How does March-F 3-24x42 FFP FML-1 stack up against S&B PM II 5-25x56 Pf4?
Rifle Scopes How does March compare to S&B?
- Thread starter Shooter McGavin
- Start date
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I've been dying to get my hands on a March scope to try out. S&B is absolute top of the line, but I've read great reviews on March. Hopefully someone here has shot with both that can leave a review.
Trevor B
I've been dying to get my hands on a March scope to try out. S&B is absolute top of the line, but I've read great reviews on March. Hopefully someone here has shot with both that can leave a review.
Trevor B
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya
I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I've read about them, that's it. I went up their web photos are great, the 8x-80x WOW. I'd like to know what the price is etc. The ausies make good stuff, hope this is just like the rest of their high quality products.
I've read about them, that's it. I went up their web photos are great, the 8x-80x WOW. I'd like to know what the price is etc. The ausies make good stuff, hope this is just like the rest of their high quality products.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SSSamurai</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya </div></div>
I read his review on the high end scopes. I made the plunge today and purchased a March-F 3-24x42 FFP FML-1 non-illuminated reticle. I just wanted to know if I made the right choice. I guess I will be one of the first to have both scope.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SSSamurai</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya </div></div>
I read his review on the high end scopes. I made the plunge today and purchased a March-F 3-24x42 FFP FML-1 non-illuminated reticle. I just wanted to know if I made the right choice. I guess I will be one of the first to have both scope.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paw print</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've read about them, that's it. I went up their web photos are great, the 8x-80x WOW. I'd like to know what the price is etc. The ausies make good stuff, hope this is just like the rest of their high quality products.</div></div>
March scopes are made in Japan.
The 3-24x42 FFP is something like $2800 illuminated $2200 non-illuminated. Don't know about the others.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paw print</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've read about them, that's it. I went up their web photos are great, the 8x-80x WOW. I'd like to know what the price is etc. The ausies make good stuff, hope this is just like the rest of their high quality products.</div></div>
March scopes are made in Japan.
The 3-24x42 FFP is something like $2800 illuminated $2200 non-illuminated. Don't know about the others.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SSSamurai</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya </div></div>
I read his review on the high end scopes. I made the plunge today and purchased a March-F 3-24x42 FFP FML-1 non-illuminated reticle. I just wanted to know if I made the right choice. I guess I will be one of the first to have both scope. </div></div>
I'm thinking of getting a high mag March scope for F/TR. Speaking with Ilya he said for under $1k the best option would be Sightron but above that, March. I value his opinion so I'd say you're good.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SSSamurai</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think you're going to have to give it a week, until some people get them in hand. Hopefully someone will have the S&B you are asking about to compare it to. I will have my March soon, but my S&B is a 3-12. Until then, if you haven't read this, it's about as close as you'll get, since he's the only one that's gotten to play with the March.
Ilya </div></div>
I read his review on the high end scopes. I made the plunge today and purchased a March-F 3-24x42 FFP FML-1 non-illuminated reticle. I just wanted to know if I made the right choice. I guess I will be one of the first to have both scope. </div></div>
I'm thinking of getting a high mag March scope for F/TR. Speaking with Ilya he said for under $1k the best option would be Sightron but above that, March. I value his opinion so I'd say you're good.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Hi my friend recieved one last week they are both amasing optics but totaly different. The march is a lot lighter and has the smaller objective but from the testing we have done so far the ED glass is amasing and it still transmits the light verry well but the scope also can provide amasing definition like the larger S&B. if you are using the March on a lighter rifle it is streets ahead of the S&B and other scopes in its class just for the smaller size and weight saving. the reticle is also amasing on 3 power the reticle looks like 4 pickets to get fast target aquisition and then you can wind it up to 24 power and have good accurate holdovers a realy well thought out reticle for close up and long distance shooting. i have found the other 25 power 34mm scopes lacking in close range target aquisition and this scope is a real dual purpose optic.
I think you wil like the March i think even though it is lighter it will be just as strong as it does not have a huge objective hanging over the front ring that could get damaged meaning the tube does not have to be as thick to gain the same strength.
I think they are both great scopes but the March seems more versatile from my first impressions and it is on a 338-378Wby weighing 10 pounds so it has stiff recoil and is tracking perfectly and handeling it well so we will see over time how they stack up. My friend is ordering another one for his 30-378 he has replaced NXS5.5-22 scopes and there is no comparison when comparing the NXS to the march.
Hi my friend recieved one last week they are both amasing optics but totaly different. The march is a lot lighter and has the smaller objective but from the testing we have done so far the ED glass is amasing and it still transmits the light verry well but the scope also can provide amasing definition like the larger S&B. if you are using the March on a lighter rifle it is streets ahead of the S&B and other scopes in its class just for the smaller size and weight saving. the reticle is also amasing on 3 power the reticle looks like 4 pickets to get fast target aquisition and then you can wind it up to 24 power and have good accurate holdovers a realy well thought out reticle for close up and long distance shooting. i have found the other 25 power 34mm scopes lacking in close range target aquisition and this scope is a real dual purpose optic.
I think you wil like the March i think even though it is lighter it will be just as strong as it does not have a huge objective hanging over the front ring that could get damaged meaning the tube does not have to be as thick to gain the same strength.
I think they are both great scopes but the March seems more versatile from my first impressions and it is on a 338-378Wby weighing 10 pounds so it has stiff recoil and is tracking perfectly and handeling it well so we will see over time how they stack up. My friend is ordering another one for his 30-378 he has replaced NXS5.5-22 scopes and there is no comparison when comparing the NXS to the march.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
A couple of comments:
-comparing a 3-24x42 scope with a 5-25x56 is kinda like comparing apples to pumpkins. 56mm objective lens provides for a 77% large exit pupil (by area) at any magnification. As good as March is, at higher magnifications it will have a hard time hanging with this particular S&B simply because of the objective lens size difference.
-if you were to compare March and S&B using scope of similar magnification range and objective lens diameter, you would fins that March would likely outresolve S&B slightly, while S&B would likely have slightly better contrast
ILya
A couple of comments:
-comparing a 3-24x42 scope with a 5-25x56 is kinda like comparing apples to pumpkins. 56mm objective lens provides for a 77% large exit pupil (by area) at any magnification. As good as March is, at higher magnifications it will have a hard time hanging with this particular S&B simply because of the objective lens size difference.
-if you were to compare March and S&B using scope of similar magnification range and objective lens diameter, you would fins that March would likely outresolve S&B slightly, while S&B would likely have slightly better contrast
ILya
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle.
Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
What kind of voodoo magic are they using to get a 8x zoom ratio?
What kind of voodoo magic are they using to get a 8x zoom ratio?
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards
I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wild_Bill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think they are both great scopes but the March seems more versatile from my first impressions and it is on a 338-378Wby weighing 10 pounds so it has stiff recoil and is tracking perfectly and handeling it well so we will see over time how they stack up. My friend is ordering another one for his 30-378 he has replaced NXS5.5-22 scopes and there is no comparison when comparing the NXS to the march.
</div></div>
I think versatility is the key. The March would have to be the leader (at a guess) in magnification range, weight and size. It can be used for long range precision at high mag and close range bush hunting on 2.5x. It can be carried in the hills and keep a rifle nice and light. I wouldnt want to hike around some of our hills with a premier high mag scope for example.
I have a MArch SFP 2.5-25 x 42 and its amazing. S&B may be a more well known brand name but from all the reviews I heard and read the March is as good in optical quality and better in size, weight etc. I prefer the low profile tactical turrets as well.
+1 for March scopes.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wild_Bill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think they are both great scopes but the March seems more versatile from my first impressions and it is on a 338-378Wby weighing 10 pounds so it has stiff recoil and is tracking perfectly and handeling it well so we will see over time how they stack up. My friend is ordering another one for his 30-378 he has replaced NXS5.5-22 scopes and there is no comparison when comparing the NXS to the march.
</div></div>
I think versatility is the key. The March would have to be the leader (at a guess) in magnification range, weight and size. It can be used for long range precision at high mag and close range bush hunting on 2.5x. It can be carried in the hills and keep a rifle nice and light. I wouldnt want to hike around some of our hills with a premier high mag scope for example.
I have a MArch SFP 2.5-25 x 42 and its amazing. S&B may be a more well known brand name but from all the reviews I heard and read the March is as good in optical quality and better in size, weight etc. I prefer the low profile tactical turrets as well.
+1 for March scopes.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
World champ fixed variable bench rest shooters use March. Must tell you something.
The big zoom March scope are 2fp. No good for me but for BR shooters that's not an issue.
My new 3x 24x ffp March arrives in a day or two. Will post some pics as previously posted when it does.
World champ fixed variable bench rest shooters use March. Must tell you something.
The big zoom March scope are 2fp. No good for me but for BR shooters that's not an issue.
My new 3x 24x ffp March arrives in a day or two. Will post some pics as previously posted when it does.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
March 1000 Yds 80x
Target centre (dark) 9 inches.
http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/Qman3/1000ydswith80xMarchX.jpg
March 1000 Yds 80x
Target centre (dark) 9 inches.
http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy219/Qman3/1000ydswith80xMarchX.jpg
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards </div></div>
Hi i would probably use neither on a tacticle rifle i have the 10-60X52 on my long range F Class rifle and the eye relief is critical and the scope realy is not suitable for positional shooting the 3-24 would be a better choice. Also the 50 power S&S would not be my choice either it is to big of a scope for a tacticle rifle the biggest i would go for is the 5-50 March not the 10-60 realy though for a tacticle rifle the 5-25 S&B would be a better option.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards </div></div>
Hi i would probably use neither on a tacticle rifle i have the 10-60X52 on my long range F Class rifle and the eye relief is critical and the scope realy is not suitable for positional shooting the 3-24 would be a better choice. Also the 50 power S&S would not be my choice either it is to big of a scope for a tacticle rifle the biggest i would go for is the 5-50 March not the 10-60 realy though for a tacticle rifle the 5-25 S&B would be a better option.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I can tell you as a photographer the Japanese make a hell of a lens.
Check out this link on how crisp and clear the 500f4 is...
http://www.michaelkdickson.com/oldsite/ROADTRIP/pr1a.jpg
I can tell you as a photographer the Japanese make a hell of a lens.
Check out this link on how crisp and clear the 500f4 is...
http://www.michaelkdickson.com/oldsite/ROADTRIP/pr1a.jpg
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
<span style="color: #FF0000">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).</span>
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
<span style="color: #FF0000">March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting</span>.</div></div>
I mean no offense but that is a pretty bold statement about one of the best optics made. do you have any statistics or experiences with this personally?
I hate to tell you but benchrest competition is alittle easier on the optics than even a tactical match. You will see alot of s&b's at every match and most guys that don't have one wish they did after using one.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
<span style="color: #FF0000">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).</span>
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
<span style="color: #FF0000">March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting</span>.</div></div>
I mean no offense but that is a pretty bold statement about one of the best optics made. do you have any statistics or experiences with this personally?
I hate to tell you but benchrest competition is alittle easier on the optics than even a tactical match. You will see alot of s&b's at every match and most guys that don't have one wish they did after using one.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I looked through the March scopes at SHOT show. I thought they eye relief was very short and you had to be right behind the scope perfectly to get a good sight picture.
I think I have read before that the same people that make the March scopes also manufacture the Japanese NF scopes? Any truth to this?
I looked through the March scopes at SHOT show. I thought they eye relief was very short and you had to be right behind the scope perfectly to get a good sight picture.
I think I have read before that the same people that make the March scopes also manufacture the Japanese NF scopes? Any truth to this?
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards </div></div>
Have a look at what the benchrest shooters think of the March.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shar</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the money ready to buy either the S&B 12.5x50x56 or the March 10x60x52 tactical. It is basicly a coin toss from everything I have read from my research.
I need to make my mind up pretty quick as my rifle is being built
Any final recomendations would be greatly appreciated to help me with my decision
It will be put on a tac rifle (6.5x47 lapau)
Shooting paper at 100, 300 and 600 yards </div></div>
Have a look at what the benchrest shooters think of the March.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Ok so it seems a pretty pointless debate. The facts we know are that march are rated highly in bench rest but new to tactical. S&B are obviously proven in the tactical market. Based on that it seems that both have the highest quality optical qualities. I guess Whether march has the same tactical qualities remains to be seen. I think the march is smaller, lighter and has great magnification range. I think someone did a review on high quality scopes and the s&b had the edge on eye relief.
So the only unknown at this point seems to be whether the march scope is durable enough for tactical applications. It may be a long time before someone can answer that. You need masses of data on real world use before you can truly make an informed opinion and it's unlikely march is going to be deployed by the US military any time soon.
For the advantages of size and weight and mag range I am prepared to take a risk on the durability. The Australian march support is very high quality and I know for a fact that they will ensure my scope functions at all times the highest standard - otherwise it will be fixed. I'm pretty comfortable with that.
It seems both scopes are very good choices and are hard to beat.
Ok so it seems a pretty pointless debate. The facts we know are that march are rated highly in bench rest but new to tactical. S&B are obviously proven in the tactical market. Based on that it seems that both have the highest quality optical qualities. I guess Whether march has the same tactical qualities remains to be seen. I think the march is smaller, lighter and has great magnification range. I think someone did a review on high quality scopes and the s&b had the edge on eye relief.
So the only unknown at this point seems to be whether the march scope is durable enough for tactical applications. It may be a long time before someone can answer that. You need masses of data on real world use before you can truly make an informed opinion and it's unlikely march is going to be deployed by the US military any time soon.
For the advantages of size and weight and mag range I am prepared to take a risk on the durability. The Australian march support is very high quality and I know for a fact that they will ensure my scope functions at all times the highest standard - otherwise it will be fixed. I'm pretty comfortable with that.
It seems both scopes are very good choices and are hard to beat.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Team-Send-It!!!</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
<span style="color: #FF0000">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).</span>
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
<span style="color: #FF0000">March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting</span>.</div></div>
I mean no offense but that is a pretty bold statement about one of the best optics made. do you have any statistics or experiences with this personally?
I hate to tell you but benchrest competition is alittle easier on the optics than even a tactical match. You will see alot of s&b's at every match and most guys that don't have one wish they did after using one. </div></div>
Don't be too hard on problemchild, he <span style="font-weight: bold">READ</span> the info on which scopes break or not somewhere in the internet (he said it himself in that thread)... I mean, this is REALLY SOLID data
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Team-Send-It!!!</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter McGavin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well it seems I made the right choice in getting the March scope. It will be used on a light tactical rifle. </div></div>
Talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. You picked a new scope with a non-existent track record in the type of shooting for which you intend to use it over a tried and true market leader. </div></div>
<span style="color: #FF0000">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).</span>
Arent the NF's made in Japan?
"I bought a Nightforce 5.5-22X56MM and it arrived today. I was amazed to see "Made in Japan" on the bottom of the tube by the eye piece. I thought they were made in America. Anybody have any info"?
<span style="color: #FF0000">March have a HUGE track record in Bench shooting</span>.</div></div>
I mean no offense but that is a pretty bold statement about one of the best optics made. do you have any statistics or experiences with this personally?
I hate to tell you but benchrest competition is alittle easier on the optics than even a tactical match. You will see alot of s&b's at every match and most guys that don't have one wish they did after using one. </div></div>
Don't be too hard on problemchild, he <span style="font-weight: bold">READ</span> the info on which scopes break or not somewhere in the internet (he said it himself in that thread)... I mean, this is REALLY SOLID data
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
Bullshit. Don't use your google knowledge to talk shit about S&B. S&Bs are used aorund the world and have an excellent track record of holding up in combat. Don't let some other company put together models having problems cloud the truth. Even the USMC scopes are holding up well.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
Bullshit. Don't use your google knowledge to talk shit about S&B. S&Bs are used aorund the world and have an excellent track record of holding up in combat. Don't let some other company put together models having problems cloud the truth. Even the USMC scopes are holding up well.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
some people can't separate propaganda from the truth and they fail to realize a lot of these fairytales are started by competitors because they know idiots on the internet will promote the stories for them in order to sway opinion.
some people can't separate propaganda from the truth and they fail to realize a lot of these fairytales are started by competitors because they know idiots on the internet will promote the stories for them in order to sway opinion.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I suggest you just go try them. See what you prefer.
If you are spending this sort of money, no need to rush, try everything you can.
My reasoning may be completely different to yours. In my case if I can get optics that are if not better but in most cases on par with more expensive brands and offer the same features then its an easy decision.
However as previously mentioned, a lot of hype surrounds new scopes, (not sure this justifies rubbishing other brands), but the proof will be in the detail once the scopes are field tested.
I suggest you just go try them. See what you prefer.
If you are spending this sort of money, no need to rush, try everything you can.
My reasoning may be completely different to yours. In my case if I can get optics that are if not better but in most cases on par with more expensive brands and offer the same features then its an easy decision.
However as previously mentioned, a lot of hype surrounds new scopes, (not sure this justifies rubbishing other brands), but the proof will be in the detail once the scopes are field tested.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
Bullshit. Don't use your google knowledge to talk shit about S&B. S&Bs are used aorund the world and have an excellent track record of holding up in combat. <span style="font-weight: bold">Don't let some other company put together models having problems cloud the truth.</span> Even the USMC scopes are holding up well. </div></div>
Did I get that correctly that you are trying to say that there are problems that are not a result of the design but rather the assembly process? Now that is a pretty bold statement and I'm sure you can back it up with some further explanation. So, what are the problems that occur and how are they related to assembly rather than design? What was being done differently during assembly in one place vs. the other? Also, what is the source of your information?
If you cannot answer those questions convincingly, one would have to assume that Lowlight's statement
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">some people can't separate propaganda from the truth and they fail to realize a lot of these fairytales are started by competitors because they know idiots on the internet will promote the stories for them in order to sway opinion.</div></div>
was directed at the story you are just trying to make up.
Yeah, I know I'm not being very diplomatic here, but I think you just got a little bit carried away. As long as everything is fine, it's the greatness of the brand and design that is responsible, but as soon as there are problems, the blame goes to someone else? That explanation should seem just a little too convenient even for those without any further knowledge of the matter. Nothing wrong with promoting the advantages of one's pet brand. You know that I'm not shy to directly compare properties of different brands/models myself, so I don't see anything wrong with someone else doing the same. But if you make a claim like this, you should be prepared to back it up with facts.
To be very clear about this, I don't think that anybody should be surprised that the USMC breaks scopes, whatever the make and model, and I also don't think that internet chatter is a good source of information about whether they break an <span style="font-style: italic">unusual</span> number of scopes of a certain make and model.
Regards,
David
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problemchild</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
Bullshit. Don't use your google knowledge to talk shit about S&B. S&Bs are used aorund the world and have an excellent track record of holding up in combat. <span style="font-weight: bold">Don't let some other company put together models having problems cloud the truth.</span> Even the USMC scopes are holding up well. </div></div>
Did I get that correctly that you are trying to say that there are problems that are not a result of the design but rather the assembly process? Now that is a pretty bold statement and I'm sure you can back it up with some further explanation. So, what are the problems that occur and how are they related to assembly rather than design? What was being done differently during assembly in one place vs. the other? Also, what is the source of your information?
If you cannot answer those questions convincingly, one would have to assume that Lowlight's statement
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">some people can't separate propaganda from the truth and they fail to realize a lot of these fairytales are started by competitors because they know idiots on the internet will promote the stories for them in order to sway opinion.</div></div>
was directed at the story you are just trying to make up.
Yeah, I know I'm not being very diplomatic here, but I think you just got a little bit carried away. As long as everything is fine, it's the greatness of the brand and design that is responsible, but as soon as there are problems, the blame goes to someone else? That explanation should seem just a little too convenient even for those without any further knowledge of the matter. Nothing wrong with promoting the advantages of one's pet brand. You know that I'm not shy to directly compare properties of different brands/models myself, so I don't see anything wrong with someone else doing the same. But if you make a claim like this, you should be prepared to back it up with facts.
To be very clear about this, I don't think that anybody should be surprised that the USMC breaks scopes, whatever the make and model, and I also don't think that internet chatter is a good source of information about whether they break an <span style="font-style: italic">unusual</span> number of scopes of a certain make and model.
Regards,
David
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Pet brand... I have no affiliation to S&B, they don't advertise with me, sponsor me, or anything else by of the way of support, yet I do own 13 of them since quite a ways back. And I can say, next to my NF, which I also own in volume, <span style="font-style: italic">(both bought and paid for by me)</span> I have only had to use CS once... <span style="font-style: italic">(Never with my NF)</span> regardless of the abuse or number of rounds underneath.
I have never been accused of being soft on optics,
I can't say that about everything I have used, including discussions with you David which, if you want to air dirty laundry I am happy to do so as I feel nothing I would say I have no said to you and others in person.
But let's face it, sure Marines can break anything and will, but to say that S&B breaks 1 out of 3 is a bit of a stretch. Would Andi agree to that assessment of work he did prior to leaving, I doubt it. As far as the claims to workmanship, I have heard them, and don't repeat them, but heck you guys have had stories come out of your shop that were not repeated because certain people considered the sources, "disgruntled"... so as far as facts and rumor, we believe Problemchild more or former employees on specific subjects.
Pet brand... I have no affiliation to S&B, they don't advertise with me, sponsor me, or anything else by of the way of support, yet I do own 13 of them since quite a ways back. And I can say, next to my NF, which I also own in volume, <span style="font-style: italic">(both bought and paid for by me)</span> I have only had to use CS once... <span style="font-style: italic">(Never with my NF)</span> regardless of the abuse or number of rounds underneath.
I have never been accused of being soft on optics,
I can't say that about everything I have used, including discussions with you David which, if you want to air dirty laundry I am happy to do so as I feel nothing I would say I have no said to you and others in person.
But let's face it, sure Marines can break anything and will, but to say that S&B breaks 1 out of 3 is a bit of a stretch. Would Andi agree to that assessment of work he did prior to leaving, I doubt it. As far as the claims to workmanship, I have heard them, and don't repeat them, but heck you guys have had stories come out of your shop that were not repeated because certain people considered the sources, "disgruntled"... so as far as facts and rumor, we believe Problemchild more or former employees on specific subjects.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Frank,
my post wasn't directed at you at all, sorry if it came across that way. And I also wasn't going to air any dirty laundry, quite to the contrary. Personally, I think that "1 in 3 scopes broken"-claim is BS, exactly to what degree I don't know and don't really care.
My post was directed at Rob01's claim as highlighted in my response alone because I think he went a little overboard with his way of dealing with the "1 in 3"-BS.
Regards,
David
Frank,
my post wasn't directed at you at all, sorry if it came across that way. And I also wasn't going to air any dirty laundry, quite to the contrary. Personally, I think that "1 in 3 scopes broken"-claim is BS, exactly to what degree I don't know and don't really care.
My post was directed at Rob01's claim as highlighted in my response alone because I think he went a little overboard with his way of dealing with the "1 in 3"-BS.
Regards,
David
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Frank pretty much covered it. I know some of the same people he does. No need to air dirty laundry. And if you read it it didn't say that the putting together was the problem per se.
Sorry you think it was overboard. Just trying to straighten out Problemchild. Feel free to do so yourself as well.
For the record, I think the 1 in 3 scopes is BS as well.
Frank pretty much covered it. I know some of the same people he does. No need to air dirty laundry. And if you read it it didn't say that the putting together was the problem per se.
Sorry you think it was overboard. Just trying to straighten out Problemchild. Feel free to do so yourself as well.
For the record, I think the 1 in 3 scopes is BS as well.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BirdmanOz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
</div></div>
Do a search....a PH would be the last optic I'd use as a hammer.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BirdmanOz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
</div></div>
Do a search....a PH would be the last optic I'd use as a hammer.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problem child</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
I dunno about that, dude. I've used my S&B PMII extensively at the mall on weekends in my ninja outfit and it's seemed to hold up really well so far. Between dragging my rifle into hide sites somewhere near the GAP and Toys R Us as well as the abuse it's taken from thousands of rounds on my airsoft rifle..... I figure S&Bs are good to go.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: problem child</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Tried and true that breaks like mad in combat (sb).
</div></div>
I dunno about that, dude. I've used my S&B PMII extensively at the mall on weekends in my ninja outfit and it's seemed to hold up really well so far. Between dragging my rifle into hide sites somewhere near the GAP and Toys R Us as well as the abuse it's taken from thousands of rounds on my airsoft rifle..... I figure S&Bs are good to go.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
I've just paid for a March 3-24x FFP, without any opportunity (as usual down here) to 'try before you buy' unfortunately. I own another March which is on an F/TR gun and it is an excellent bit of glass, so no doubts about the quality of manufacture. Ilya Koshkin's review helped and the handiness and light weight of the scope were also factors in the decision - scope will be going on a short barreled, lighter 308.
S&B produces excellent scopes as well. I once had one get stuck between me and some bar-work on a vehicle I was standing in the back of, during a 'rapid, unscheduled vehicle deceleration due to presence of large hole'. It took a really heavy impact. I thought the thing would be u/s, but apart from a dent in the objective housing, it kept on keeping on.
The average user (which I am one of) doesn't really have the opportunity (or ability) to use a lot of these scopes to the limit of their durability and overall, there really isn't much daylight between a lot of the premium scope manufacturers in quality terms these days, so a lot of the arguments that go on are a bit asinine. It's also important to remember you wouldn't have to try too hard to break any scope. I think durability can be a bit of an overcooked factor in optics considerations. Important factor for sure - but you need to be realistic. They are optical instruments after all..
I've just paid for a March 3-24x FFP, without any opportunity (as usual down here) to 'try before you buy' unfortunately. I own another March which is on an F/TR gun and it is an excellent bit of glass, so no doubts about the quality of manufacture. Ilya Koshkin's review helped and the handiness and light weight of the scope were also factors in the decision - scope will be going on a short barreled, lighter 308.
S&B produces excellent scopes as well. I once had one get stuck between me and some bar-work on a vehicle I was standing in the back of, during a 'rapid, unscheduled vehicle deceleration due to presence of large hole'. It took a really heavy impact. I thought the thing would be u/s, but apart from a dent in the objective housing, it kept on keeping on.
The average user (which I am one of) doesn't really have the opportunity (or ability) to use a lot of these scopes to the limit of their durability and overall, there really isn't much daylight between a lot of the premium scope manufacturers in quality terms these days, so a lot of the arguments that go on are a bit asinine. It's also important to remember you wouldn't have to try too hard to break any scope. I think durability can be a bit of an overcooked factor in optics considerations. Important factor for sure - but you need to be realistic. They are optical instruments after all..
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Dr. Scholl I agree with you completely! This argument gets brought up a lot anymore with newer companies, not saying there shouldn't be questions brought up. It just gets a bit crazy! I have seen guys drop their March 3 feet onto concrete steps and dent the bell in 3/4" and still reliably function. Actually the guy placed 3rd in the competition in Austria!
I can stand behind these scopes without a doubt in my mind. They have been to Saskatchewan and Alaska for hunts and have performed excellently! We now have two scopes (D10V24TI- 1x-10x24mm) going to Afghanistan. One is there as we speak and another was ordered last week. These were ordered by individual military members, and I cannot wait to get their feedback.
What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them. Not debate about the TRIED and TRUE! I mean think about it, if no one tried something new then we would still be shooting lead balls through smooth bores with pins on the barrel as sights!
The debate of abuse from discipline to discipline is understandable, but on average our long range F-Class or Bench shooters are firing between 50-150 rounds a day. This can go on for 2-6 days straight and even longer for larger events! It is also nothing for a long range or bench shooter to fire over 10,000 rounds a year. The relentless recoil abuse is the true test! What good is a scope that can fall off a cliff and be ok, but won't function properly after 3,000 rounds of recoil? All I am saying is NO ONE that has a rig worth $3-7K is intentionally throwing the thing under a truck, shooting it, blowing it up, or throwing it off a cliff! I understand that the military demands products that go above and beyond normal scope use and March will handle the abuses thrown at it. What we really forget is the largest mountain to climb in any kind of rifle is the spring type air rifle. These types of rifles require SPECIAL scopes to accommodate the reversed recoil. March’s are being used by spring type air rifle shooters along with compressed air rifle shooters. I challenge anyone to put up their top scope designed for a centerfire rifle and to mount it side by side with a March on spring type air rifles to see which one will handle the recoil reliably!
The reason that March will take this kind of abuse is because of their manufacturing! They are hand assembling every one of the scopes that are made. They are engineered like nothing else on the market, and that is why precision competition shooters are using them! Not ONE part in a March scope is made of plastic and not ONE o-ring is used to hold the lenses in place! They are actually cemented in place! There is a 24 hour process to release the cement in the scopes, just so they can get inside to change a reticle or any parts that may need changing! If you DO break it, then they will fix it!
The initial test when the first March 10x-60x came to America was done with an AR-50 and a 6PPC railgun. The March started on the railgun and was tested for group accuracy. Then the 10x-60x made its way onto the AR-50 for a little test firing with the Objective faced rearward. That’s what I said it was on the .50 BMG BACKWARDS! It was fired ten times and then placed back onto the railgun. Holding the same POI as before with group sizing that didn’t experience any changes!
Guys what I am getting at is that no matter what discipline it is a GOOD scope is a GOOD scope and the crap scopes dissolve from the competition market!
If you order a scope from us we will stand behind it, we are selling these scopes because WE believe in them and WE use them! If you get a scope from us and take it out of the box and hate it or don’t like the reticle or anything like that, we will buy it back from you! We tell everyone that has doubts this very thing “If you don’t like it and have not mounted it on your rifle, then we will buy it back no questions asked!”
I hope everyone has a great start to the shooting season and I CANNOT wait until I can get out and shoot some matches this year!
Thank you,
Ian A. Kelbly
Kelbly’s Inc
330-683-4674
Kelbly.com
Dr. Scholl I agree with you completely! This argument gets brought up a lot anymore with newer companies, not saying there shouldn't be questions brought up. It just gets a bit crazy! I have seen guys drop their March 3 feet onto concrete steps and dent the bell in 3/4" and still reliably function. Actually the guy placed 3rd in the competition in Austria!
I can stand behind these scopes without a doubt in my mind. They have been to Saskatchewan and Alaska for hunts and have performed excellently! We now have two scopes (D10V24TI- 1x-10x24mm) going to Afghanistan. One is there as we speak and another was ordered last week. These were ordered by individual military members, and I cannot wait to get their feedback.
What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them. Not debate about the TRIED and TRUE! I mean think about it, if no one tried something new then we would still be shooting lead balls through smooth bores with pins on the barrel as sights!
The debate of abuse from discipline to discipline is understandable, but on average our long range F-Class or Bench shooters are firing between 50-150 rounds a day. This can go on for 2-6 days straight and even longer for larger events! It is also nothing for a long range or bench shooter to fire over 10,000 rounds a year. The relentless recoil abuse is the true test! What good is a scope that can fall off a cliff and be ok, but won't function properly after 3,000 rounds of recoil? All I am saying is NO ONE that has a rig worth $3-7K is intentionally throwing the thing under a truck, shooting it, blowing it up, or throwing it off a cliff! I understand that the military demands products that go above and beyond normal scope use and March will handle the abuses thrown at it. What we really forget is the largest mountain to climb in any kind of rifle is the spring type air rifle. These types of rifles require SPECIAL scopes to accommodate the reversed recoil. March’s are being used by spring type air rifle shooters along with compressed air rifle shooters. I challenge anyone to put up their top scope designed for a centerfire rifle and to mount it side by side with a March on spring type air rifles to see which one will handle the recoil reliably!
The reason that March will take this kind of abuse is because of their manufacturing! They are hand assembling every one of the scopes that are made. They are engineered like nothing else on the market, and that is why precision competition shooters are using them! Not ONE part in a March scope is made of plastic and not ONE o-ring is used to hold the lenses in place! They are actually cemented in place! There is a 24 hour process to release the cement in the scopes, just so they can get inside to change a reticle or any parts that may need changing! If you DO break it, then they will fix it!
The initial test when the first March 10x-60x came to America was done with an AR-50 and a 6PPC railgun. The March started on the railgun and was tested for group accuracy. Then the 10x-60x made its way onto the AR-50 for a little test firing with the Objective faced rearward. That’s what I said it was on the .50 BMG BACKWARDS! It was fired ten times and then placed back onto the railgun. Holding the same POI as before with group sizing that didn’t experience any changes!
Guys what I am getting at is that no matter what discipline it is a GOOD scope is a GOOD scope and the crap scopes dissolve from the competition market!
If you order a scope from us we will stand behind it, we are selling these scopes because WE believe in them and WE use them! If you get a scope from us and take it out of the box and hate it or don’t like the reticle or anything like that, we will buy it back from you! We tell everyone that has doubts this very thing “If you don’t like it and have not mounted it on your rifle, then we will buy it back no questions asked!”
I hope everyone has a great start to the shooting season and I CANNOT wait until I can get out and shoot some matches this year!
Thank you,
Ian A. Kelbly
Kelbly’s Inc
330-683-4674
Kelbly.com
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Talked to Ian,
I have a March on the way I am buying to try out...
Talked to Ian,
I have a March on the way I am buying to try out...
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talked to Ian,
I have a March on the way I am buying to try out... </div></div>
You had better get to reviewing, your scopes to review list is getting long!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talked to Ian,
I have a March on the way I am buying to try out...
You had better get to reviewing, your scopes to review list is getting long!
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Awwww Ian, you are gradually talking me into getting a second one. I got the 1-10 from you and it is quite the performer and looker. Guys at the range says my March topped AR is the most beautiful AR they've ever seen and its versatile too. 1x for CQB mode and 10x for long range.
Both the March and S&B have great glass but the March is way more compact than the S&B and just about all the other premium scopes. In the smaller two models, it also has more reticle travel too.
Awwww Ian, you are gradually talking me into getting a second one. I got the 1-10 from you and it is quite the performer and looker. Guys at the range says my March topped AR is the most beautiful AR they've ever seen and its versatile too. 1x for CQB mode and 10x for long range.
Both the March and S&B have great glass but the March is way more compact than the S&B and just about all the other premium scopes. In the smaller two models, it also has more reticle travel too.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Is the 1-10 daylight visible? Can you post some more info on this specific model?
TIA
Is the 1-10 daylight visible? Can you post some more info on this specific model?
TIA
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bacarrat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I looked through the March scopes at SHOT show. I thought they eye relief was very short and you had to be right behind the scope perfectly to get a good sight picture.
I think I have read before that the same people that make the March scopes also manufacture the Japanese NF scopes? Any truth to this? </div></div>
no... There are 4 guys at March tht make the scopes. they have nothing to do with NF...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bacarrat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I looked through the March scopes at SHOT show. I thought they eye relief was very short and you had to be right behind the scope perfectly to get a good sight picture.
I think I have read before that the same people that make the March scopes also manufacture the Japanese NF scopes? Any truth to this? </div></div>
no... There are 4 guys at March tht make the scopes. they have nothing to do with NF...
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It just gets a bit crazy! ... What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them.</div></div>
The question isn't crazy at all. I think the reason why people ask about comparisons is because what you're suggesting is asking A LOT from customers. Considering the price of these scopes, I don't see people just going out and dropping $2K+ just to "give 'em a chance" unless there is some sort of 100% money back guarantee (especially in this economy). What happens if I try it and I hate it?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It just gets a bit crazy! ... What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them.</div></div>
The question isn't crazy at all. I think the reason why people ask about comparisons is because what you're suggesting is asking A LOT from customers. Considering the price of these scopes, I don't see people just going out and dropping $2K+ just to "give 'em a chance" unless there is some sort of 100% money back guarantee (especially in this economy). What happens if I try it and I hate it?
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mo_Zam_Beek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is the 1-10 daylight visible? Can you post some more info on this specific model?
TIA </div></div>
The 1-10 has two illumination choices. The night time visible one and the daytime visible. I have the daytime visible one and on click #4, it does get bright enough to be visible even in a fairly bright setting.
You can look here for more details:
http://www.deon.co.jp/march/Reticle.htm#
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mo_Zam_Beek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is the 1-10 daylight visible? Can you post some more info on this specific model?
TIA </div></div>
The 1-10 has two illumination choices. The night time visible one and the daytime visible. I have the daytime visible one and on click #4, it does get bright enough to be visible even in a fairly bright setting.
You can look here for more details:
http://www.deon.co.jp/march/Reticle.htm#
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: recce556</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It just gets a bit crazy! ... What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them.</div></div>
The question isn't crazy at all. I think the reason why people ask about comparisons is because what you're suggesting is asking A LOT from customers. Considering the price of these scopes, I don't see people just going out and dropping $2K+ just to "give 'em a chance" unless there is some sort of 100% money back guarantee (especially in this economy). What happens if I try it and I hate it?
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Maybe I'm missing something but what is there that you could "hate" about a rifle scope. It's not like you would be the first to try it. I could imagine that you may disagree with it being the number one scope but its there abouts (certainly tier one). The pictures show what it looks like. The reviews and observations from quality shooters tell you it's up there with the very best. Whether its number one or number four - it's close race. It performs all functions to the highest standard. Simple.
I'm not sure what the scope buying experience in the USA is but here in Australia there are no stores that lend any scope for you to test properly. There are very few stores that carry a broad range of night force scopes let alone top tier S&B, march, premier etc. So the best you get here is a dealer that happens to have a NF in stock and you get to look through it in the store (not much of test). So if you guys are anything like us the only help you get is maybe having a go of someone else's at the range. There are probably enough march scopes down here to at least find one around at a range to have a look at / through in proper real world conditions.
I guess what I'm saying is that the chance of you "hating" it would be pretty slim. It would mean that everyone of the significant number of capable people that have used one are seriously off the mark. Unlikely. Not saying you would agree it's the best but I think you would agree its a contender if you used one.
Maybe it's because none of the big brands are supported down here so March is pretty much in the same boat as the others. In fact the march support is probably better because we have a highly respected Australian distributor that is a champion shooter (world standard) and he provides amazing support. I was sent a lapping kit for my rings and told it was a must to use it (at no cost to me). I'm not sure if the S&B and premier distributors do this. March are very serious about their precision. It has been made very clear to me that if there are any problems whatsoever it will be fixed no question.
Its early days but I think in time March will become a far more widely used brand with the best.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: recce556</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It just gets a bit crazy! ... What a new scope company needs is for you to TRY them.</div></div>
The question isn't crazy at all. I think the reason why people ask about comparisons is because what you're suggesting is asking A LOT from customers. Considering the price of these scopes, I don't see people just going out and dropping $2K+ just to "give 'em a chance" unless there is some sort of 100% money back guarantee (especially in this economy). What happens if I try it and I hate it?
</div></div>
Maybe I'm missing something but what is there that you could "hate" about a rifle scope. It's not like you would be the first to try it. I could imagine that you may disagree with it being the number one scope but its there abouts (certainly tier one). The pictures show what it looks like. The reviews and observations from quality shooters tell you it's up there with the very best. Whether its number one or number four - it's close race. It performs all functions to the highest standard. Simple.
I'm not sure what the scope buying experience in the USA is but here in Australia there are no stores that lend any scope for you to test properly. There are very few stores that carry a broad range of night force scopes let alone top tier S&B, march, premier etc. So the best you get here is a dealer that happens to have a NF in stock and you get to look through it in the store (not much of test). So if you guys are anything like us the only help you get is maybe having a go of someone else's at the range. There are probably enough march scopes down here to at least find one around at a range to have a look at / through in proper real world conditions.
I guess what I'm saying is that the chance of you "hating" it would be pretty slim. It would mean that everyone of the significant number of capable people that have used one are seriously off the mark. Unlikely. Not saying you would agree it's the best but I think you would agree its a contender if you used one.
Maybe it's because none of the big brands are supported down here so March is pretty much in the same boat as the others. In fact the march support is probably better because we have a highly respected Australian distributor that is a champion shooter (world standard) and he provides amazing support. I was sent a lapping kit for my rings and told it was a must to use it (at no cost to me). I'm not sure if the S&B and premier distributors do this. March are very serious about their precision. It has been made very clear to me that if there are any problems whatsoever it will be fixed no question.
Its early days but I think in time March will become a far more widely used brand with the best.
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What we really forget is the largest mountain to climb in any kind of rifle is the spring type air rifle. These types of rifles require SPECIAL scopes to accommodate the reversed recoil. March’s are being used by spring type air rifle shooters along with compressed air rifle shooters. I challenge anyone to put up their top scope designed for a centerfire rifle and to mount it side by side with a March on spring type air rifles to see which one will handle the recoil reliably! </div></div>
Ian,
In this comparison in this thread, the other scope in question is a Schmidt and Bender 5-25x56. I have read countless times (not that reading it makes it true,) that the Schmidt and Bender 5-25x56 PM2 is designed specifically to be able to handle the recoil of an air rifle, compressed air or spring. This is why it has a 10m parralax.
Certainly it is impressive that your scopes stand up to this, however, for the sake of comparison, I thought it needed to be pointed out that the Schmidt and Bender will handle this as well.
Thanks,
-Bob
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ian A. Kelbly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What we really forget is the largest mountain to climb in any kind of rifle is the spring type air rifle. These types of rifles require SPECIAL scopes to accommodate the reversed recoil. March’s are being used by spring type air rifle shooters along with compressed air rifle shooters. I challenge anyone to put up their top scope designed for a centerfire rifle and to mount it side by side with a March on spring type air rifles to see which one will handle the recoil reliably! </div></div>
Ian,
In this comparison in this thread, the other scope in question is a Schmidt and Bender 5-25x56. I have read countless times (not that reading it makes it true,) that the Schmidt and Bender 5-25x56 PM2 is designed specifically to be able to handle the recoil of an air rifle, compressed air or spring. This is why it has a 10m parralax.
Certainly it is impressive that your scopes stand up to this, however, for the sake of comparison, I thought it needed to be pointed out that the Schmidt and Bender will handle this as well.
Thanks,
-Bob
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
Called Kelbly's this morning - my March scope is supposed to be shipped to them on May 26th, so I should have it by the 2nd week in June.
Can't wait to try it out!!
Called Kelbly's this morning - my March scope is supposed to be shipped to them on May 26th, so I should have it by the 2nd week in June.
Can't wait to try it out!!
Re: How does March compare to S&B?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BirdmanOz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
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Do a search....a PH would be the last optic I'd use as a hammer. </div></div>
As for me, a hammer is about the only thing I'd use a Premier Reticles optic for now. Furthermore, the only (PR)ick scope I own will be for sale as soon as I find its replacement. Won't be for sale here though, I don't have the post count.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Poison123</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BirdmanOz</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Also worth saying that if my life was on the line (which it isnt) then i would be going with the toughest most proven option there was (not that you'd get a choice). The premiers look like you could use them as a hammer. NF feel pretty tough as well.
</div></div>
Do a search....a PH would be the last optic I'd use as a hammer. </div></div>
As for me, a hammer is about the only thing I'd use a Premier Reticles optic for now. Furthermore, the only (PR)ick scope I own will be for sale as soon as I find its replacement. Won't be for sale here though, I don't have the post count.
