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Common core debate team...

This is satire, right?
What does "common core style" mean? I'm sort of missing the point - it's supposed to make fun of the style of debates by portraying both sides as rambling and incoherent? I mean, it's sort of like they do on crossfire, where it's just raised voices with appeal to emotion and no actual logic, but I'm failing to understand what the point was for this bit of parody.
 
This is more in-line to be classified as "debate rap" and carries about as much weight as you give it. In other words, it only means something to the few individuals that are involved in it. I facilitated a few debates in my time but this crap would not last 5 seconds in a normal curriculum. Just another example of making idiots feel better about themselves and giving them trophies to reinforce the stupidity of the whole process. I would love to see that kind of mark on one of their job apps "I was champion of the Ebonics debate team"........ Welcome to minimum wage.
 
I cant open the video but Im guessing debaters that hold no position and use anything but logic and common sense to form their arguments.

Look up Lev Vygotsky. Who he was, who he worked for and what entity he wanted to design an education system for.

My kids school just adopted the "Vygotskian" based Tools of the Mind.

Whats next, our med schools start using Dr Mengele's body of research?


Edit - Opened it next day. My God what the hell was that. Worse than I could have imagined.
 
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I have a hard time believing that idiocy, ineptitude, and lack of forethought is being rewarded.

How dismal are we destined to fall to?
 
Hey now.....she said the team spent a lot of time "researching" the subject to prepare for the debate. I can honestly say, I have not heard the "N" word used more times in such few sentences in my life.
 
I still am not getting it. This is real? As in, people actually judged it? HOW? I didn't understand anything that any of them said. How can you determine who won? What did they win? I'm lost.

This makes me think of the article Richard Feynman wrote about sitting on a school board for selecting textbooks, and he was the only one that didn't give a particular book a score or draw any conclusions about the adequacy of the book. Everyone else had given it high marks. When asked, he stated that he opened the book and it was completely blank. There was nothing to judge. Turns out that the publisher hadn't finished getting the book printed and had sent out blank books with just the cover printed, and nobody else on the board had bothered to read it. They just listened to what the publisher told them. So, back to this. How can you actually judge, and determine a winner, for something that is devoid of understandable content?
 
I still am not getting it. This is real? As in, people actually judged it? HOW? I didn't understand anything that any of them said. How can you determine who won? What did they win? I'm lost.

This makes me think of the article Richard Feynman wrote about sitting on a school board for selecting textbooks, and he was the only one that didn't give a particular book a score or draw any conclusions about the adequacy of the book. Everyone else had given it high marks. When asked, he stated that he opened the book and it was completely blank. There was nothing to judge. Turns out that the publisher hadn't finished getting the book printed and had sent out blank books with just the cover printed, and nobody else on the board had bothered to read it. They just listened to what the publisher told them. So, back to this. How can you actually judge, and determine a winner, for something that is devoid of understandable content?


You got it dude.
 
I still am not getting it. This is real? As in, people actually judged it? HOW? I didn't understand anything that any of them said. How can you determine who won? What did they win? I'm lost.

The problem here is that the debate style, the permission of which I find strangely unsettling, is a complete reflection of a very limited range of expression within an ethnic stereotype that reinforces concepts of intellectual and social segregation.

Discussed at length: http://www.theatlantic.com/educatio...tional-college-debate-white-privilege/360746/

Discussed in brief: Prepare for outrage: Far left destroys college debate club because RACISM | The Daily Caller


 
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Holy Christ, things have changed since my debate days. My high school was changed for the worse after being sued for admissions criteria viewed as being too stringent. Eighteen years ago I returned to help coach the debate and quiz bowl teams and immediately left after finding that you could get points for style. The video above shows just how far we can go with the everyone-gets-a-trophy mentality. Thinking is hard. Thinking on your feet is harder. The article below outlines a decline in standards that is blown away by the video. It also gives a sense of the mania of preparation that goes (went?) into a debate. I truly feel sad for our country.

Contest of Words | Harper's Magazine
 
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Moses, you know where I went to school, and y'all were one of our top debate rivals in the City. I think if these girls had shown up to a competition our debate teams would have just been dumbstruck and incapable of response, waiting for the "joke" to be over.
 
Moses, you know where I went to school, and y'all were one of our top debate rivals in the City. I think if these girls had shown up to a competition our debate teams would have just been dumbstruck and incapable of response, waiting for the "joke" to be over.

No doubt, Bogey. I have tremendous respect for your alma mater. What can you say about a school that has seen off graduates to probably every ivy league university and a 2nd overall pick in the MLB draft? Unfortunately, my eyes and ears have witnessed the sort of lop sided academic contest you describe, more than once. During such moments there is usually a choice to be made between elevating your game or, like those in the video above, changing the rules such that the bar can only be found by one of James Cameron's deep sea exploration teams.

I am also well versed in a different style of debate learned from my father and his colleagues. Being a swift boat veteran and a boilermaker of 30+ years (the acetylene and TIG kind, not Perdue University) his speech patterns were possessed of a special color. The sort of forceful blue collar language used to settle disagreements during the construction of a fluid catalytic cracker by members of Boilermakers Local 37 is very different from the stage of American Parliamentary Debate. I have combined the two to dramatic effect. The older I get the more weight I give to boilermaker variety.
 
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It sounds as though we were raised by similar fathers, and debate was all well and good until Pops had enough. A slap to the back of the head was the trump card in any family "debate".

Having to work while in school prevented my involvement in many extracurriculars, but many of my friends were heavily involved in quiz bowl and debate, so I'd help them prepare and "study" prior to large meets. I can only imagine the looks of sheer amazement on Monday morning had they returned from a weekend competition and faced THIS. I have a feeling the teachers involved would have quit and the team would have withdrawn from further participation.
 
Moses, you know where I went to school, and y'all were one of our top debate rivals in the City. I think if these girls had shown up to a competition our debate teams would have just been dumbstruck and incapable of response, waiting for the "joke" to be over.
I was not on the Debate team but I knew the teacher who coached the debate team. I believe Mr D.... would have been thought he was seeing a medical disorder of some type and called for an ambulance.
 
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I debated both (team) Policy and (solo) Lincoln Douglas - what is Cross X?

I am great with the cadence but the sucking wind thing is distracting. I can only assume they are deemed to be articulate and coherent due to regionalism; but when was it deemed wise to use "nigger" as a proper noun when making an argument?

Also, we worn suits & ties / dresses. This....looks like a couple of booshy girls from the suburbs doing their best to work in some ebonics b/c the fatass & fro just ain't cutting it for street cred in the hood....
 
Honestly - don't blame them. They were told by somebody that they were doing a great job, and somehow made it to the finals. Someone should have told them to speak english, use factual arguments to support their thesis, and present those facts in a cohesive, logical manner, refuting their opponents arguments. They didn't fail, they have been failed.

If someone tells you you're doing a great job shooting a 12" group and that that will win the tournament, and your opponent was told a 14" group was great, you would probably win the match as well, never knowing that a 6" group was possible.

Someones got to start telling these people they suck, and that they can fix it with hard work and perseverance. There really isn't any prize for mediocre. But hey, they were on TV, so maybe there is.
 
I agree with this idea, but how do you get so far off the beaten path that, even when being told you are doing well, you don't stop to question whether you should actually be debating the topic at hand? How does a debate on the use presidential wartime powers become an incoherent diatribe on the government's perceived war on a particular racial group?

I know we foster many of the ideas provided us throughout childhood, but at some point, we are supposed to become adults, the mark of which is taking responsibility for one's thoughts and actions. At some point, "it's my parent's, coach's, teacher's, etc. fault" is no longer a valid excuse. I understand this is college, so I think they are still a ways from that stage, but I think there is blame to be shared throughout that entire auditorium.
 
I think this is much bigger and more far reaching then many of you are either not realizing or want to entertain. stop looking at the small picture of some ghetto hood rats and look at the big picture.
 
First of all, they are on the fast track to becoming tomorrow's leadership cadre.

I don't say yeah, I say Hell yeah!

Who's making this happen? Not us. We couldn't; and we damned sure wouldn't.

A clear and solid diet of this style of leadership is precisely what this Nation needs in order to demonstrate once and for all that democracy is a failed experiment.

Whatever comes next has got to be better than this crap.

Oh, hasten the day...

From Wiki:

Criticisms of North American "Vygotskian" legacy

A critique of the North American interpretation of Vygotsky's ideas and, somewhat later, its global spread and dissemination appeared in the 1980s. The early 1980s criticism of Russian and Western "Vygotskian" scholars continued throughout the 1990s. Thus, different authors emphasized the biased and fragmented interpretations of Vygotsky by representatives of what was termed "neo-Vygotskian fashions in contemporary psychology or "selective traditions" in Vygotskian scholarship. Characteristically, the most fashionable "Vygotskian" phraseology in wide circulation in Western scholarly and educational discourse—such as the so-called "zone of proximal development"—in the critical literature of this period were referred to as "one of the most used and least understood constructs to appear in contemporary educational literature", the construct that was "used as little more than a fashionable alternative to Piagetian terminology or the concept of IQ for describing individual differences in attainment or potential". Other authors also suggest clearly distinguishing between original Vygotsky's notion of "zona blizhaishego razvitiia" (ZBR) and its later Western superficial interpretations known under the umbrella term "zone of proximal development" (ZPD). The criticism continued and reached a peak in the 2000s. Most often these critiques address numerous distortions of Vygotsky's ideas, mere "declarations of faith", "versions of Vygotsky", the "concepts and inferences curiously attributed to Lev Vygotsky", "multiple readings of Vygotsky", some of which—for instance, "activity theory"—are referred to as "dead end” for cultural-historical psychology and, moreover, for methodological thinking in cultural psychology. Some publications question "if anyone actually reads Vygotsky’s words", whether it is "too late to understand Vygotsky for the classroom", and suggest "turning Vygotsky on his head." Inconsistencies, contradictions, and at times fundamental flaws in "Vygotskian" literature were revealed in the ocean of critical publications on this subject and are typically associated with—but certainly not limited to—the North American legacy of Michael Cole and James Wertsch and their associates. These criticisms contributed significantly to the increasing awareness of numerous "challenges of claiming a Vygotskian perspective".

Criticisms of available Vygotsky's texts

A relatively recent trend in Vygotskian science emerged in the 1990s. This trend is typically associated with growing dissatisfaction with the quality and scholarly integrity of available English translations of the texts of Vygotsky and members of Vygotsky Circle made from largely mistaken, distorted, and even in a few instances falsified Soviet editions, which raises serious concerns about the reliability of Vygotsky's texts available in English.[51] However, unlike critical literature that discusses Western interpretations of Vygotsky's legacy, the target of criticism and the primary object of research in the studies of the revisionist strand are Vygotsky's texts proper: the manuscripts, original lifetime publications, and Vygotsky's posthumous Soviet editions that most often were subsequently uncritically translated into other languages. The revisionist strand is solidly grounded in a series of studies in Vygotsky's archives that uncovered the previously unknown and unpublished Vygotsky's materials.

Thus, some studies of the revisionist strand show that certain phrases, terms, and expressions typically associated with Vygotskian legacy as its core notions and concepts—such as "cultural-historical psychology", "cultural-historical theory", "cultural-historical school", "higher psychical/mental functions", "internalization", "zone of proximal development", etc., -- in fact, either occupy not more than just a few dozen pages within the six-volume collection of Vygotsky’s works or even never occur in Vygotsky's own writings. Another series of studies revealed the questionable quality of Vygotsky's published texts that, in fact, were never finished and intended for publication by their author, but were nevertheless posthumously published without giving proper editorial acknowledgement of their unfinished, transitory nature and with numerous editorial interventions and distortions of Vygotsky's text. Another series of publications reveals that another well-known Vygotsky's text that is often presented as the foundational work was back-translated into Russian from an English translation of a lost original and passed for the original Vygotsky's writing. This episode was referred to as "benign forgery".

The entire text. This is some really deep shit about some really weird shit.

Greg
 
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Walk on stage after that preformance and say. I REST MY CASE! and than you take home the trophy
 
They had me at chocolate covered watermelons.


One would have to know the premise of the question/topic of debate. Those girls on fox seem to be well spoken. Lets go out on a limb here. I thought the limitation of presidential war powers was brought up as the topic of debate. So what if they were saying that one day in the distant future there could be a president from IDK, chicago or something. Who walked around just like how those folks were acting during the debate. If that was the case then surely their power must be limited.

By the way 2016 Obama is running for a 3rd term against Cornelius, from Planet of the Apes. I'm hoping the incumbent is unseated.
 
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What was THAT?!

Tomorrow`s Executive branch, thats what that was.


Like Mr Greg said a while ago, the sooner we let this stupidity completely take over, the sooner it will run itself into the ground. Hopefully there will be atleast a fraction of the American intelligentsia left to build it back up from the ashes.
 
The Intelligentsia is what got us into this mess.

Exactly my point. When I say intelligentsia, I mean people who are actually intelligent. People who, educated or not, understand that to be respected /feared by the rest of the world we will have to have a populace that knows how to do everything for itself. A populace that knows you gotta take a few licks to give a few licks. Businesses should NOT be bailed out when going bankrupt for one, let them fail. If a kid does something wrong, he should get whipped like the red-headed stepchild. Not to mention, when are people gonna realize we are in massive debt, and the debt is increasing by the second?

I didnt mean to imply the "everyone gets a trophy" professors. They are indeed part of the problem, I just dont consider them worthy of the title "intelligentsia". Not everyone should get a trophy. Only those who are putting in time on the books, putting in time on the weights, putting in time on the ball field, or best of all putting in time on the shooting range(lets hope marksmanship competition isnt invaded by the "it needs to be more fair for XXXX" crowd) should get trophies.


Needless to say when stuff like was shown in the video is allowed to flourish, American school systems aint gonna be producing any Albert Einsteins or Stephen Hawkings for years, or decades to come. Who cares though right? Even our great leader seems to endorse the "fact" that Lil Wayne is the person to look up to, not your father, or someone who came to fame in a profession less noble than hip-hop.
 
I would love to see the faces on a prep school debate team if these two were brought in to debate them.

I would surmise that the prep school debated team would be rendered speechless and those two lovely young ladies would win by default.