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Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

KillShot

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Full Member
Minuteman
May 25, 2010
2,362
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Tulsa, Oklahoma
I CANNOT believe this f*cking shit! Oppositional Defiant Disorder..REALLY?! When I was a kid, it was called misbehaving and disobedience and NOW it's called a 'disorder'?

This is what's wrong with society. Everything is classified as a disorder instead of labeling it what it truly is. The REALLY f*cked up part is that people are getting SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS for their KIDS for this kind of shit! Does anyone else see a problem with that?!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All children are oppositional from time to time, particularly when tired, hungry, stressed or upset. They may argue, talk back, disobey, and defy parents, teachers, and other adults. Oppositional behavior is often a normal part of development for two to three year olds and early adolescents. However, openly uncooperative and hostile behavior becomes a serious concern when it is so frequent and consistent that it stands out when compared with other children of the same age and developmental level and when it affects the child’s social, family and academic life.

In children with Oppositional Defiant Disorder (ODD), there is an ongoing pattern of uncooperative, defiant, and hostile behavior toward authority figures that seriously interferes with the youngster’s day to day functioning. Symptoms of ODD may include:


<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*] Frequent temper tantrums[*]Excessive arguing with adults[*]Often questioning rules[*]Active defiance and refusal to comply with adult requests and rules[*]Deliberate attempts to annoy or upset people[*]Blaming others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior[*]Often being touchy or easily annoyed by others[*]Frequent anger and resentment[*]Mean and hateful talking when upset[*]Spiteful attitude and revenge seeking[/list]

The symptoms are usually seen in multiple settings, but may be more noticeable at home or at school. One to sixteen percent of all school-age children and adolescents have ODD. The causes of ODD are unknown, but many parents report that their child with ODD was more rigid and demanding that the child’s siblings from an early age. Biological, psychological and social factors may have a role.

A child presenting with ODD symptoms should have a comprehensive evaluation. It is important to look for other disorders which may be present; such as, attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), learning disabilities, mood disorders (depression, bipolar disorder) and anxiety disorders. It may be difficult to improve the symptoms of ODD without treating the coexisting disorder. Some children with ODD may go on to develop conduct disorder.

Treatment of ODD may include: Parent Management Training Programs to help parents and others manage the child’s behavior. Individual Psychotherapy to develop more effective anger management. Family Psychotherapy to improve communication and mutual understanding. Cognitive Problem-Solving Skills Training and Therapies to assist with problem solving and decrease negativity. Social Skills Training to increase flexibility and improve social skills and frustration tolerance with peers.

Medication may be helpful in controlling some of the more distressing symptoms of ODD as well as the symptoms related to coexistent conditions such as ADHD, anxiety and mood disorders.

A child with ODD can be very difficult for parents. These parents need support and understanding. Parents can help their child with ODD in the following ways:

<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*]Always build on the positives, give the child praise and positive reinforcement when he shows flexibility or cooperation.[*]Take a time-out or break if you are about to make the conflict with your child worse, not better. This is good modeling for your child. Support your child if he decides to take a time-out to prevent overreacting.[*]Pick your battles. Since the child with ODD has trouble avoiding power struggles, prioritize the things you want your child to do. If you give your child a time-out in his room for misbehavior, don’t add time for arguing. Say “your time will start when you go to your room.”[*]Set up reasonable, age appropriate limits with consequences that can be enforced consistently.[*]Maintain interests other than your child with ODD, so that managing your child doesn’t take all your time and energy. Try to work with and obtain support from the other adults (teachers, coaches, and spouse) dealing with your child.[*]Manage your own stress with healthy life choices such as exercise and relaxation. Use respite care and other breaks as needed

Many children with ODD will respond to the positive parenting techniques. Parents may ask their pediatrician or family physician to refer them to a child and adolescent psychiatrist or qualified mental health professional who can diagnose and treat ODD and any coexisting psychiatric condition.</div></div>

Source - <span style="font-weight: bold">Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder</span>[/list]
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Hopefully there will be a drug made for it soon, so the conspiracy theorist in me can claim it's being added to the country's water supply.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

I was considered a bad kid growing up. So can I put in a request to SS to get back pay for it?
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Dad gave me a whippin' when I was out of line, mom didn't have to....just her sayin' she was going to made me fully realize the error of my ways.

I'm blessed with good kids myself, who mind us well, great in school, appreciated in the sports circles they've chosen, and in general make life a pleasure.

Never gets old when all sorts of people walk up and tell you how great your kids are..........
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

"Oppositional Defiant Disorder" also commonly referred to as "Piss Poor Parenting"...
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Huh...that guy was describing Eric Cartman.

Personally, I would just beat my kids 'till they did what they were told to do. It worked on me, so it should work on them.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

My daughter had that once, I flipped her on her stomach and swatted her ass so hard it hurt both of us.
She's never had it since.

I used to tell her I was going to turn into the "Daddy monster" and she would do what she was told.

I have a good kid though, she knows i'm crabby as shit today from losing my computer, a kid in hte dojo, and my patience so I only had to tell her once to do what needed doing.

Her mom however, Wow...my daughter can be a monster at her house...saying F you to her mom...

Her mom once asked her, "What would you do if she said that to you".

I lookd at my daughter and said "She would never say that to me"....and she agreed.

It's about mutual respect but keeping the line defined who the parent is.

You still gotta respect your kids and have fun and do stuff with them, but in the end YOU are the parent....
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I CANNOT believe this f*cking shit! Oppositional Defiant Disorder..REALLY?! When I was a kid, it was called misbehaving and disobedience and NOW it's called a 'disorder'?

This is what's wrong with society. Everything is classified as a disorder instead of labeling it what it truly is. The REALLY f*cked up part is that people are getting SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS for their KIDS for this kind of shit! Does anyone else see a problem with that?!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All children are oppositional from time to time, particularly when tired, hungry, stressed or upset. They may argue, talk back, disobey, and defy parents, teachers, and other adults. Oppositional behavior is often a normal part of development for two to three year olds and early adolescents. However, openly uncooperative and hostile behavior becomes a serious concern when it is so frequent and consistent that it stands out when compared with other children of the same age and developmental level and when it affects the child’s social, family and academic life.

In children with Oppositional Defiant Disorder (ODD), there is an ongoing pattern of uncooperative, defiant, and hostile behavior toward authority figures that seriously interferes with the youngster’s day to day functioning. Symptoms of ODD may include:


<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*] Frequent temper tantrums[*]Excessive arguing with adults[*]Often questioning rules[*]Active defiance and refusal to comply with adult requests and rules[*]Deliberate attempts to annoy or upset people[*]Blaming others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior[*]Often being touchy or easily annoyed by others[*]Frequent anger and resentment[*]Mean and hateful talking when upset[*]Spiteful attitude and revenge seeking[/list]

The symptoms are usually seen in multiple settings, but may be more noticeable at home or at school. One to sixteen percent of all school-age children and adolescents have ODD. The causes of ODD are unknown, but many parents report that their child with ODD was more rigid and demanding that the child’s siblings from an early age. Biological, psychological and social factors may have a role.

A child presenting with ODD symptoms should have a comprehensive evaluation. It is important to look for other disorders which may be present; such as, <span style="color: #FF0000"> attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), learning disabilities, mood disorders (depression, bipolar disorder) and anxiety disorders </span> It may be difficult to improve the symptoms of ODD without treating the coexisting disorder. Some children with ODD may go on to develop conduct disorder.

Treatment of ODD may include: Parent Management Training Programs to help parents and others manage the child’s behavior. Individual Psychotherapy to develop more effective anger management. Family Psychotherapy to improve communication and mutual understanding. Cognitive Problem-Solving Skills Training and Therapies to assist with problem solving and decrease negativity. Social Skills Training to increase flexibility and improve social skills and frustration tolerance with peers.

Medication may be helpful in controlling some of the more distressing symptoms of ODD as well as the symptoms related to coexistent conditions such as ADHD, anxiety and mood disorders.

A child with ODD can be very difficult for parents. These parents need support and understanding. Parents can help their child with ODD in the following ways:

<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*]Always build on the positives, give the child praise and positive reinforcement when he shows flexibility or cooperation.[*]Take a time-out or break if you are about to make the conflict with your child worse, not better. This is good modeling for your child. Support your child if he decides to take a time-out to prevent overreacting.[*]Pick your battles. Since the child with ODD has trouble avoiding power struggles, prioritize the things you want your child to do. If you give your child a time-out in his room for misbehavior, don’t add time for arguing. Say “your time will start when you go to your room.”[*]Set up reasonable, age appropriate limits with consequences that can be enforced consistently.[*]Maintain interests other than your child with ODD, so that managing your child doesn’t take all your time and energy. Try to work with and obtain support from the other adults (teachers, coaches, and spouse) dealing with your child.[*]Manage your own stress with healthy life choices such as exercise and relaxation. Use respite care and other breaks as needed

Many children with ODD will respond to the positive parenting techniques. Parents may ask their pediatrician or family physician to refer them to a child and adolescent psychiatrist or qualified mental health professional who can diagnose and treat ODD and any coexisting psychiatric condition.</div></div>

Source - <span style="font-weight: bold">Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder</span> </div></div>

To a large extent I agree with you, crappy kids reflect crappy parenting, but some of the above disorders are real, and come from chemical disorders and the such,no different than say diabetess, or any other illness. That cant really be solved with normal disipline. The trick is to be able to distinguish between being a shit and being ill. Then there are situations where a kid may being abused or even molested in some area outside the home, is too ashamed to talk about it, and it comes out in bad ways.

When he ws about 10 a buddy ofmine and his friend got stuck in an elevator. It was half way between floors so they pried the door open and his pal tried to crawl out....half the way out the elevator dropped and cut the kid in half, leavings half of him in the elevator with my pal. Hes never been the same. No matter what he tries, before long the stress gets him and he goes off the deep end and ends up in the psyche ward for a few weeks til they bring him down with Lithium and other nasty shit. Its not something he can control...we've all worked with him and tried to help him deal but when its time to go, hes gone. I could give you others ......

Im not excusing rotteness, just making the point that sometimes there are logical and real reasons for misbehaivor and fucking up.

And some of it is just liberals being liberals.[/list]
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

This is another excuse for little, and adult, psychopaths to demand mercy from the courts. We used to put them in Reform School, but now, we put them on SSDI, for life, and give them a excuse to do it forever, because they can get away with it.
And when they assault teachers and other students, well, just fire the teacher because they didn't show proper consideration for the "disability".
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Some people are just not wired right. Giving them a beating doesn't fix it, just makes it worse. There's a difference between being a disrespectful malfeasant and being sick.

Start with the beating, if that doesn't work, then there's something wrong where your foot won't reach via the kid's ass.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some people are just not wired right. Giving them a beating doesn't fix it, just makes it worse. There's a difference between being a disrespectful malfeasant and being sick.

Start with the beating, if that doesn't work, then there's something wrong where your foot won't reach via the kid's ass.</div></div>
That's true, some aren't right, but the 5 is far fewer than the Psychologists would have you believe. see, the more with "Behavioral Disorders" that they can use to justify weekly paid visits with.....Psychologists is just giving them even more job security.
Replacing bad parenting and bad behavior with a Mental disorder is nonsense.
They act really stupid you wrap them up in duct tape and stick them in the closet for a couple days. They won't misbehave again, I assure you.
If they say they want to run away, ask them if they want you to make them a sandwich for the road.
And if none of that works, tell them you'll sell them to the Arabs, cheap.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Donttrytorun</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some people are just not wired right. Giving them a beating doesn't fix it, just makes it worse. There's a difference between being a disrespectful malfeasant and being sick.

Start with the beating, if that doesn't work, then there's something wrong where your foot won't reach via the kid's ass.</div></div>
That's true, some aren't right, but the 5 is far fewer than the Psychologists would have you believe. see, the more with "Behavioral Disorders" that they can use to justify weekly paid visits with.....Psychologists is just giving them even more job security.
Replacing bad parenting and bad behavior with a Mental disorder is nonsense.
They act really stupid <span style="color: #FF0000">you wrap them up in duct tape and stick them in the closet for a couple days. They won't misbehave again, I assure you. </span>
If they say they want to run away, ask them if they want you to make them a sandwich for the road.
And if none of that works, tell them you'll sell them to the Arabs, cheap. </div></div>

I do believe we've encountered a total moron. Someone should have given you a plastic bag to play with the day you were born. What they will do, is in 20 years, end up like Jared Loughner, or perhaps worse, you.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I do believe we've encountered a total moron. Someone should have given you a plastic bag to play with the day you were born. What they will do, is in 20 years, end up like Jared Loughner, or perhaps worse, you. </div></div>

+1.....

Fuck this douchebag. Can't wrap my brain around the amount of Jerry Springer people insist on participating in these days....fucking idiots.

Can't fathom either even the thought of child abuse, which THAT would be....

Two of mine have been gone for a month now, visiting an older step sister, and will be home mid next week. They've had a blast with her and her husband, but they miss home, and I miss them, and they KNOW they'd never get duct taped and locked in a closet....no matter what they did.

Can't wait for my kids to be home again.....
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Content deleted.

I won't be participating further in this thread.

Greg
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My Grandson was misdiagnosed for years with ADHD. Recently rediagnosed with this. Meds were changed, counselling goals were realigned, and now the family has (at least some) peace in their time.

These disorders are real. Railing about how appropriate they are rather misses the point. After all's said and done and we've all won our arguments, the kids till need to be dealt with.

They can be, and I'm glad they can.

Greg</div></div>


This ODD disorder is utter bullshit and a complete failure to recognize and identify what the problem really is; piss poor parenting as someone stated above. The first 5 years of a child's life are the most critical. Discipline should be taught at an early age because if you wait until they are older before trying to rein them in, to put it plainly...you're fucked. Not only that but you are doing the child a MAJOR disservice for not disciplining them as a child and there is plenty of evidence to prove that failure to love, nurture, and discipline a child at an early age leads to catastrophic consequences later in life.

 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry you feel that way.</div></div>

Sorry to hear that you've bought into the bullshit that a kid who acts out and won't obey their parents has a disorder. Furthermore, what I said about the first 5yrs of a child's life is FACT.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/child/

http://birthtofive.tripod.com/

http://www.factsforlifeglobal.org/03/

http://lisahwarren.hubpages.com/hub/Your-Childs-First-Five-Years

http://www.barnardos.ie/assets/files/publications/free/childlinks_body13.pdf
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry you feel that way.</div></div>

Sorry to hear that you've bought into the bullshit that a kid who acts out and won't obey their parents has a disorder. <span style="color: #FF6666">Furthermore, what I said about the first 5yrs of a child's life is FACT </span> .

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/child/ </div></div>

No one is disputing that FACT. What Greg is trying to convey is that not ALL problems a child has is from poor parenting. There are legitimate, non parental causes, for children to have problems.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry you feel that way.</div></div>

Sorry to hear that you've bought into the bullshit that a kid who acts out and won't obey their parents has a disorder. <span style="color: #FF6666">Furthermore, what I said about the first 5yrs of a child's life is FACT </span> .

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/child/ </div></div>

No one is disputing that FACT. What Greg is trying to convey is that not ALL problems a child has is from poor parenting. There are legitimate, non parental causes, for children to have problems. </div></div>


While I agree with you to a point, doctors are so quick to prescribe medicine for something instead of addressing the root of the problem. For example, damn near everyone you talk to these days either has ADD/ADHD or their kid does.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry you feel that way.</div></div>

Sorry to hear that you've bought into the bullshit that a kid who acts out and won't obey their parents has a disorder. <span style="color: #FF6666">Furthermore, what I said about the first 5yrs of a child's life is FACT </span> .

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/child/ </div></div>

No one is disputing that FACT. What Greg is trying to convey is that not ALL problems a child has is from poor parenting. There are legitimate, non parental causes, for children to have problems. </div></div>


While I agree with you to a point, doctors are so quick to prescribe medicine for something instead of addressing the root of the problem. For example, damn near everyone you talk to these days either has ADD/ADHD or their kid does. </div></div>

Not me
grin.gif
. Im just fuckin crazy
whistle.gif
.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Hey Killshot, hold up a minute....

You know any adults with ADHD? How about combining that with a garnish of OCD. Met any of them?

I can tell you right now, that they do exist. There are a few VERY CLOSE in my life who are absolutely well behaved, very controlled, contributing members of society. Never broken the law in a serious way, other than speeding tickets and parking tickets.

All those tickets stopped coming in once meds were prescribed and adjusted. (just throwing this point out there, as a 'side-symptom' and nothing more)

But let me tell you this. When the meds are (testingly?) stopped for a day, or accidentally missed.... whoa man there's a whirlwind going on. Activity/process/7 different topics in one sentence of discussion(KEEP UP WITH ME DAMMIT)/then the ability to clean the house-mow the yard-go grocery shopping-balance the budget-AND MOST IMPORTANTLY color coordinate the sock drawer. All this before dinner. This is where that "H" in AD'H'D comes in.

And don't even think of going to sleep that night. No, you'll be up all night going further into discussion on those 7 different topics we touched on earlier. Except now, it's both sides of each point.

While we won't deny that it seems to be overdiagnosed as well as 'overprescribed', there ARE legitimate cases where it actually is an issue/does exist.

There's a massive difference between 'crutch' and 'cure'.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sean the Nailer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">


Activity/process/7 different topics in one sentence of discussion(KEEP UP WITH ME DAMMIT)</div></div>

I can do that, I can talk about 1 thing and have two others on my mind. I can say what I need to, but my brain is 5 pages ahead of my mouth. Do I take drugs for this? NO! Do I need drugs for this? NO!

Why you might ask, because I control myself, and realize I am weird/wired, and try not to come off as the retard I can be
grin.gif
. Open mouth, insert thigh was me for along time, and sometimes still is because I am thinking way ahead of what I am saying and things dont always come out right. But I be damned if I would go on a drug to control it. What a lot of this shit is, is people not accepting who they are, taking responsibility for themselves and having ZERO self control.

If I had talked back to my parents when I was young, they would have spanked me so hard, I couldnt sit for a month. I love my parents, but damn I knew better than to screw up, I got knocked back into place once or twice. You know what though, I learned real quick not to get out of place, and you wont get knocked back into it. Funny how that happens.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Some may be able to 'control themselves' to which I commend them. Go Nuts, I ain't holding you back.

Control (discipline) is <span style="font-weight: bold">NOT</span> always the issue at hand. There are other aspects of living to which I was trying to insinuate.

Let me try a different tangent. Some people have high blood pressure. Some of those, may be able to <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">control</span></span> it through diet/excercise/meditation or whatever. While at the same time, there are others to which they are medicated. And it can be lethal if they were off their meds.

Are we seeing a <span style="text-decoration: underline">differing degree of severity</span> here? I really hope so. One person's thought, opinion, experience, or teaching does not necessarily cover EVERY situation. And all I was trying to do, was instill a little broader view of the whole problem. While there are circumstances to which this is "overly-diagnosed" and the typical meds are "overly-prescribed", there are in fact situations/conditions to which this IS necessary.

There are some here, whom seem to have the opinion that this whole topic is BS and a band-aid for a non-existent problem. To which I'll retort that a .22 lr bolt action will do so much of what is required of a firearm, ergo, all anyone ever needs is a bolt action .22 lr .

I would like to believe, that especially those on THIS SITE would have the intelligence AND the integrity to see the possibility of OTHER SITUATIONS/SCENARIO'S.

Have a nice day.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<span style="font-weight: bold">After much time, effort, research and development, Dr. Shankster has finally found the cure for children suffering from the debilitating disease of ODD: (patent pending)</span>













kids-spank.jpg
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sean the Nailer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some may be able to 'control themselves' to which I commend them. Go Nuts, I ain't holding you back.

Control (discipline) is <span style="font-weight: bold">NOT</span> always the issue at hand. There are other aspects of living to which I was trying to insinuate.

Let me try a different tangent. Some people have high blood pressure. Some of those, may be able to <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">control</span></span> it through diet/excercise/meditation or whatever. While at the same time, there are others to which they are medicated. And it can be lethal if they were off their meds.

Are we seeing a <span style="text-decoration: underline">differing degree of severity</span> here? I really hope so. One person's thought, opinion, experience, or teaching does not necessarily cover EVERY situation. And all I was trying to do, was instill a little broader view of the whole problem. While there are circumstances to which this is "overly-diagnosed" and the typical meds are "overly-prescribed", there are in fact situations/conditions to which this IS necessary.

There are some here, whom seem to have the opinion that this whole topic is BS and a band-aid for a non-existent problem. To which I'll retort that a .22 lr bolt action will do so much of what is required of a firearm, ergo, all anyone ever needs is a bolt action .22 lr .

<span style="color: #CC0000">I would like to believe, that especially those on THIS SITE would have the intelligence AND the integrity to see the possibility of OTHER SITUATIONS/SCENARIO'S. </span>

Have a nice day. </div></div>

Ha. Bwaha. Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
whistle.gif
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Has anybody posting here, besides me, even known anybody who has actually been diagnosed with this disorder?

I am trying <span style="font-style: italic">very</span> hard to treat all posters with dignity and respect. I don't have a very large reserve of such things right now...

Because, please excuse the expression, if you don't, then MAYBE YOU'RE TALKING OUT OF YOUR ASS, BUDDY!!!!
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

While I agree that there may be a small percentage of kids who may have any one of the actual disabilities that have been discussed. I believe they are a EXTREMELY small segment of the kids that are on medication and are GROSSLY outnumbered by misbehaved children whose only handicap is that they were born to crappy parents who lack the spine or responsibility to raise their children properly.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has anybody posting here, besides me, even known anybody who has actually been diagnosed with this disorder?

I am trying <span style="font-style: italic">very</span> hard to treat all posters with dignity and respect. I don't have a very large reserve of such things right now...

Because, please excuse the expression, if you don't, then MAYBE YOU'RE TALKING OUT OF YOUR ASS, BUDDY!!!! </div></div>

I have.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Good; then <span style="font-style: italic">you</span> probably know what you're talking about, Goldie...

<span style="font-style: italic">You</span> have my respect.

The rest, not really...
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

A.D.D.= Adult Discipline Deficiency.

My brother and I had plenty, the youngest didn't. Guess who had issues? Answer: My mother for not beating his ass more often.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 50calcruiser</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A.D.D.= Adult Discipline Deficiency.

My brother and I had plenty, the youngest didn't. Guess who had issues? Answer: My mother for not beating his ass more often.</div></div>


Ha ha ha! That is damn funny!
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has anybody posting here, besides me, even known anybody who has actually been diagnosed with this disorder?

I am trying <span style="font-style: italic">very</span> hard to treat all posters with dignity and respect. I don't have a very large reserve of such things right now...

Because, please excuse the expression, if you don't, then MAYBE YOU'RE TALKING OUT OF YOUR ASS, BUDDY!!!!</div></div>

Yes Greg, that was the whole basis of my posts. Someone very close to me (an adult no less) has this/deals with this and it is not fun.

Not fun at all. There is some beneficial treatment while at the same time side effects are quite strong too. The lesser of two evils is chosen, and positivity is continuously tantamount.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

There was always a dignosis for this, one that was much more accurate. "Anti-Social Personality Disorder". And there were always kids who fit it. There was even a "Triad of Terror" that involved children who wet the bed, lit fires, and tortured other children, usually smaller helpless vulbnerable ones, or animals.
These kids would go through Court-Ordered Psychiatric Treatment from as young as 5 years old. some of these kids had to be locked in Mental Institutions and you couldn't go in a room with them without at least 2 staff. You couldn't turn your back on them, or put them in a room with others without the risk of somebody getting seriously hurt. You couldn't trust them even with a pencil because they would likely stab somebody with it eventually, like in the face or eye.
These kids weren't openly psychotic, or stupid. they could care for themselves when they wanted and needed to, and could talk, read, and function. Some had some degree of learning disability, and that indicates a defect in the brain. No surprise. But they were always capable of doing dangerous things, with or without premeditation.
They would get kicked out of school, temporarily and eventually permanently for violence and dangerous and disruptive behaviors.
But now when they burn something or somebody, or hurt somebody or something, like a pet or a teacher or another kid, they will have a "Diagnosis" tat will excuse it all. That will just encourage that to continue because there will be little or no consequence for their behaviors. They will act out, and steal, and hurt, and destroy, and get away with it because some Psychologist got to "discover" a new pigeonhole to put them in and write a paper about it, and get published.
And they will have job security for it because what, 1 to 16 or so % of the children (and adults) have this? Do any of you remember 16% of your fellow students fitting the desciption the Psychologists have decided? Even 1%?
call a dangerous nut and dangerous nut instead of coating it with sugar.
i knew a couple kids like that when I was young. they were identified as young as 7 years old, and saw Psychiatrists and Psychologists their whole childhood. they went to "special" schools that were private and paid for by the State. They caused trouble their whole youth, with violence against others, and thefts, and drugs, and worse, and every time they went to court they got excuses.
those kids are now in Prison for long, long sentences. No surprise. they were "Bad Seeds" and there was nothing anybody or any drug was going to do about it.
And the incidence is much higher in certain Racial/Ethic groups, especially in urban areas. In my city, Philadelphia, there are a large # of schools just for kids kicked out of neighborhood ones. they go there for a year or so, and then back to the old one. They can't actually "expel" kids from the system, since they are "entitled" to a education, even if they spend their time destroying everybody else's.
And they will always have those appointment scheduled with Psychologist who will discuss "Life Coping Skills", and get paid without any expectation of curing the problem.
The only drugs to curb these anti-social behaviors will be the same ones we use for psychotics. And only Psychiatrists can order those. Psychologists can't order a Asparin for anybody. They aren't real doctors.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

We've all seen kids like this on trash TV. Real little bad asses until they get shipped off to boot camp where someone a lot tougher than them can push back.

Some straighten themselves out, and some revert to their previous behavior. A good portion of them simply suffer from a lack of discipline.

Sure, you're always gonna have some percentage with mental disorders that will legitimately require treatment. But it would seem that far too many get labeled, medicated, and their behavior excused. It's just a lot easier that way.

We had some friends with fraternal twins. The daughter was nice as could be. The son went after his mom with a kitchen knife when he was 3 years old, and had to be institutionalized. Pure evil, that one.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

I need to apologize for letting this get to me and posting while annoyed. That seldom ends well.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

This is a way to be classified so as to be helped with the new healthcare bill. This is a conspiracy...RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!

Total BS. No different than ADD...Another liberal based feel good NORMAL condition being turned into an "Official" disease...

Sorry I'm new here and very opinionated, I hope I don't make too many enemies...
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I need to apologize for letting this get to me and posting while annoyed. That seldom ends well.</div></div>


Stop making excuses for yourself, or someone else you might know. Face the music and accept the fact that being a piss poor parent is the root cause of ANYONE being 'diagnosed' with this artificial disorder.

So many people these days would rather put little Johnny in a corner than light his ass up with a belt! So many people would rather MEDICATE their child than TRAIN their child.

If you're one of those people, you make me sick.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

If you're one of those folks whose solution for behavioral disorders requires a bludgeon, you make us all sick.

The 'apology' was a piece of subtle sarcasm, but clearly you lack the subtlety to recognize anything less blatant than your trusty verbal bludgeon.

You get on this site, stick an arrogant "Fuck you all, I'm gonna have my say and nobody better object" peremptory challenge into your profile, and procede to slam everything you don't like and treat just about all of us here to your sophomoric contempt.

To borrow a word, you're rally good at bloviating. If you're any good at anything else, that has yet to make itself apparent.

Damned good thing a lot of us don't have Moderator status here, or you'd already have been out on your arrogant ass some time ago. Come to think of it, that's probably still a good idea.

We're done here. Say what you like for the others benefit; your posts will simply not appear on my screen anymore.

Meanwhile, have a nice millennium.

In hell.

Greg

PS, you remind me of another guy; also from OK. But he doesn't come around here anymore...
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you're one of those folks whose solution for behavioral disorders incolces a bludgeon, yu make us all sick.</div></div>

I do not believe in beating a child, in any form or manner. I do believe in corporal punishment and whipping their ass when they're out of line or go astray of what they've been instructed to do or not do. Go ahead and slap them on the wrist or mollycoddle them and you'll be the next parent we see on the Maury Povich show with a knocked-up twelve year old girl or a son who already has a wrap-sheet by the age of 14.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The'apology' was a piece of subtle sarcasm, but clearly you lack the subtlety to recognize anything less blatant than your trust verbal bludgeoin.</div></div>

Whatever you say, buddy.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You get on this site, stick and arrogant 'Fuck you all, I'm gonna have my say and nobody better object' peremptory challenge into you profile, and procede to slam everything you don't like and treat just about all of us here to your sophomoric contempt.</div></div>

You couldn't be more wrong but, I needn't justify myself to the 'resident elder' who thinks he knows more than anyone else here, as evident by many of the posts you've made. After reading your comments in this topic, it's obvious that you don't know half as much as you think you do.

It seems rather strange to me how we didn't have a lot of these <span style="text-decoration: underline"><span style="font-style: italic">bullshit</span></span> disorders some years ago because bad behavior was remedied with a belt to the backside but now, psychologists classify everything as a disorder, removing all PERSONAL ACCOUNTABILITY and RESPONSIBILITY!

Instead of TRAINING a child in the way they should go, we f*cking MEDICATE them?! I agree there are some disorders that are CLEARLY disorders (anorexia, etc) but a child acting like a demon, defying everyone in authority, is NOT a disorder!


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Damned good thing a lot of us don't have Moderator status here, or you'd already have been out on your arrogant ass some time ago. Come to think of it, that's probably still a good idea.</div></div>

Because you don't like what I have to say about whatever topic is being discussed, you prefer to suppress my speech although it's within the boundaries/rules of what's allowed? Yeah, sounds like you'd make a GREAT moderator. That's sarcasm, I assure you.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We're done here. Say what you like for the others benefit; your posts will simply not appear on my screen anymore.</div></div>

My e-feelings, crushed they are. Now, excuse me while I go vomit.



<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Have a nice millennium.

In hell.

Greg</div></div>

Rest assured, you'll beat me there.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PS, you remind me of another guy; also from OK. But he doesn't come around here anymore...</div></div>

Maybe you can do us all the service of pulling your own disappearing act.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

I'm sorry, did you say something.?
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm sorry, did you say something.? </div></div>

Real mature, Greg. For someone who is retired, you are such a child but I digress.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Seems to be a cliche in the Hide who see a liberal conspiracy/ wimpy Americans/science is crap, in everything.

One of them drags something in and the rest attempt to outdo each other in howling or rolling around on it.

What strikes me is most the time the more opinionated the howler the more restricted the knowledge/education/experience this ranter has.

My childhood isn't a window to child rearing anymore than any ONE other person's can be. But odd how so many think so narrow a sample is gospel.

The logic, if you can call it that, of since I don't know one they must not exist is typical of narrow minded provincial minds.

That some may over use syndrome language and over prescribe medications doesn't mean ALL do.

I doubt the ranters know enough 'bad' parents to form an informed opinion on nature vs nurture. Yet they do so and attack others if their 'expertise' is questioned.

Also interesting how being quickly a subject is dropped when inconvenient truth surfaces. Last winter the strong storms had the ranters trying to outdo each other with Global Warming jokes.

No one seems to be laughing as we have one of the hottest summers ever recorded in the USofA.

Just noticing alot of what gets drug in here would be better left where it was found and the adamant statements and attacks on fellow members should be dropped.

Attacking each other with slurs and crap does nothing useful and clouds any discussion.

But have noticed it is resorted to quite quickly.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Time for this to end.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I do not believe in beating a child, in any form or manner. I do believe in corporal punishment and whipping their ass when they're out of line or go astray of what they've been instructed to do or not do. Go ahead and slap them on the wrist or mollycoddle them and you'll be the next parent we see on the Maury Povich show with a knocked-up twelve year old girl or a son who already has a wrap-sheet by the age of 14.


</div></div>
I ued to work at a State prison, and had to process most of the new receptions to the system myself. We had minors as young as 15 come through with Life (without possibility of parole0 come through. They were tried as adults for really heinous murders. If the crime was done by a single perp, he was already identified as a little sociopath long before. If there were several kids involved then one of them had a history of severe anti-social behavior in school and on the street, as was the leader of the crime.
There was a kid as young as 10 or something on the other side of the state who shot his father's pregnant fiancee with a shotgun because he was jealous, and then went to school.
The State Hospital nearby had a children's unit for years where the worst kids in the Country were sent for "research". You couldn't put two of them together in a room. They would go after each other. Worst of the worst. they all had blood on their hands already, as young as 7.
The result of years of research was there was no cure for the worst of the worst. heavy doses of Thorazine, Haldol, and Clozaril were required or hell would break loose. It was the only way to make them managable.
As for others, it's bad parenting, bad genes, deep feelings of inadequacy, no limits, and attention seeking behavior.
Society has a hard time admitting that some kids are incorrigable.
Hell, society won't admit that some adults are incorrigable.
You know, we several Grandfather/Father/Son, as well as broothers and cousins, in the same prison for serious crimes. We had one Grandfather/father/Son all serving Life without parole terms for murder. don't tell me heredity doesn;t have a impact. But sometimes you have a good, educated, normal, intact family that gives birth to a demon.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Donttrytorun</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I do not believe in beating a child, in any form or manner. I do believe in corporal punishment and whipping their ass when they're out of line or go astray of what they've been instructed to do or not do. Go ahead and slap them on the wrist or mollycoddle them and you'll be the next parent we see on the Maury Povich show with a knocked-up twelve year old girl or a son who already has a wrap-sheet by the age of 14.


</div></div>
I ued to work at a State prison, and had to process most of the new receptions to the system myself. We had minors as young as 15 come through with Life (without possibility of parole0 come through. They were tried as adults for really heinous murders. If the crime was done by a single perp, he was already identified as a little sociopath long before. If there were several kids involved then one of them had a history of severe anti-social behavior in school and on the street, as was the leader of the crime.

There was a kid as young as 10 or something on the other side of the state who shot his father's pregnant fiancee with a shotgun because he was jealous, and then went to school.

The State Hospital nearby had a children's unit for years where the worst kids in the Country were sent for "research". You couldn't put two of them together in a room. They would go after each other. Worst of the worst. they all had blood on their hands already, as young as 7.

The result of years of research was there was no cure for the worst of the worst. heavy doses of Thorazine, Haldol, and Clozaril were required or hell would break loose. It was the only way to make them manageable.

<span style="font-weight: bold">As for others, it's bad parenting, bad genes, deep feelings of inadequacy, no limits, and attention seeking behavior.</span>

<span style="font-weight: bold">Society has a hard time admitting that some kids are incorrigable.
Hell, society won't admit that some adults are incorrigable.</span></div></div>

I agree with what I've put in bold. I do believe some kids, and adults, are beyond help. The point I've tried to make is that when a child is young, as in birth to 5yrs, it is important to train the child in the way it should go. If no discipline has been given at an early age, the child will be completely out of control and unmanageable by the time they hit their teens. I've seen it happen first hand. When I say discipline, I'm not talking about taking a belt to them after each infraction. You have to pick your battles and constantly taking a belt to a child for every little thing will have <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic"><span style="text-decoration: underline">nothing</span></span></span> but an adverse effect.

The same can be said of adults. If a child doesn't receive the love and nurturing that is crucial to the child's development in the first 12-24 months, they will become monsters of society such as the likes of which we've seen happen with Ted Bundy and a few others. Once it gets to that point, the damage done to the adult is irreversible because it is in the early stages of childhood when their conscience is formed and no amount of medication can give someone a conscience.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

KillShot,

It seems to me you have this all figured out. Do you have any children? I haven't read through the entire thread so if you mentioned it I apologize.

Between my wife and I we have three children. Each has a son from a prior marriage and we have a daughter together. Both of our sons were relatively easy to raise. Her son graduated from HS this year and my son graduates next. My son has more frequent flier miles than most business professionals because we live 1000 miles apart, he started getting letters from Princeton university and the like this year when he took the ACT & SAT tests. We've never had a problem out of either of our sons.

My daughter is six years old. One could conclude that since both of our sons were trouble free that my wife and I (our ex's included) must have done something right while raising our boys. My daughter, even though my wife and I have changed nothing in our approach, proves to be a challenge daily. The "symptoms" of this "disorder" seem to fit almost exactly. Have we all of a sudden become shitty parents that make you sick? It's our fault? My daughter has had more than one "come to Jesus" meeting with the palm of my right hand and while she may straighten up for a short period, it doesn't take long before she is back to being a challenge.

Now, I'm sure I could beat her on a daily basis until her spirit is absolutely broken and she is so afraid of me that she becomes an introvert but I'm not trying to break a horse to take a saddle here. There are days where my wife and I don't know what the hell to do with her but the last fucking thing you'll see me doing is dragging her to a psychologist for some behavioral modification drugs. She is basically a carbon copy of me when I was a child. Nothing is going to make her behave all of the time but you can bet she knows that there is a limit to what we will tolerate and she pushes past it anyway.

I will admit that at times I am impressed with her tenacity. I see it as something that will serve her well later in life and I'm not going to beat it out of her. Keeping her reeled in to an acceptable level without crushing her spirit is tricky and I will not dope her up to make my life easier.

I used to have the same attitude that you did, especially several years into raising my son. My daughter has changed my perspective a bit. Perhaps you'll get the same opportunity someday.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Time for this to end.</div></div>

Yup. There's a few here who've been part of the conversation. And there's a few here to whom it would be easier and more productive to teach a rock to float.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">KillShot,

It seems to me you have this all figured out. Do you have any children? I haven't read through the entire thread so if you mentioned it I apologize.</div></div>

Yes, I do. They are well behaved but at the same time, I allow them to be kids. They know where the line is drawn and they know there will be consequences when it's crossed. Everything doesn't require corporal punishment and it seems as though I have given that impression, more than once. I don't believe you whip a child for every little thing they've done. Oftentimes, a period of being grounded works wonders.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Between my wife and I we have three children. Each has a son from a prior marriage and we have a daughter together. Both of our sons were relatively easy to raise. Her son graduated from HS this year and my son graduates next. My son has more frequent flier miles than most business professionals because we live 1000 miles apart, he started getting letters from Princeton university and the like this year when he took the ACT & SAT tests. We've never had a problem out of either of our sons.</div></div>

Man, all I can say is congratulations and that is AWESOME! I can't begin to imagine how proud you must be.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My daughter is six years old. One could conclude that since both of our sons were trouble free that my wife and I (our ex's included) must have done something right while raising our boys. My daughter, even though my wife and I have changed nothing in our approach, proves to be a challenge daily. The "symptoms" of this "disorder" seem to fit almost exactly. Have we all of a sudden become shitty parents that make you sick? It's our fault? My daughter has had more than one "come to Jesus" meeting with the palm of my right hand and while she may straighten up for a short period, it doesn't take long before she is back to being a challenge.</div></div>

As I stated above, kids will be kids. Each of us gave our parents some kind of hell at some point in time while we were growing up. Hell, I certainly did. That being said, I never buckled to peer pressure and partook of drugs, avoiding those who did and steered clear of kids who seemed hell-bent on getting into trouble.

No, I didn't say or imply that everyone is shitty parents. I was merely making reference to the people you see on Maury Povich with kids so out of control that it's probably too late to do anything about it, and they wonder why the hell it happened. Then, they take their child to some therapy session and the kid is diagnosed with something like this disorder when...it couldn't be farther from the truth.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, I'm sure I could beat her on a daily basis until her spirit is absolutely broken and she is so afraid of me that she becomes an introvert but I'm not trying to break a horse to take a saddle here. There are days where my wife and I don't know what the hell to do with her but the last fucking thing you'll see me doing is dragging her to a psychologist for some behavioral modification drugs. She is basically a carbon copy of me when I was a child. Nothing is going to make her behave all of the time but you can bet she knows that there is a limit to what we will tolerate and she pushes past it anyway.</div></div>

As I also stated previously, whipping a child on a daily basis would do more harm than good. I believe that 100 percent. I agree with everything you've said in that paragraph.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will admit that at times I am impressed with her tenacity. I see it as something that will serve her well later in life and I'm not going to beat it out of her. Keeping her reeled in to an acceptable level without crushing her spirit is tricky and I will not dope her up to make my life easier.</div></div>

Again, I certainly agree. There will come a time when she will look back on her life and understanding what was going on, she will thank you for the stance you took. Believe me, I have done the same with my own parents.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I used to have the same attitude that you did, especially several years into raising my son. My daughter has changed my perspective a bit. Perhaps you'll get the same opportunity someday.</div></div>

Thank you for that, Phylodog. I have enjoyed reading your response.

On a side note, I apologize to anyone to whom I came across as a tyrant. That, I most certainly am not. I believe in letting a kid be a kid, I just don't believe in allowing a child to run around like a wild banshee and then claim it's a disorder. My dad was an abusive prick to my mother, brothers, and myself. I made it my mission in life to be the exact opposite and everyone who knows me personally can attest to the fact that I've done a damned good job of it.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">KillShot,

It seems to me you have this all figured out. Do you have any children? I haven't read through the entire thread so if you mentioned it I apologize.</div></div>

Yes, I do. They are well behaved but at the same time, I allow them to be kids. They know where the line is drawn and they know there will be consequences when it's crossed. Everything doesn't require corporal punishment and it seems as though I have given that impression, more than once. I don't believe you whip a child for every little thing they've done. Oftentimes, a period of being grounded works wonders.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Between my wife and I we have three children. Each has a son from a prior marriage and we have a daughter together. Both of our sons were relatively easy to raise. Her son graduated from HS this year and my son graduates next. My son has more frequent flier miles than most business professionals because we live 1000 miles apart, he started getting letters from Princeton university and the like this year when he took the ACT & SAT tests. We've never had a problem out of either of our sons.</div></div>

Man, all I can say is congratulations and that is AWESOME! I can't begin to imagine how proud you must be.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My daughter is six years old. One could conclude that since both of our sons were trouble free that my wife and I (our ex's included) must have done something right while raising our boys. My daughter, even though my wife and I have changed nothing in our approach, proves to be a challenge daily. The "symptoms" of this "disorder" seem to fit almost exactly. Have we all of a sudden become shitty parents that make you sick? It's our fault? My daughter has had more than one "come to Jesus" meeting with the palm of my right hand and while she may straighten up for a short period, it doesn't take long before she is back to being a challenge.</div></div>

As I stated above, kids will be kids. Each of us gave our parents some kind of hell at some point in time while we were growing up. Hell, I certainly did. That being said, I never buckled to peer pressure and partook of drugs, avoiding those who did and steered clear of kids who seemed hell-bent on getting into trouble.

No, I didn't say or imply that everyone is shitty parents. I was merely making reference to the people you see on Maury Povich with kids so out of control that it's probably too late to do anything about it, and they wonder why the hell it happened. Then, they take their child to some therapy session and the kid is diagnosed with something like this disorder when...it couldn't be farther from the truth.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now, I'm sure I could beat her on a daily basis until her spirit is absolutely broken and she is so afraid of me that she becomes an introvert but I'm not trying to break a horse to take a saddle here. There are days where my wife and I don't know what the hell to do with her but the last fucking thing you'll see me doing is dragging her to a psychologist for some behavioral modification drugs. She is basically a carbon copy of me when I was a child. Nothing is going to make her behave all of the time but you can bet she knows that there is a limit to what we will tolerate and she pushes past it anyway.</div></div>

As I also stated previously, whipping a child on a daily basis would do more harm than good. I believe that 100 percent. I agree with everything you've said in that paragraph.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will admit that at times I am impressed with her tenacity. I see it as something that will serve her well later in life and I'm not going to beat it out of her. Keeping her reeled in to an acceptable level without crushing her spirit is tricky and I will not dope her up to make my life easier.</div></div>

Again, I certainly agree. There will come a time when she will look back on her life and understanding what was going on, she will thank you for the stance you took. Believe me, I have done the same with my own parents.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Phylodog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I used to have the same attitude that you did, especially several years into raising my son. My daughter has changed my perspective a bit. Perhaps you'll get the same opportunity someday.</div></div>

Thank you for that, Phylodog. I have enjoyed reading your response.

On a side note, I apologize to anyone to whom I came across as a tyrant. That, I most certainly am not. I believe in letting a kid be a kid, I just don't believe in allowing a child to run around like a wild banshee and then claim it's a disorder. <span style="color: #FF0000"> My dad was an abusive prick to my mother, brothers, and myself.</span> I made it my mission in life to be the exact opposite and everyone who knows me personally can attest to the fact that I've done a damned good job of it. </div></div>

That explains a lot. Thats exactly how you've come across in this and other threads. Obvioulsy your intelligent, so please dont play out that which you strive to avoid with your kids, on us. Thanks.
 
Re: Children With Oppositional Defiant Disorder

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That explains a lot. Thats exactly how you've come across in this and other threads. Obvioulsy your intelligent, so please dont play out that which you strive to avoid with your kids, on us. Thanks.</div></div>

Noted, and I do apologize.