CHINA WAR INEVITABLE...SOONER THAN LATER

[Edsel]

China is stepping up their belligerence in the South China Sea, particularly with Taiwan and the Phillipines. Surely their eye is on the prize in their own neighborhood.

You have to ask yourself - what exactly is this “Freedom of Navigation” that people talk about?

Like in almost every “conflict” we’ve been in during modern times - what on earth are white folks’ naval vessels doing in Asian waters?

Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea are all vassal territories of America - little discussion needed there if one’s familiar with their history.

The Philippines is an interesting outlier because they’re worse than that - they’re more closely comparable to a “Banana Republic.” They used to have pretty good relations with China over the disputed islands - there used to be an unwritten agreement between the Philippines (previous administrations) and China for joint development and “kicking the can down the road” as far as sovereignty was concerned (meaning, maybe we’ll be too prosperous from mutual trade to seriously care about these islands in the future). It’s difficult for them to substantiate any claims over the territory as they didn’t exist as a country and thus lacked any formalized written language documenting such until a few hundreds of years ago - whereas the Chinese predate them by thousands of years.

The Philippines’ largest trading partner is China. They are a country which is largely dependent on Xiaomi, OPPO, Vivo, Realme, and OnePlus phones for mobile connectivity and can barely afford Samsungs or iPhones. It was once the top exporter of Bananas, Mangoes, and Durians to SEAsia but lost out due to their inability to maintain a proper cold chain, much less appropriate quality control. Their higher - tier (manufacturing) exports are entirely foreign subsidiaries, and their private sector is trying to emulate the American “service - based” economy instead.



The Filipinos are under the impression that they’re in the middle of a great, patriotic struggle of sovereignty (the South China Sea is now the “West Philippine Sea,” from their rhetoric) when in fact they’re just another little Ukraine - the big difference is, they’re prostating themselves practically for free. Indonesia has burned, blown up, or outright sunk 92 Filipino fishing vessels for illegal fishing in disputed waters since 2014 - but we don’t hear the Filipinos contesting any EEZ rules over such. Guess why.

Among all of the ASEAN countries, that territory just fails to present itself as a serious argument.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

 

[Fig]

First off, they don't invent or create anything. They live in a crushing surveillance state that considers them a resource and an asset like oil or timber. There is no respect for human life except at a personal level. They are still communists who believe The State is god, and the people exist to worship it.

You have to ask yourself - what exactly is this “Freedom of Navigation” that people talk about?

Like in almost every “conflict” we’ve been in during modern times - what on earth are white folks’ naval vessels doing in Asian waters?

Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea are all vassal territories of America - little discussion needed there if one’s familiar with their history.

The Philippines is an interesting outlier because they’re worse than that - they’re more closely comparable to a “Banana Republic.” They used to have pretty good relations with China over the disputed islands - there used to be an unwritten agreement between the Philippines (previous administrations) and China for joint development and “kicking the can down the road” as far as sovereignty was concerned (meaning, maybe we’ll be too prosperous from mutual trade to seriously care about these islands in the future). It’s difficult for them to substantiate any claims over the territory as they didn’t exist as a country and thus lacked any formalized written language documenting such until a few hundreds of years ago - whereas the Chinese predate them by thousands of years.

The Philippines’ largest trading partner is China. They are a country which is largely dependent on Xiaomi, OPPO, Vivo, Realme, and OnePlus phones for mobile connectivity and can barely afford Samsungs or iPhones. It was once the top exporter of Bananas, Mangoes, and Durians to SEAsia but lost out due to their inability to maintain a proper cold chain, much less appropriate quality control. Their higher - tier (manufacturing) exports are entirely foreign subsidiaries, and their private sector is trying to emulate the American “service - based” economy instead.

The Filipinos are under the impression that they’re in the middle of a great, patriotic struggle of sovereignty (the South China Sea is now the “West Philippine Sea,” from their rhetoric) when in fact they’re just another little Ukraine - the big difference is, they’re prostating themselves practically for free. Indonesia has burned, blown up, or outright sunk 92 Filipino fishing vessels for illegal fishing in disputed waters since 2014 - but we don’t hear the Filipinos contesting any EEZ rules over such. Guess why.

Among all of the ASEAN countries, that territory just fails to present itself as a serious argument.

Freedom of navigation is why there is modern medicine and electricity in the third world. To understand what freedom of navigation means you only have to go back to early America to find examples of how eliminating piracy far away from our shores and establishing international rules on the high seas lifted humanity out of the mud. Great Brittan before us was the only territorial marshal in the no man's land, and their global trade and colonialism started it. It's probably the greatest gift the white man ever gave the world. Before that the only safe travel depended on how many shields and spear men were on board.


Even though we run a trade deficit (which I don't think it good), we make over two trillion in trade every year. If you don't think loosing two trillion dollars would hurt our economy, then you are as oblivious to economics as you are to history, and why safe travel on the high seas is so critically important, and why a bully trying to take the established territory of a weaker neighbor can't be tolerated on the seas.

Yea, in a distant land we can say it isn't our problem, because they actually can't get here. The water is all connected. If it isn't free and safe with the rules being followed over there it is literally on our doorstep. The USN has been power projection since the beginning of the 20th century, and if we loose that it is a leap into the next dark age. This isn't renaming a gulf. This is the Chicoms trying to control the entrance to Subic
Bay.

China has, in it's party propaganda papers and "news" has, essentially unofficially, declared war on us already. Lots of the reasons we defend international law is to prevent an adversary from seizing forward bases and depots. If Imperial Japan had followed up The Pearl Harbor attack with an invasion and we were deprived Hawaii to fight from WWII may have gone a very different way.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

You have to ask yourself - what exactly is this “Freedom of Navigation” that people talk about?

Like in almost every “conflict” we’ve been in during modern times - what on earth are white folks’ naval vessels doing in Asian waters?

Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea are all vassal territories of America - little discussion needed there if one’s familiar with their history.

The Philippines is an interesting outlier because they’re worse than that - they’re more closely comparable to a “Banana Republic.” They used to have pretty good relations with China over the disputed islands - there used to be an unwritten agreement between the Philippines (previous administrations) and China for joint development and “kicking the can down the road” as far as sovereignty was concerned (meaning, maybe we’ll be too prosperous from mutual trade to seriously care about these islands in the future). It’s difficult for them to substantiate any claims over the territory as they didn’t exist as a country and thus lacked any formalized written language documenting such until a few hundreds of years ago - whereas the Chinese predate them by thousands of years.

The Philippines’ largest trading partner is China. They are a country which is largely dependent on Xiaomi, OPPO, Vivo, Realme, and OnePlus phones for mobile connectivity and can barely afford Samsungs or iPhones. It was once the top exporter of Bananas, Mangoes, and Durians to SEAsia but lost out due to their inability to maintain a proper cold chain, much less appropriate quality control. Their higher - tier (manufacturing) exports are entirely foreign subsidiaries, and their private sector is trying to emulate the American “service - based” economy instead.

The Filipinos are under the impression that they’re in the middle of a great, patriotic struggle of sovereignty (the South China Sea is now the “West Philippine Sea,” from their rhetoric) when in fact they’re just another little Ukraine - the big difference is, they’re prostating themselves practically for free. Indonesia has burned, blown up, or outright sunk 92 Filipino fishing vessels for illegal fishing in disputed waters since 2014 - but we don’t hear the Filipinos contesting any EEZ rules over such. Guess why.

Among all of the ASEAN countries, that territory just fails to present itself as a serious argument.

One thing many don’t seem to get about Taiwan is they include an island literally right off the main land.

There are still old tank traps and pill boxes along the coast. Craters from shelling that occurred in the 1950’s.

As far as the Philippines, China is pushing into what has post Ww2 been there Economic waters, oddly enough China is using a map drawn by Republic of China members before they were pushed off the main land during the Chinese civil war. They are literally using a claim western supported chinese gov were trying to make until the commies gained the upper hand, and “we” got pushed out. A fun fact no one in western press seems to mention when talking about the 9 dash line

Where that recent collion between two Chinese ships occurred. Is that disputed territory.

 

[Edsel]

One thing many don’t seem to get about Taiwan is they include an island literally right off the main land.

They are literally using a claim western supported chinese gov were trying to make until the commies gained the upper hand, and “we” got pushed out.

The Middle East, Africa, South America, Asia - did I leave anybody out - all dealing with post - colonial detritus.

If they settled it out amongst themselves, they (probably) would have fallen into a reasonable state of equilibrium by now.

But there is convincing evidence that the departing Colonial Imperialists did this deliberately, primarily to keep the regions unstable - and thus ripe for continued resource extraction.

Examples: Great Britain. Arguably the worst perpetrator as far as the above modus operandi is concerned. Too many examples to elaborate on. Favorite case in point: France, the Sahel, Uranium, and their Currency. If you're familiar with Johnny Cash's "Sixteen Tons," there is no better expression of "I owe my soul to the company store."

A fun fact no one in western press seems to mention when talking about the 9 dash line

An inconvenient truth that does not support the narrative (honestly, that word is like Herpes).

Where that recent collion between two Chinese ships occurred. Is that disputed territory.

Yes.

There are some images of the damage from the South China Morning Post, and various Philippine news outlets - many are too iffy, need to wait for better pichers.

Probably the most detailed publication discussing this area, apolitical as it appears to be, is “The History and Sovereignty of the South China Sea Islands” by Anthony Carty. The content is extensive for such an inconsequential bunch of rocks that remain submerged half of the time. Thus far, the Filipinos have not put forth any counter to any of his findings. Caveat: He was a visiting professor at Peking University, and the book was published in association with them.

Don’t get distracted from the fact that these rocks were largely a non - issue until we set up the SON of our last puppet dictator, the guy whose wife had 3,000 pairs of shoes - in our greater pursuit to “Pivot to Asia.”

 

[GreenGO Juan]

If you're familiar with Johnny Cash's "Sixteen Tons," there is no better expression of "I owe my soul to the company store."

16 tons is not Johny Cash, Ernie Ford.

 

[Edsel]

16 tons is not Johny Cash, Ernie Ford.

Was it a cover?

Anyway, my point was that phrase about “the company store.”

 

[Long Range 338]

You have to ask yourself - what exactly is this “Freedom of Navigation” that people talk about?

Like in almost every “conflict” we’ve been in during modern times - what on earth are white folks’ naval vessels doing in Asian waters?

Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea are all vassal territories of America - little discussion needed there if one’s familiar with their history.

The Philippines is an interesting outlier because they’re worse than that - they’re more closely comparable to a “Banana Republic.” They used to have pretty good relations with China over the disputed islands - there used to be an unwritten agreement between the Philippines (previous administrations) and China for joint development and “kicking the can down the road” as far as sovereignty was concerned (meaning, maybe we’ll be too prosperous from mutual trade to seriously care about these islands in the future). It’s difficult for them to substantiate any claims over the territory as they didn’t exist as a country and thus lacked any formalized written language documenting such until a few hundreds of years ago - whereas the Chinese predate them by thousands of years.

The Philippines’ largest trading partner is China. They are a country which is largely dependent on Xiaomi, OPPO, Vivo, Realme, and OnePlus phones for mobile connectivity and can barely afford Samsungs or iPhones. It was once the top exporter of Bananas, Mangoes, and Durians to SEAsia but lost out due to their inability to maintain a proper cold chain, much less appropriate quality control. Their higher - tier (manufacturing) exports are entirely foreign subsidiaries, and their private sector is trying to emulate the American “service - based” economy instead.

The Filipinos are under the impression that they’re in the middle of a great, patriotic struggle of sovereignty (the South China Sea is now the “West Philippine Sea,” from their rhetoric) when in fact they’re just another little Ukraine - the big difference is, they’re prostating themselves practically for free. Indonesia has burned, blown up, or outright sunk 92 Filipino fishing vessels for illegal fishing in disputed waters since 2014 - but we don’t hear the Filipinos contesting any EEZ rules over such. Guess why.

Among all of the ASEAN countries, that territory just fails to present itself as a serious argument.

Certainly and admittedly, I don't call myself any kind of expert on Chinese history and couldn't have any reasonable argument as I know very little about the area before WW2.

What I am basing my comments on is the building of islands in the South China Sea so they can place military facilities on them in an attempt to extend their international borders. This is so transparently power play to try to push the USN further back and easily take Taiwan at their leisure as there is no guarantee the Administration in power at the time will honor our treaty to defend Taiwan.

 

[Edsel]

Certainly and admittedly, I don't call myself any kind of expert on Chinese history and couldn't have any reasonable argument as I know very little about the area before WW2.

None of us are.

If we were "experts," we'd replace that hack Gordon Chang on Fox News

Remember, in publication since 2001!

What I am basing my comments on is the building of islands in the South China Sea so they can place military facilities on them in an attempt to extend their international borders. This is so transparently power play to try to push the USN further back and easily take Taiwan at their leisure as there is no guarantee the Administration in power at the time will honor our treaty to defend Taiwan.

There’s really no need for them to build military facilities there.

Those “facilities” are just territorial placeholders.

Little Dog and Big Dog used to get along, kicked the can down the road and mutually agreed this was a bullshit issue that was an impediment to doggie bone and kibble trade.

American Poodle whispers in the ear of Little Dog, who decides to be an obedient puppy and further our great “Pivot to Asia.”

Big Dog and the ASEAN pack shake their heads in disbelief. Little Dog is back to being a colonial puppy?

What is Big Dog to do with spineless Little Dog?

You do not play sovereignty games with Big Dog when you’re Little Dog.

I suppose the easiest explanation would be that the Philippines is happily vying to be the SEAsian Ukraine - but the big difference is, they're wantonly doing it for free.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Certainly and admittedly, I don't call myself any kind of expert on Chinese history and couldn't have any reasonable argument as I know very little about the area before WW2.

What I am basing my comments on is the building of islands in the South China Sea so they can place military facilities on them in an attempt to extend their international borders. This is so transparently power play to try to push the USN further back and easily take Taiwan at their leisure as there is no guarantee the Administration in power at the time will honor our treaty to defend Taiwan.

Its not just Taiwan, it affects multiple countries. It crosses into Phillipean, Malaysian, Indonesian and Vietnamese economic zones. Its one of the reasons they are pressing so hard to build up a Navy, it's not so much to challenge the US but these countries can not compete with that.

 

[Edsel]

Its not just Taiwan, it affects multiple countries. It crosses into Phillipean, Malaysian, Indonesian and Vietnamese economic zones. Its one of the reasons they are pressing so hard to build up a Navy, it's not so much to challenge the US but these countries can not compete with that.

Not a big issue with ASEAN.

ASEAN mutually agreed with China to regard it as a non - issue (I'll need to keep repeating the figure of speech, "kicking the can down the road").

Except the Philippines, which is playing Ukraine for free.

The Chinese naval buildup is a direct response to American provocations.

Again, remember the great "Pivot to Asia."

We openly publish that we need to kneecap China by 2028 at the latest, otherwise we lose our supremacy (or hegemony, as the online Saturday Morning Punditoons like to say).

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Not a big issue with ASEAN.

ASEAN mutually agreed to make it a non - issue.

I'll need to keep repeating the figure of speech, "kicking the can down the road."

Except the Philippines, which is playing Ukraine for free.

The Chinese naval buildup is a direct response to American provocations.

Again, remember the great "Pivot to Asia."

We openly publish that we need to kneecap China by 2028 at the latest, otherwise we lose our supremacy (or hegemony, as the online Saturday Morning Punditoons like to say).

I think everybody saw recently two Chinese ships collided attempting to ram a Philippines fishing resupply vessel in Philippines economic zone.

Everything is not hunky Dory.

What provocative actions has the US Navy done in the south China Sea? Name some example examples if you’re gonna make that claim. Are we out harassing our neighbors fishing vessels, claiming their economic exclusive zones as our own?

China just doesn’t like it cause they wanna claim the whole sea for themselves.

That’s not provocative on the part of the US.

 

[Fig]

The Middle East, Africa, South America, Asia - did I leave anybody out - all dealing with post - colonial detritus.

If they settled it out amongst themselves, they would have fallen into a reasonable state of equilibrium by now.

But there is convincing evidence that the departing Colonial Imperialists did this deliberately, primarily to keep the regions unstable - and thus ripe for continued resource extraction.

Examples: Great Britain. Arguably the worst perpetrator as far as the above modus operandi is concerned. Too many examples to elaborate on. Favorite case in point: France, the Sahel, Uranium, and their Currency. If you're familiar with Johnny Cash's "Sixteen Tons," there is no better expression of "I owe my soul to the company store."



An inconvenient truth that does not support the narrative (honestly, that word is like Herpes).

Totally disagree, as much as I possibly can. While the British Empire most certainly exploited the natural resources and industry of their colonies, that was clearly not their only impetus, and how the British colonies have fared against the other Europeans bears that out. I can eaisily make a convincing argument that the British were far and away the best colonial masters of the bunch. This is terribly easy both in both the bloodless way many of them got their independence (of course we shot them), and in the post colonial arc of many of those countries who may have had monarchy, but also had rule of law and strong civilizing currents.

Compare those of the British to those of the French, or worse the Belgians (true brutal rapists) or Portuguese.

Even though we shot them in the face, I'd rather grow up in almost any British colony than that of any other country, and it must be noted that the vast majority of the world was an utter shithole when the Europeans were colonizing it. I'd say that the British left everything better whenever they went with the exception of some of the African colonies where it really seems hopeless even today...


Almost like throwing rocks at the Romans for being so violent and conquesty when the rest of the world was a dark and ignorant shithole with nothing but the claw-law. Yea, Rome was brutal by our measure, but by that of BC till the third century it was the absolute pinnacle of light in the world. Perspective is everything.

 

[Threadcutter308]

Dammit! You beat me to it.

Just say it anyway. He'll come back to you with a spicy insult.

Call me if you need some moral support afterwards.

 

[Edsel]

What provocative actions has the US Navy done in the south China Sea? Are we out harassing our neighbors fishing vessels, claiming their economic exclusive zones as our own?

That’s not provocative on the part of the US.

Here you go.

Two episodes from Napolitano's program.

Now, mind you - I don't have any of the hull numbers to cite examples to that level of specificity.

There's a smattering of reports on Hong Kong news programs that I haven't been able to keep track of as they felt like daily fare.

Naturally, we don't hear about it.

Name some example examples if you’re gonna make that claim.

Are you presuming to judge me now?

 

[MO Fugga]

Is it just me or is that description oddly specific?

View attachment 8749765

And why no suggestion to bring the dog?

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Here you go.

Two episodes from Napolitano's program.

Now, mind you - I don't have any of the hull numbers to cite examples to that level of specificity.

There's a smattering of reports on Hong Kong news programs that I haven't been able to track as they felt like daily fare.

Naturally, we don't hear about it.

Thats all you got. A Flanker conducting a close intercept of a Buff and a US ship crossing about a 1/2 mile in front of a Chinese ship. Thats it.

LOL...

 

[theLBC]

china is having lots of problems elsewhere

https://www.monitor.co.ug/uganda/news/china-under-fire-angola-riots-trigger-mass-exodus-and-factory-closures-5157714

Angola is oil rich. So why a fuel price hike that led to deadly protests?

Critics say most people in Africa’s third-largest oil-producing nation have not seen benefits from that natural wealth.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[supercorndogs]

And why no suggestion to bring the dog?

His dog has diabetes and the aunt jehmimahs syrup put it in a coma last time.

 

[Edsel]

Thats all you got. A Flanker conducting a close intercept of a Buff and a US ship crossing about a 1/2 mile in front of a Chinese ship. Thats it.

It is what it is.

Not sure what you're getting out of starting mockery...

 

[Fig]

china is having lots of problems elsewhere

https://www.monitor.co.ug/uganda/news/china-under-fire-angola-riots-trigger-mass-exodus-and-factory-closures-5157714

Angola is oil rich. So why a fuel price hike that led to deadly protests?

Critics say most people in Africa’s third-largest oil-producing nation have not seen benefits from that natural wealth.

www.aljazeera.com

I've said it many times. Let China invest in Africa. It's a fucking waste of money and they will end up fleeing. The Chinese are way too racist and supremacist to operate in Africa anyway. The Africans fucking hate them from what I understand.

Keep them the fuck out of South America. That's where our interests lie. Africa can go fuck itself for all I care. I am never going back there.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

It is what it is.

Not sure what you're getting out of starting mockery...

That is not provocative. That being the most provocative thing you can come up with is pretty funny me.

It’s an airplane in a ship traveling through international air and waters. Ohhhhh no.

 

[Fig]

It is what it is.

Not sure what you're getting out of starting mockery...

Because you don't believe anything that ACTUALLY happens. It's all fake and some conspiracy by evil Americans, like we are omnipotent and control everything.

It is no different at all than what the moon bats protesting think. They just arrive at the same place from the opposite direction.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Hainan Island incident - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

You could at least mention the time the P-3 scored a kill on a Chinese fighter jet.

 

[NoDopes]

EDIT - forgot to add the sellers of fine chinese cutlery.

Just don't use their steel for anything important...
Bangkok Building collapse

The lying, stealing and corruption in China...is 2nd only to the US. We'll... maybe Ukraine.

 

[Edsel]

American Foreign Policy in a Nutshell*

Axioms:

1. Our mindset is based on zero - sum thinking; a state either dominates or is subjugated, in the context of finite resources.
2. Any state that is too large, technologically progressing, or getting too prosperous is a threat and must either:

a) fall in lockstep​

b) rendered a nonfunctional state or Balkanized into bite - sized servings through​

i) Economic (sanctions, weaponization of currency) or​

ii) Military Interventions (Destabilization and Regime Changes through “Color Revolutions” included).​

3. Incidental characteristics

a) American Exceptionalism on a background of Manifest Destiny​

Short Outline for Focused Reading**

1991. Fall of the Soviet Union. Rise of what has been referred to as the "Unipolar Moment." We can do whatever the f*ck we want, and nobody's going to stop us.

1993. No GPS for you! Well, they built their own. Not really relevant, included just because.

1997. Defines in text what our modus operandi is. Sometimes referred to as the "State Department's Bible."

2007. Wesley Clark's interview re: "seven countries in five years." Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, and Iran. All but Iran are failed states.

2008. Financial Crisis. China bails out America to the tune of ~ $800 billion. Gradual creep towards loss of trust in the stability of the U$D. Thought to be one of the larger catalysts prompting consideration of alternative currencies by non - Anglosphere nations, as well the State Department's consideration of China (they’re that rich?!) as a potential "adversary.”

2009. How do we screw over Iran? Incidentally, Iran is a major Belt and Road Initiative partner.

2011. Official announcement of "Pivot to Asia" policy. Accelerated increase in Chinese naval capacity.

2011. No International Space Station for you! Well, yet again they built their own.

2015. Publication of presently most consistent outline towards weakening / containing China. Enhanced Defense Cooperation Agreement (EDCA), Philippines. American Bases previously absent after expulsion of Ferdinand Marcos Sr. reestablished in the Philippines.

2016. Start of Taiwan's Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) administration, with Tsai Ing - wen. Increased rhetoric with marked pro - independence stance. Acceleration of weapon sales to Taiwan. Decline in cordial China - Taiwan relations; coincident drop in cross - strait tourism traffic.

2017. Magical Year #1. Accelerated anti - China propaganda.

2018. Adrian Zenz starts publishing Uyghur Genocide propaganda.

2019. Let's get creative screwing Russia over! Stretch Russia thin using Ukraine, pull Syria out from under their feet.

2019. SARS - CoV-2 / COVID. China weathered the pandemic with more resilience than America. Further affirmation that China must be knocked down a peg or two.

2019 - 2020. Hong Kong Riots, incited by the National Endowment for Democracy.

2020. No, your ideas will be abandoned. Too ambitious. See “Strategic Sequencing” below.

2021. A lot of smear and propaganda money.

2021. CEBR predicts China will surpass America as world's biggest economy by 2028 (Magical Year #2, since postponed to 2036 in the 2025 report, but the warmongers haven't received the memo). Similar fearmongering by ASPI (Compare: China against: USA in: All technologies). Metrics suggest overwhelming lead by China. Hence the mindset of "preparing for conflict with China by 2025 - er, no - 2027, or was it 2028."

2021. AUKUS nuclear submarine deal with Australia. Notable opposition from locals due to 1) China is Australia's biggest trading partner (like the Philippines) 2) They have no resources for or intentions of projecting power 3) The French Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A SSs would have been sufficient 4) Most optimistic estimate for SSN delivery is ~ 2040. In the meantime, sans Australian Virginia - class SSNs - Australia's ports will serve as free parking for American submarines. To further their goal of containing China.

2023. Not to be taken seriously, but the sentiment's there.

2024. Navigation Plan 2024. Unsure what the earlier plans called for, what projected year of conflict. Above edition calls for "preparedness for conflict by 2027." Thought 2028 was the Magic Year, perhaps they want to make sure by starting a year early.

2024. American goal of simultaneous weakening / containing Russia through Ukraine and China through Asian allies is unfeasible. Foist Ukraine onto Europe, focus on the more imminent threat, China. The "Geostrategy for Eurasia" cannot be implemented en bloc.

2024. Even more smear and propaganda money.

2025. More aggressive attempts at de - dollarization by Global South / BRICS countries. Triggers: 1) A third of the world is under American sanctions 2) Russian assets were frozen in 2022 3) American debt is skyrocketing 4) America is simply not a reliable trading partner with all these (tariffs)

2025. Department of State drops wording "we do not support Taiwan independence" from webpage.

1. Achievement of Goals re: Eurasia

Middle East: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, and Sudan all folded except for Iran​

Russia: looks like a failure​

China: in the works - must have war by 2028 - later than that, China would have gained an insurmountable lead!​

South Korea: secured; an occupied front since the Korean war, with America (not South Korea) having operational control over South Korean military during conflict​

Japan: secured; an occupied front since World War 2​

Taiwan: secured as a lapdog​

Philippines: secured; stirred up some sovereignty sh*t, a lapdog almost for free​

Thailand and Myanmar: not even sure what's going on there​

​

2. Our overall Foreign Policy has remained unchanged

- It makes no difference what president or party is in charge​

- We'll beat everybody who opposes us, reasons lie in #2​

3. We need to remain the sole hegemon

- Prosperity will be granted to those who are subservient, poverty must befall those who aren't​

- The U$D must remain the de facto world currency​

- SWIFT must remain as the sole network for international financial transactions​

- The U$D must NOT lose its "Exorbitant Privelege"​

- Alternative trading networks and currencies will significantly reduce the purchasing power of the U$D - this will have significant consequences on the American "way of life" and "standard of living" - we cannot live poor​

- All countries not willing to kiss the ring must be kneecapped or stopped outright​

4. The Philippines is but a tiny inconsequential cog for which we must stir trouble up in the larger scheme of destabilizing or Balkanizing large, non - subservient countries (in this case, China)

*reposted from elsewhere
**all accessible free of charge online

 

[Edsel]

First off, they don't invent or create anything.

Not true.

The second image is old, from 2018. The gap's much wider now.

Also, refer to the ASPI Critical Technology Tracker for many more such metrics.

They live in a crushing surveillance state that considers them a resource and an asset like oil or timber. There is no respect for human life except at a personal level. They are still communists who believe The State is god, and the people exist to worship it.

That sounds like the very same rhetoric from Gordon Chang on Fox News.

I spent most of my post - government life doing consultancy work over many parts of Asia, usually on three month jaunts twice to thrice a year.

I was last in Shenzhen around five to six years ago.

When was the last time you were in China, and not just on something like a five - day pleasure trip to Macau?

In 2024 alone, 140 million Chinese tourists went all over the world and back. That's twice the population of Britain. Did you hear of any defections? They must be sooo scared of defecting.

Freedom of navigation is why there is modern medicine and electricity in the third world. To understand what freedom of navigation means you only have to go back to early America to find examples of how eliminating piracy far away from our shores and establishing international rules on the high seas lifted humanity out of the mud. Great Brittan before us was the only territorial marshal in the no man's land, and their global trade and colonialism started it. It's probably the greatest gift the white man ever gave the world. Before that the only safe travel depended on how many shields and spear men were on board.

"Freedom of Navigation" is a nebulous catch phrase used in lieu of the more codified UNCLOS, of which America is very surprisingly not a signatory. We have real laws. UNCLOS, flawed as it is in the way it was set up, has discrete, defined, codified rules.

Along the same lines, the "Rules Based International Order" is a blank check for us to say whatever we want. Frequently applied as "Rules for thee, not for me."

...you are as oblivious to economics as you are to history, and why safe travel on the high seas is so critically important, and why a bully trying to take the established territory of a weaker neighbor can't be tolerated on the seas.

I don't know how many times I've said this at this point... Those half - submerged rocks were a non - issue during Rodrigo Duterte's (favored trade with China) tenure. Much like the territorial disputes with the other claimants - Brunei, Malaysia, and Vietnam - it was a non - issue and there were NO skirmishes with the Philippines until the new American - supported Banana Republic son of the late also American - supported dictator Ferdinand Marcos, Sr. (remember when this guy fled to Hawaii toting all these suitcases full of cash?) was set up. The new guy's name is Ferdinand "Bongbong" Marcos, Jr. America goaded its new puppet into allowing several more bases / military installations as well as escalating maritime aggression with China.

Ah, yes. The ICC and Duterte. He was practically kidnapped by the ICC and shuttled to the Hague. The big joke is, the Philippines ceased being a signatory to the ICC a few years back. Remember, the guy favors trade with China. Similarly, recall what happened to Pakistan's (surprisingly thought to be in the Middle East by some) Imran Khan when he declared a stance of neutrality as far as Russia / China / America were concerned.

The USN has been power projection since the beginning of the 20th century, and if we loose that it is a leap into the next dark age. This isn't renaming a gulf. This is the Chicoms trying to control the entrance to Subic
Bay.

A leap into the next dark age - for whom?

Us?

ASEAN, BRICS, god knows who else - they're pulling away from us.

We're a drunk, abusive boyfriend blindly swinging punches much to everybody's chagrin.

All of this is OUR doing.

I suppose this should illustrate the point.

 

[Edsel]

I can eaisily make a convincing argument that the British were far and away the best colonial masters of the bunch.

...you are as oblivious to economics as you are to history, and why safe travel on the high seas is so critically important, and why a bully trying to take the established territory of a weaker neighbor can't be tolerated on the seas.

There's quite a lot about contemporary history that I don't have a firm grasp on.

Too much of it to read, and my reading glasses are uncomfortable.

That being said, I do know about the British having left us with the greatest bestest superduperest Easter Eggs of them all - through the Balfour Declaration and the Sykes - Picot Agreement.

Since you’re probably unfamiliar with these events, 1) The Balfour Declaration is often seen as a pivotal moment that laid the groundwork for the Israeli - Palestinian conflict, as it supported the establishment of a national home for the Jewish people in Palestine without adequately addressing the political rights of the Arab inhabitants. 2) The Sykes - Picot Agreement, on the other hand, ignored ethnic and sectarian lines when it arbitrarily partitioned the Middle East, as expected of the then colonial powers.

This legacy of these artificial borders has contributed significantly to the present world stage, leading to long - term instability, conflict, and arguably the unhappiest, unsafest, most turbulent region of immediate international consequence in the world today.

Discounting the British as being the “best colonial masters” simply isn’t a serious argument.

 

[Edsel]

The "Rules Based International Order."

 

[Edsel]

The dollar must remain supreme!

Otherwise, we lose our privelege of living large at the expense of others.

If BRICS succeeds - the first video will be something history books will be making references to for decades to come.

 

[Edsel]

Because you don't believe anything that ACTUALLY happens. It's all fake and some conspiracy by evil Americans, like we are omnipotent and control everything.

Our powers are omnipotent...

We put a suit on this fella, and - big reveal - he emerges as a young, attractive, tough young man with a strong past!

We indeed control everything!

After all, our military presence overseas is omnipresent!

This is where all our money goes, by the way.



Just reposting this video to remind us of this little fact.

Our money, I mean, and where it should have gone...

 

[Fig]

So, you think we're a hegemony, and you have no problem with China supplanting us, because we're no better than they are?

The great thing about being a cynical conspiracy theorist is never having to say you are sorry or wrong, because every piece of information that does not conform to your preconceptions is dismissed as propaganda.

Not impressed with your analysis, not China's patents. They are notorious for stealing and do so all the time. That CCP stooges apply for Chinese patents on tech they stole would only surprise you. China has come a long way fast, but it has entirely been by stealing, and they literally have no ethics about anything. They worship power and the state. Life on this planet with them as an actual hegemon ain't gona be like you think it is.

 

[Threadcutter308]

So, you think we're a hegemony, and you have no problem with China supplanting us, because we're no better than they are?

The great thing about being a cynical conspiracy theorist is never having to say you are sorry or wrong, because every piece of information that does not conform to your preconceptions is dismissed as propaganda.

Not impressed with your analysis, not China's patents. They are notorious for stealing and do so all the time. That CCP stooges apply for Chinese patents on tech they stole would only surprise you. China has come a long way fast, but it has entirely been by stealing, and they literally have no ethics about anything. They worship power and the state. Life on this planet with them as an actual hegemon ain't gona be like you think it is.

You are exactly spot on. I had chinese customers that would do this and I had non chinese customers that had their Intellectual Property and designs stolen from them by the chinese.

I have seen it with my own two eyes. And not isolated instances, it is rampant. To believe otherwise is pure delusion.

 

[Edsel]

I've said it many times. Let China invest in Africa. It's a fucking waste of money and they will end up fleeing.

To cite an example - the region is strategically important for France's geopolitical interests and energy resources, such as Uranium from Niger, which are vital for France's nuclear energy sector. France SELLS electricity to the EU thanks to Uranium from the Sahel.

Cobalt is another hot topic located elsewhere.

South Africa has all fifteen of the Rare Earth Elements.

Knowing that, discounting Africa would seem ignorant.

The Chinese are way too racist and supremacist to operate in Africa anyway. The Africans fucking hate them from what I understand.

Honestly, that sounds like quite a bit of Projection.



This one's more of clickbait, but the Namibian president's choice of words - never mind his thick accent - is perfect.

I'm certain there are Africans who hate the Chinese. The world isn't perfect.



Try this one, "Empire of Dust."

It's grittier and more adherent to harsh realities.

Keep them the fuck out of South America. That's where our interests lie. Africa can go fuck itself for all I care. I am never going back there.

re: what you said about South America - that sounds like the Monroe Doctrine. It's deeply rooted in the Colonial Imperialism mindset. While it isn’t Colonial Imperialism per se in the traditional sense, it is certainly about asserting dominance and control over the western hemisphere.

It's a big planet, there's lots of places for everybody to go - Africa won't miss any of us.

With the way you refer to Africa - I'm curious - did the Africans do something to you while you were there? Did the Africa s ask you to perform, or were you subjected to, any acts against your will?



Our present administration seems to disagree with your views - it would appear that they smell gold.

So, you think we're a hegemony, and you have no problem with China supplanting us, because we're no better than they are?

I most certainly have some reservations, but I find it difficult saying no to that...

I know we are a hegemony.

I'm very surprised you're unaware of this.

The concept has been widely discussed since 2001, perhaps even earlier, and remains part of regular collegiate discourse to this day.

The great thing about being a cynical conspiracy theorist is never having to say you are sorry or wrong, because every piece of information that does not conform to your preconceptions is dismissed as propaganda.

Oh, far from it.

Most of the tidbits I mentioned have likewise been discussed extensively in decades past by John Mearsheimer and Jeffrey Sachs.

For the most part, it's now open knowledge...

The foreign policy papers are pretty much cookbooks detailing how we attempt to destabilize countries.

The steps are spelled out in amazing detail.

Try reading them.

Not impressed with your analysis, not China's patents. They are notorious for stealing and do so all the time. That CCP stooges apply for Chinese patents on tech they stole would only surprise you. China has come a long way fast, but it has entirely been by stealing, and they literally have no ethics about anything. They worship power and the state. Life on this planet with them as an actual hegemon ain't gona be like you think it is.

That's pretty much what we've been conditioned to believe, just like the Kuwaiti babies being thrown out of their incubators, Dubya's WMDs and the like...

You're free to think whatever you please, I have no objections - whatever floats your boat.

After all, this is a public forum.

Caution - one can be very impressionable and easily swayed by cognitive biases as the result of not having done any due diligence in the first place.

Do try to look up and read at least some of the references to broaden your horizons, as I'm certain you haven't - it took me quite a bit of time to read them all.

They're all available free of charge, floating around in cyberspace.

Paperbacks like the one below, however - you'll have to buy them yourself.

On the side, this book by Chomsky is quite the read.

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

another incel! You fellas should get together and compare notes re self gratification w/aunt jemima butter flavored syrup.

They took aunt jenima away from us....

 

[DeathBeforeDismount]

Look at all the Chinese dick sucker faggots in here.

They must want to be Chinese so bad...at least their their dick looks average among them. Probably can't get American pussy either.

Oh and for the mikey above:
Welcome to

 

[mosin46]

American Foreign Policy in a Nutshell*

Axioms:

1. Our mindset is based on zero - sum thinking; a state either dominates or is subjugated, in the context of finite resources.
2. Any state that is too large, technologically progressing, or getting too prosperous is a threat and must either:

a) fall in lockstep​

b) rendered a nonfunctional state or Balkanized into bite - sized servings through​

i) Economic (sanctions, weaponization of currency) or​

ii) Military Interventions (Destabilization and Regime Changes through “Color Revolutions” included).​

3. Incidental characteristics

a) American Exceptionalism on a background of Manifest Destiny​

Short Outline for Focused Reading**

1991. Fall of the Soviet Union. Rise of what has been referred to as the "Unipolar Moment." We can do whatever the f*ck we want, and nobody's going to stop us.

View attachment 8751474

1993. No GPS for you! Well, they built their own.

View attachment 8751249View attachment 8751251

1997. Defines in text what our modus operandi is. Sometimes referred to as the "State Department's Bible."

2007. Wesley Clark's interview re: "seven countries in five years." Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, and Iran. All but Iran are failed states.

2008. Financial Crisis. China bails out America to the tune of ~ $800 billion. Gradual creep towards loss of trust in the stability of the U$D. Thought to be one of the larger catalysts prompting consideration of alternative currencies by non - Anglosphere nations, as well the State Department's consideration of China as a potential "adversary."

View attachment 8751341

2009. How do we screw over Iran?

View attachment 8751258View attachment 8751376

2011. Official announcement of "Pivot to Asia" policy. Accelerated increase in Chinese naval capacity.

View attachment 8751473

2011. No International Space Station for you! Well, yet again they built their own.

View attachment 8751265

2015. Publication of presently most consistent outline towards weakening / containing China. Enhanced Defense Cooperation Agreement (EDCA), Philippines. American Bases previously absent after expulsion of Ferdinand Marcos Sr. reestablished in the Philippines.

View attachment 8751259View attachment 8751264

2016. Start of Taiwan's Democratic Progressive Party (DPP) administration, with Tsai Ing - wen. Increased rhetoric with marked pro - independence stance. Acceleration of weapon sales to Taiwan. Decline in cordial China - Taiwan relations; coincident drop in cross - strait tourism traffic.

View attachment 8751300View attachment 8751302

2017. Magical Year #1. Accelerated anti - China propaganda.

View attachment 8751377

2019. Let's get creative screwing Russia over.

2019. SARS - CoV-2 / COVID. China weathered the pandemic with more resilience than America. Further affirmation that China must be knocked down a peg or two.

View attachment 8751318

2020. No, your ideas will be abandoned. Too ambitious.

View attachment 8751467

2021. A lot of smear and propaganda money.

View attachment 8751286
View attachment 8751273

2021. CEBR predicts China will surpass America as world's biggest economy by 2028 (Magical Year #2, since postponed to 2036 in the 2025 report, but the warmongers haven't received the memo). Similar fearmongering by ASPI (Compare: China against: USA in: All technologies). Metrics suggest overwhelming lead by China. Hence the mindset of "preparing for conflict with China by 2025, er no - 2027."

2021. AUKUS nuclear submarine deal with Australia. Notable opposition due to 1) China is their biggest trading partner (like the Philippines) 2) They have no resources for or intentions of projecting power 3) The French Diesel - Electrics (or Stirlings?) would have been sufficient 4) Most optimistic estimate for submarine delivery is ~ 2040. In the meantime, sans submarines - Australia's ports will serve as free parking for American submarines.

View attachment 8751312

2023. Not to be taken seriously, but the sentiment's there.

View attachment 8751275View attachment 8751276

2024. Navigation Plan 2024. Unsure what the earlier plans called for, what projected year of conflict. Above edition calls for "preparedness for conflict by 2027." Thought 2028 was the Magic Year, perhaps they want to make sure by starting a year early.

View attachment 8751281

2024. American goal of simultaneous weakening / containing Russia through Ukraine and China through Asian allies is unfeasible. Foist Ukraine onto Europe, focus on the more imminent threat, China. The "Geostrategy for Eurasia" cannot be implemented en bloc.

View attachment 8751469
View attachment 8751471

2024. Even more smear and propaganda money.

2025. More aggressive attempts at de - dollarization by Global South / BRICS countries. Triggers: 1) A third of the world is under American sanctions 2) Russian assets were frozen in 2022 3) American debt is skyrocketing 4) America is simply not a reliable trading partner with all these (tariffs)

1. Achievement of Goals re: Eurasia

Middle East: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, and Sudan all folded except for Iran​

Russia: looks like a failure​

China: in the works​

South Korea: an occupied front since the Korean war, with America (not South Korea) having operational control over South Korean military during conflict​

Japan: an occupied front since World War 2​

Taiwan: secured as a lapdog​

Philippines: stirred up sovereignty sh*t and secured as a lapdog almost for free​

Thailand and Myanmar: not even sure what's going on there​

​

2. Our overall Foreign Policy has remained unchanged

- It makes no difference what president or party is in charge​

- We'll beat everybody who opposes us, reasons lie in #2​

3. We need to remain the sole hegemon

- Prosperity will be granted to those who are subservient, poverty must befall those who aren't​

- The U$D must remain the de facto world currency​

- SWIFT must remain as the sole network for international financial transactions​

- The U$D must NOT lose its "Exorbitant Privelege"​

- Alternative trading networks and currencies will significantly reduce the purchasing power of the U$D - this will have significant consequences on the American "way of life" and "standard of living" - we cannot live poor​

- All countries not willing to kiss the ring must be kneecapped or stopped outright​

4. The Philippines is but a tiny inconsequential cog for which we must stir trouble up in the larger scheme of destabilizing or Balkanizing large, non - subservient countries (in this case, China)

*reposted from elsewhere
**all accessible free of charge online

well laid out. i would say that China is an enemy based on their actions here at the least. read the "100 yr marathon" it supports that idea. i do believe covid was a deliberate attack. of course financed by a part of our deep state. it seems your point is that we are goading China in the same ways we do with Russia and Iran. now Venezuela?
seems your point is that we want to stop China's expansion. for which we are aggravating them unwisely. is true IMHO. we can't fight them in Asia and have no reason to. they have a navy. taliban,VC,NKs,Iraquis didn't. would be a logistics disaster and our real fighting power has become questionable. fact is we have no reason to fight them in Asia at least. w.hemis is a bit different. but a stronger reaction to their screwing around there would not result in a hot war. i have to believe that they can see the Pacific as a game loser just like for us.
i would say that the problem caused by our neocon,MIC elites is looking universal everywhere.
our short sided stupidity and greed gave them a green light to overtake us in many things. it can be fixed but gonna take 10-20 yrs. to survive that long will need a lot of wisdom in our leadership. afraid i don't see much lately.

 

[Edsel]

well laid out. i would say that China is an enemy based on their actions here at the least. read the "100 yr marathon" it supports that idea. i do believe covid was a deliberate attack. of course financed by a part of our deep state. it seems your point is that we are goading China in the same ways we do with Russia and Iran. now Venezuela?
seems your point is that we want to stop China's expansion. for which we are aggravating them unwisely. is true IMHO. we can't fight them in Asia and have no reason to. they have a navy. taliban,VC,NKs,Iraquis didn't. would be a logistics disaster and our real fighting power has become questionable. fact is we have no reason to fight them in Asia at least. w.hemis is a bit different. but a stronger reaction to their screwing around there would not result in a hot war. i have to believe that they can see the Pacific as a game loser just like for us.
i would say that the problem caused by our neocon,MIC elites is looking universal everywhere.
our short sided stupidity and greed gave them a green light to overtake us in many things. it can be fixed but gonna take 10-20 yrs. to survive that long will need a lot of wisdom in our leadership. afraid i don't see much lately.

I quite forgot about Venezuela.

Yes, once again - we are the provocateur.

Just like what we did to dear old Ukraine.

There's nothing new in what I compiled - by no means am I putting out a new, novel point of view.

It's all been heavily discussed and threshed out by others who spent far more time doing real work.

I'm really surprised that there are people totally in the dark about this, considering contemporary history involving Ukraine - which pretty much outed everything we've been doing.

re: “The Hundred - Year Marathon,” its author - Michael Pillsbury - is associated with the Hudson Institute, a conservative stalwart, and is basically a Neoconservative. Pillsbury's views on China's strategic ambitions align with the notion that China is a revisionist power seeking to challenge American dominance.

 

[khel]

Paperbacks like the one below, however - you'll have to buy them yourself.

View attachment 8751484

On the side, this book by Chomsky is quite the read.

I'll second this book! BTW, you don't have to buy it, I've got an audio version from the library.

 

[mosin46]

likely get it. BUT,Chomsky has had his own agenda for a long time. like everything you gotta consider the context.

 

[theLBC]

I've said it many times. Let China invest in Africa. It's a fucking waste of money and they will end up fleeing. The Chinese are way too racist and supremacist to operate in Africa anyway. The Africans fucking hate them from what I understand.

Keep them the fuck out of South America. That's where our interests lie. Africa can go fuck itself for all I care. I am never going back there.

 

[mosin46]

Africa has a hx of not dealing nicely with foreign presence. happened to Indians,Brits,Belgians in 50s & later.

 

[W54/XM-388]

What do you want to bet some "Western intelligence agency" is "helping" all those "organic protests" against the Chinese in Africa...

 

[GreenGO Juan]

What do you want to bet some "Western intelligence agency" is "helping" all those "organic protests" against the Chinese in Africa...

if they weren't, they are now.

 

[mosin46]

not betting against that. seem to remember that the KGB had something to do with anti western (white) agitation 50s,60s Mau Mau etc. i know for sure we had mil working in Africa back then. had a friend who was a VN vet from the 101st ABD who was there as part of it not CIA but the 101st in uniform before he went to VN. i think he was in the Congo as he did say he saw Mike Hoare's men in action. never got the whole story. was a non issue for us in the 70s. many think the CIA had Lumumba killed and was involved with the Belgians during the Katanga/Mobutu mess.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Decent piece on basic Post WW2 till China detonates their first Nuke Chinese history.

 

[Edsel]

What do you want to bet some "Western intelligence agency" is "helping" all those "organic protests" against the Chinese in Africa...

Yeeesss, they certainly did all that in Ukraine!

Nooo, they’re not doing it at all anywhere else in the world! <sarcasm>

Sorry, but I can’t help but point out the sheer stupidity of that guy up there. We’ve already dismissed Gordon Chang as an idiot on the first page, and yet - he proceeds to post a video featuring…

…no other than Gordon Chang.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Watch out for #1, don't step in #2.

 

[Edsel]

A little blurb on the Monroe Doctrine, for those who have forgotten American history…

 

[jabonra]

So, you think we're a hegemony, and you have no problem with China supplanting us, because we're no better than they are?

The great thing about being a cynical conspiracy theorist is never having to say you are sorry or wrong, because every piece of information that does not conform to your preconceptions is dismissed as propaganda.

Not impressed with your analysis, not China's patents. They are notorious for stealing and do so all the time. That CCP stooges apply for Chinese patents on tech they stole would only surprise you. China has come a long way fast, but it has entirely been by stealing, and they literally have no ethics about anything. They worship power and the state. Life on this planet with them as an actual hegemon ain't gona be like you think it is.

He's a straight up shill larping as a conspiracy theorist