja AF. All those tacti-cool acessories people put on their guns in an effort to just fill the available real estate is unnecessary bulk/weight. The rails, themselves, are often just unnecesary bulk/weight. ARCA and MLOK rails have reduced some of this bulk/weight... but having empty mounting space on top of the barrel seemed useless, excess, and wasted to me. Why even put material there, at all?

A place to put the hand. Mirage mitigation. And, for the few that actually have the necessary optical accessories... nightvision/thermal capabilities. Operator as fuck.

Looking at this from a strictly structural design aspect:

A forearm on a rifle is a beam in a cantilever load. A tubular beam has a higher omnidirectional strength-to-weight ratio as compared to a u-beam. With an enclosed handguard being approximately a tubular beam, and a traditional stock being approximately a u-channel, then the fully enclosed forearm is stronger per unit mass than the traditional arm.



So maybe you should stop seeing "unused" forearm space as mall ninja, and start seeing it as torsional rigidity. It is in fact being used, to create structural integrity, even if nothing is bolted to the outside of it.

Since you go on and on here about saving every ounce, maybe you should consider going mall ninja yourself, seeing that the enclosed handguard is actually lighter.

 

[DavidBoren]

Science.

I can appreciate a purely engineering perspective. And that makes sense.

Thank you for bringing that to my attention. All opinions aside, especially my own, these are the answers I was seeking when I asked the question.

 

[TacticalPlinker]

I played 3Gun prior to getting pulled toward bolt action competition. Just a novice to PRS style competition. That being said , I find the enclosed forend designs like the Cadex Lite Competition and the new AT-X an easy transition from the AR-15 . I used the Costa Clamp method as one of the tools in my positional shooting bag of tricks.

Against barricades it's very comfortable for me to wrap my hand around the whole tube. YMMV...

 

[GrumpyOleFart]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with adorning your beloved firearm with any kind of tacticool or shiny thing.
It's a personal preference.
Glue a fluorescent rubber cock to it, if you want.
Bling it, sling it, cam it, write religious or Second Amendment phrases on it ( more or less the same thing for some people), stick whatever the fuck you want on it.
Just enjoy.

 

[scudzuki]

My AIAX 308 came with a tubular hanguard/forearm and full length pic rail on top.
It came in handy this year when I bought a PVS-30. I never really thought about it before then.

 

[deersniper]

Anyways, whoever made the comment about Antifa... yeah, your default state of mind should be anti-facism... everyone that isn't a facist should be against facism. You say it like it's a bad thing. Lol. Those Portland people don't like facists... no, we don't. You shouldn't either. Nazi's and bigots are bad, mmkay? Don't know why any of that is relevant to a topic on enclosed handguards, but thanks for paying enough attention to see that I am both relatively new to this forum AND from Portland. You get a gold star.

Can we ban these commie faggots? ^

Also

 

[Steel head]

Operator as fuck when you got a night vision bridge.

So if you made your own night vision bridge from aluminum C channel are you SOAF?

 

[Hutch_WV]

It's sort of like a ZJ

Thank you for that joke. I ha ent seen that in a while. Remains hilarious forever.

 

[jakelly]

Good thread man. So you don't care what others do except enough to think about it, start a thread about it, argue about it and decide that, despite responses, you will condemn them for your preconceived notions. Seems time to use your mental pistol and fight back to a place where you can reason a bit better.

A liberal giving advice on mental pistol tactics?!?

 

[6MT]

Au contraire, I care not what others do. I was honestly wondering the purpose of the enclosed handguard, and have since seen its practical application in various shooting positions. Mirage mitigation also makes sense.

I, personally, will always consider excess rail space mall-ninja AF. All those tacti-cool acessories people put on their guns in an effort to just fill the available real estate is unnecessary bulk/weight. The rails, themselves, are often just unnecesary bulk/weight. ARCA and MLOK rails have reduced some of this bulk/weight... but having empty mounting space on top of the barrel seemed useless, excess, and wasted to me. Why even put material there, at all?

A place to put the hand. Mirage mitigation. And, for the few that actually have the necessary optical accessories... nightvision/thermal capabilities. Operator as fuck.

Yep!

I removed the top rail off the fore end here. It also had side rails near the front...removed as well. Me thinks the air space, although not a lot with this thick barrel, does mitigate heat a little. The bottom rail is for the bipod, of course. If I were to shoot off hand with this beast, I wouldn’t want to be touching the barrel as it heats.