So I reloaded 150 9mm rounds for my bowling pin shoot I do on tuesdays. And got a call later in the week from a friend who wanted to use my shooting ground. After getting off the phone I started to cautiously load up 75-.308, 168gr a-max with 42.6gr varget weighing every load. Well the play day was here and I loaded my first round, touched off the trigger. 2878fps, but something felt funny. Tried to run the bolt... STUCK??!! Smacked the bolt with my palm... STUCK??!! To make a long story short, I DIDN'T MAKE SURE MY POWDER MEASURE DIDN"T HAVE ANY RESIDUAL PISTOL POWDER (autocomp)LEFT IN IT!!! There is a case stuck in the chamber. And upon trying to get the bolt to open, I snapped the bolt body. <another rookie mistake. and the bolt head (savage 10fp) is stuck in the action... Let the lashings commence.
- Thread starter TacT-MecH
- Start date
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Curious, I never imagined NOT dumping the powder measure out. Powder is soo expensive, I try to save every grain.
As to your accident, I don't think there is a reloading mistake that hasn't been made before. Glad yours did not end in injury.
Curious, I never imagined NOT dumping the powder measure out. Powder is soo expensive, I try to save every grain.
As to your accident, I don't think there is a reloading mistake that hasn't been made before. Glad yours did not end in injury.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt?
How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt?
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
At least you alive to tell the tale.....
At least you alive to tell the tale.....
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Assuming that there wasn't severe damage to the barrel/receiver.
If the bolt is "that stuck" there might have been some serious expansion in other areas, not just the case.
Cross Fingers.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Assuming that there wasn't severe damage to the barrel/receiver.
If the bolt is "that stuck" there might have been some serious expansion in other areas, not just the case.
Cross Fingers.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
I'm glad you're okay. It could've been much, much worse. Always, always, always empty your hopper right after you're done using it. NOT before the next batch of ammo. Then check it again for residual powder before you fill it again. I hope everything works out for you.
I'm glad you're okay. It could've been much, much worse. Always, always, always empty your hopper right after you're done using it. NOT before the next batch of ammo. Then check it again for residual powder before you fill it again. I hope everything works out for you.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
The hopper was empty. The rotary drum had some in it. (The part with the handle and adjustment micrometer). I got the barrel and receiver apart today. The barrel nut wouldn't come off so I fear the chamber was expanded. Also the extractor was "blown" down into the front action bolt hole. I had to tap it out to get the stuck bolt head to turn out. WHAT A MESS! DOH!! (smacking open palm on forehead)
The hopper was empty. The rotary drum had some in it. (The part with the handle and adjustment micrometer). I got the barrel and receiver apart today. The barrel nut wouldn't come off so I fear the chamber was expanded. Also the extractor was "blown" down into the front action bolt hole. I had to tap it out to get the stuck bolt head to turn out. WHAT A MESS! DOH!! (smacking open palm on forehead)
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Senna11</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and <span style="color: #FF0000">glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas</span>. </div></div>
Never heard this before.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Senna11</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sentry1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How does one deal with a stuck bolt, without wrecking the bolt? </div></div>
Unscrew the barrel. </div></div>
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and <span style="color: #FF0000">glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas</span>. </div></div>
Never heard this before.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hdbiker1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Senna11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and <span style="color: #FF0000">glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas</span>. </div></div>
Never heard this before. </div></div>
The 110 based actions has a couple of unique gas handling features not found on any other action. The front baffle, just behind the locking lugs diverts much of the gas through the two vent holes in the receiver ring. Any gas which gets past the front baffle is vented out the loading port. Gas or particles which make it all the way to the back of the action encounter the rear baffle which totally seals off the lug raceways and diverts gas to the side.
Gas which enters the bolt through the firing pin hole encounters a completely sealed rear of the bolt when it strikes the solid, unpierced bolt assembly screw. The latest 110's with the bottom bolt release compromise this last safeguard by piercing the BAS with the new cocking indicator. A step backwards for safety IMO.
Old Nick Brewer knew what he was doing with regard to gas handling.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hdbiker1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Senna11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Exactly right.
With a Savage it's easy and, the bolt assembly being made up of numerous separate parts, makes it cheap to replace just the parts damaged.
Glad you didn't get hurt and <span style="color: #FF0000">glad you were using a Savage as there is not a better action out there for handling any wayward gas</span>. </div></div>
Never heard this before. </div></div>
The 110 based actions has a couple of unique gas handling features not found on any other action. The front baffle, just behind the locking lugs diverts much of the gas through the two vent holes in the receiver ring. Any gas which gets past the front baffle is vented out the loading port. Gas or particles which make it all the way to the back of the action encounter the rear baffle which totally seals off the lug raceways and diverts gas to the side.
Gas which enters the bolt through the firing pin hole encounters a completely sealed rear of the bolt when it strikes the solid, unpierced bolt assembly screw. The latest 110's with the bottom bolt release compromise this last safeguard by piercing the BAS with the new cocking indicator. A step backwards for safety IMO.
Old Nick Brewer knew what he was doing with regard to gas handling.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fiveshotdot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So I reloaded 150 9mm rounds for my bowling pin shoot I do on tuesdays. And got a call later in the week from a friend who wanted to use my shooting ground. After getting off the phone I started to cautiously load up 75-.308, 168gr a-max with 42.6gr varget weighing every load. Well the play day was here and I loaded my first round, touched off the trigger. 2878fps, but something felt funny. Tried to run the bolt... STUCK??!! Smacked the bolt with my palm... STUCK??!! To make a long story short, I DIDN'T MAKE SURE MY POWDER MEASURE DIDN"T HAVE ANY RESIDUAL PISTOL POWDER (autocomp)LEFT IN IT!!! There is a case stuck in the chamber. And upon trying to get the bolt to open, I snapped the bolt body. <another rookie mistake. and the bolt head (savage 10fp) is stuck in the action... Let the lashings commence
Dont sweat it man. I dont care if your a reloading "genius" or not, EVERYBODY has screwed up at one time or another. Whether it be forgetting to prime, or seating an uncharged case, we've all done it. Sucks about your bolt though
.</div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fiveshotdot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So I reloaded 150 9mm rounds for my bowling pin shoot I do on tuesdays. And got a call later in the week from a friend who wanted to use my shooting ground. After getting off the phone I started to cautiously load up 75-.308, 168gr a-max with 42.6gr varget weighing every load. Well the play day was here and I loaded my first round, touched off the trigger. 2878fps, but something felt funny. Tried to run the bolt... STUCK??!! Smacked the bolt with my palm... STUCK??!! To make a long story short, I DIDN'T MAKE SURE MY POWDER MEASURE DIDN"T HAVE ANY RESIDUAL PISTOL POWDER (autocomp)LEFT IN IT!!! There is a case stuck in the chamber. And upon trying to get the bolt to open, I snapped the bolt body. <another rookie mistake. and the bolt head (savage 10fp) is stuck in the action... Let the lashings commence
Dont sweat it man. I dont care if your a reloading "genius" or not, EVERYBODY has screwed up at one time or another. Whether it be forgetting to prime, or seating an uncharged case, we've all done it. Sucks about your bolt though
.</div></div>
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Glad you're OK. Time to take some measurements to determine if there's been any irreparable damage.
Glad you're OK. Time to take some measurements to determine if there's been any irreparable damage.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Human error is natural. The good thing is we learn from the worst mistakes. I am now about 1/2" short of a left pinky because I was pissed off and trying to hurry loading ammo.
Can't hurry and do this stuff, mistakes can be very damaging.
Zach
Human error is natural. The good thing is we learn from the worst mistakes. I am now about 1/2" short of a left pinky because I was pissed off and trying to hurry loading ammo.
Can't hurry and do this stuff, mistakes can be very damaging.
Zach
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Glad to hear you weren't injured. I'm not as convinced as you are as to the cause of the overpressure round? Sure, it's possible as you have surmised but I would hate to assume that is what happened when it certainly could have other causes. Glad the integrity of the Savage kept you safe, if it was me, I'd review my entire reloading process......YMMV.
Glad to hear you weren't injured. I'm not as convinced as you are as to the cause of the overpressure round? Sure, it's possible as you have surmised but I would hate to assume that is what happened when it certainly could have other causes. Glad the integrity of the Savage kept you safe, if it was me, I'd review my entire reloading process......YMMV.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
You could take the barrel and have it magnafluxed.
You could take the barrel and have it magnafluxed.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
When you stick a case, you don't fuck around, LOL. Glad you're OK.
When you stick a case, you don't fuck around, LOL. Glad you're OK.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
fiveshotdot,
Hasn't been mentioned so far, but it sounds like quite a coincidence that the very first shot was the one case that got a does of the pistol powder, doesn't it? If you've still got those other 74 rounds stashed away someplace, I'd suggest pulling them down and completely re-doing them from the ground up. Better than going back to the same gunsmith, with the same gun, with the same problem shortly after he hands it back to you.
As far as being a "novice mistake," I know a commercial reloader who blew up not one, but TWO customers guns before they pulled the ammo off the shelves. An M16 (which is hard enough) and an AK-47, which is downright impressive! Talk about a mess you don't want any part of, that was the one. I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
Dump that ammo, just to make sure.
fiveshotdot,
Hasn't been mentioned so far, but it sounds like quite a coincidence that the very first shot was the one case that got a does of the pistol powder, doesn't it? If you've still got those other 74 rounds stashed away someplace, I'd suggest pulling them down and completely re-doing them from the ground up. Better than going back to the same gunsmith, with the same gun, with the same problem shortly after he hands it back to you.
As far as being a "novice mistake," I know a commercial reloader who blew up not one, but TWO customers guns before they pulled the ammo off the shelves. An M16 (which is hard enough) and an AK-47, which is downright impressive! Talk about a mess you don't want any part of, that was the one. I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
Dump that ammo, just to make sure.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
</div></div>
I'm surprised!
1) He had access to C-4.
2) When I was in the service we used to tear a small chunk off our blocks of C-4 to heat our food over.
It only exploded when subjected to an electrical charge.
3) Who intentionally "kabooms" AK's?
Just wonderin'
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
</div></div>
I'm surprised!
1) He had access to C-4.
2) When I was in the service we used to tear a small chunk off our blocks of C-4 to heat our food over.
It only exploded when subjected to an electrical charge.
3) Who intentionally "kabooms" AK's?
Just wonderin'
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Maj. John Plaster, who was with SOG at the time. They were stuck with the task of destroying large caches of VC and NVA ammo when they ran across them, and there's frankly just no good way to do that. Explosives merely scattered the ammo, and actually damaged/destroyed just a few that were close to the charge. They (the bad guys) picked it up, sorted through the damaged rounds and were right back in business. What they finally hit on, was shear genius. They got dies and a press sent from stateside, and started experimenting with what it took to consistently destroy an AK. The answer was, a full case of C-4. They loaded large amounts of the stuff, and when a cache was found, would meticulously salt these rounds in the magazines and clips throughout the bulk of the ammo. After that, they covered the evidence of the cache being discovered, leaving it exactly as they found it. This didn't destroy the ammo, but it made it virtually unusable, since Charlie now was playing Russian roulette with every mag. They pulled some other dirty tricks after this got rolling, really brilliant psy-ops games that left the VC and NVA troops doubting the quality of their ammo from their Chinese comrades. I think he's written about this in one of his books, but I can't say for sure. Interesting guy, to say the least.
Maj. John Plaster, who was with SOG at the time. They were stuck with the task of destroying large caches of VC and NVA ammo when they ran across them, and there's frankly just no good way to do that. Explosives merely scattered the ammo, and actually damaged/destroyed just a few that were close to the charge. They (the bad guys) picked it up, sorted through the damaged rounds and were right back in business. What they finally hit on, was shear genius. They got dies and a press sent from stateside, and started experimenting with what it took to consistently destroy an AK. The answer was, a full case of C-4. They loaded large amounts of the stuff, and when a cache was found, would meticulously salt these rounds in the magazines and clips throughout the bulk of the ammo. After that, they covered the evidence of the cache being discovered, leaving it exactly as they found it. This didn't destroy the ammo, but it made it virtually unusable, since Charlie now was playing Russian roulette with every mag. They pulled some other dirty tricks after this got rolling, really brilliant psy-ops games that left the VC and NVA troops doubting the quality of their ammo from their Chinese comrades. I think he's written about this in one of his books, but I can't say for sure. Interesting guy, to say the least.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
All the rounds have been pulled. About half way through most of the pistol powder had dwindled to about 2-7 granules of powder per round(of course trailing as I got closer to the end of the batch). This lesson, although a pain in the ars, was learned, duly noted, and not soon forgotten. I now have a powder dispenser for pistol and one for rifle (as well as a Dillon sdb, and a 550 for rifle) so this is not likely to happen again. Thanks to all for the kind words and condolences (may the 10fp rest in pieces). And thanks for interesting history lesson.
All the rounds have been pulled. About half way through most of the pistol powder had dwindled to about 2-7 granules of powder per round(of course trailing as I got closer to the end of the batch). This lesson, although a pain in the ars, was learned, duly noted, and not soon forgotten. I now have a powder dispenser for pistol and one for rifle (as well as a Dillon sdb, and a 550 for rifle) so this is not likely to happen again. Thanks to all for the kind words and condolences (may the 10fp rest in pieces). And thanks for interesting history lesson.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
thank goodness you weren't hurt
thank goodness you weren't hurt
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
Thanks for sharing this story, I can see how easy it is to happen with how I have been reloading and am going to adjust to make sure it never happens to me.
Thanks for sharing this story, I can see how easy it is to happen with how I have been reloading and am going to adjust to make sure it never happens to me.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
The only place I see that I went wrong was, I didn't take the drum apart( 1 screw) or have separate powder measures. If I had done either of those 2 things my rifle would still be intact. I am a very cautious reloader, this time I made one oversight and it cost me big time. It will be the last of its kind coming from my reloading room. I can promise you all that. I am planning on purchasing a new action and brux barrel and chambering in 260 REM. I already have a hs precision stock bottom metal, 20moa and 0motps steel scope bases.
The only place I see that I went wrong was, I didn't take the drum apart( 1 screw) or have separate powder measures. If I had done either of those 2 things my rifle would still be intact. I am a very cautious reloader, this time I made one oversight and it cost me big time. It will be the last of its kind coming from my reloading room. I can promise you all that. I am planning on purchasing a new action and brux barrel and chambering in 260 REM. I already have a hs precision stock bottom metal, 20moa and 0motps steel scope bases.
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
Hasn't been mentioned so far, but it sounds like quite a coincidence that the very first shot was the one case that got a does of the pistol powder, doesn't it? If you've still got those other 74 rounds stashed away someplace, I'd suggest pulling them down and completely re-doing them from the ground up. Better than going back to the same gunsmith, with the same gun, with the same problem shortly after he hands it back to you.
As far as being a "novice mistake," I know a commercial reloader who blew up not one, but TWO customers guns before they pulled the ammo off the shelves. An M16 (which is hard enough) and an AK-47, which is downright impressive! Talk about a mess you don't want any part of, that was the one. I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
Dump that ammo, just to make sure. </div></div>
PETN works even better
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
Hasn't been mentioned so far, but it sounds like quite a coincidence that the very first shot was the one case that got a does of the pistol powder, doesn't it? If you've still got those other 74 rounds stashed away someplace, I'd suggest pulling them down and completely re-doing them from the ground up. Better than going back to the same gunsmith, with the same gun, with the same problem shortly after he hands it back to you.
As far as being a "novice mistake," I know a commercial reloader who blew up not one, but TWO customers guns before they pulled the ammo off the shelves. An M16 (which is hard enough) and an AK-47, which is downright impressive! Talk about a mess you don't want any part of, that was the one. I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
Dump that ammo, just to make sure. </div></div>
PETN works even better
Re: Expensive Novice Mistake
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sudden Impact</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
</div></div>
I'm surprised!
1) He had access to C-4.
2) When I was in the service we used to tear a small chunk off our blocks of C-4 to heat our food over.
It only exploded when subjected to an electrical charge.
3) Who intentionally "kabooms" AK's?
Just wonderin' </div></div>
Heat and pressure are required to detonate C4... you can burn it all day and nothing will happen. It's stable enough that you can even shoot it... although I don't recommend trying it (you never know what kind of freak thing can happen).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sudden Impact</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kevin Thomas</div><div class="ubbcode-body">fiveshotdot,
I have a friend who blew up a number of AKs, but he had to load the ammo with C-4 to do so (yes, it was deliberate).
</div></div>
I'm surprised!
1) He had access to C-4.
2) When I was in the service we used to tear a small chunk off our blocks of C-4 to heat our food over.
It only exploded when subjected to an electrical charge.
3) Who intentionally "kabooms" AK's?
Just wonderin' </div></div>
Heat and pressure are required to detonate C4... you can burn it all day and nothing will happen. It's stable enough that you can even shoot it... although I don't recommend trying it (you never know what kind of freak thing can happen).
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