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mark larue is a great guy

Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess being from Jersey, I have a different mentality. I don't understand the "if we can't have it, neither should you." I'm happy that people in PA and states all across the country don't have the same retarded gun laws that we have here in NJ and NY. So I don't get the mentality that me as a cop, I should only have the same thing that everyone else has on our duty weapons.

For my personal weapons, I agree that I should only have the same thing that every other gun owner in my state has, but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. I wish I could have the same weapons at home, but I have to make due with what I am allowed to have, which is an AR with a fixed stock, permanently attached muzzle brake, and 15 round mags. </div></div>



Why should you be afforded weapons that possession of for non-le is criminal?

Are you anti-second amendment? The purpose of the second amendment is for citizens to have the same arms as those in power, should they become tyrants. What makes your life more valuable, as an officer, than the life of any citizen of your jurisdiction such that you should have better tools for defense?

You are on an ethical slippery slope. </div></div>

It isn't my life that I'm trying to protect you moron. I want the best weapons at work to protect the innocent people that can't protect themselves. </div></div>

And you resort to name calling. Police are reactionary to crime. People must be able to protect themselves. I don't want to deny any weapon to LE, but I don't want want them to have anything individuals cannot. That creates a bad, bad situation.

Please, have an adult conversation, not resorting to childish name calling. It doesn't help your case. </div></div>

Sorry for calling you a moron. I obviously misdiagnosed you. You are a delusional gun nut. You actually think cops are going to turn into tyrants. That's cute. You should make a movie. Maybe you can include zombies in it.

You seem to forget that the criminals don't exactly follow the gun laws. So you expect me and my fellow officers to have to use lesser equipment to stop the scumbag criminals, just so you don't get butthurt because the big bad PoPo gets to have some cooler toys than you.

I take it back. You are a fucking moron.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess being from Jersey, I have a different mentality. I don't understand the "if we can't have it, neither should you." I'm happy that people in PA and states all across the country don't have the same retarded gun laws that we have here in NJ and NY. So I don't get the mentality that me as a cop, I should only have the same thing that everyone else has on our duty weapons.

For my personal weapons, I agree that I should only have the same thing that every other gun owner in my state has, but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. I wish I could have the same weapons at home, but I have to make due with what I am allowed to have, which is an AR with a fixed stock, permanently attached muzzle brake, and 15 round mags. </div></div>

Why should you be afforded weapons that possession of for non-le is criminal?

Are you anti-second amendment? The purpose of the second amendment is for citizens to have the same arms as those in power, should they become tyrants. What makes your life more valuable, as an officer, than the life of any citizen of your jurisdiction such that you should have better tools for defense?

You are on an ethical slippery slope. </div></div>

It isn't my life that I'm trying to protect you moron. I want the best weapons at work to protect the innocent people that can't protect themselves. </div></div>

The public has the same right to protect them selves with the best available, should you have access to something the public does not NO. If LEO has a need then so does the public period
its that simple

When you get into separate law for LE and public then your quickly becoming a police state
Disarm the public disarm the police
Perhaps then the anti gun cops will be happy
LE is not above law nor exempt from it, you get to suffer the same stupidity as the rest of us
</div></div>

So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military?
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military? </div></div>

I'm not really for getting in-between the both of you but, it's interesting that nobody sees this from the perspective of a business.

One mistake and the man loses his entire business.

Why can't LEO's do what everyone else does? Order the upper and lower separately and then order your own parts.

You still haven't communicated why you're above the man's business or anyone for that matter.

As to your argument...Military have no restrictions, we do.

How can he make a mistake on a military rifle in which there are no laws to abide by vs. ours in which each state has an incomplete law as to restrictions?

As a business, it's a very simple decision.

As an individual, there's a very simple solution.

I don't quite see what the issue is...None of us are worth the grand scheme of his business and employees.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Come on guys... Can't we just agree that "mark larue is a great guy"?
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Funny, some day as an LEo you will report to work and draw your weapon and will not have a weapon off duty! look at europe.The military is not exempte it will be and is that way today. Once LEO police departments harm the people they are SUPOSEDLY protecting the battle will ensue! so watch you you piss off guy we are togeather NOW!
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

The seconadry issue here is why are laws so difficult to interrput and follow ??? i would protect my business and life firts sales would be second for all military , LEO, Civilians all treated the same.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess being from Jersey, I have a different mentality. I don't understand the "if we can't have it, neither should you." I'm happy that people in PA and states all across the country don't have the same retarded gun laws that we have here in NJ and NY. So I don't get the mentality that me as a cop, I should only have the same thing that everyone else has on our duty weapons.

For my personal weapons, I agree that I should only have the same thing that every other gun owner in my state has, but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. I wish I could have the same weapons at home, but I have to make due with what I am allowed to have, which is an AR with a fixed stock, permanently attached muzzle brake, and 15 round mags. </div></div>

I wish you would fight this hard for all our rights. When you respond to a school shooting, most likely dozens of civilians will have been fighting for their lives without such life-saving protection weapons. And from my experience at active shooter events, they will continue to fight unaided until such time that an overwhelming force can be assembled outside (unless Detective Callahan is employed there). That is not a complaint, just a fact.

Your comment about the military does not apply. They travel to foreign lands and face other militaries. Police face the same threats as every US citizen and I have always opposed the ability of a civilian police force to arm itself with personal defense weapons not legally available to the law abiding citizen. With rare exception, the first person to contact a violent criminal is going to be a civilian. You seem passionate about the ability to take up quality, efficient arms to protect yourself and others. You are compensated by we the people to do so. Lets direct that passion in the right direction to help us all retain our freedom.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Masked</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military? </div></div>

I'm not really for getting in-between the both of you but, it's interesting that nobody sees this from the perspective of a business.

One mistake and the man loses his entire business.

Why can't LEO's do what everyone else does? Order the upper and lower separately and then order your own parts.

You still haven't communicated why you're above the man's business or anyone for that matter.

As to your argument...Military have no restrictions, we do.

How can he make a mistake on a military rifle in which there are no laws to abide by vs. ours in which each state has an incomplete law as to restrictions?

As a business, it's a very simple decision.

As an individual, there's a very simple solution.

I don't quite see what the issue is...None of us are worth the grand scheme of his business and employees. </div></div>

I don't understand why you keep bringing this up. I don't want anyone to lose their business over this, even Larue, who I think is a scumbag. If there is a law saying that he can't sell to NY, then he can't sell to NY. As far as I know, thag law doesn't apply to NJ, yet he is not selling to us in NJ, correct?
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military? </div></div>

Posse Comitatus. Not saying I agree or disagree with the move, but NJ laws are a bit hazy, as are most laws in the more restrictive states.

Take for example the principal or "full faith and credit." Each state should give full faith and credit to acts, judicial process, and public acts (this includes legislative acts). This is a core constitutional value provided in Article IV. However, states choose to reinterpret or disregard. There's so much room for interpretation, even when talking about the values stored in a document as old as the Constitution. Think concealed carry licenses and marraige.

 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Redhooker</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess being from Jersey, I have a different mentality. I don't understand the "if we can't have it, neither should you." I'm happy that people in PA and states all across the country don't have the same retarded gun laws that we have here in NJ and NY. So I don't get the mentality that me as a cop, I should only have the same thing that everyone else has on our duty weapons.

For my personal weapons, I agree that I should only have the same thing that every other gun owner in my state has, but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. I wish I could have the same weapons at home, but I have to make due with what I am allowed to have, which is an AR with a fixed stock, permanently attached muzzle brake, and 15 round mags. </div></div>

I wish you would fight this hard for all our rights. When you respond to a school shooting, most likely dozens of civilians will have been fighting for their lives without such life-saving protection weapons. And from my experience at active shooter events, they will continue to fight unaided until such time that an overwhelming force can be assembled outside (unless Detective Callahan is employed there). That is not a complaint, just a fact.

Your comment about the military does not apply. They travel to foreign lands and face other militaries. Police face the same threats as every US citizen and I have always opposed the ability of a civilian police force to arm itself with personal defense weapons not legally available to the law abiding citizen. With rare exception, the first person to contact a violent criminal is going to be a civilian. You seem passionate about the ability to take up quality, efficient arms to protect yourself and others. You are compensated by we the people to do so. Lets direct that passion in the right direction to help us all retain our freedom. </div></div>

There is a reason I'm called a gun nut at work. I do have the same passion. Unfortunately the politicians and our brass don't listen to guys like me. Matter of fact, they don't even ask for our opinion on these things.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...... but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. </div></div>

I will say it again

BINGO!!!!!!

We want the best possible gear to protect our self's also.

I didn't here all the LE up in arms about it when Barrett made a similar decision. why because few LE have or need 50 bmg rifles but now that Larue as spoken up some LE are all butt hurt about it.

It is my understanding (though not 100% confirmed) that glock has stated they will not make pistols with 7 rd mags and are not going to make different models for every state in the USA.

I also notice that it is the LE in the states that Larue will not sell to that are all pissed. Of course, because it only affects them. But were they voicing their opposition to the restrictive guns laws when it didn't affect them? Nice to hear your voice now, hold on while I move over and make room for you on the band wagon. This is no different than the "hunters" that are quiet right now because they are not going after the "hunting" rifles. Well I will make room for them when they finally wake up.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Why is the military exempt? ... really if you need that explaining then your truely lost

bad law, is bad law period

Larue made a business decision, i think more should follow his lead.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> This is no different than the "hunters" that are quiet right now because they are not going after the "hunting" rifles. Well I will make room for them when they finally wake up. </div></div>

When that shoe drops we may be all on the airsoft forum but the psychological impact will be extreme.

The AR community has been experienced with the ban phenomonon but the "woodstock" hunting crowd is so dellusional in their "It will never happen to me" fantasy that they are psychologically unequipped to handle what is coming their way.

Much like the police officer that believes "No problem, I'm exempt."
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You seem to forget that the criminals don't exactly follow the gun laws. So you expect me and my fellow officers to have to use lesser equipment to stop the scumbag criminals, just so you don't get butthurt because the big bad PoPo gets to have some cooler toys than you. </div></div>

The whole point most are trying to convey in regards to impending new gun law, you just stated
So why should the public be denied the ability to defend them selves against the scumbag criminals?
Do we not face the same scum bag criminals as you?
Your chasing your tail, your enlargement is mute
Your making the same point folks are trying to convey to lawmakers
Criminals dont obey law therefore the purposed new laws only hamper the law abiding, making LE play by same rules only serves to highlite that fact.
The response from gun owners is in kind reply to numerous COP backing new gun restrictions, is how quick that changes when law applies to them also
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...... but if I get sent on a school shooting, I want the best possible gear at my disposal to protect the innocent. </div></div>

I will say it again

BINGO!!!!!!

We want the best possible gear to protect our self's also.

I didn't here all the LE up in arms about it when Barrett made a similar decision. why because few LE have or need 50 bmg rifles but now that Larue as spoken up some LE are all butt hurt about it.

It is my understanding (though not 100% confirmed) that glock has stated they will not make pistols with 7 rd mags and are not going to make different models for every state in the USA.

I also notice that it is the LE in the states that Larue will not sell to that are all pissed. Of course, because it only affects them. But were they voicing their opposition to the restrictive guns laws when it didn't affect them? Nice to hear your voice now, hold on while I move over and make room for you on the band wagon. This is no different than the "hunters" that are quiet right now because they are not going after the "hunting" rifles. Well I will make room for them when they finally wake up.

</div></div>

Sorry, but we've been fighting the gun laws in NJ since 1994, so I don't know what you are talking about.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why is the military exempt? ... really if you need that explaining then your truely lost

bad law, is bad law period

Larue made a business decision, i think more should follow his lead.


</div></div>

I was in the military. I don't need an explanation. I was just curious.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

I dont want to get sucked into the us/them blue line debate but Im guessing Larue's move is more of a reaction to all the Mayors getting together and delivering an ultimatum to manufacturers saying that if you sell X to civilians, we will make you inelligable for department/state gov't purchases. In light of that kind of threat from govtofficials, it becomes hard to fault the logic IMO.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You seem to forget that the criminals don't exactly follow the gun laws. So you expect me and my fellow officers to have to use lesser equipment to stop the scumbag criminals, just so you don't get butthurt because the big bad PoPo gets to have some cooler toys than you. </div></div>

The whole point most are trying to convey in regards to impending new gun law, you just stated
So why should the public be denied the ability to defend them selves against the scumbag criminals?
Do we not face the same scum bag criminals as you?
Your chasing your tail, your enlargement is mute
Your making the same point folks are trying to convey to lawmakers
Criminals dont obey law therefore the purposed new laws only hamper the law abiding, making LE play by same rules only serves to highlite that fact.
The response from gun owners is in kind reply to numerous COP backing new gun restrictions, is how quick that changes when law applies to them also
</div></div>

So now we are going back to the "if we can't have it, you can't have it" crap. I already said I don't agree with the gun laws. I want the military, police, gun owners to be equipped with the best stuff. Unfortunately, I don't make the laws.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So now we are going back to the "if we can't have it, you can't have it" crap. I already said I don't agree with the gun laws. I want the military, police, gun owners to be equipped with the best stuff. Unfortunately, I don't make the laws. </div></div>

But you do have a voice and a vote. Use them wisely
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But were they voicing their opposition to the restrictive guns laws when it didn't affect them? Nice to hear your voice now, hold on while I move over and make room for you on the band wagon. </div></div>

Assume much? Unless you're actually an LEO in one of these State's you don't have any evidence to such a statement other than what you might have read on the news. This statement keeps getting thrown out in both of these threads that LEO should have said or done something and the people making these opinion based statements have nothing to support it other than media article where some politicized PD Commissioner or Chief made a comment that the general public took as a reflection on ALL LEO beneath them. That's like saying because the President of the US say's so then all of us must be in agreement...
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

I agree with Larue. If I can not own something why should law enforcement? Oh thats right because all these criminals are running the streets with fully auto ak47s and m-16s . If we believe the media and the govt theres more full auto stuff on the streets of chicago than knob creek. Which we know is a lie. Thats why if I cant have it they really dont need it.Once again look at how safe law enforcement is in england!
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

There is a reason I'm called a gun nut at work. I do have the same passion. Unfortunately the politicians and our brass don't listen to guys like me. Matter of fact, they don't even ask for our opinion on these things. </div></div>

They listen to you with as much interest as they listen to us. So speak with us. Obama is not asking our opinion either. We are trying to make them listen. You get paid by us to chase the same bad guys we live among. Do not feel like you are being singled out when a civilian-owned gun maker (which they all are) wants the true ramifications of foolish legislation to be experienced by even those that could afford to have police by their side 24/7.

Pissed that you might not be able to get an AR15 to chase bad guys? Welcome to the reality of all those you serve. If every gun maker did what Mr Larue did, and extended that to federal non-mil agencies we might be having a different discussion right now.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Masked</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military? </div></div>

I'm not really for getting in-between the both of you but, it's interesting that nobody sees this from the perspective of a business.

One mistake and the man loses his entire business.

Why can't LEO's do what everyone else does? Order the upper and lower separately and then order your own parts.

You still haven't communicated why you're above the man's business or anyone for that matter.

As to your argument...Military have no restrictions, we do.

How can he make a mistake on a military rifle in which there are no laws to abide by vs. ours in which each state has an incomplete law as to restrictions?

As a business, it's a very simple decision.

As an individual, there's a very simple solution.

I don't quite see what the issue is...None of us are worth the grand scheme of his business and employees. </div></div>

I don't understand why you keep bringing this up. I don't want anyone to lose their business over this, even Larue, who I think is a scumbag. If there is a law saying that he can't sell to NY, then he can't sell to NY. As far as I know, thag law doesn't apply to NJ, yet he is not selling to us in NJ, correct? </div></div>

No, You'll only be limited to what you can buy in your state/district according to the letter linked at the beginning. From what it says, New York cops will only get 7 round mags etc, while you in New Jersey will be limited to what New Jersey's rules are. Here in Missouri where it's all legal, they'll be able to get whatever they want.

As far as why he keeps bringing the business side of it up, it's a smart move. Like I said earlier in the thread, my cousin bought a Glock 22 during the AWB from a dealer, when he opened it up it had been packaged with one LE only banned high capacity mag by accident. Under the current admin and rules/laws being put into play it's hard telling what they would do to a manufacturer for making that kind of mistake if it ever got found out.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

So now we are going back to the "if we can't have it, you can't have it" crap. I already said I don't agree with the gun laws. I want the military, police, gun owners to be equipped with the best stuff. Unfortunately, I don't make the laws.</div></div>

There is a second part to this quote that is missing but has been implied is a number of earlier posts. I will add it here for clarity...

"But, so long as I can have what I want I'm okay with you not having what you want."

The irony of this post...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"United we stand, divided we fall"</div></div>

is thick and undeniable. Equal restrictions and no exemptions. That is unifying.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Fucking hell. Let's all be honest here, very few people trust LEO's. And for good reason. LEO's should NEVER be armed more than the average citizen. Period. For obvious reasons. I'm not talking about the criminals. I'm talking about the average, law abiding citizens.

Paulo, if what you say is your system of belief, you're one of the very few LEO's we have to worry about. But the majority tells me that most of you don't want the average law abiding citizen to be armed.

Who cares what LaRue does. It's his business and he can do whatever he wants. What he does, doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. And believe me when I say, there's more to the story when it comes to the "LaRue Vs. LEO's". I have no idea what it is, but there's two sides to every story and I will lean more towards LaRue's side before LEO's. Just saying.

And for the LEO's here; What about the average citizens that need to protect ourselves from the federal government and below? This country was founded on less government and more states rights. Less government and more personal rights. My personal rights supersede your local/state/federal rights any day of the week. What's to keep the local/state/federal laws from infringing on my personal rights? The Second Amendment....

My personal thought is that MOST Law Enforcement Agencies are corrupt. Not every one and not everybody. Most is a generalization. I generalize a lot. And before you try to chastise me with "you're not a cop", "you've never been in the military" or "you have no idea what you're talking about", let me school you. I was in the Navy for four years and served in Desert Storm. After that, I was a Deputy Sheriff for a year and a half. Then I was a Marine for ten years serving in Iraq and Afghanistan for several tours. I have been a military contractor now for seven years in Iraq And Afghanistan. So, for those of you that will try to change my behavior or school of thought, don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining because it's not going to work.

That is all.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

dead-horse.jpg
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broker</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
dead-horse.jpg
</div></div>

It's still got three legs! beat it some more, it can still run!!
grin.gif
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Sorry for calling you a moron. I obviously misdiagnosed you. You are a delusional gun nut. You actually think cops are going to turn into tyrants. That's cute. You should make a movie. Maybe you can include zombies in it.

You seem to forget that the criminals don't exactly follow the gun laws. So you expect me and my fellow officers to have to use lesser equipment to stop the scumbag criminals, just so you don't get butthurt because the big bad PoPo gets to have some cooler toys than you.

I take it back. You are a fucking moron. </div></div>



More name calling. You are so emotional. It doesn't help your case. I guess you are anti second amendment.

Again, the purpose of the second amendment is to ensure private individuals can combat tyranny. I didn't say your department would be tyranic, did I? Again, why is your life worth protecting with the best gear available when the average citizen's is not? Obviously criminals don't care about gun laws. That only endangers law abiding gun owners.

I don't know why you are so hateful and negative. You're doing a disservice to your profession.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Christopher R. Browning wrote a book about police once. I doubt very many have read it.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broker</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But were they voicing their opposition to the restrictive guns laws when it didn't affect them? Nice to hear your voice now, hold on while I move over and make room for you on the band wagon. </div></div>

Assume much? Unless you're actually an LEO in one of these State's you don't have any evidence to such a statement other than what you might have read on the news. This statement keeps getting thrown out in both of these threads that LEO should have said or done something and the people making these opinion based statements have nothing to support it other than media article where some politicized PD Commissioner or Chief made a comment that the general public took as a reflection on ALL LEO beneath them. That's like saying because the President of the US say's so then all of us must be in agreement...

</div></div>

AHH HA again BINGO!!

Perception = reality

You make a good point. The media is playing you also. There are many LE that have stood up and told the FEDs to SUCK IT. Utah Sheriffs' Association for one. Living in Utah I really don't have a fear of a ban on the state level. The FEDs on the other hand who knows.

Have you in fact sat down with your fellow LEO and wrote a letter to your governor and/or president. As LE you are respected, and your voice, even though it is not suppose to, counts for more.

This is about joining forces against our enemies, would you go to the pro-gun rallies at your capitol wearing your uniform and carrying a sign that said "cops for guns".
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

You failed to get point

the justification for LE to have such weapons is no different from publics

but your all about anti LE stance, which has curtailed your ability to see issue clearly
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: adrenaline junkie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Masked</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So why doesn't that thinking apply to the military? </div></div>

I'm not really for getting in-between the both of you but, it's interesting that nobody sees this from the perspective of a business.

One mistake and the man loses his entire business.

Why can't LEO's do what everyone else does? Order the upper and lower separately and then order your own parts.

You still haven't communicated why you're above the man's business or anyone for that matter.

As to your argument...Military have no restrictions, we do.

How can he make a mistake on a military rifle in which there are no laws to abide by vs. ours in which each state has an incomplete law as to restrictions?

As a business, it's a very simple decision.

As an individual, there's a very simple solution.

I don't quite see what the issue is...None of us are worth the grand scheme of his business and employees. </div></div>

I don't understand why you keep bringing this up. I don't want anyone to lose their business over this, even Larue, who I think is a scumbag. If there is a law saying that he can't sell to NY, then he can't sell to NY. As far as I know, thag law doesn't apply to NJ, yet he is not selling to us in NJ, correct? </div></div>

No, You'll only be limited to what you can buy in your state/district according to the letter linked at the beginning. From what it says, New York cops will only get 7 round mags etc, while you in New Jersey will be limited to what New Jersey's rules are. Here in Missouri where it's all legal, they'll be able to get whatever they want.

As far as why he keeps bringing the business side of it up, it's a smart move. Like I said earlier in the thread, my cousin bought a Glock 22 during the AWB from a dealer, when he opened it up it had been packaged with one LE only banned high capacity mag by accident. Under the current admin and rules/laws being put into play it's hard telling what they would do to a manufacturer for making that kind of mistake if it ever got found out.
</div></div>

When MA started its "approved list" the whole process was a cluster. Glock applied for approval and passed all the requirements. They were waiting on absolute approval from the AG to sell to civilians which because they are "Evil Glock" was never going to come.

Glock said screw it and started having their guns distributed in MA - they pass the standards. For a short period of time Glocks were sold to civilians post the 98 regulations.

The AG had a coniption as they never intended civilians to get new Glocks no matter if they passed the regs or not. So Glock was banned from selling new guns in MA out of spite.

Those window guns are still a conundrun for MA dealers as they dont know if they are legal or not.

Many MA LEO carry Glocks. Gaston should have told the state to pound sand. Unfortunately the state wouldnt of cared and the officer would have suffered.

In this case such action would only work if S&W, Ruger everyone else put their differences aside and supported Glocks boycott of MA.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

I think the only thing we are doing is pissing each other off. At this point, it is counter-productive to continue any further discussion. I'm not going to respond, so please don't quote me anymore, unless you want to waste your own time.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

I think all you have done is encourage the sentiment that many here feel about LE
It may of not of been your intent but it was however what you achieved
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broker</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But were they voicing their opposition to the restrictive guns laws when it didn't affect them? Nice to hear your voice now, hold on while I move over and make room for you on the band wagon. </div></div>

Assume much? Unless you're actually an LEO in one of these State's you don't have any evidence to such a statement other than what you might have read on the news. This statement keeps getting thrown out in both of these threads that LEO should have said or done something and the people making these opinion based statements have nothing to support it other than media article where some politicized PD Commissioner or Chief made a comment that the general public took as a reflection on ALL LEO beneath them. That's like saying because the President of the US say's so then all of us must be in agreement...

</div></div>

AHH HA again BINGO!!

Perception = reality

You make a good point. The media is playing you also. There are many LE that have stood up and told the FEDs to SUCK IT. Utah Sheriffs' Association for one. Living in Utah I really don't have a fear of a ban on the state level. The FEDs on the other hand who knows.

Have you in fact sat down with your fellow LEO and wrote a letter to your governor and/or president. As LE you are respected, and your voice, even though it is not suppose to, counts for more.

This is about joining forces against our enemies, would you go to the pro-gun rallies at your capitol wearing your uniform and carrying a sign that said "cops for guns". </div></div>

You completely missed the point. And you just said "Bingo" to a counterpoint against your earlier opinion? You want to know how you missed the point... Again... You assume too much. What makes you think I'm a LEO?
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think all you have done is encourage the sentiment that many here feel about LE
It may of not of been your intent but it was however what you achieved </div></div>

Sorry, but I wanted to reply to this one. This site, and pretty much all of the weapon forums have been anti-cop ever since Obama became President. I pretty much stopped posting on just about every forum because of that. I don't even know why I even wasted my time responded to this thread or even logged on here, so I doubt that I made anyone here hate cops more than than you guys already do.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry, but I wanted to reply to this one. This site, and pretty much all of the weapon forums have been anti-cop ever since Obama became President. I pretty much stopped posting on just about every forum because of that. I don't even know why I even wasted my time responded to this thread or even logged on here, so I doubt that I made anyone here hate cops more than than you guys already do. </div></div>

I'm not anti-cop, I just disagree with the stance you've taken.

There are legitimate business reasons as to why this decision was made and maybe some personal decisions as well but, that doesn't mean you can't still get what you need.

You just have to do it like the rest of us peons.

Buy the upper and lower separately and put on your own accessories.

This really isn't complicated nor is it a difficult thing to process.

The VAST majority of us, especially in the recent situation, have piecemeal-ed our own AR's together so, now you have to - Boohoo.

While I understand that you feel "you shouldn't have to", it's just the way things are now so, dance around the laws like the rest of us do on a daily basis.

If you don't like it, order your gun from somewhere else.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think the only thing we are doing is pissing each other off. At this point, it is counter-productive to continue any further discussion. I'm not going to respond, so please don't quote me anymore, unless you want to waste your own time. </div></div>

Is that why you attempt to belittle, berate, and call names like a child? It wasn't a discussion. You showed no interet in a discussion. Enjoy the door.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think all you have done is encourage the sentiment that many here feel about LE
It may of not of been your intent but it was however what you achieved </div></div>

Exactly. The states that pass these laws are your enemy. Not Mark LaRue. Not us.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

Okay, I believe I have tried to be polite. Some have not, please everyone take a deep breath. I really enjoy a good debate. Name calling doesn't help anyone. Just like getting caught with a gun in your carry on bag at the airport (6 last month at SLC) doesn't help the pro-gun side.

So I will say that I know a few LEO and I must say that I have always perceived (which makes it my reality) that LEO was not on my side. That is until the Utah Sheriff Association wrote a letter to the president. This told me for the first time that they are on my side. If you are LE and on the Pro-gun side, then PLEASE speak up. go to the rallies. maybe form a group, show us that you ARE on our side.

You can correct me if I am wrong, but most LEO to me seem very suspicious of people. Well we are suspicious of you. Feels like shit doesn't it.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think all you have done is encourage the sentiment that many here feel about LE
It may of not of been your intent but it was however what you achieved </div></div>

Sorry, but I wanted to reply to this one. This site, and pretty much all of the weapon forums have been anti-cop ever since Obama became President. I pretty much stopped posting on just about every forum because of that. I don't even know why I even wasted my time responded to this thread or even logged on here, so I doubt that I made anyone here hate cops more than than you guys already do. </div></div>

Paul I love to quote you...lol... Really, I am not anti officer, I do armory work for some dept's, I see what he is doing, and why...sending a message, because honestly these laws are absurd, but the LE community will enforce it, and will be exempt, like the Cell phone law in NJ, you cannot be on your cell driving, great law...but LE and essential state govt. employes are exempt from it...what Mark wants to do is level the field in his own way..right or wrong, his money...
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RagnarDM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think what he is doing is great. I also think LEO agencies should not be exempt from firearm laws, on the job or off.

In a perfect world, firearm manufactures would not sell equipment to LEOs that is not available to the general public. </div></div>

While you are entitled to your opinion, these are the comments that make it hard to continue posting on gun forums. <span style="font-weight: bold">Thanks for adding to the us vs them bullshit</span>. </div></div>

But thats the way it is in many instances. Here in Commiefornia citizens are allowed to purchase new/used handguns from a dealer off a list of guns that are deemed "safe" while LE is exempt even for personal use. While CA is a shitty example for gun laws, it is in fact a "first class vs second class citizen" example.

If the LE rank and file are against said laws, I'd love to see them stand up and say so publicly.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RobG</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RagnarDM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think what he is doing is great. I also think LEO agencies should not be exempt from firearm laws, on the job or off.

In a perfect world, firearm manufactures would not sell equipment to LEOs that is not available to the general public. </div></div>

While you are entitled to your opinion, these are the comments that make it hard to continue posting on gun forums. <span style="font-weight: bold">Thanks for adding to the us vs them bullshit</span>. </div></div>

But thats the way it is in many instances. Here in Commiefornia citizens are allowed to purchase new/used handguns from a dealer off a list of guns that are deemed "safe" while LE is exempt even for personal use. While CA is a shitty example for gun laws, it is in fact a "first class vs second class citizen" example.

If the LE rank and file are against said laws, I'd love to see them stand up and say so publicly. </div></div>

They give the carrot to some, the stick to others.

Thing is after you eat the carrot you end up beating yourself with the stick.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2ndamendfan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, I believe I have tried to be polite. Some have not, please everyone take a deep breath. I really enjoy a good debate. Name calling doesn't help anyone. Just like getting caught with a gun in your carry on bag at the airport (6 last month at SLC) doesn't help the pro-gun side.

So I will say that I know a few LEO and I must say that I have always perceived (which makes it my reality) that LEO was not on my side. That is until the Utah Sheriff Association wrote a letter to the president. This told me for the first time that they are on my side. If you are LE and on the Pro-gun side, then PLEASE speak up. go to the rallies. maybe form a group, show us that you ARE on our side.

You can correct me if I am wrong, but most LEO to me seem very suspicious of people. Well we are suspicious of you. Feels like shit doesn't it. </div></div>

Do you ask every LEO you come across what their opinion is on gun rights? If not then how can you perceive something that isn't there? How do you know there aren't LEO at gun rallies? Is it based upon not seeing a uniform that maybe they're not allowed to wear outside of being on duty? And yes LEO are suspicious people when you encounter them in their professional capacity as it's their job to do so.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: spiralseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
like the Cell phone law in NJ, you cannot be on your cell driving, great law...but LE and essential state govt. employes are exempt from it...</div></div>

I'd say 99% of people on that kick don't think about it fully. Many officers have to make work related calls as follow-ups or to do investigating. Would you rather they spent that time in an office and off the street where at least their presence is a deterrent and should they need to respond they'd at least be in the area? The exemption isn't there because they're some sort of special but because in the process of doing their job and effectively using your tax dollars it's better for them to be exempt. They could always increase taxes and therefor funding so as to hire more LEO if you feel that's a better idea... just sayin.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RobG</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
If the LE rank and file are against said laws, I'd love to see them stand up and say so publicly. </div></div>

Plenty of them do, especially sheriffs. El Dorado, Placer, Amador, several others voice their opinions of gun laws in a public manner. It's just that whenever a gun control proposal comes up the Democrats trot out whatever ass-to-mouth sheriff/police chief/mayor owes them political favors to make their case for them.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RobG</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
If the LE rank and file are against said laws, I'd love to see them stand up and say so publicly. </div></div>

Plenty of them do, especially sheriffs. El Dorado, Placer, Amador, several others voice their opinions of gun laws in a public manner. It's just that whenever a gun control proposal comes up the Democrats trot out whatever ass-to-mouth sheriff/police chief/mayor owes them political favors to make their case for them. </div></div>

It's like the clouds in the sky parted and a beam of light shined down upon logic and common sense... then the lord said... this is good.
 
Re: mark larue is a great guy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broker</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: spiralseal</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
like the Cell phone law in NJ, you cannot be on your cell driving, great law...but LE and essential state govt. employes are exempt from it...</div></div>

I'd say 99% of people on that kick don't think about it fully. Many officers have to make work related calls as follow-ups or to do investigating. Would you rather they spent that time in an office and off the street where at least their presence is a deterrent and should they need to respond they'd at least be in the area? The exemption isn't there because they're some sort of special but because in the process of doing their job and effectively using your tax dollars it's better for them to be exempt. They could always increase taxes and therefor funding so as to hire more LEO if you feel that's a better idea... just sayin. </div></div>

That's absurd BS. People in sales depend on the phone even more so for their jobs. Do they get an exemption? The fact is they passed a law because they believe it's unsafe to drive and talk on the phone. If it's unsafe for the public, it's equally, or even more unsafe for the government officials.
 
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