Where that would really be nice would be in some sort of larger optic like a PVS 27 or PVS 30
Night Vision L3 Unfilmed vs Photonis Echo
- Thread starter GBMaryland
- Start date
Is that an OMNI VII AVS-6?
It is not. It's a plain 10160 WG made by L3 in 2007. So it shouldn't be anything special.
There are some damn nice Omni seven tubes out there… I had an ITT AVS-6 that is one of the nicest tools I ever had...
In extreme low light, the L3 Unfilmed is the winner. That's not going to change for now...
Elbit tubes tend to have, at least recently, higher EBIs and Halos than L3 or Photonis - at least in the commercial market space.
(As mentioned earlier, L3 seems to have cracked the code for great specs... and Photonis uses a different technology, which leads to low EBI / Halo / High Center Resolution on par with L3. In very dark conditions the L3 has a contrast that Photonis can't equal, but with the "4G+" it's very close.)
Ok... hitting something with an illuminator at 100 yards will wash any tube to some extent... the Phontis Intens (aka 4G, aka MilSpec, aka some other marking gimmick) will do a little better and probably stay at about 55-60 lp/mm for the center resolution.
Even at 500 yards the photonis is going to do great... and it's probably going to do great at 1000 yards.
The L3 is going to do well as well. In circumstances where the light is very bright, it's going to be half as clear as it normally would.
However, don't kid yourself, those L3 tubes do pretty well... you just aren't going to be reading license plates off of cars in anything that would be a high light environmental issue... as the L3 is gonna get pretty fuzzy.
The ECHO tubes are darker. Period. However, they are incredibly cost effective. Image quality on high signal-to-noise / 68 lp/mm Echo tubes is OUTSTANDING. However, they are not L3 Unfilmed tubes, and they are not 4G tubes... ...but, as others have pointed out: you can get an Echo for under $3000.00. You can a really good L3 for $4500-5000.
Both will work fine for you at 500 yards, and at 1000 yards... your eyes will probably be more of a factor.
I was told that the Intens are similar to the Echo in terms of how much darker they are than gen 3 and your pics on page 2 seems to confirm that's the case. Is that accurate?
That was not the case with my 2500+ FOM Intens tube.
visually, to the eye, it was fairly bright and pretty nice. The difference is the amount of contrast in very dark and environments.
The L3 by contrast has a tendency to be a little more bleached out because it’s so bright at the screen; and without a doubt it has ever so slightly better contrast In very dark environments...
The echo actually is darker at the screen. While the screen is really clean and it looks fantastic it is definitely darker to the eyeball.
It’s not a deal killer kind of darker. But the echo tubes are darker than the intens, L3, I TT, Elbit, XR5, And probably other tubes I’ve used over the years
visually, to the eye, it was fairly bright and pretty nice. The difference is the amount of contrast in very dark and environments.
The L3 by contrast has a tendency to be a little more bleached out because it’s so bright at the screen; and without a doubt it has ever so slightly better contrast In very dark environments...
The echo actually is darker at the screen. While the screen is really clean and it looks fantastic it is definitely darker to the eyeball.
It’s not a deal killer kind of darker. But the echo tubes are darker than the intens, L3, I TT, Elbit, XR5, And probably other tubes I’ve used over the years
Oh yeah and I’ll put brightness at the screen for each of those tubes was pretty comparable except one was white and one was green
What, you don’t have one of those?
Ahem... fixed
The eggshell blue image and the green green image are both time lapse at three second exposure.
How does the crazy dark bedroom it’s pretty clear the L3 has much better contrast in the time lapse photo.
Also not talking apples to apples here as not only is the technology different, but the Photonis Intens 4G is a 29.5:1 SN, and made in 2016.
I don't know were my eyes are more sensitive to green or not. But the green intens looks brighter to me in the woods. In the bed room L3 def looks clearer and brighter.
The L3 tube I have will definitely do better than the Intense tube I have in super darkness.
If I had an Intens with a 35:1 signal to noise, then it would be much closer.
This was a brand new but made is 2016, vs an L3 made
A few months ago
If I had an Intens with a 35:1 signal to noise, then it would be much closer.
This was a brand new but made is 2016, vs an L3 made
A few months ago
Oh, and for what it’s worth if anybody needs additions wide angle C Mount lenses for C Mount based NVDs (such as the Mod3, Mod3b, ENVIS, etc)...
I put in a lowball bid on eBay for 50 of these lenses, and I actually won… So now rather than two of them I’ve got 48 extras!
The only thing I’d want you to pay shipping
I put in a lowball bid on eBay for 50 of these lenses, and I actually won… So now rather than two of them I’ve got 48 extras!
The only thing I’d want you to pay shipping
What does this lens do?
Aperture disk fixed it at f/2.8 but if you remove the 3 screws on the back end, just behind the c-mount adapter, you can pop the lens in half and remove the aperture disk. This will get you the maximum aperture of f/1.8, well worth doing.
Good call compass call!
So on the ruggedized version of the lens, you actually have to takeoff the focus ring...
Then, you take a very very micro slotted screwdriver and remove a setscrew from the threaded barrel at the back of the lens. I highly recommend you don’t take it out completely.
Once the setscrew is removed you may be able to remove the rear lens assembly simply using your fingers. I however use the spanner wrench to do this…
The hard part was removing the aperture disk without touching any of the other lens components. I have some actual instruments that allow me to get underneath it and give the aperture disk a good yank so that it pulls out.
The lens does work relatively well for looking at the sky, but it absolutely does not pass quite as much light as an ENVIS lens does.
Comparing the photonis and the L3 I have, The L3 is ever so slightly better at showing an image with respect to contrast.
What was interesting is that in the tester using both lens types, the photons tube was able to show more lines clearly in the tester image.
One of the annoying things is that the camera perceives green and white very differently, preventing really great pictures of the L3 tube. I will say though that it is true that the futon is tube was better in the tester with the Schneider lens.
So on the ruggedized version of the lens, you actually have to takeoff the focus ring...
Then, you take a very very micro slotted screwdriver and remove a setscrew from the threaded barrel at the back of the lens. I highly recommend you don’t take it out completely.
Once the setscrew is removed you may be able to remove the rear lens assembly simply using your fingers. I however use the spanner wrench to do this…
The hard part was removing the aperture disk without touching any of the other lens components. I have some actual instruments that allow me to get underneath it and give the aperture disk a good yank so that it pulls out.
The lens does work relatively well for looking at the sky, but it absolutely does not pass quite as much light as an ENVIS lens does.
Comparing the photonis and the L3 I have, The L3 is ever so slightly better at showing an image with respect to contrast.
What was interesting is that in the tester using both lens types, the photons tube was able to show more lines clearly in the tester image.
One of the annoying things is that the camera perceives green and white very differently, preventing really great pictures of the L3 tube. I will say though that it is true that the futon is tube was better in the tester with the Schneider lens.
It effectively gives you a wide angle night vision field of view if you have a C mount style lens system for your mod3 or ENVIS housings.
If you try to buy one of those lenses new they are unbelievably expensive, especially if they have an adjustable Iris.
I did find a similar computar lens, but it’s got a slight bit of magnification. It does however work very well.
I have to get my ass up to the club some night and take a look at the sky using these two twos for some more comparisons.
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