PRS Talk Negligent Discharges Need To Stop!

[Dthomas3523]

Yes, I get it, those were carbines. I'm not saying that's the number, and not arguing at all that accuracy doesn't improve with lighter triggers. I'm saying 5lbs. to 1 lb. is a pretty big leap. If you re-read the part of LL's post I quoted above, he would seem to agree that 24 oz is the lightest you should go.

In his podcast he says 1lb.

1lb is likely going to be consensus where people feel things can start getting unsafe if you go too far down.

I’d be ok with 1lb and for variance, you need to be within 20% on a scale.

So, 12oz at the lightest on a scale for a pull test.

 

[morganlamprecht]

I feel safer with my trigger at 8oz than I feel about most of the field with any trigger weight lol

I went from a 2-2.5 Huber or AI 2 stage trigger last year, to an 8oz trigger tech diamond the week before the 2018 Finale...never even shot it in a match before that

Me being safe was never a real concern to me cause I know how I approach each shot at each target

This year at the Brawl I ran an 8oz TT single stage, couple weekends ago at the Silent Night my 2 stage AI...the triggers aren’t the real issue, it’s sloppy shooters, but without any vetting or proof of skill, the light triggers aren’t helping most guys

 

[Dthomas3523]

The trigger weight is just my opinion based on seeing guys mess up, run to the trigger too fast, etc.

I have no data to say 16oz is better than 24oz or the other way around, I just feel a limit helps to guide the new shooter and the lowest common denominator during an event.

I believe anything under 1LBS is too light for an action sport, and that 1.5LBS will help balance the field a bit and make sure a less than good trigger is not adjusted below the point of safety.

There is two factors at play, drop safety and weapons handling, we dont want to bang into something or drop the rifle and have it fire, and we don't want the smallest of contact to set it off, so for me these two values represent a point in the system we can achieve a safe balance.

In your drop test, safety is on or off?

Except for some triggers like diamond, I haven’t had very much luck with drop tests straight down on but with safety off.

Even my factory AI triggers will Fire sometimes this way.

I can beat on them all day. No fires.

But if dropped straight down, directly on butt, it can fire at times.

 

[Lowlight]

I have always done it with the safety off,

Mechanical safeties are not perfect and the only trigger I know that uses the safety as a functioning device is the Huber, you reset the broke 1st stage with the safety.

So safety off, its really a momentum thing, is the trigger so light that the shoe bouncing sets it off, that is how that works.

 

[generalzip]

I run my triggers around 8-10oz. My triggers must be broken because I've never had an ND and I've never shot anything I wasn't trying to. I also was taught when I started shooting PRS to never close the bolt until I'm on target and my finger never goes anywhere near the trigger until my crosshairs are on the target and I'm steady. I think you guys are blaming the tool and not the person using it which is the same logic people use when they say guns kill people. This isn't combat as much as some want to think it is. We don't run around with a closed bolt and safety off. Follow the rules and nobody gets hurt. Don't and you should be removed.

If you follow this strategy you can't really have an ND. The gun physically can not fire until my crosshairs are on the target. Even if you brushed the trigger like in the video it will send the round very close to the target, which does not threaten anyone no matter whether you want to call it a ND, AD, COPD, TnT, IDGAF.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I run my triggers around 8-10oz. My triggers must be broken because I've never had an ND and I've never shot anything I wasn't trying to. I also was taught when I started shooting PRS to never close the bolt until I'm on target and my finger never goes anywhere near the trigger until my crosshairs are on the target and I'm steady. I think you guys are blaming the tool and not the person using it which is the same logic people use when they say guns kill people. This isn't combat as much as some want to think it is. We don't run around with a closed bolt and safety off. Follow the rules and nobody gets hurt. Don't and you should be removed.

If you follow this strategy you can't really have an ND. The gun physically can not fire until my crosshairs are on the target. Even if you brushed the trigger like in the video it will send the round very close to the target, which does not threaten anyone no matter whether you want to call it a ND, AD, COPD, TnT, IDGAF.

You better give a fuck. It’s still negligent discharge.

Your scenario only works when everything goes perfectly. Safety comes in layers. I can name 50 what if scenarios where you can screw up and throw that round off the berm.

This isn’t the same as blaming a tool. At a certain point, things become inherently unsafe. Light triggers are inherently unsafe. The weight at which this happens can be debated. But the fact that at some point, too light is dangerous, is a fact.

You are also a sample size of one.

Introduce yourself to me at a match when I’m up that way so I can stay away from you since you “dgaf” about an ND.

 

[Dthomas3523]

“It’s impossible for me to have an ND” is how complacency starts.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Regardless if you want to admit it or not, this game is based of hunting and combat.

We play these games with weapons.

Treat it with the respect you would in a hunting or combat situation.

Otherwise, find a new fucking hobby.

 

[generalzip]

You better give a fuck. It’s still negligent discharge.

Your scenario only works when everything goes perfectly. Safety comes in layers. I can name 50 what if scenarios where you can screw up and throw that round off the berm.

This isn’t the same as blaming a tool. At a certain point, things become inherently unsafe. Light triggers are inherently unsafe. The weight at which this happens can be debated. But the fact that at some point, too light is dangerous, is a fact.

You are also a sample size of one.

Introduce yourself to me at a match when I’m up that way so I can stay away from you since you “dgaf” about an ND.

I read through all 7 pages of this thread and figured you'd respond in the typical bully-ish manner you have done with anyone else that has a different opinion.

So someone that goes up accidentally on their 2nd rev thinking they are on the first gets a match DQ? It has the same consequence as sending one over the berm when most scopes have 10-15 mil turrets. And yes I've seen guys do it and they were not DQ'd.

Also you've met me at a match already and not once in my post did I say IDGAF about ND's. I implied IDGAF what you call it. Take some time to actually read what I wrote instead of knee jerk reacting.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Yep, if you don’t spin your turret, and you launch a round over a berm......gtfo and come back next week.

You didn’t know the condition of your weapon.

The guy in the video didn’t get a match DQ either. But he should have.

Launch a round 10mils over a berm, you just committed a HUGE safety violation.

 

[morganlamprecht]

hunting? lol

you should go hunting more...i feel safer at any match ive been to than with 99% of the typical hunters ive encountered

typical hunters weapons handling is a joke

 

[generalzip]

hunting? lol

you should go hunting more...i feel safer at any match ive been to than with 99% of the typical hunters ive encountered

typical hunters weapons handling is a joke

This^. Not to mention half of them are drunk

 

[Dthomas3523]

hunting? lol

you should go hunting more...i feel safer at any match ive been to than with 99% of the typical hunters ive encountered

typical hunters weapons handling is a joke

I do as well. I’m talking about stage design and such.

 

[Tree]

Isn't the point to this whole discussion safety and enforcing rules as it relates to safety? If an infraction occurs regardless of who or what caused it a match DQ should be enforced. Would equipment restrictions help? For many, possibly. Will it prevent it, No. The discussion should be IDGAF what causes the safety infraction, it happened, pck your gun away and help RO/spot. And yes a round over a berm should be a DQ. It is in every other pistol/3-gun game.

 

[Lowlight]

So people act unsafe and don't get called on it so it's Okay?

How does that work, the fact that people failed to address safety issues should mean we ignore blatantly unsafe conduct ?

Now everyone can understand how we got here... these rules are not for guys who do it right, it's for all the guys doing it wrong. If you feel you are an exception to the rule and you're training means there is never mistake to make, then hold a class before each event you attend and vouch for every shooter with a pledge in writing backed up with money to say, nobody is gonna make a mistake because you trained them in your method.

Next time you go to a match, ask the entire field, "Who has never shot a match before" and if more than 10 hands go up, how are you gonna vouch for their weapons handling skills in an event they never experienced?

This is not about the ones who do it right every weekend, it's about the ones who do it wrong.

 

[generalzip]

So people act unsafe and don't get called on it so it's Okay?

How does that work, the fact that people failed to address safety issues should mean we ignore blatantly unsafe conduct ?

Now everyone can understand how we got here... these rules are not for guys who do it right, it's for all the guys doing it wrong. If you feel you are an exception to the rule and you're training means never mistake to make, they hold a class before each event you attend and vouch for every shooter with a pledge in writing backed up with money to say, nobody is gonna make a mistake because you trained them in your method.

Next time you go to a match, ask the entire field, "Who has never shot a match before" and if more than 10 hands go up, how are you gonna vouch for their weapons handling skills in an event they never experienced?

This is not about the ones who do it right every weekend, it's about the ones who do it wrong.

I assume you're talking about the second rev comment? I don't think there's anything in the rule book about that. Someone please correct me if that's wrong. Most have defined a ND as not having conscious thought about sending the round and lacking trigger control. In this instance the shooter has complete control over when the rifle fires. Their firing solution was just wayyy off. I just brought it up because I've seen it happen with no consequence. I honestly don't know if the PRS considers that an ND or how you would really prove it.

I agree the rules need to be set for the lowest common denominator. I just think policing trigger weight is not necessarily the right way to go about it. I'm all about not getting shot and am all ears on ways to improve the safety culture. Personally, I think it needs to come from the very top and work its way down.

I attended RO Brawl and also attended the match in the video and was standing probably 25 yards away when it happened. Nobody even noticed it happen. Even Joel said he didn't notice until he got home reviewing tape. I will say I felt less safe at RO with the way the stages were designed. I even recall folks shooting the helicopter stage being freaked out about the barrel stage being so close and people were effectively standing down range 45 degrees to the right. The match in the video had racks to stage your rifles etc.

 

[morganlamprecht]

either people get vetted and/or forced training prior, or the risk of bad weapons handling aint goin anywhere...regardless of any rules or DQs

ive been to enough pistol/carbine matches to see DQ rules aint affecting a sloppy shooters form once the timer beeps

 

[Dthomas3523]

The rules don’t specify every situation possible. They have provisions for unsafe acts in general.

Not knowing the condition of your weapon at all times is an extremely unsafe act.

I think it makes a good point though. Literally NOTHING is even being called out, let alone enforced. Being unsafe is the norm. I’ve caught myself doing stupid shit because it’s becoming normal.

I think we’ve all been around and seen something like the video or someone launching a round because they didn’t zero a turret. And that’s a problem. We say and consequently do nothing.

This needs to change. We as a whole need to start saying something when it happens.

 

[Dthomas3523]

At a lot of stages out of courtesy we tell people “bolt back, mag out.”

I think I’ll try to remember to say “bolt back, mag out, did you zero your turret?”

 

[lte82]

You better give a fuck. It’s still negligent discharge.

Have you ever had a "no call" from the guy spotting at a club match? Or have you ever made a shot and didn't personally see where it landed? Did you DQ yourself because you couldn't account for that shot? Does why you miss by 20 ft make a difference? Bad trigger control, bad hold, dialed wind the wrong way, forgot to dial elevation, used the wrong bullet profile on your app, scope went down, barrel shot out?

I draw the line at "did the shooter make the shot when in position, head on the gun, with the target in view". If he did, no ND. If he did not, ND. With the exception of "if the shooter is obviously making unsafe shots" from an extreme case of being a bad shooter, those guys can't be there until they can control what they are doing.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Have you ever had a "no call" from the guy spotting at a club match? Or have you ever made a shot and didn't personally see where it landed? Did you DQ yourself because you couldn't account for that shot? Does why you miss by 20 ft make a difference? Bad trigger control, bad hold, dialed wind the wrong way, forgot to dial elevation, used the wrong bullet profile on your app, scope went down, barrel shot out?

I draw the line at "did the shooter make the shot when in position, head on the gun, with the target in view". If he did, no ND. If he did not, ND. With the exception of "if the shooter is obviously making unsafe shots" from an extreme case of being a bad shooter, those guys can't be there until they can control what they are doing.

Actually, yea, I’ve stage zero’d myself when I couldn’t tell where my rounds were going.

Several times.

A couple times was me fucking up. A couple other times was an optic malfunction.

It’s called being responsible and knowing when something isn’t right. Otherwise you’re just randomly sending shots downrange without any accountability for them.

One of the times I stopped shooting the match. Was a 7-35 when a turret shit out.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

So 7 pages of IF that vs IF this.......

General consensus is that NDs happen at what appears to be way to often.

General consensus is shooter cannot be trusted to score themselves, much less DQ themselves for a ND.

Per the written PRS rules this video showcases a ND, that is crystal clear, black & white.
So the rule is already in place for the situation..what is lacking is the personnel to implement the written rule.

Implementation of Solutions???
Any communication from Organization Directors on implementation of solutions?
Any communication from Match Directors on implementation of solutions.?

Question(s):
Why can the Sanctioning Organization itself not provide ROs?
Why does the MD have to rely on volunteers for this very critical component of what is essentially a "licensed" match? The Organization is licensing you to run a match under their brand, rules, policies, etc but not provide the critical safety personnel?

If I want to hold a Red Bull sanctioned Air Race...Guess what...the safety inspectors come from the Organization.
If I want to hold a NHRA sanctioned event...Guess what...the safety inspectors come from the Organization.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Dthomas3523]

Another match, barrel went tits up. I stopped with 3 stages to go. My rounds were all over the place.

 

[RRW]

We have velocity limits on our rifles to save steel; is it time to implement a minimum trigger weight for people safety?

Couldn't agree more! Guys running bench rest weight triggers in field type matches. That's an accident waiting to happen.

 

[Tree]

In reference to the question on volunteers being safety officers/range officers. It works in other sports. Difference being they are educated on the rules and procedures, there are escalation paths in place, and it is enforced across the board. Any participate can call a cease fire and shooting stops immediately until all is made safe and issue discussed. No one likes it but rarely is a DQ disputed in those sports. As a match director I stand behind my SOs/ROs. I have DQd others and have been DQd, I have also DQd myself. Safety is the number one thing to consider in shooting sports. We also put new to the game shooters through an "orientation" as well as allow coaching and "education" while they participate. Not sure why safety is being viewed as a negative in this discussion.

 

[Dthomas3523]

A lot of this comes down to personal accountability. Many times you know something is wrong when you are missing. The RO has no idea because you’re in the ballpark.

We have a personal responsibility to stop what’s happening or change it when we know it’s not just us pulling a bad shot.

Even if you’re not sure exactly what’s happening, but you know it’s not normal. Time to at a minimum stop the stage, take a zero, go to the zero range and figure out what’s going on.

I think this might come from training though. And as Morgan mentioned, some of this stuff only comes from experience or training. I can see how a newer shooter could think “I’ll send’em and I’ll at least get a point or two.”

We need to go back to becoming marksmen and not just shooters looking for points.

 

[Lowlight]

The reason there no PRS Rule about going over a berm is, they leave it up to the individual match directors

If a range has no berms or has a huge safety fan it's one rule, if the range has berms, a lot less property and a smaller safety fan the rules should reflect that situation. that is an MD issue, not the series. If a MD is okay with a shooter sending a round over a berm, that is his issue, but some ranges it very well may be.

It was the barrel and the Roof Top events at RO that were close together. When my bipod fell off it fell on that side (right) and catching it was close to flagging the squad there. So for sure, I see get it.

But if we are gonna start making excuses because of X or Y and not acknowledge the very real bigger picture, what is the point, sign your waiver and take your chance. That is what is being debated now, But, but, but, at X Match I saw Y and at Y match I saw X and nobody said anything so why are we saying something now.

Total distraction, bullshit, change the subject, what if Aliens land, crap... either you have rules and become a sport or you have no rules and stay a disorganized hobby with a series of subjective scores because if the Top Guy can ND and still win, who cares right.

I'm a good guy why do I need rules, they should apply to those who break them.

 

[generalzip]

That's right it was the rooftop stage that was close by. I think your point aligns well with my comment around this needing to come from the top. We can sit here and discuss changes until the cows come home, but until PRS/NRL leadership and it's MDs make a movement to really enforce the rules as they are written and push for safety, we will continue to see this type of think happening with no consequences. Experienced shooters can certainly take the stage and set the tone for those around them, but in my experience it won't carry enough weight unless the leaders back it up.

 

[HogsLife]

That's right it was the rooftop stage that was close by. I think your point aligns well with my comment around this needing to come from the top. We can sit here and discuss changes until the cows come home, but until PRS/NRL leadership and it's MDs make a movement to really enforce the rules as they are written and push for safety, we will continue to see this type of think happening with no consequences. Experienced shooters can certainly take the stage and set the tone for those around them, but in my experience it won't carry enough weight unless the leaders back it up.

Honestly, I don’t think PRS can do much. What’s the worst they can do? Tell an MD that he is no longer able to run a PRS sanctioned event? Big deal. The MD is still just gonna run his own match anyways. It’s not like PRS is footing the bill for any of it.

Not saying they don’t need to do that, because at a minimum that’s what should happen. Will it change anything? As far as the PRS goes, they’ll be covering their ass, and they’ll have less matches, but unless the MD’s get it handled, you’re just gonna have a few safe PRS matches and a shit load of unsafe local matches.

Its the safety culture that the MD sets in place and enforces during his / her match thats going to make the biggest difference in the Precision Rifle Game.

EDIT:

I don’t care if it’s a new shooter or not. If you drop the hammer on a new shooter for a serious safety violation and he takes a Match DQ, that experience is going to make a lasting impression on him.

Some lessons are best learned the hard way. I can guarantee you this, that he will remember that lesson more after a DQ than he will if you cut him slack and gave him a warning.

We learn the most not from what we do right, but the things we’ve done wrong.

Set the shooter on the right track from the get go, and that doesn’t get done by cutting them slack. Set the precedence early. ND’s, flagging, dropping rifles, and leaving the line with anything other than a Condition 4 weapon system are serious and dangerous violations with serious consequences. These types of violations need to be given serious penalty’s (ie Match DQ’s). Not warnings.

Good shooters, bad shooters, pro, armature, Super Secret Squirrel Operators, and pencil pushers alike. Doesn't matter. Theyre all equal in the fact that they all have the ability to end someone’s life due to poor and lackadaisical safety habits.

 

[LawnMM]

Honestly, I don’t think PRS can do much. What’s the worst they can do? Tell an MD that he is no longer able to run a PRS sanctioned event? Big deal. The MD is still just gonna run his own match anyways. It’s not like PRS is footing the bill for any of it.

The series could DQ the offenders score for the match, if he's a repeat offender he could be barred from the series.

Might not keep them from shooting matches as non members but it makes them ineligible for prize money and that's what a lot of guys going faster than they're able to do safely are after.

It also would discourage MDs from allowing them to shoot on their property for liability reasons. Think of the lawsuit you'd eat if you're a facility owner like Rifles Only, who elects to affiliate with NRL/PRS matches and thereby their rule book, and you allow a banned shooter to participate as a non series member because he was booted for safety violations...and somebody gets hurt or killed.

You are F U C K E D.

But this would once again be asking the PRS to actually do something besides collect money and keep score.

Why the fuck hasn't this guy been ID'd? Somebody knows who it is. He's on video doing it and then taking a point for it. Zero his match score, then zero the next match he attends and has a score submitted, for cheating.

That would raise a few eyebrows and wake some people up. It's not hard to do. Make a list and update it. Shit the NRL/PRS should share their lists in the interest of safety and consistent discipline. Just like if you get a DUI in Colorado you can't go to Nevada and get a license.

Keeps a PRS offender from jumping ship and fleeing to the NRL and vice versa. This isn't one guys word against another's and there's clear evidence of two violations: safety and sportsmanship.

If the PRS ever needed to make an example of somebody, it's this guy.

 

[Wilc0]

I'm pretty new to this so maybe I'm talking entirely out of my depth but here's my observation.

An ND should be a match DQ no question. They have a potentially terminal effect on innocent bystander or property, a potentially terminal effect on the range at which it occured, a definite terminal effect on the shooter's plans for that weekend, but they SHOULD not carry with them the social stigma which it has rightfully cultivated given how serious of an offense it can be.

Sure, you can say that the only incentives for someone to conceal their ND would be to continue the match, preserve their score, not lose out on the cash they dropped to be there, and that pride has nothing to do with it. I won't believe you though.

This is increasingly important at national level matches where the eyes, ears, and keyboards are increased tenfold.

Hypothetically, if I was in the video'd shooter's squad and he committed that same ND, safe'd his rifle, stood up and said "You know what, I didn't intend to touch that round off, I fucked up"; He'd be getting a handshake from me as he packed his shit up to leave and I'd defend him against anyone who tries to roast him over it.

I've seen USPSA shooters get rightfully DQ'd and even DQ themselves for way less than what this guy did.

 

[Dthomas3523]

I'm pretty new to this so maybe I'm talking entirely out of my depth but here's my observation.

An ND should be a match DQ no question. They have a potentially terminal effect on innocent bystander or property, a potentially terminal effect on the range at which it occured, a definite terminal effect on the shooter's plans for that weekend, but they SHOULD not carry with them the social stigma which it has rightfully cultivated given how serious of an offense it can be.

Sure, you can say that the only incentives for someone to conceal their ND would be to continue the match, preserve their score, not lose out on the cash they dropped to be there, and that pride has nothing to do with it. I won't believe you though.

This is increasingly important at national level matches where the eyes, ears, and keyboards are increased tenfold.

Hypothetically, if I was in the video'd shooter's squad and he committed that same ND, safe'd his rifle, stood up and said "You know what, I didn't intend to touch that round off, I fucked up"; He'd be getting a handshake from me as he packed his shit up to leave and I'd defend him against anyone who tries to roast him over it.

I've seen USPSA shooters get rightfully DQ'd and even DQ themselves for way less than what this guy did.

Agreed. Said shooter isn’t a bad person or pariah for getting a DQ. It happens all the time in other shooting sports.

We have not enforced it so much that now a DQ at a rifle match might carry a bad stigma. Wouldn’t last long though. Here’s the kicker, you’d only have to do it a couple times and things would shape up real fast.

Matches at RO, people are intimately aware of their zero tolerance ND and Flagging rules. Guess where everyone is super aware of the 4 safety rules? Rifles Only.

All it takes is the same attitude towards safety around the country and you won’t see videos or hear things like this very much at all.

 

[regnar375]

I'm pretty new to this so maybe I'm talking entirely out of my depth but here's my observation.

An ND should be a match DQ no question. They have a potentially terminal effect on innocent bystander or property, a potentially terminal effect on the range at which it occured, a definite terminal effect on the shooter's plans for that weekend, but they SHOULD not carry with them the social stigma which it has rightfully cultivated given how serious of an offense it can be.

Sure, you can say that the only incentives for someone to conceal their ND would be to continue the match, preserve their score, not lose out on the cash they dropped to be there, and that pride has nothing to do with it. I won't believe you though.

This is increasingly important at national level matches where the eyes, ears, and keyboards are increased tenfold.

Hypothetically, if I was in the video'd shooter's squad and he committed that same ND, safe'd his rifle, stood up and said "You know what, I didn't intend to touch that round off, I fucked up"; He'd be getting a handshake from me as he packed his shit up to leave and I'd defend him against anyone who tries to roast him over it.

I've seen USPSA shooters get rightfully DQ'd and even DQ themselves for way less than what this guy did.

Dq is much more accepted in uspsa. when it happens, people respond the correct way.

 

[Tree]

Just hand out DQ gift cards. It takes the sting away and they get a blizzard out of the f-up.

 

[Wilc0]

Dq is much more accepted in uspsa. when it happens, people respond the correct way.

Which is a shame that we arent there yet. There is a culture in USPSA where you'll even see M and GM shooters upload videos of their own match DQ, bringing to light and discussing what they did wrong. That's pretty damn awesome in my opinion, and the type of response from its community that all shooting sports organizations should strive to achieve.

 

[lash]

Just hand out DQ gift cards. It takes the sting away and they get a blizzard out of the f-up.

Shooting matches here in Florida in the summer heat, we’d lose the whole field to DQs and have to reconvene at Dairy Queen, and then at the ale house. Heck, I might DQ AH for that...

 

[lash]

Thought that this was a good time to repost this. Loved it.

I’ve actually been there and still find this very funny.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Shooting matches here in Florida in the summer heat, we’d lose the whole field to DQs and have to reconvene at Dairy Queen, and then at the ale house. Heck, I might DQ AH for that...

Pro tip, when you’re shooting like shit and don’t want anyone to see your score, you flag the squad and take a DQ.

Much less embarrassing to explain.

 

[lash]

Shooting matches here in Florida in the summer heat, we’d lose the whole field to DQs and have to reconvene at Dairy Queen, and then at the ale house. Heck, I might DQ AH for that...

Real quick, for those that didn’t capture the lighthearted humor attempt, that was meant to be funny.

 

[Wilc0]

Pro tip, when you’re shooting like shit and don’t want anyone to see your score, you flag the squad and take a DQ.

Much less embarrassing to explain.

Definitely if the DQ comes with a blizzard from DQ!

"OFF THE LEFT EDGE!.... OFF THE RIGHT EDGE!.... OFF THE LEFT EDGE AGAIN!" - RO

"Fuck this, I'm going to get an oreo treat... I DIDNT MEAN TO SEND THAT LAST ONE!" - everyone.

 

[HogsLife]

This guy is either the dude in Joel’s video or related to him......... there’s just too many similarities to be a coincidence.... ??

 

[Precision Underground]

yes its terrible form and a training issue

find the target with sight, close the bolt, find the grip, settle on the target, find the trigger, press it

finger stays out of there until youre ready to actually send it, not getting ready to send it, especially with a single stage

I posted an IG video of a stage in my second ever match. The 1st comment was "why do you not finish closing the bolt until you find the target?"

 

[Lowlight]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

 

[sabrecross]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

Unbelieveable and it flies in the face of everything I was taught in the military.

 

[Wilc0]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

I always did like shooting alone...

 

[lash]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

How about competitive drone ice race dancing? Time for something new. ?

 

[Diver160651]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

My wife last week -

 

[lash]

But seriously...

Some groups are taking this “safety thing” seriously. I guess that we’ll see if common sense or denial rule the day in the end.

Maybe in the end, the PRS will run a separate series sponsored by Red Bull, called Extreme LR Without Limits wherein people tune in on sports TV to see the occasional ND and it’s results, like they do NASCAR. That was the goal after all, right?

 

[regnar375]

Has there been a statement from PRS on this? An acknowledgment?

 

[Dthomas3523]

Apparently, we have been coming at this all wrong... I got an update and it's a bit disturbing

I was told tonight, that the MD said in the initial match briefing that NDs that happened "downrange" will be excused, or in other words, never happened. Don't sweat the small shit, if you torch one off we are all good as long as it is downrange.

I guess that or this is the direction the series wants to go, overlooking the basic firearms safety rules. Why bother discussing if the mindset from the top is don't worry about it. It's one way to eliminate the Range Officer problem, just have scorekeepers, safety is now officially optional.

I really thought this was about creating a professional series with the best shooters in the world. Instead, we'll just dumb it down, hide the failures and collect our checks for the Best Toaster for the Gun Guys Man Cave.

Wow, I am floored, forget the fact I was told the winner had an ND, an actual MD said don't sweat it. I think it might be time to retire or find a new hobby. I was thinking about fishing but I dislike fish, and all those pictures of guys with a fishing hook in their fingers have scared me away from the sport. Competitive Ice Dancing, nah, not very dancerific, Drone Racing, ya there is an idea, I can get much farther away from the drama if I drive a drone.

Hmmm, didn’t said MD have a tough time juggling some shit before?