- Thread starter TheOtherAndrew
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I'd rather see a policy change rather replacing one drug for another.
well yeah of course its better to live drug free....point is that isn't reality today - China/MCartel/Fentanyl is absolutely winning. How do you truly reverse the pendulum given the landscape today?
thought stems from THC deaths over millennia - much better than fentanyl OD like right away.
Convincing a true drug addict in his prime that he is wrong and needs a new path then following thru with all of that is not going to happen. You need to coax them with for instance potency numbers (unknown is how different is THC from THC2-5 on human body/behavior. But it's a drug that is not in circulation there is no market So you do it right and you can cut the desire for fentanyl at consumer level and that always works back to the producer.
Is it the absolute best front to back? No
Is it better than current trajectory of fentanyl BS? I have a belief so.
Would it wreak havoc on some very bad intentioned people?
Would it shift power away from the people who truly desire to harm America?
Would it even be illegal in say CO?
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has potential IMO.
thought stems from THC deaths over millennia - much better than fentanyl OD like right away.
Convincing a true drug addict in his prime that he is wrong and needs a new path then following thru with all of that is not going to happen. You need to coax them with for instance potency numbers (unknown is how different is THC from THC2-5 on human body/behavior. But it's a drug that is not in circulation there is no market So you do it right and you can cut the desire for fentanyl at consumer level and that always works back to the producer.
Is it the absolute best front to back? No
Is it better than current trajectory of fentanyl BS? I have a belief so.
Would it wreak havoc on some very bad intentioned people?
Would it shift power away from the people who truly desire to harm America?
Would it even be illegal in say CO?
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has potential IMO.
I get that.
What is your proposal to make any significant dent? 'forget about it they're all stupid anyway let the scoundrels do their thing.' or wait n see...write a new law? You have to understand it isn't the consumers driving this bus.
What is your proposal to make any significant dent? 'forget about it they're all stupid anyway let the scoundrels do their thing.' or wait n see...write a new law? You have to understand it isn't the consumers driving this bus.
Well you were the one that posted a paper from the '60s when it was illegal worldwide to do any real studies on....well...THC.
This lame ass wiki page has 5 times the info, and more to the point, accurate info, than that shitty ass old junk you posted.
Tetrahydrocannabinol - Wikipedia
Do you really think a OPIOID junky that is doing fentanyl (which is incredibly strong BTW) would settle for weak ass weed ?
There's about a 20,000 percent difference in effect there, and nothing to quell the jonesing of an addict.
You tell me....who's the dumb ass mofo around here ?
I suppose me right? Did it escape you that [pictured] is the first page of ~140?
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So, if people have something other than fentanyl to get high on, they will stop using fentanyl?
at a higher rate than with no new alternatives - yes
Is this like telling an alcoholic to drink beer vice whiskey.
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at the consumer level it is pretty much yes.
It's a real answer. It's an absolute fact that where weed has become legal, overdoses drop off significantly.
There are a plethora of new issues that pop up with legal weed, but they are probably less severe than dead needle addicts laying in ditches, as well as the intentional and or unintentional collateral damage caused by fentanyl. THC is habit forming, (I won't hear anyone say otherwise), but it isn't addictive.
If the question is as simple as: weed or heroin? The answer is simple.
I'm still puzzled by the people who stand around smoking cigarettes, drinking coffee 12 hours a day followed by a half liter of whiskey before bed who talk about how opposed to drugs they are. You just mean the drugs that you were told were bad, not the drugs they told you were cool.
There are a plethora of new issues that pop up with legal weed, but they are probably less severe than dead needle addicts laying in ditches, as well as the intentional and or unintentional collateral damage caused by fentanyl. THC is habit forming, (I won't hear anyone say otherwise), but it isn't addictive.
If the question is as simple as: weed or heroin? The answer is simple.
I'm still puzzled by the people who stand around smoking cigarettes, drinking coffee 12 hours a day followed by a half liter of whiskey before bed who talk about how opposed to drugs they are. You just mean the drugs that you were told were bad, not the drugs they told you were cool.
I can tell you exactly how to do it.
Legalize all of it.
Recognize that enshrined in our Constitution is the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If your in pain, its your right to stop your pain, or just get high if you want to. Those rights are unalienable. Period.
Most of the problems with any 'drug' is that because theyre illegal, people have to go to unreliable sources, and get garbage or poison that kills them. If they could go to the pharmacy and buy pure products that were measured and calibrated to their body weight they wouldn have nearly the problem It would eliminate most tf the crime associated. The 'stupids' as you call them would off themselves and leave a better place for all.
Legalize all of it Its your right.
what he saidI don’t know about your 1968 chemistry report but total legalization with a focus on harm reduction seems like a better choice.
Oregon tried it. The results have not been good. Mostly due to treatment not being available for those that want it but in part because it caused a flood of new users to go to Oregon.
I mean, I actually agree with you. It should all be legal and the government shouldn’t be involved. Small government is a good thing,
I never tried opiates but I doubt it will help people already addicted very much. might help if they smoke pot before they are addicted because they'll be too lazy to go out to look for hard drugs.
NOpe, different things. I have a prescription for dialudid (if you saw the MRI of my neck youd know why, The physician winced when he looked at it, LOL). It stops the pain temporarily, lets you sleep, and you feel good for a day or two. But because it makes you feel 'Good' you need to be very careful about addiction.
I dont use cannabis anymore, but its not nearly as good at pain relief, which is most people are looking for even if they dont consciously know it. Cannibis has other good uses, but I havent found pain relief to really be one of them.
It would lower crime in that theatre. at least in part because people wouldnt have to associate with the 'criminal element' to get thier stuff, what ever it might be. Also, legally, it would reduce the price.
in the long run there is no silver bullet
Let me add that anything can be abused.
I know a woman who drinks at leas two pots of coffee a day. If she doesnt get her fix she cant function, goes into a form of withdrawl, and you dont want to be near her. That's addiction.. You should see her teeth.
I know a woman who drinks at leas two pots of coffee a day. If she doesnt get her fix she cant function, goes into a form of withdrawl, and you dont want to be near her. That's addiction.. You should see her teeth.
Sober, Willie Nelson can be a bit of a pill. Drunk Willie is a mean asshole.
He found the magic ingredient with marriage-a-wanna. With that, he is calm and focused and a pleasure to be around. So, different people react differently to the same thing.
Beer puts pounds on me.
Wine gives me a headache.
Not interested in the psychedelics.
Mota (marijuana) makes me sleepy and dizzy.
Whiskey (with a soda chaser) calms me down and I can still concentrate. I drink more of the chaser. And I eat. So, I don't get falling down drunk or sick.
Gave up cigarettes years ago. Barely touch the vape. But I smoked cigarettes from 05-25-1982 to 01-28-2018.
So, things can change in life. One of my bosses is 2 years younger than me and he smoked probably a little longer. And he quit cold turkey.
Yeah, youre (mostly) correct.
I quit alcohol for years in the 70' because it brought out a lot of violence. I almost cut by best friends throat with a broken beer bottle because he gave me the wrong shit the wrong time. Just walked away. Now I enjoy the occasional drink with no problems.
The hard drugs, opiates, meth, crack, fentanyl blow, generally seem to have very similar effects on folks. If youre in bad (emotional) space the, drugs tend to make it worse.
Quit tobacco circa 83 and never looked back.
Dont take this wrong but you dont understand addiction at all. No opiod user is going to switch to thc unless its for legit medical uses. Once youre physically addicted to opiods youre fucked and only absence will work. Things like suboxone help some but most its just a switch until they relapse. I fully believe thc and weed have true medicinal power but not here
And there's tolerance, which is different than addiction. When I first got the dialauid prescription 2mg would do the job. After years it takes 4 mg to do the same. As long as youre aware of what youre doing and careful, its not a problem. I use it about once every two weeks just to get a good nights rest.
You have a pretty good understanding of this, thanks for sharing. No one wants to be addicted, but when youre in pain long enough you'll do what it takes to not hurt.
Years ago you could go th the pharmacy and buy laudnum, opiate wine, and there was very little addiction problem Then...DEA.
As usual, some will compare/call this a disease.
Last I checked folks with diseases didn't choose to have it.
The mommy bone is strong in some.
I'd say this is part of how we have gotten here.
Personal responsibility is at the core of an ass load of societal problems.
The more you remove the more you'll get of things like this.
I'd be all for full legalization of the entire ass load of stupid shit people want to use.
The caveat being not a fucking red cent of my tax dollars, or anyone else's, can be used to bail out those hell bent on self destruction.
You'll never sell this to the modern "mothers" of society.
As such, no fucking way.
Free narcan is just one example of the above ideals.
Do you think that has lead to less ODs?
R
Last I checked folks with diseases didn't choose to have it.
The mommy bone is strong in some.
I'd say this is part of how we have gotten here.
Personal responsibility is at the core of an ass load of societal problems.
The more you remove the more you'll get of things like this.
I'd be all for full legalization of the entire ass load of stupid shit people want to use.
The caveat being not a fucking red cent of my tax dollars, or anyone else's, can be used to bail out those hell bent on self destruction.
You'll never sell this to the modern "mothers" of society.
As such, no fucking way.
Free narcan is just one example of the above ideals.
Do you think that has lead to less ODs?
R
If you can continue like that youll probably be fine forever but god forbid what ever happens to the body when someone becomes physically addicted theres no going back. You cant quit for months then take it 2 days in a row and youre right back to where you where. The sad part is a ton of user are addicted because the doctors used to give out vicodin and Percocet like tylenol. Now we have the opposite effect where people in real pain cant get a script becuase the doctors are terrified to get people hooked. Its a mess and i feel for everyone wrapped up in it.
Its definitely a disease theres no argument there from anyone who knows anything about it. The most important aspect of getting well is accepting responsibility. Im for full legalization also but then how is government going to justify breaking into so many houses and cars and those big budgets. Itll never happen
YOu cant imagine (maybe you can) the hoops I have to jump through to get mine. Piss test everytime I go in.
The pharma reps were paying doctors big money to hand it out like candy. Stubbed your toe> Oxy. Feeling down? Oxy. Pee'd your pants? Osy.
Its not so much theyre afraid of getting people addicted, theyre afraid of the DEA jerking their license.
I was a teenager in the 60's and watched this emerge. Went by a guys house one morning to score some weed and he was sitting in his rocker on the porch blue, the needle still in his hand.
Tried it many years ago.
What true psychedelics do is allow you to get to the source of the problem...where ever that may be buried. One you find the root you can cut it and get better
"You shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free. Jesus of Nazareth.
I’ve only don’t them a few times and it was strictly for a good time, no therapeutic reason. Yes, it was a blast. I sat on my couch, watched standup comedy and giggled all night
yes yes because chemistry was so elusive in the 1960's...
what is this an arms race - who's done the most of the bad stuff?...yeah I have zero clue about addiction
I was referring to how other ppl view [drug addicts] - I don't believe they are stupid
Legalize everything. Make narcan illegal. Problem solved.
I disagree with that statement somewhat. Do obese people not choose diabetes? Do smokers not choose lung or other types of cancer? Do masterbaters not choose to go blind?
@Rthur
I dont disagree, Many who get addicted do it out of carelessness or stupidity, but far from all. You need to understand that diseases are not only physical. some are emotional, or psychosomatic. Those arent chosen and are far more difficult to treat than the physical ones with clear symptoms.
I'd disagree to some degree with Koala, One chooses what they put in their mouths to causse obesity and diabetes. That aslo cab be a psychosomatic disturbance.
Its not a simple nor not silver bullet solution.
Correct but those disturbances can also lead an individual to drug use. We point at the drug user and shame them but not the fat ass that needs insulin or the smoker who's carrying an oxygen tank with them.
From the article:
"The letter states that “since the implementation of Measure 110, all drug overdoses rose 61%1 and fentanyl overdoses rose nearly 600%,” citing testimony from Public Health Director at the Oregon Health Authority Rachael Banks.
Banks gave testimony at the House Committee on Behavioral Health and Health Care in January, saying “fentanyl overdose deaths increased nearly 600% between 2019 and 2021 and has now surpassed methamphetamine as the most frequent drug involved in overdose deaths.”"
Multiple counties are working toward repealing 110, both due to increased ODs and the associated rise in crimes that support the addicts.
No. Either is alcohol. Weed and Fentanyl are two different things and only one causes an OD.
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