Kestrel 4500 and Crosswind Headwind function

[NevadaZielmeister]

Gentlemen,

I was wondering if anyone has used the Crosswind/Headwind function within the Kestrel 4500. I have read the manual to figure out how to perform this feature, but have no first hand experience and online resources are limited regarding if it really works.

Does anyone have first hand knowledge using this function in field conditions? Does it work well? What do you like or not like about it? Did it improve your wind calls?

Now I understand that a lot of people will talk about wind at the location of the shooter versus the target location and so on. I do not need schooling in this. Only if the function of the Kestrel was really worth the extra money over just a regular weather meter.

I thank you in advance for any assistance.

 

[LawnMM]

In my experience the wind moves around too much to really make this useful. By the time you have set your bearing and then measured wind speed from the new bearing it changes, by the time you get a crosswind and get on the rifle, it changes again.

I really like the Applied Ballistics Kestrel because you can manually set up the wind direction and two speeds. You can use the compass and capture features if time allows. For competition settings though I like to set up the wind for 9 o' clock (full value) and wind speeds at 5mph and 10mph. Then it displays your 5/10mph fv holds and you can scale them down or up as needes and on the fly.

If my 5/10 at 500yds are 0.5/1.0mil and its a 3/4 value how hard is it to hold at 0.35/0.75? It keeps the math simple and adaptable to the changing conditions. It also keeps you from constantly trying to capture changing crosswinds.

You get a shifty head or tail wind and its impossible to keep up with the crosswind feature. If you are bent on using it upgrade to the Applied Ballistics version. At least you can hit the picture button and have it pump in live wind speeds after you set bearing to target.

In summary... Its not very useful in field conditions. May be more useful on a range where you aren't under pressure or on the clock.

 

[Darkside-Six]

^^ I agree.

I don't use the cross wind function personally. I just point the kestrel into the wind and take a reading. easy to get an average that way and less time consuming.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

In my experience the wind moves around too much to really make this useful. By the time you have set your bearing and then measured wind speed from the new bearing it changes, by the time you get a crosswind and get on the rifle, it changes again.

I really like the Applied Ballistics Kestrel because you can manually set up the wind direction and two speeds. You can use the compass and capture features if time allows. For competition settings though I like to set up the wind for 9 o' clock (full value) and wind speeds at 5mph and 10mph. Then it displays your 5/10mph fv holds and you can scale them down or up as needes and on the fly.

If my 5/10 at 500yds are 0.5/1.0mil and its a 3/4 value how hard is it to hold at 0.35/0.75? It keeps the math simple and adaptable to the changing conditions. It also keeps you from constantly trying to capture changing crosswinds.

You get a shifty head or tail wind and its impossible to keep up with the crosswind feature. If you are bent on using it upgrade to the Applied Ballistics version. At least you can hit the picture button and have it pump in live wind speeds after you set bearing to target.

In summary... Its not very useful in field conditions. May be more useful on a range where you aren't under pressure or on the clock.

I understand what you mean regarding the changing winds. I deal with on a constant basis in the wide open competitions where I am trying to ring the Woodchuck silhouette at 400meters and the Rabbit silhouette at 500 meters. Those are always tough shots.

I have a question. When you say "manually" set up, are talking about setting up the "flight path" direction? Once that is entered, doesn't the Kestrel 4500 then take a real time reading of the wind and the compass reading, giving you the true cross wind?

Yes, I can see how using a Kestrel in the field is not completely practical. My thoughts regarding a Kestrel, in getting equipped for the upcoming Sniper's Hide Cup, I would imagine I could take readings in the staging area to get a rough idea regarding winds, and then put it away when it is time to shoot. I completely get that I cannot lay there for a few minutes messing around with the Kestrel when I am shooting.

How do you use your Kestrel then? Because it sounds like most people are buying it just for the Applie Ballistics and Horus ATRAG software. Am I right?

Thank you again for your assistance.

 

[LawnMM]

. have a question. When you say "manually" set up, are talking about setting up the "flight path" direction? Once that is entered, doesn't the Kestrel 4500 then take a real time reading of the wind and the compass reading, giving you the true cross wind?

Correct. That's how it's supposed to work. However it is only valid for where you are standing. If you move, start over. If terrain features influence the wind speed or direction between you and the target, no dice.

Yes, I can see how using a Kestrel in the field is not completely practical. My thoughts regarding a Kestrel, in getting equipped for the upcoming Sniper's Hide Cup, I would imagine I could take readings in the staging area to get a rough idea regarding winds, and then put it away when it is time to shoot. I completely get that I cannot lay there for a few minutes messing around with the Kestrel when I am shooting.

Yes. You can do that. However its not necessarily the correct information. I've shot a monthly match at the same place and there are shooting positions where you will get a wind speed from the Kestrel and thats absolutely not the correct wind speed.

How do you use your Kestrel then? Because it sounds like most people are buying it just for the Applie Ballistics and Horus ATRAG software. Am I right?

Thank you again for your assistance.

I have the Applied Ballistics version and its definitely nice for our purposes. Even before that though I did the conversion myself. I'd measure the wind speed, check the angle to target, adjust the solution and then favor a bit more or less depending on other factors like terrain and different shooting positions.

My advice is from a competition viewpoint, your hands will be full already so there isn't time to be goofing with it under the clock. You need to have an idea what your hold is before you step up. So checking readings in the staging area like you said is a good plan. I'm just saying I wouldn't call it a 4mph full value wind just because the Kestrel says that's your number.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

Excellent information LawnMM. Thank you.

I plan on creating my range data card with the assistance of the Kestrel in the staging area prior to starting my stage. Then I will make slight corrections depending on my success.

One method I have used is where I measure in my mil radian reticle how far I was off, then work backwards regarding the wind reading. So instance. I shoot at the 400 meter target and I was off by .2 mil radians. Well than meant, based on my FDAC, that it was a 6 mph wind instead of a 4mph wind and so I adjust my wind call when I shoot at the 600 meter target. With the 400 meter being in-between, it will give me a generally good idea regarding my wind call. Then I will hit the 600 meter dead on.

This technique, will hopefully work at the Cup.

I just know that once I get really good at wind calls with my .308 cartridge, I will be VERY good when I step up to the 6mm and the 6.5mm calibers, which is what everyone is using it seems.

Thank you for the information. As luck would had it, my shooting partner, who will be going with me to the Cup, just purchased the Kestrel 4500 Applied Ballistics. I will play with his.

 

[t-payne]

I've used the crosswind function quite a bit and it works really well. Mainly in areas I have never shot with winds over 10 mph. Being from GA, anything over 10 mph is a guess for me anyway so it helps to at least get close.

 

[medic727]

To make the crosswind function work for you, there are 2 things you need. The free-swiveling tripod attachment and the bluetooth feature. Set your compass for the direct to target bearing. As the Kestrel swings the crosswind updates go to the smartphone. There is a downloadable app, free, that hooks everything up. Almost forgot, the app is for the Shooter app. I can see where manually swinging the Kestrel can be too time consuming to work anywhere near realtime.

 

[MJY65]

Something I've been meaning to try, but seem to forget.

How accurately (or inaccurately) does the Kestrel measure a crosswind if instead of holding the face directly into the wind, you hold it perpendicular to the line of sight. In other words, the wind is actually hitting the propeller at an angle. Does it give you anything close to a crosswind component, or does it mess up the way the prop spins enough to make it meaningless?

 

[LawnMM]

Excellent information LawnMM. Thank you.

I plan on creating my range data card with the assistance of the Kestrel in the staging area prior to starting my stage. Then I will make slight corrections depending on my success.

One method I have used is where I measure in my mil radian reticle how far I was off, then work backwards regarding the wind reading. So instance. I shoot at the 400 meter target and I was off by .2 mil radians. Well than meant, based on my FDAC, that it was a 6 mph wind instead of a 4mph wind and so I adjust my wind call when I shoot at the 600 meter target. With the 400 meter being in-between, it will give me a generally good idea regarding my wind call. Then I will hit the 600 meter dead on.

This technique, will hopefully work at the Cup.

I just know that once I get really good at wind calls with my .308 cartridge, I will be VERY good when I step up to the 6mm and the 6.5mm calibers, which is what everyone is using it seems.

Thank you for the information. As luck would had it, my shooting partner, who will be going with me to the Cup, just purchased the Kestrel 4500 Applied Ballistics. I will play with his.

That's not a bad plan, but I'll share a piece of advice I received from a shooter much better than I am. Instead of trying to figure out the exact wind speed and doing all the forwards/backwards math. Just look at it in terms of a percentage of your 10mph hold. To keep it easy, lets say you 500yd 10mph FV hold is 1.0 mil. If you shoot and it lands a half mil off, rather than calling it a five mph hold, call it 50% of your 10mph. Then when the next target is at 750 and the 10mph FV is 1.5 mils, you know to use .75 and you are quite likely to get a hit. The information is also much more communicable if shooting with a friend. If I'm shooting 6.5cm and you are shooting 308 and I give you a hold of half a mil at 650 yards, you will miss. If I relate that to you as a third of my 10mph FV hold at that distance, its easier for you to convert.

Something I've been meaning to try, but seem to forget.

How accurately (or inaccurately) does the Kestrel measure a crosswind if instead of holding the face directly into the wind, you hold it perpendicular to the line of sight. In other words, the wind is actually hitting the propeller at an angle. Does it give you anything close to a crosswind component, or does it mess up the way the prop spins enough to make it meaningless?

You set the bearing to target, which it remembers, then hold it facing into the wind and it does the math based off the angle. You've got it a bit backwards.

 

[MJY65]

You set the bearing to target, which it remembers, then hold it facing into the wind and it does the math based off the angle. You've got it a bit backwards.

I understand the way it's designed to work. I was just wondering if the method I described would give a "quick and dirty" result that would be close enough when you don't have time to set the bearing, etc.

 

[LawnMM]

I understand the way it's designed to work. I was just wondering if the method I described would give a "quick and dirty" result that would be close enough when you don't have time to set the bearing, etc.

No. It won't give an accurate reading doing that.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

So the 4500NV arrived today and I was able to try the crosswind function. Very easy and straightforward function to use. I was able to tell the reduction in adjusted crosswind speed when I neared the proposed bullet path (or "flight path" in the manual). It gave both readings of the calculated crosswind speed, the actual wind speed and then the actual full wind speed. All three of these readings are important to ensure you are not inputing things wrong and then getting an incorrect reading.

Now to this weekend to really try it out.

All in all, very happy with my purchase. I already like the Max and Average functions, as well as the Density Altitude reading. It is nice to have it accurate to better chose my firing solution with my FDAC.

Thank you for all of the help everyone.

 

[NevadaZielmeister]

Gentlemen, especially LawnMM.

I was able to use the Kestrel 4500. It was a very helpful tool. I am now wondering how I was able to survive without it.

The crosswind function is valuable. It does not complete solve your crosswind problem, but really gives you a better guess. The problem I had was mostly using it in the forest, with heavy tree coverage and steep hills. The court my friend put together years ago really tests your skills in reading the terrain and how it relates to your shot. However, I did score a shot out to 954 meters and the Kestrel came in handy.

I must admit that the greatest function was the Density Altitude reading. It changed quite a bit. I did find that you absolutely need the molle pouch so that you do not have the Kestrel mounted on your person, your pocket, or in your pack. When you take out the Kestrel, it changes everything. So having it out in the environment is very important.

Thank you all again for all of your help. I am happy with my purchase. Now, onward for more practice.

 

[LawnMM]

Sounds like you are on the right track, it's a very useful tool provided people use it to verify their estimates and no as a solution or a crutch.

With practice your estimates will get better and better and using DA to pick out which dope card to use is handy