Maybe a dumb 300WM question

[Black-X]

I see that loading manuals say COAL of 3.340 for the .300WM but I notice a lot of people running way past that at 3.5+. Is there a good reason to do this?

I've loaded all my 190SMK's at 3.340 and they have shot sub-moa. I loaded some test loads tonight with 208gr AMAX bullets at 3.345 and was curious if there was a good reason why I should have loaded them longer? Throat wear? Eeking out the last bit of accuracy? Chamber pressure?

Thanks,

-X

 

[cowman]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

No dumb questions in reloading, right?

It is usually done to get that last bit of accuracy out of your load. My 300 likes the 190s seated out to 3.555. Every rifle will be different so have fun playing around. Be aware that jamming a bullet in the lands can cause a pressure spike. Find out where your bullet length is touching the lands and work backward from there to find a sweet spot.

 

[Victor N TN]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

In MOST factory chambers the chamber is cut so long you can't get to the lands and still feed through the magazine. I have some loads I have to load single shot. But for others, like my hunting loads, I load to magazine length.

You have to decide what you want most. The last little bit of accuracy, or a fast second shot. Or make up some of both, like I did. Just make sure you keep them marked so you don't make a mistake when you need another shot.

For punching paper on the range where there isn't a time limit, I feed single shot by hand. But everything else is loaded to mag length minus a bit for feeding reliability.

 

[Black-X]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

Had some crappy results today with the 208gr AMAX. In all fairness it might have been me, but 1.5moa sucks no matter which way you slice it. I tried from 70.0gr of R22 up to 72.4 in .4gr increments. I'll try again later but dang they sucked this morning. Will loading them longer help (provided I do my part)?

Thanks,

-X

 

[rockz]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

If you have H1000 give that a try as well.
I've had good success with H1000 and 210vld's as well as 200SMK's.
I just got some 208 AMAX and will give them a try soon.

 

[Black-X]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

I loaded up 10 rounds at 3.575 COAL and they shot right at MOA so it's getting better. I guess I'll play with a longer COAL and powder charge and pray that I get lucky. I guess AMAX bullets don't like to jump in my rifle.

I tried to load 1 round at 3.600 and chambered it and I *think* I saw some marks from the lands on the bullet. Does that sound normal for a Remington 700 Sendero?

-X

 

[Victor N TN]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

Be careful pulling loaded rounds out of the chamber. If the bullet actually engages the rifling, the bullet may pull and dump the powder down your action and trigger. (Don't ask how I know this...)

 

[Heat]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

I'll come over and figure out you OAL if you tell me what's wrong with my 300 wsm! Ha! We'll get it figured out, I'll try to head your way soon.

 

[bohem]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Had some crappy results today with the 208gr AMAX. In all fairness it might have been me, but 1.5moa sucks no matter which way you slice it. I tried from 70.0gr of R22 up to 72.4 in .4gr increments. I'll try again later but dang they sucked this morning. Will loading them longer help (provided I do my part)?

Thanks,

-X </div></div>

Many people have had very good results with RL22 and the 208 Amax. I don't have a 300 WM, but I shoot my 30-06 with 208's driven by RL22 and I get exceptionally good results.

The Amax line shoots very well, and if in doubt, you need to set the bullet up for ~ 0.010-0.015" of "jump" to rifling engagement. This is where the COAL coms in to be more than 3.34".

My 208's in the 30-06 are 3.405" long, the book says no more than 3.25" so I single feed them.

 

[jrob300]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Had some crappy results today with the 208gr AMAX. In all fairness it might have been me, but 1.5moa sucks no matter which way you slice it. I tried from 70.0gr of R22 up to 72.4 in .4gr increments. I'll try again later but dang they sucked this morning. Will loading them longer help (provided I do my part)?

Thanks,

-X </div></div>

I can load 200g SMK's to mag length and they'll shoot under .5 moa from 100 yds out to 1000. The 208's really did not like to be jumped in my rifle. I moved them out to .010 off the lands and they tightened up a lot, but they still don't consistently group super tight at 100 yds. like the 200 SMK's. They seem to shoot better at longer distances (what they were really designed for).

Depending on your load and twist, they may not have settled by 100 yds. I ran into this with 200's from my 1:11 twist also. It would shoot almost the same groups at 200 yds as 100. It makes no logical sense, but I watched it over and over.

RL22 has been the more accurate powder for me, but very dirty and barrel un-friendly. H1000 is WAY cleaner, doesn't seem to heat my barrel as quickly, is purported to be more temperature stable and for all those things, I'll give up a little accuracy.

John

 

[bohem]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jrob300</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I can load 200g SMK's to mag length and they'll shoot under .5 moa from 100 yds out to 1000. The 208's really did not like to be jumped in my rifle. I moved them out to .010 off the lands and they tightened up a lot, but they still don't consistently group super tight at 100 yds. like the 200 SMK's. They seem to shoot better at longer distances (what they were really designed for).

Depending on your load and twist, they may not have settled by 100 yds. I ran into this with 200's from my 1:11 twist also. It <span style="font-weight: bold">would shoot almost the same groups at 200 yds as 100.</span> It makes no logical sense, but I watched it over and over.

RL22 has been the more accurate powder for me, but very dirty and barrel un-friendly. H1000 is WAY cleaner, doesn't seem to heat my barrel as quickly, is purported to be more temperature stable and for all those things, I'll give up a little accuracy.

John </div></div>

I noticed this as well. 1/2" groups @ 100y, 3/4" groups @ 200y

 

[muleman]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

I've found I get higher velocities with H-1000 than RL-22 is that normal, as much as 80-100FPS with 72.2 of RL-22 & 78gr. of H-1000.
Black-X my 208s touch the lands at 3.655, I'm seating them to 3.652 and they just feed in the magazine. I tried seating right to the lands(3.655) and had them out to .020 off the lands, did'nt seem to make alot of noticable difference in groups, so I just went as close as possible without feeding problems. You might want to know this is a Rem 700 5r milspec in 300WM. When you go to load seat your 1st bullet shallow (no crimp) then take it and chamber it slowly the lands will push the bullet in, unchamber and measure this depth then set your seater to this depth, you may have to seat them slightly deeper until when you chamber a round and it dose'nt mark your right at your lands.

 

[5R Milspec]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

hey so fare with the 200-210gn bullets most have had better luck useing H1000.even for me and a good friend we use the load most use.its 76.0gn's of H1000 and he is useing the 208 A-max and I am useing the 210 berger.we are all so both putting them in the lands.

and let me tell ya.they fly really good for both of our rifels useing the same charge of 76.0gn's.and nexted up for me will be useing the 208 A-max after I use up the 210's.

but like most have said try working from the lands and work in small increments back till you find that sweet spot for your rifel.for me if its to long for the mag its still a good COAL for my rifel.I like to chamber one at a time.

 

[Black-X]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

Guys, thanks for all of the suggestions. I'm going to try to get them close to the lands and see what she will do. How much less power should I be using when reaching for the lands?

-X

 

[Black-X]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

Ok so I loaded some up at 3.600. I put 71gr of R22 in to keep the powder lower incase of pressure. I took a sharpie and colored the bullet then put it in the rifle. I believe that I'm right now just into the lands so do I need to back off or try them?

Thanks,

-X

Here's a pic:

 

[Emilio]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

tag

 

[5R Milspec]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

loading at the lands should give you more case volume.so the 71gn that is two grain less from being a compressed load should be OK.but like I said it SHOULD give you more volume but how much I do not know for your case and how you prepped thae case.

but it looks to me that you are not even deburring the case.or at least thats what I can see from the pic.and if you are not you really need to do this.it will help out with the seatting of the bullet and keep the case mouth from shaveing the bullet.

so look out really close at your primers for pressure signs.and if you are getting really flat primers you should back off and not fire the rest of them.it only takes one to hurt you and your rifel.

 

[jrob300]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

On some of my loads I ran into pressure signs WELL below max. load when seating to the lands. Yes, case capacity is increased, but pressure over the same load can increase too, because the bullet immediately experiences resistance as opposed to having a .100-.200" running start. There are MANY factors to take into account.

If it was me I'd load some up in increments, starting well off max. and go up .5 gr at a time, keeping track of your velocities and firing until you see pressure signs (well documented in many places on this site and others). Then find the accuracy node that is below your pressure signs (ambient temp. will affect this).

Remember God did give you two eyes, but that other one is not considered a spare. Proceed cautiously.

John

 

[ChadTRG42]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

X, you're into the lands pretty good. I would seat it about .020" deeper, then chamber it and see if you are touching. If still touching, then seat it another .010" and recheck. Keep seating it .010" deeper until it doesn't touch, or gives the slightest scratch visible from the lands on a loaded round. Then you'll be good.

 

[Black-X]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

Chad,

I went ahead and seated them about .030" deeper and I think I *might* have seen a little touch or two so I went another .010 deeper. Right now I'm at 3.560 and I figure I'll give them a try. I guess this rifle doesn't have near as deep a throat as others in .300wm.

Guys, thanks again for the help. I chamfer the inside and outside of the cases but didn't trim any. From that pic it does looks like I need to at least debur them a touch. Never did that on my Lapua cases but then again, these are Winchester cases sooooo...

jrob, now you got me nervous! I may pull these and back the powder charge even further.

Thanks!

-X

 

[jrob300]

Re: Maybe a dumb 300WM question

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I chamfer the inside and outside of the cases but didn't trim any. From that pic it does looks like I need to at least debur them a touch. Never did that on my Lapua cases but then again, these are Winchester cases sooooo...
</div></div>

My experience with Win. cases is that they need a LOT of prep. The biggest problem I found was uneven neck thickness. Mine varied from .011-.017 on a side, so they all had to be turned. But they also varied in length and need to be trimmed to the same length.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Black-X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">jrob, now you got me nervous! I may pull these and back the powder charge even further.</div></div>

The 71's were probably OK. That's my mag tolerant accuracy load in Nosler brass pushing 200g SMK's, and the Win. brass has greater water capacity. But I'd hate for you to find out they weren't the hard way. I've had an overpressure load vent on me once. You don't want to go there!


John