Fill up today
- Thread starter Tunanut
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Re: Fill up today
Diesel around here is pushing $3.85 as of yesterday. It'll be $4.00 by the end of the month.
Diesel around here is pushing $3.85 as of yesterday. It'll be $4.00 by the end of the month.
Re: Fill up today
Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices.
Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently?
Re: Fill up today
what quantities are you talking about Gents, per gallon ? If so, think yourself lucky. A gallon costs near $7 here.
what quantities are you talking about Gents, per gallon ? If so, think yourself lucky. A gallon costs near $7 here.
Re: Fill up today
I think word is already out . I went to the gas station last night and every pump was backed up with customers . Pump was running so slow it took me 20 minutes to get 23 gallons
I think word is already out . I went to the gas station last night and every pump was backed up with customers . Pump was running so slow it took me 20 minutes to get 23 gallons
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently? </div></div>
Not looking for an arguement and I KNOW what the practice is in petroleum which is immediately increasing the price of what you have on hand, don't mean I agree with it. I worked at and was assistant manager and then manager of an LP coop for 19+ yrs and our needed profit was set on what we had on hand, NOT what we were buying in the next couple of weeks!! If needed our price increased after the higher priced product was actually in our tanks, not in a pipeline 1000 miles away. We reduced price accordingly as we diluted higher priced product! Oh, and yes, we made money every year I was manager!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently? </div></div>
Not looking for an arguement and I KNOW what the practice is in petroleum which is immediately increasing the price of what you have on hand, don't mean I agree with it. I worked at and was assistant manager and then manager of an LP coop for 19+ yrs and our needed profit was set on what we had on hand, NOT what we were buying in the next couple of weeks!! If needed our price increased after the higher priced product was actually in our tanks, not in a pipeline 1000 miles away. We reduced price accordingly as we diluted higher priced product! Oh, and yes, we made money every year I was manager!
Re: Fill up today
New Jersey is chock full of commies and has lower add on taxes than Wyoming.
Arizona and Alabama are hardly commie states and they tax both gas and diesel higher.
Montana must be over run with commies from the look of their tax surcharge!
Might be another reason.
New Jersey is chock full of commies and has lower add on taxes than Wyoming.
Arizona and Alabama are hardly commie states and they tax both gas and diesel higher.
Montana must be over run with commies from the look of their tax surcharge!
Might be another reason.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently? </div></div>
Not looking for an arguement and I KNOW what the practice is in petroleum which is immediately increasing the price of what you have on hand, don't mean I agree with it. I worked at and was assistant manager and then manager of an LP coop for 19+ yrs and our needed profit was set on what we had on hand, NOT what we were buying in the next couple of weeks!! If needed our price increased after the higher priced product was actually in our tanks, not in a pipeline 1000 miles away. We reduced price accordingly as we diluted higher priced product! Oh, and yes, we made money every year I was manager! </div></div>
So how often do you think stations buy gas? Three tankers a week for me. That means I can't go more than two or three days without incurring market increases, and I'm not a high volume station. High volume store get a tanker or two daily. I'll bet dollars to donuts that the credit card companies are making more per gallon than the stations pumping the gas. 48.5 cent road tax in NC on gas; 55.5 cents on diesel. Credit card company making about 12 cents/gal. I make a nickle.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SDWhirlwind</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Went up a nickel here yesterday even though neither of the 2 stations bought any!! Now $3.25 minus the 1/10 that they seem to feel necessary. Diesel I see on their sign was $3.70. Just heard on CNN they are talking $150Bbl @ NYSE. Yippeeeeeeee Another summer of setting home because of gas prices. </div></div>
It is not uncommon to sell inventory at replacement costs in order to have enough cash to replace the inventory that gets sold. Do you run your business differently? </div></div>
Not looking for an arguement and I KNOW what the practice is in petroleum which is immediately increasing the price of what you have on hand, don't mean I agree with it. I worked at and was assistant manager and then manager of an LP coop for 19+ yrs and our needed profit was set on what we had on hand, NOT what we were buying in the next couple of weeks!! If needed our price increased after the higher priced product was actually in our tanks, not in a pipeline 1000 miles away. We reduced price accordingly as we diluted higher priced product! Oh, and yes, we made money every year I was manager! </div></div>
So how often do you think stations buy gas? Three tankers a week for me. That means I can't go more than two or three days without incurring market increases, and I'm not a high volume station. High volume store get a tanker or two daily. I'll bet dollars to donuts that the credit card companies are making more per gallon than the stations pumping the gas. 48.5 cent road tax in NC on gas; 55.5 cents on diesel. Credit card company making about 12 cents/gal. I make a nickle.
Re: Fill up today
Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
. I wish they would ban the futures market, all it does is drive up the cost of fuel. If they are going to buy oil, they should be REQUIRED to take physical control of that oil. Not just sell in the next couple of hours after they drive the prices up.
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either.
Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
. I wish they would ban the futures market, all it does is drive up the cost of fuel. If they are going to buy oil, they should be REQUIRED to take physical control of that oil. Not just sell in the next couple of hours after they drive the prices up.
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either. </div></div>
I couldn't agree more. If you're not involved in the manufacture, distribution, blending, storing or an end user of oil products, you shouldn't be allowed to drive the price up. It would made it a more supply/demand commodity. Instead we have unneccessary price increases based on speculation of hedge funds and gazzilionares. We could screw them hard if we stopped buying. We are currently at a full supply level in most depot across the country, so it's safe to say that these increase are based soley on speculation, not a actual disruption in supply.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either. </div></div>
I couldn't agree more. If you're not involved in the manufacture, distribution, blending, storing or an end user of oil products, you shouldn't be allowed to drive the price up. It would made it a more supply/demand commodity. Instead we have unneccessary price increases based on speculation of hedge funds and gazzilionares. We could screw them hard if we stopped buying. We are currently at a full supply level in most depot across the country, so it's safe to say that these increase are based soley on speculation, not a actual disruption in supply.
Re: Fill up today
Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
. I wish they would ban the futures market, all it does is drive up the cost of fuel. If they are going to buy oil, they should be REQUIRED to take physical control of that oil. Not just sell in the next couple of hours after they drive the prices up.
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either. </div></div>
I couldn't agree more. If you're not involved in the manufacture, distribution, blending, storing or an end user of oil products, you shouldn't be allowed to drive the price up. It would made it a more supply/demand commodity. Instead we have unneccessary price increases based on speculation of hedge funds and gazzilionares. We could screw them hard if we stopped buying. We are currently at a full supply level in most depot across the country, so it's safe to say that these increase are based soley on speculation, not a actual disruption in supply.</div></div>
Exactly, whoever buys a contract should have to also take delivery of it. Bet that would stop that shit fast.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tunanut</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glad I dont have to leave my house to go to work
Someone said on the news $200 crude by summer! Guess what, we arent gonna drill either. </div></div>
I couldn't agree more. If you're not involved in the manufacture, distribution, blending, storing or an end user of oil products, you shouldn't be allowed to drive the price up. It would made it a more supply/demand commodity. Instead we have unneccessary price increases based on speculation of hedge funds and gazzilionares. We could screw them hard if we stopped buying. We are currently at a full supply level in most depot across the country, so it's safe to say that these increase are based soley on speculation, not a actual disruption in supply.</div></div>
Exactly, whoever buys a contract should have to also take delivery of it. Bet that would stop that shit fast.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: M25BeastShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? </div></div>
I'm not gonna go all political because I like hanging out here, but your last sentence doesn't make sense on at least 2 levels. First of all, you strung together a bunch of words in a near-incoherent question. Second of all, if you think that voting <span style="font-style: italic">for</span> America involves putting all our eggs into the oil basket, you're looking at the wrong chicken.
Even if we could become self-supplied with oil, there's only a limited amount available. That means it'll eventually run out. Unless we start putting our money toward creating renewable energy, our kids, grandkids, or great grandkids are going to have neither clean water nor land to live from. I don't know about the America you're voting for, but I try to support the America that's going to set an example for the rest of the world and give my family resources to enjoy that are at least as good if not better than what I've grown up with. I want my posterity to be able to enjoy the outdoors, raise a healthy garden, hunt, fish, and be able to eat what they harvest. If you don't, then we obviously have different ideas of what it means to be Americans.
I'm also sick of the fear-mongering "if we don't create jobs in oil, unemployment's going to skyrocket" point of view. Here's a newsflash - if we don't create and keep Americans in agricultural jobs (both by buying American, or better yet, local produce; and not killing the earth we get life from) we're going to be even more at the mercy of the foreign countries. If we don't create jobs supporting and creating renewable sources, America is going to be on its knees in front of the rest of the world begging for help. The longer we pour money into temporary oil for temporary profits, the further down the hole we go.
Also, it really sucks that gas is going up again.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: M25BeastShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? </div></div>
I'm not gonna go all political because I like hanging out here, but your last sentence doesn't make sense on at least 2 levels. First of all, you strung together a bunch of words in a near-incoherent question. Second of all, if you think that voting <span style="font-style: italic">for</span> America involves putting all our eggs into the oil basket, you're looking at the wrong chicken.
Even if we could become self-supplied with oil, there's only a limited amount available. That means it'll eventually run out. Unless we start putting our money toward creating renewable energy, our kids, grandkids, or great grandkids are going to have neither clean water nor land to live from. I don't know about the America you're voting for, but I try to support the America that's going to set an example for the rest of the world and give my family resources to enjoy that are at least as good if not better than what I've grown up with. I want my posterity to be able to enjoy the outdoors, raise a healthy garden, hunt, fish, and be able to eat what they harvest. If you don't, then we obviously have different ideas of what it means to be Americans.
I'm also sick of the fear-mongering "if we don't create jobs in oil, unemployment's going to skyrocket" point of view. Here's a newsflash - if we don't create and keep Americans in agricultural jobs (both by buying American, or better yet, local produce; and not killing the earth we get life from) we're going to be even more at the mercy of the foreign countries. If we don't create jobs supporting and creating renewable sources, America is going to be on its knees in front of the rest of the world begging for help. The longer we pour money into temporary oil for temporary profits, the further down the hole we go.
Also, it really sucks that gas is going up again.
Re: Fill up today
[/quote]
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? [/quote]
Someone is looking to get a Lowlight vacation!!!! I learned after a 7day vacation and mine wasn't even as blatant!!
[/quote]
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? [/quote]
Someone is looking to get a Lowlight vacation!!!! I learned after a 7day vacation and mine wasn't even as blatant!!
Re: Fill up today
Oil prices are not static it's a resource that bears the cost the market is willing to pay for it.
The free market defines the cost of oil currently, and if it were any cheaper China would just be creating more oil consumers rapidly enough to allow for more effective depletion of the remaining supply.
Personally, I think it's time to invest heavily in advancing and industrializing replacement technologies for energy generation.
America can either set the new world energy paradigm, or we can wait until someone else does, and purchase it from them at top dollar we're unlikely to still have.
I personally have vested interests in oil financially, but I would be thrilled if it became relegated entirely to plastics and pharmaceuticals overnight.
Oil prices are not static it's a resource that bears the cost the market is willing to pay for it.
The free market defines the cost of oil currently, and if it were any cheaper China would just be creating more oil consumers rapidly enough to allow for more effective depletion of the remaining supply.
Personally, I think it's time to invest heavily in advancing and industrializing replacement technologies for energy generation.
America can either set the new world energy paradigm, or we can wait until someone else does, and purchase it from them at top dollar we're unlikely to still have.
I personally have vested interests in oil financially, but I would be thrilled if it became relegated entirely to plastics and pharmaceuticals overnight.
Re: Fill up today
Spazz, its estimated, with population growth taken into account, we have enough oil under the USA to last for 200yrs, plus whats in the artic.
I do agree though, if we dont invest heavy in Ag, we are going to be in trouble, if Ag keeps getting regulated like it has been. Its not going to be pretty, food will skyrocket. Take a look at the price of beef lately? 400lb calves are selling right now @ $1.75, they were around $1.05 or so this time last year. They wont be killed until they hit 1250. In the next year, we are going to see beef go through the roof exponetially.
Spazz, its estimated, with population growth taken into account, we have enough oil under the USA to last for 200yrs, plus whats in the artic.
I do agree though, if we dont invest heavy in Ag, we are going to be in trouble, if Ag keeps getting regulated like it has been. Its not going to be pretty, food will skyrocket. Take a look at the price of beef lately? 400lb calves are selling right now @ $1.75, they were around $1.05 or so this time last year. They wont be killed until they hit 1250. In the next year, we are going to see beef go through the roof exponetially.
Re: Fill up today
Well the last time gas hit $4.25 here the economy went to shit. Gives you something to look forward to again.
Well the last time gas hit $4.25 here the economy went to shit. Gives you something to look forward to again.
Re: Fill up today
hamr-
was a bit busy today. The source I cite is Tax Foundation in its april 1 2010 report on STATE taxes. Where did you get yours?
Now I cite the state portion only as thats what the local 'commies' can control.
So lets look-
Wyoming adds 14 cents
New Jersey adds 14.5 cents why those commie bastards!
Alabama long known as a hotbed of socialism adds 20.9
Idaho adds 25 cents
Montana, another hardcore state of Castro worshippers adds 27.8 cents
Buts its decadent North Carolina with its 30.2 cents in STATE tax per gallon that really has sold decent Americans out.
Actually I dont see the relationship between state taxes on gas and the number of evile commies at work in your or any other state.
But it was a good kneejerk anti-commie rant to toss in on some gas price rise.
Thank you for your input.
hamr-
was a bit busy today. The source I cite is Tax Foundation in its april 1 2010 report on STATE taxes. Where did you get yours?
Now I cite the state portion only as thats what the local 'commies' can control.
So lets look-
Wyoming adds 14 cents
New Jersey adds 14.5 cents why those commie bastards!
Alabama long known as a hotbed of socialism adds 20.9
Idaho adds 25 cents
Montana, another hardcore state of Castro worshippers adds 27.8 cents
Buts its decadent North Carolina with its 30.2 cents in STATE tax per gallon that really has sold decent Americans out.
Actually I dont see the relationship between state taxes on gas and the number of evile commies at work in your or any other state.
But it was a good kneejerk anti-commie rant to toss in on some gas price rise.
Thank you for your input.
Re: Fill up today
I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan
I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan
Re: Fill up today
Fucking gas prices, they really like to stick it peoples ass's dont they. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
Fucking gas prices, they really like to stick it peoples ass's dont they. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Spazz, its estimated, with population growth taken into account, we have enough oil under the USA to last for 200yrs, plus whats in the artic.</div></div>
This seems like a very simplistic and misleading figure to me. 200 years may include a significant amount of oil that's incredibly expensive and inefficient to access. I'm all but certain this is including shale estimates, which aren't going to be near as cheap as light sweet crude. To some degree it's going to boil down to energy in vs energy out.
That's why we have so much oil left currently. It was more profitable to use other oil first.
It doesn't solve our dilemma.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ubet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Spazz, its estimated, with population growth taken into account, we have enough oil under the USA to last for 200yrs, plus whats in the artic.</div></div>
This seems like a very simplistic and misleading figure to me. 200 years may include a significant amount of oil that's incredibly expensive and inefficient to access. I'm all but certain this is including shale estimates, which aren't going to be near as cheap as light sweet crude. To some degree it's going to boil down to energy in vs energy out.
That's why we have so much oil left currently. It was more profitable to use other oil first.
It doesn't solve our dilemma.
Re: Fill up today
How the hell else is BP and 'Petro Inc' going to pay for the mess in the Gulf? They ain't gonna lose money over it
How the hell else is BP and 'Petro Inc' going to pay for the mess in the Gulf? They ain't gonna lose money over it
Re: Fill up today
I think we should raise the fines on BP! It is like a backdoor tax BP pays the Govt money, and we pay it off in higher gas prices... seems backwards for all the folks calling for BP to be fined heavy
I think we should raise the fines on BP! It is like a backdoor tax BP pays the Govt money, and we pay it off in higher gas prices... seems backwards for all the folks calling for BP to be fined heavy
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Soon we will be reading once again where Exxon had record earnings... </div></div>
That's the part I remember too!
I've said it before-with as much American blood as there is in the middle eastern sand we should have hot and cold running unleaded at our houses......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Soon we will be reading once again where Exxon had record earnings... </div></div>
That's the part I remember too!
I've said it before-with as much American blood as there is in the middle eastern sand we should have hot and cold running unleaded at our houses......
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Susan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan</div></div>
Well said..........And the $200 dollar per barrel answer is ? <span style="color: #FF0000">GREED!!!
</span> Pandimonium or hype is a chance for greedy people to jack prices up because they can!
I could tell you one hundred ways that the whole system is screwed up or twisted for the gain of a few but the simplist way to sum it up is just corruption, power and greed.
....SmokeRolls
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Susan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan</div></div>
Well said..........And the $200 dollar per barrel answer is ? <span style="color: #FF0000">GREED!!!
</span> Pandimonium or hype is a chance for greedy people to jack prices up because they can!
I could tell you one hundred ways that the whole system is screwed up or twisted for the gain of a few but the simplist way to sum it up is just corruption, power and greed.
....SmokeRolls
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: M25BeastShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? </div></div>
I'm not gonna go all political because I like hanging out here, but your last sentence doesn't make sense on at least 2 levels. First of all, you strung together a bunch of words in a near-incoherent question. Second of all, if you think that voting <span style="font-style: italic">for</span> America involves putting all our eggs into the oil basket, you're looking at the wrong chicken.
Even if we could become self-supplied with oil, there's only a limited amount available. That means it'll eventually run out. Unless we start putting our money toward creating renewable energy, our kids, grandkids, or great grandkids are going to have neither clean water nor land to live from. I don't know about the America you're voting for, but I try to support the America that's going to set an example for the rest of the world and give my family resources to enjoy that are at least as good if not better than what I've grown up with. I want my posterity to be able to enjoy the outdoors, raise a healthy garden, hunt, fish, and be able to eat what they harvest. If you don't, then we obviously have different ideas of what it means to be Americans.
I'm also sick of the fear-mongering "if we don't create jobs in oil, unemployment's going to skyrocket" point of view. Here's a newsflash - if we don't create and keep Americans in agricultural jobs (both by buying American, or better yet, local produce; and not killing the earth we get life from) we're going to be even more at the mercy of the foreign countries. If we don't create jobs supporting and creating renewable sources, America is going to be on its knees in front of the rest of the world begging for help. The longer we pour money into temporary oil for temporary profits, the further down the hole we go.
Also, it really sucks that gas is going up again.</div></div>
While I respect your views and I'm glad you hunt I don't completely agree with you. You have swallowed way too much of the hip green pill. I agree with taking care of the environment but some of the green movements measures are a little far fetched. I believe it was Holland ( Can't remember) that has stated that going completely to wind turbines for electricity, has failed miserably. And thats just one example. I'm all about refining our way of life to use less and not have to rely on anyone. I hope to one day go off grid and to be self sustaining and to have a super energy efficient home as well.
But we as a country must do it responsibly and not get caught up into fads. We must do it in steps that the populace can handle. Trying to force our country into a leap when the economy is suffering is foolish.
As far as us killing the earth......You have watched too many green disney movies.
I will admit that in a couple of areas and in a few streams we have made some messes but the earth doesn't even know we are here.
Some scientist have said that we have less than a 2% impact on the earth......
We try to refine our co2 emisions with our scrubbers and our converters and then one volcano belches and screws all of our #'s up for that year.
I'm not against all green at all but for Gods sake I wish some of them would use a brain instead of turning into fools with a hyped-chick-fad to follow and have crack headed hollywood stars that can't even manage their own lives champion their movement.
Feal free to rag on my grammer,spelling or whatever else you want to as well.....Hell, I know I suck at that so I will save you the trouble of pointing it out.
Just my opinion.....Carry on.
....SmokeRolls
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: M25BeastShooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't you just love the tree huggers!! Don't drill here you might mess up something! Don't build any new refineries, oil rigs ect. Don't want to put any one to work.
When is America going to connect the dots eco freaks Democratic party Obama and the like and start voting FOR America? </div></div>
I'm not gonna go all political because I like hanging out here, but your last sentence doesn't make sense on at least 2 levels. First of all, you strung together a bunch of words in a near-incoherent question. Second of all, if you think that voting <span style="font-style: italic">for</span> America involves putting all our eggs into the oil basket, you're looking at the wrong chicken.
Even if we could become self-supplied with oil, there's only a limited amount available. That means it'll eventually run out. Unless we start putting our money toward creating renewable energy, our kids, grandkids, or great grandkids are going to have neither clean water nor land to live from. I don't know about the America you're voting for, but I try to support the America that's going to set an example for the rest of the world and give my family resources to enjoy that are at least as good if not better than what I've grown up with. I want my posterity to be able to enjoy the outdoors, raise a healthy garden, hunt, fish, and be able to eat what they harvest. If you don't, then we obviously have different ideas of what it means to be Americans.
I'm also sick of the fear-mongering "if we don't create jobs in oil, unemployment's going to skyrocket" point of view. Here's a newsflash - if we don't create and keep Americans in agricultural jobs (both by buying American, or better yet, local produce; and not killing the earth we get life from) we're going to be even more at the mercy of the foreign countries. If we don't create jobs supporting and creating renewable sources, America is going to be on its knees in front of the rest of the world begging for help. The longer we pour money into temporary oil for temporary profits, the further down the hole we go.
Also, it really sucks that gas is going up again.</div></div>
While I respect your views and I'm glad you hunt I don't completely agree with you. You have swallowed way too much of the hip green pill. I agree with taking care of the environment but some of the green movements measures are a little far fetched. I believe it was Holland ( Can't remember) that has stated that going completely to wind turbines for electricity, has failed miserably. And thats just one example. I'm all about refining our way of life to use less and not have to rely on anyone. I hope to one day go off grid and to be self sustaining and to have a super energy efficient home as well.
But we as a country must do it responsibly and not get caught up into fads. We must do it in steps that the populace can handle. Trying to force our country into a leap when the economy is suffering is foolish.
As far as us killing the earth......You have watched too many green disney movies.
I will admit that in a couple of areas and in a few streams we have made some messes but the earth doesn't even know we are here.
Some scientist have said that we have less than a 2% impact on the earth......
We try to refine our co2 emisions with our scrubbers and our converters and then one volcano belches and screws all of our #'s up for that year.
I'm not against all green at all but for Gods sake I wish some of them would use a brain instead of turning into fools with a hyped-chick-fad to follow and have crack headed hollywood stars that can't even manage their own lives champion their movement.
Feal free to rag on my grammer,spelling or whatever else you want to as well.....Hell, I know I suck at that so I will save you the trouble of pointing it out.
Just my opinion.....Carry on.
....SmokeRolls
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Susan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan </div></div>
Problem - it's a global market and futures are just that. The whole region is a powder keg. How would you like to prognosticate on a water way shutting down or a few pipelines being blown?
Numbers mean more when they are put into context.
Source: British Petroleum Statistical Review 2010
Combined output of Libya, Tunisia and Baharain (+ Eygpt + $5.00 / bbl Venezuelan Oil Sold to the Chinese, Subsidized by USA + $37 Billion Saudi Pay Off is actually quite a bit more than 2%). Even though it is light, lets call it 3% just for an easy data point.
Total World Oil Production not including bio mass or coal derivatives - 79,948 x 1,000 / day bbls
Total US Gasoline (light distillate) consumption - 9,221 x 1,000 / day bbls
15% of total light distillate consumption = 1,383 x 1,000 / day bbls
3% of total world oil production - 2,398 x 1,000 / day bbls
Which means 3% of total world production is 26% of Total Annual US gas (light distillate) consumption and it is 12.84% of total US oil consumption.
Again - 3 points is light.
Now - run those dailies against the nominal price per bbl - it ain't pretty.
Another way to express this is - the market has (rightly) determined that 13% of Total US Oil Supply or 26% of Total US gas supply is at risk. Since the market is global, and demand is largely static that means price has to be elastic. They are buying contracts for future deliveries in an area of the world ripe for serious disruption to supply. The Kingdom / social strata / ruling class / disposition toward the West / linchpin status to the ME of Saudi Arabia is ripe to fall as well; if it does the impact to price will be more than what would be indicated by sheer production volume alone, as it is a better indicator of current risk. Risk is always a factor in price.
Also I changed this post so as not to be political however this fact and the corresponding influence on the market can not be ignored (and I will phrase it this way so as to minimize the politics of the statement) - where are the the most powerful leaders of the world on this matter? Without stability, real information about the true level of risk becomes difficult to obtain, which makes the market all the more imperfect and allows for more manipulation - translation higher prices. This is a failure of leadership.
Good luck
ETA a couple of other data points to think about and keep the conversation intellectually honest:
US Domestic Oil Production in 2009 (7,196 x 1,000 / day bbl) was 7% greater than in 2008. In fact, in 2000 domestic production was 7,733 x 1,000 / day bbls and by 2005 had fallen to a low of 6,895 x 1,000 / day bbls.
2009 Total US Domestic Consumption - 18,686 x 1,000 / day bbls, of that 49.4% of that was related to vehicle fuel. Think about that for a half a second - if we could just shift the fuel source for vehicles and make a slight tweek to some household and commercial applications we could be petroleum independent.
That said - ODOT in OR has a fancy new piece of software called GreenSTEP that is intended to model greenhouse gas emissions from all point sources (as with all models - crap inputs = crap outputs). IIRC the model states that vehicles account for 80% of GHEs and that if 20% of the vehicles were Nat Gas or Electric the problem would magically cure itself. No one from ODOT ever consulted with the Nat Gas folks or the Power folks to see if their backbones could support this. NG can - they just twist the valve and add pressure to the pipe. Power - not so much. In fact an increase of a mere 2% of electric cars pops the grid outside of Multnohmah county (and they aren't much above that threshold). Gonna need to add massive capacity to the system (rewire the state in layman's terms). Gee I wonder how we pay for that? No fear though, we are doing land use planning and economic development around the whole concept.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Susan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I work for an oil company as a geologist and was listening to some of the news this morning. Libya, Tunisia and Baharain don't even make up 2% of the worlds oil production, so why the market is being so reactive is beyond me. On the other hand 15% of the US gasoline, comes from the gulf of mexico, so if the prices at the pump go up...we have someone else to blame in addition to the market.
Susan </div></div>
Problem - it's a global market and futures are just that. The whole region is a powder keg. How would you like to prognosticate on a water way shutting down or a few pipelines being blown?
Numbers mean more when they are put into context.
Source: British Petroleum Statistical Review 2010
Combined output of Libya, Tunisia and Baharain (+ Eygpt + $5.00 / bbl Venezuelan Oil Sold to the Chinese, Subsidized by USA + $37 Billion Saudi Pay Off is actually quite a bit more than 2%). Even though it is light, lets call it 3% just for an easy data point.
Total World Oil Production not including bio mass or coal derivatives - 79,948 x 1,000 / day bbls
Total US Gasoline (light distillate) consumption - 9,221 x 1,000 / day bbls
15% of total light distillate consumption = 1,383 x 1,000 / day bbls
3% of total world oil production - 2,398 x 1,000 / day bbls
Which means 3% of total world production is 26% of Total Annual US gas (light distillate) consumption and it is 12.84% of total US oil consumption.
Again - 3 points is light.
Now - run those dailies against the nominal price per bbl - it ain't pretty.
Another way to express this is - the market has (rightly) determined that 13% of Total US Oil Supply or 26% of Total US gas supply is at risk. Since the market is global, and demand is largely static that means price has to be elastic. They are buying contracts for future deliveries in an area of the world ripe for serious disruption to supply. The Kingdom / social strata / ruling class / disposition toward the West / linchpin status to the ME of Saudi Arabia is ripe to fall as well; if it does the impact to price will be more than what would be indicated by sheer production volume alone, as it is a better indicator of current risk. Risk is always a factor in price.
Also I changed this post so as not to be political however this fact and the corresponding influence on the market can not be ignored (and I will phrase it this way so as to minimize the politics of the statement) - where are the the most powerful leaders of the world on this matter? Without stability, real information about the true level of risk becomes difficult to obtain, which makes the market all the more imperfect and allows for more manipulation - translation higher prices. This is a failure of leadership.
Good luck
ETA a couple of other data points to think about and keep the conversation intellectually honest:
US Domestic Oil Production in 2009 (7,196 x 1,000 / day bbl) was 7% greater than in 2008. In fact, in 2000 domestic production was 7,733 x 1,000 / day bbls and by 2005 had fallen to a low of 6,895 x 1,000 / day bbls.
2009 Total US Domestic Consumption - 18,686 x 1,000 / day bbls, of that 49.4% of that was related to vehicle fuel. Think about that for a half a second - if we could just shift the fuel source for vehicles and make a slight tweek to some household and commercial applications we could be petroleum independent.
That said - ODOT in OR has a fancy new piece of software called GreenSTEP that is intended to model greenhouse gas emissions from all point sources (as with all models - crap inputs = crap outputs). IIRC the model states that vehicles account for 80% of GHEs and that if 20% of the vehicles were Nat Gas or Electric the problem would magically cure itself. No one from ODOT ever consulted with the Nat Gas folks or the Power folks to see if their backbones could support this. NG can - they just twist the valve and add pressure to the pipe. Power - not so much. In fact an increase of a mere 2% of electric cars pops the grid outside of Multnohmah county (and they aren't much above that threshold). Gonna need to add massive capacity to the system (rewire the state in layman's terms). Gee I wonder how we pay for that? No fear though, we are doing land use planning and economic development around the whole concept.
Re: Fill up today
hate to say it but I hope the oil goes back up, the best work I have had in three years has been with the oil sands production in Alberta, they have around 20 billion of construction work planned, just waiting for the price point to exceed the production costs, plenty of oil up there just will not be cheap
hate to say it but I hope the oil goes back up, the best work I have had in three years has been with the oil sands production in Alberta, they have around 20 billion of construction work planned, just waiting for the price point to exceed the production costs, plenty of oil up there just will not be cheap
Re: Fill up today
I can't agree with the government controlling how much money a person or company can make. It just seems to me that people making record profits by (seemingly) arbitrarily raising prices on essential goods or services could be told to effin' quit it. I say essential knowing that oil isn't necessarily absolutely essential, but not using it would knock us back into the dark ages right now.
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> ride my bike the 8.5 miles I drive to get to work, and it would be good for me. I could get a basket and ride the additional 5 mile round trip to the grocery store after work a few times a week (though riding home with dog food would SUCK). Someone who lives 30 miles from their job can't practically do that.
In the end, I guess what I'm saying is that if electricity tripled in cost this year because the power companies wanted more profits, I think something would be done about it. Sure, you don't <span style="font-style: italic">need</span> electricity to live (remember, people did it up until about the last 100 years or so), but it's pretty much an essential part of every day life. Why are ridiculous profits for profits' sake by oil and gas companies tolerated?
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________
Smokerolls, I'll just say that I personally think it's not a good idea to have pollution levels in any form where they are right now. I think we should find ways to seriously cut back (somehow getting rid of it completely would be nice, but that's complete fantasy) our pollution as individuals, a nation, and a world. I think if America and the world continue to head down the path we're on now, we'll eventually destroy the bulk of the beauty the earth has to offer. I'd like that to be around as long as possible, since my personal belief is that God created it and made us stewards to care for it. That's as far as I'll go on that.
I agree with you that finding and employing sustainable energy should be done in steps. It's foolish to jump headlong into anything that's not thoroughly tested. I also agree that I wish that people who are "fighting the green cause" would grow a brain in a lot of cases. Just like any belief, that movement has its morons and extremists.
We can agree on some things, disagree on others, but we both want to keep our land nice and our animals healthy. Take care, see you around.
I can't agree with the government controlling how much money a person or company can make. It just seems to me that people making record profits by (seemingly) arbitrarily raising prices on essential goods or services could be told to effin' quit it. I say essential knowing that oil isn't necessarily absolutely essential, but not using it would knock us back into the dark ages right now.
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> ride my bike the 8.5 miles I drive to get to work, and it would be good for me. I could get a basket and ride the additional 5 mile round trip to the grocery store after work a few times a week (though riding home with dog food would SUCK). Someone who lives 30 miles from their job can't practically do that.
In the end, I guess what I'm saying is that if electricity tripled in cost this year because the power companies wanted more profits, I think something would be done about it. Sure, you don't <span style="font-style: italic">need</span> electricity to live (remember, people did it up until about the last 100 years or so), but it's pretty much an essential part of every day life. Why are ridiculous profits for profits' sake by oil and gas companies tolerated?
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________
Smokerolls, I'll just say that I personally think it's not a good idea to have pollution levels in any form where they are right now. I think we should find ways to seriously cut back (somehow getting rid of it completely would be nice, but that's complete fantasy) our pollution as individuals, a nation, and a world. I think if America and the world continue to head down the path we're on now, we'll eventually destroy the bulk of the beauty the earth has to offer. I'd like that to be around as long as possible, since my personal belief is that God created it and made us stewards to care for it. That's as far as I'll go on that.
I agree with you that finding and employing sustainable energy should be done in steps. It's foolish to jump headlong into anything that's not thoroughly tested. I also agree that I wish that people who are "fighting the green cause" would grow a brain in a lot of cases. Just like any belief, that movement has its morons and extremists.
We can agree on some things, disagree on others, but we both want to keep our land nice and our animals healthy. Take care, see you around.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I can't agree with the government controlling how much money a person or company can make. It just seems to me that people making record profits by (seemingly) arbitrarily raising prices on essential goods or services could be told to effin' quit it. I say essential knowing that oil isn't necessarily absolutely essential, but not using it would knock us back into the dark ages right now.
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> ride my bike the 8.5 miles I drive to get to work, and it would be good for me. I could get a basket and ride the additional 5 mile round trip to the grocery store after work a few times a week (though riding home with dog food would SUCK). Someone who lives 30 miles from their job can't practically do that.
In the end, I guess what I'm saying is that if electricity tripled in cost this year because the power companies wanted more profits, I think something would be done about it. Sure, you don't <span style="font-style: italic">need</span> electricity to live (remember, people did it up until about the last 100 years or so), but it's pretty much an essential part of every day life. Why are ridiculous profits for profits' sake by oil and gas companies tolerated?
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________
Smokerolls, I'll just say that I personally think it's not a good idea to have pollution levels in any form where they are right now. I think we should find ways to seriously cut back (somehow getting rid of it completely would be nice, but that's complete fantasy) our pollution as individuals, a nation, and a world. I think if America and the world continue to head down the path we're on now, we'll eventually destroy the bulk of the beauty the earth has to offer. I'd like that to be around as long as possible, since my personal belief is that God created it and made us stewards to care for it. That's as far as I'll go on that.
I agree with you that finding and employing sustainable energy should be done in steps. It's foolish to jump headlong into anything that's not thoroughly tested. I also agree that I wish that people who are "fighting the green cause" would grow a brain in a lot of cases. Just like any belief, that movement has its morons and extremists.
We can agree on some things, disagree on others, but we both want to keep our land nice and our animals healthy. Take care, see you around. </div></div>
Oil companies don't set the price silly, the NYMEX futures traders do in the US anyway. Don't get me wrong, the oil companies are happy to make record profits, but they don't set the price of crude or even refined product.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I can't agree with the government controlling how much money a person or company can make. It just seems to me that people making record profits by (seemingly) arbitrarily raising prices on essential goods or services could be told to effin' quit it. I say essential knowing that oil isn't necessarily absolutely essential, but not using it would knock us back into the dark ages right now.
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> ride my bike the 8.5 miles I drive to get to work, and it would be good for me. I could get a basket and ride the additional 5 mile round trip to the grocery store after work a few times a week (though riding home with dog food would SUCK). Someone who lives 30 miles from their job can't practically do that.
In the end, I guess what I'm saying is that if electricity tripled in cost this year because the power companies wanted more profits, I think something would be done about it. Sure, you don't <span style="font-style: italic">need</span> electricity to live (remember, people did it up until about the last 100 years or so), but it's pretty much an essential part of every day life. Why are ridiculous profits for profits' sake by oil and gas companies tolerated?
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________
Smokerolls, I'll just say that I personally think it's not a good idea to have pollution levels in any form where they are right now. I think we should find ways to seriously cut back (somehow getting rid of it completely would be nice, but that's complete fantasy) our pollution as individuals, a nation, and a world. I think if America and the world continue to head down the path we're on now, we'll eventually destroy the bulk of the beauty the earth has to offer. I'd like that to be around as long as possible, since my personal belief is that God created it and made us stewards to care for it. That's as far as I'll go on that.
I agree with you that finding and employing sustainable energy should be done in steps. It's foolish to jump headlong into anything that's not thoroughly tested. I also agree that I wish that people who are "fighting the green cause" would grow a brain in a lot of cases. Just like any belief, that movement has its morons and extremists.
We can agree on some things, disagree on others, but we both want to keep our land nice and our animals healthy. Take care, see you around. </div></div>
Oil companies don't set the price silly, the NYMEX futures traders do in the US anyway. Don't get me wrong, the oil companies are happy to make record profits, but they don't set the price of crude or even refined product.
Re: Fill up today
Its not bp, chevron, or shell driving up the price of oil. Its opec, and a bunch of yuppie/hippie, non working, chrony, blood sucking, greedy, lazy ass, cock sucking, cant see their own feet cause they have their head shoved so far up their ass its became what used to be an adams apple bum bandit leaches that are on the floor of the futures market in Chicago. Every last one of those future trader should be strung up and gut shot. If they arent going to take possesion of it, they shouldnt be buying it. I wish they would find something else to fuck around with, like cyanide.
Its not bp, chevron, or shell driving up the price of oil. Its opec, and a bunch of yuppie/hippie, non working, chrony, blood sucking, greedy, lazy ass, cock sucking, cant see their own feet cause they have their head shoved so far up their ass its became what used to be an adams apple bum bandit leaches that are on the floor of the futures market in Chicago. Every last one of those future trader should be strung up and gut shot. If they arent going to take possesion of it, they shouldnt be buying it. I wish they would find something else to fuck around with, like cyanide.
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh. Well...shit. Whoever makes gas so damn high needs to quit it. </div></div>
I second that motion.
Spazz. I'm not against cleaning up the smog levels, I'm for it but only in moderation and at an acceptable pace. My theory is two steps forward and one step back at the minimum and if we can make a smooth transition towards a responsible society I am all for it.
I'll use this example; when I tell my youngest daughter to clean her room I have found that she gets overwhelmed by the amount of stuff to clean up and gets frustrated. But when I tell her to get an area cleaned up in her room or to do this and this....Then she can handle it and take care of it in about ten minutes.
The old saying "How do you eat an elephant?"
...answer:...."One bite at a time".
I believe we as a nation sometimes try to eat the whole elephant at one sitting......And we end up choking on it.
I just see the green extremism both now and what they are trying to do in the near future and I also see the drawbacks and the wake of calamity that it will bring... Like "lets save the earth" but cause many families to struggle even harder because they don't have the money to go out and buy the hybrid... They are stuck with the hand-me down old pickup truck that gets 10mpg.
I didn't mean to ragg on you too bad, it's just that some of the green movement has caused me to be soured and I probably took it out on you a little too harshly. Sorry I expressed frustration.
....SmokeRolls
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Spazz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh. Well...shit. Whoever makes gas so damn high needs to quit it. </div></div>
I second that motion.
Spazz. I'm not against cleaning up the smog levels, I'm for it but only in moderation and at an acceptable pace. My theory is two steps forward and one step back at the minimum and if we can make a smooth transition towards a responsible society I am all for it.
I'll use this example; when I tell my youngest daughter to clean her room I have found that she gets overwhelmed by the amount of stuff to clean up and gets frustrated. But when I tell her to get an area cleaned up in her room or to do this and this....Then she can handle it and take care of it in about ten minutes.
The old saying "How do you eat an elephant?"
...answer:...."One bite at a time".
I believe we as a nation sometimes try to eat the whole elephant at one sitting......And we end up choking on it.
I just see the green extremism both now and what they are trying to do in the near future and I also see the drawbacks and the wake of calamity that it will bring... Like "lets save the earth" but cause many families to struggle even harder because they don't have the money to go out and buy the hybrid... They are stuck with the hand-me down old pickup truck that gets 10mpg.
I didn't mean to ragg on you too bad, it's just that some of the green movement has caused me to be soured and I probably took it out on you a little too harshly. Sorry I expressed frustration.
....SmokeRolls
Re: Fill up today
Maybe Susan can speak more intelligently than I can on the subject but at some point Peak Oil comes into play on all of this.
I know folks wanna talk about oil shale and fantastically deep exploration but it is a simple question of math.
If we are (as many white coats think) currently in Peak Oil we have exhausted the easy to extract finds, and we are at the point where finds with moderately high extraction costs are at or slightly past peak outputs. So while demand continues to expand, out put of moderate cost to extract oil is starting to wane. We have already covered what a couple percent swing in world production / demand means to the US (double digit shortfalls). The whole concept of Peak Oil is fact, yet it isn't quantifiable. Why would a company, let alone a nation really tell anyone how much oil they are really sitting on. Can you imagine if things are as unpleasant as they are in the ME now what happens when the crude spigot is turned off? Bedlam, violent overthrow, forced irrelevance, and then an entire region that is about like Afghanistan circa the late '90s - curtain of freekin darkness and whacked out religious zealots. What is the old saying? My father rode a camel, I drive a Cadillac, my grandson will ride a camel.
Therefore what we're really saying is - Is it best to continue to throw good money after very expensive recoverables in a finite system - only to have to switch again at some later point; or does it make sense to spend the same (more / less?) in pursuit of an infinite or near infinite system that may (should) lead to a next level means of production and reinvigorate US manufacturing?
There is no emotion to the question or the answer - it's just math. However it is a conversation that has been put off for decades and now has become a painful subject.
Good luck
Maybe Susan can speak more intelligently than I can on the subject but at some point Peak Oil comes into play on all of this.
I know folks wanna talk about oil shale and fantastically deep exploration but it is a simple question of math.
If we are (as many white coats think) currently in Peak Oil we have exhausted the easy to extract finds, and we are at the point where finds with moderately high extraction costs are at or slightly past peak outputs. So while demand continues to expand, out put of moderate cost to extract oil is starting to wane. We have already covered what a couple percent swing in world production / demand means to the US (double digit shortfalls). The whole concept of Peak Oil is fact, yet it isn't quantifiable. Why would a company, let alone a nation really tell anyone how much oil they are really sitting on. Can you imagine if things are as unpleasant as they are in the ME now what happens when the crude spigot is turned off? Bedlam, violent overthrow, forced irrelevance, and then an entire region that is about like Afghanistan circa the late '90s - curtain of freekin darkness and whacked out religious zealots. What is the old saying? My father rode a camel, I drive a Cadillac, my grandson will ride a camel.
Therefore what we're really saying is - Is it best to continue to throw good money after very expensive recoverables in a finite system - only to have to switch again at some later point; or does it make sense to spend the same (more / less?) in pursuit of an infinite or near infinite system that may (should) lead to a next level means of production and reinvigorate US manufacturing?
There is no emotion to the question or the answer - it's just math. However it is a conversation that has been put off for decades and now has become a painful subject.
Good luck
G
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Guest
Re: Fill up today
The biggest problem continues to be unregulated speculation.
People who do not use fuels as an end user have no business buying and selling their futures.
Speculators get a boner when news starts talking about unrest in oil producing countries or hurricanes in the gulf. The news agencies are feeding a fear that drives up futures prices a little bit, but the greatest factor driving up the prices is the potential to make a quick and sizable profit by buying and selling in a volatile market.
The beast feeds itself.
But hey, it doesn't bother me as much as it used to, thanks to the new car.
The biggest problem continues to be unregulated speculation.
People who do not use fuels as an end user have no business buying and selling their futures.
Speculators get a boner when news starts talking about unrest in oil producing countries or hurricanes in the gulf. The news agencies are feeding a fear that drives up futures prices a little bit, but the greatest factor driving up the prices is the potential to make a quick and sizable profit by buying and selling in a volatile market.
The beast feeds itself.
But hey, it doesn't bother me as much as it used to, thanks to the new car.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Fill up today
Popular Mechanics did a nice article back in 2009 when certain politicians were battling over these issues.
It turns out, or at least it did back then, that Americans do indeed waste a huge amount of fuel by not properly maintaining their vehicles.
It was calculated that we as a nation squander away about 1.25 billion gallons of gas a year by not keeping engines tuned and tires properly inflated.
Turns out that number is nearly identical to the EIA's estimates for gasoline production from currently off-limits offshore sources.
Scoff if you want, but I check my tires every week, and they routinely need to be adjusted.
I was surprised to learn from the article that air actually bleeds out through the rubber in the tires. It's a slow process, but it happens.
Popular Mechanics did a nice article back in 2009 when certain politicians were battling over these issues.
It turns out, or at least it did back then, that Americans do indeed waste a huge amount of fuel by not properly maintaining their vehicles.
It was calculated that we as a nation squander away about 1.25 billion gallons of gas a year by not keeping engines tuned and tires properly inflated.
Turns out that number is nearly identical to the EIA's estimates for gasoline production from currently off-limits offshore sources.
Scoff if you want, but I check my tires every week, and they routinely need to be adjusted.
I was surprised to learn from the article that air actually bleeds out through the rubber in the tires. It's a slow process, but it happens.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Fill up today
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COURAGEWOLF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The free market defines the cost of oil currently
</div></div>
With respect, that's simply not true.
It would be if futures were only bought by the companies that take deliveries when they mature. But that isn't the case.
If it were, Wall Street would be jammed with tankers.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: COURAGEWOLF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The free market defines the cost of oil currently
</div></div>
With respect, that's simply not true.
It would be if futures were only bought by the companies that take deliveries when they mature. But that isn't the case.
If it were, Wall Street would be jammed with tankers.
Re: Fill up today
You have a narrow vision of the who should participate in the market. Consider that some funds (read retirement accounts) consist of such commodities.
On another note - I am the guy that you reference, I drive a hand me down 20 yr old truck, tires get air when the are visibly low and vehicles get worked on when they don't start. I guess you can all blame me.
Good luck
You have a narrow vision of the who should participate in the market. Consider that some funds (read retirement accounts) consist of such commodities.
On another note - I am the guy that you reference, I drive a hand me down 20 yr old truck, tires get air when the are visibly low and vehicles get worked on when they don't start. I guess you can all blame me.
Good luck
