Suppressors Interesting article on hearing loss...

[DIBBS]

I found this interesting. I try and wear double protection when shooting a braked rifle, but in the rare competition I participate in, or when shooting with friends that dont have suppressors. However, some muzzle brakes are just plain abusive to those around. Perhaps this explains my constant ringing ears, and continuing hearing loss.

Concussive Hearing Loss « Daily Bulletin

Content tagged with Concussive Hearing Loss.

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[kthomas]

Thanks for sharing.

I plan on shooting 100% suppressed once I get my suppressor approved. No real reason not to, and I would hate myself if I lost my hearing and had a tool at my disposal to prevent it.

 

[pmclaine]

I understood muffs help with this.

Thought it broke the vibration wave coming through the bones.

 

[E. Bryant]

Also consider that many popular muffs (such as the Howard Leight Impact ones that I use) don't really reduce nose enough on their own. 22db of noise reduction isn't all that great when you're starting at 160+, and that latter number often gets worse in the proximity of barricades and other hard surfaces.

 

[samb300]

I share that article whenever the topic of brake vs suppressor comes up. Inevitably the argument of doubling-up ear pro comes up, which is not the magic solution some think it is. People need to remember that double ear pro doesn't double the NRR, i.e. 30 dB plugs + 25 dB muffs does NOT equal a 55 dB reduction. (I won't claim to know the math, but it might be more like 35-40 dB total) The frequency of the sound has an effect on how well the ear pro works as well, then facial + ear anatomy for bone conduction, etc.

That being said, I'm willing to sacrifice the ultimate recoil reduction and barrel length/muzzle velocity in order to use a suppressor whenever I shoot matches. Using a suppressor means I don't have headaches at the end of the day, and don't have to worry that in 10 or 20 years my hearing will be markedly worse. So many match shooters seem to think that they have to use a monster brake to be competitive; to that I say - yes, it helps...but having proper fundamentals helps a lot as well. I used a 6.5x47L with a bare muzzle for an entire season while I waited for my TBAC to get out of jail, and I think that helped my shooting skills more than any 6mm with a 3-port brake ever would have.

 

[NorthWesterner]

Concussive hearing damage is why I bought a can. I plan on shooting %100 suppressed at matches with my ultra 7. Once my 338 ultra gets out of jail I won’t have to use anything but a can for a long while.

 

[NateVA]

I'm not a match shooter but I don't shoot without a suppressor anymore, ever. I have the whole TBAC Ultra lineup for my centerfires and their 22-TD for my rimfires. I do not buy new guns which can't be suppressed either.

 

[deersniper]

SUPPRESSED supersonic RIFLES AREN'T HEARING SAFE!!!

Shouting because you probably can’t hear me. .22s are bad for your ears too without a can or supersonic.

 

[kthomas]

SUPPRESSED supersonic RIFLES AREN'T HEARING SAFE!!!

Shouting because you probably can’t hear me. .22s are bad for your ears too without a can or supersonic.

Absolutely correct. Still recommended to wear hearing protection.

It's just another layer of protection for your ears, not to be used alone unless you still want hearing damage.

 

[NateVA]

SUPPRESSED supersonic RIFLES AREN'T HEARING SAFE!!!

Shouting because you probably can’t hear me. .22s are bad for your ears too without a can or supersonic.

I'm tired so my reading comprehension is out the window right now. Who said they are hearing safe? I'm confused as to who you're replying to. The thread is about concussive hearing loss, not "take your earplugs/earmuffs off and just shoot suppressed".

 

[deersniper]

I guess I was inferring too much from some of the replies.

But that is a common misconception here, other forums and IRL

How many times have you read that a can is “hearing safe”

 

[NateVA]

I guess I was inferring too much from some of the replies.

But that is a common misconception here, other forums and IRL

How many times have you read that a can is “hearing safe”

I mean hearing safe is a question of amount of rounds fired. My TBAC Ultra-9 is hearing safe for my hunting because I only fire one shot. Hearing loss in this respect has to do with the additive effect of multiple shots. For hunting I use no ear-pro but for any other shooting I use earplugs and suppressors.

 

[johnnyG]

I am an Ear, Nose, and Throat surgeon (Otolaryngology) and hopefully can shed some light on this article. Concussive trauma that is transmitted though the bones of the skull (not the face) causes a type of hearing loss called conductive hearing loss as a result of dislocation of the middle ear bones (ossicles) or perforation of the eardrum. This is seen with explosions that have a very concussive air pressure and sound pressure that cause that kind of damage, like a bomb. Perhaps there are some rifles with brakes that could do this, but I doubt it. To find out if shooting with a braked rifle causes conductive hearing loss you would need a formal audiogram. I have never seen this in my practice on patients that shoot a lot. It is always the noise induced nerve hearing loss not conductive hearing loss. Now, it is possible that an extremely loud gun can cause noise induced hearing loss in spite of wearing hearing protection, especially if ear muffs are not used. Sound waves from the blast also hit our skull, particularly the temporal bone and these sound waves are transmitted to the cochlea (hearing apparatus) and then passed on to the hearing nerve and brain. In fact, when we test for conductive hearing loss the sound is presented directly to the temporal bone. When we shoot, however, that loud sound of the shot is distributed over the entire skull so you can't say that all 140 dB are passed on through the bone. I don't know how much exactly but it isn't a lot. Wearing ear muffs I think is extremely important and the more they cover the bone around your ear the better off you are. We all should do everything we can to reduce our exposure to the noise our guns make. Shooting suppressed is better, of course. But shooting a braked gun is not going to cause conductive hearing loss as this article states. Hearing loss due to loud noise exposure of the magnitude we are exposed to with guns happens over time and takes months to years to developed, unless it is a very loud blast without any protection at all. Who knows, maybe, his hearing loss just happened to manifest the year he started shooting the braked gun in comp.. Another suggestion I have is to do what you can to reduce that loud blast when you shoot. I put a soft foam sleeping pad on the bench or floor to absorb the blast. I also put a lead filled bag on the ground between my left ear and the brake of the gun to block as much of it as I can. I have seen other shooters at the range look at me weird with my set up. Oh well.

 

[NET65]

This is why I love the hide.
Thanks Doc

I am an Ear, Nose, and Throat surgeon (Otolaryngology) and hopefully can shed some light on this article. Concussive trauma that is transmitted though the bones of the skull (not the face) causes a type of hearing loss called conductive hearing loss as a result of dislocation of the middle ear bones (ossicles) or perforation of the eardrum. This is seen with explosions that have a very concussive air pressure and sound pressure that cause that kind of damage, like a bomb. Perhaps there are some rifles with brakes that could do this, but I doubt it. To find out if shooting with a braked rifle causes conductive hearing loss you would need a formal audiogram. I have never seen this in my practice on patients that shoot a lot. It is always the noise induced nerve hearing loss not conductive hearing loss. Now, it is possible that an extremely loud gun can cause noise induced hearing loss in spite of wearing hearing protection, especially if ear muffs are not used. Sound waves from the blast also hit our skull, particularly the temporal bone and these sound waves are transmitted to the cochlea (hearing apparatus) and then passed on to the hearing nerve and brain. In fact, when we test for conductive hearing loss the sound is presented directly to the temporal bone. When we shoot, however, that loud sound of the shot is distributed over the entire skull so you can't say that all 140 dB are passed on through the bone. I don't know how much exactly but it isn't a lot. Wearing ear muffs I think is extremely important and the more they cover the bone around your ear the better off you are. We all should do everything we can to reduce our exposure to the noise our guns make. Shooting suppressed is better, of course. But shooting a braked gun is not going to cause conductive hearing loss as this article states. Hearing loss due to loud noise exposure of the magnitude we are exposed to with guns happens over time and takes months to years to developed, unless it is a very loud blast without any protection at all. Who knows, maybe, his hearing loss just happened to manifest the year he started shooting the braked gun in comp.. Another suggestion I have is to do what you can to reduce that loud blast when you shoot. I put a soft foam sleeping pad on the bench or floor to absorb the blast. I also put a lead filled bag on the ground between my left ear and the brake of the gun to block as much of it as I can. I have seen other shooters at the range look at me weird with my set up. Oh well.

 

[loveha]

Holy sheet, a sturgeon with knowledge for us. Thanks Doc.

I need to see one of you type of guys this year. Always put it off because I don't think anything can really be done. I bounced my head off the pavement a while back and my left ear was muffled for a couple months. Bass tones were all screwed up. For a long time my right ear feels like something rattles inside during certain noise pitches. Think that was also from head trauma. Want to say getting kneed in the side of the head playing flag football during PT in 2011. Rolled over on my back and the blue sky looked purple for a few moments. Went to medical for that one.

Thankfully, I still "pass" my hearing tests my civilian company has us do each year, and I only have slight tinnitus.

I still wear ear pro with my cans if I'm doing any long term shooting. Hunting I don't or just checking zero I don't always put my plugs in.