Sidearms & Scatterguns Gunsite and the SERPA holster

[CoryT]

The other thread having degererated to nonsense, I though I'd start a new one just to make a couple points.

First, Gunsite has NOT banned the SERPA holster. The only holster we do not permit is a horizontal type of carry where the muzzle will end up pointed at others during the presentation. The muzzle must point at the ground within a few feet of the shooter.

That said, we do not find the SERPA to be desireable. I have personally had to fix no less than 10 of these that would not release the handgun AT ALL, due to debris behind the button. They seem quite fragile in construction, and yes I'm looking at brand new issue units. We don't sell them, and I don't suggest them to any clients.

I don't think having the trigger finger pressing for release, even if it is straight along the frame, is a good design, though proper training probably makes it a non-issue. Most users seem to have little or no training in proper operation, with predictable results.

 

[J-Ham]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Well said. If they work for you (the operator), I say fantastic. As for me, I will continue to use a Blade-Tech or similar...

YMMV

 

[Cortney Beard]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

I just don't understand the emotional attachement people get to these damn things?

SERPAs have a failure rate far to high to be counted on in times where your life is in jeopardy.

I personally had a 1911 locked in my holster to the point I had to cut the holster off the weapon. I purchased a Safariland for retention work going forward without a problem.

I was at a match were a very good shooter had his 1911 lock up in his SERPA, the video is on youtube somewhere.

Google SERPA failure look at the results, then do the same for Safariland.

In police work this is what is commonly referred to as "a clue"

 

[dpairborneranger]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

I have used my Serpa for a year now working the roads and shoot at the minimum of once a week with it and never have had any problems. Maybe I just got lucky. I have the one that holds the weapon light with it.

 

[Cortney Beard]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

DonniePD, all the SERPAs work.....

....until they don't.

Why risk it when there are so many other great holsters out there. What does Blackhawk do for you that you can't get from others?

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Got one for my 1911 to see what the fuss is about.

It's serviceable in a clean environment. I would not carry one in the bush.

I don't particularly like the finger release. I carry my TASER in a Serpa and the release on it is backward from the handgun release. It makes it very difficult to switch back and forth. I have been too used to thumb release holsters to be able to comment on speed. I don't have the time to re-train myself on the SERPA nor do I have the inclination since I still carry my duty pistol in Safariland holsters.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Well I'm not going into combat, nor LE. I don't carry it or any holster for my CC revolver, (I use my pants pocket).

I have one for my Beretta for competition and it works quite will.

All I do is remove if from my shooting bag, put it on my belt, insert the pistol and I'm ready.

It works for me.

 

[dpairborneranger]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cortney Beard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">DonniePD, all the SERPAs work.....

....until they don't.

Why risk it when there are so many other great holsters out there. What does Blackhawk do for you that you can't get from others? </div></div>

Do what? Yes, eventually all things usually break. Genius concept you got there. You know 1911s' springs wear out, should we not buy them?

 

[EddieNFL]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know 1911s' springs wear out, should we not buy them?</div></div>

Massive difference between wearing out and failing.

 

[Strangedays]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EddieNFL</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know 1911s' springs wear out, should we not buy them?</div></div>

Massive difference between wearing out and failing. </div></div>
100%^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^100%

 

[Strangedays]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Cortney Beard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just don't understand the emotional attachement people get to these damn things?

SERPAs have a failure rate far to high to be counted on in times where your life is in jeopardy.

I personally had a 1911 locked in my holster to the point I had to cut the holster off the weapon. I purchased a Safariland for retention work going forward without a problem.

I was at a match were a very good shooter had his 1911 lock up in his SERPA, the video is on youtube somewhere.

Google SERPA failure look at the results, then do the same for Safariland.

In police work this is what is commonly referred to as "a clue" </div></div>
Thats what I find so funny. You make a comment about how you don't like a certain gun or item and people act as if you kicked them in the balls.

 

[dpairborneranger]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EddieNFL</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know 1911s' springs wear out, should we not buy them?</div></div>

Massive difference between wearing out and failing. </div></div>

Well my Serpa holster has neither wore out or failed. For that matter no one at my 500 man department has had a their Serpa fail or wear out.

 

[SgtKope]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

FWIW, My military unit does not allow the SERPA holter for exactly the reason stated by the OP, debris behind the release button. This is a no-go especially here in sand land.

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

 

[Strangedays]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DonniePD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EddieNFL</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You know 1911s' springs wear out, should we not buy them?</div></div>

Massive difference between wearing out and failing. </div></div>

Well my Serpa holster has neither wore out or failed. For that matter no one at my 500 man department has had a their Serpa fail or wear out. </div></div>
Well I would like to see your department put the use on these holsters that the military does. I own one for a glock and had issues with the first and the replacement has been fine but it only sees the closet and at the matches it sits in a bag in the event I need the glock as a backup.

 

[Cortney Beard]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

DonniePD, you are proving my point about the emotional connection to a brand. Instead of accepting others personal experience you try to berate my comment then throw out a "fact" that you nor any of us can substantiate about your 500 man police force.

I replace my 1911 springs according to the recommended service schedule like my other guns. What is the service recommendation on your SERPA?

 

[Guest]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Here's a "Clue" as you called it.

The other Serpa thread went long, because of one thing an one thing only. Seems most but not all, got a grip on what the real end game was, at about the second or third page.

Everything, an everybody fails,...Boeing, DOE, NRC, even NASA have hosed things up over the years. The thing they all have an had, in common, was they admitted their failure to completely understand the total operational perimeters an learning curves, involved.

 

[dpairborneranger]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

I also was in the military and we were not allowed to choose what holster we were to use for our handgun. With that being said I would not of used the Serpa while I was in the military. Fast roping and jumping out of planes I feel would of been too much for the Serpa. Plus, overseas in the sandbox may have caused problems with the dirt and grime. Also, not everyone on the 500 department uses Serpas. The ones that do I have heard no problems from. Beard, I also own the Safariland holster with light attachment. I like the Serpa better because the draw is smoother and smoother=faster. My Serpa did not come with a service schedule but like I said earlier I've had no problems with it so I can't fix what isn't broke. End of rant for this thread

 

[Cortney Beard]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Donnie, the thing to think about is when you have to drop someone to the ground and you are wrestling around it's not always clean and clear of debris. It's all to easy to get something jambed in the release and prevent you from drawing your weapon.

I owned a SERPA, the release jambed on me. I understand some of the reasons to like the thing but I value my life more than I value the holster.

 

[ghorsley]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Redmanss:

Gunny, What the hell kind of picture is that you posted of a dead horse and a kid standing over him with a baseball bat?

Gil Horsley

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MrHiggins</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Redmanss:

Gunny, What the hell kind of picture is that you posted of a dead horse and a kid standing over him with a baseball bat?

Gil Horsley</div></div> Um..... Beating a dead horse? The last thread on the Serpa holsters went around in circles and so is this one. For fuck's sake, this argument is worse than Glock vs. 1911 and one side will never convince the other that they're right.

The picture is actually a parody from the movie "Office Space".
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/wzGWvZAd228"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/wzGWvZAd228" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>

 

[Mackay Sagebrush]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

On another note. I was at a weapon retention instructor class last year. There were some guys in the class from another agency that were issued the concealment version of the Serpa holsters.

We were going through the motions of learning the techniques properly, not using any speed or force. We broke numerous Serpa holsters away from the "plate" portion that the belt threads through.

Bear in mind, we were not actually attempting gun grabs, just working on learning proper techniques when we started breaking these guys holsters. It was not one holster. We broke numerous holsters.

I handed the person I was paired up with, his still holstered gun back to him. I felt bad, not realizing it would not be the last trashed rig of the day.




Food for thought.

 

[Kingof battle]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

Thanks for some good information!

 

[ColoWyo]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: King of Battle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks for some good information! </div></div>

Trying to get your 100 posts?

 

[Jim_D303]

Re: Gunsite and the SERPA holster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mackay Sagebrush</div><div class="ubbcode-body">On another note. I was at a weapon retention instructor class last year. There were some guys in the class from another agency that were issued the concealment version of the Serpa holsters.

We were going through the motions of learning the techniques properly, not using any speed or force. We broke numerous Serpa holsters away from the "plate" portion that the belt threads through.

Bear in mind, we were not actually attempting gun grabs, just working on learning proper techniques when we started breaking these guys holsters. It was not one holster. We broke numerous holsters.

I handed the person I was paired up with, his still holstered gun back to him. I felt bad, not realizing it would not be the last trashed rig of the day.




Food for thought.

</div></div>

I was at a training class the other week with a number of experienced shooters...http://www.firearmstrainingandtactics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1700

When we talked about the SERPA, in a class of 16 people (many LE guys) there were 6 students from this class who personally knew someone who had shot themselves while using a SERPA.

After one of them returned home to his department after the class, he learned that someone else in his dept shot themselves with a SERPA, that same weekend.

Not counting the hordes of people whom guys like Kyle Defoor know of at USTC who've shot themselves with that holster, that is no less than a dozen verified cases of guys shooting themselves using that one type of holsters that I personally know of.

Want to guess how many verified stories I've come across of people shooting themselves using a Safariland? <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Click to reveal.. <input type="button" class="form-button" value="Show me!" onclick="toggle_spoiler(this, 'Yikes, my eyes!', 'Show me!')" /></div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div style="display: none;"><span style="font-weight: bold">Zero!</span></div></div></div>