New 6 Creed problems with PETERSON brass

[viking78]

I have tested Lapua 6.5 Creedmoor with small and large primer pockets.
Small can take a quite lot more pressure, than large primer pocket brass, and i am talking load that is made with
VV reloading manual chart.
But dont they say, speed is nothing without accuracy.

 

[Thump_rrr]

I have tested Lapua 6.5 Creedmoor with small and large primer pockets.
Small can take a quite lot more pressure, than large primer pocket brass, and i am talking load that is made with
VV reloading manual chart.
But dont they say, speed is nothing without accuracy.

This is also my experience with Lapua SRP brass.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Are those Winchester primers?

 

[6brshooter]

Are those Winchester primers?

What his notes say, I've always found win primers a bit undersized.

 

[kyotekiller25]

What his notes say, I've always found win primers a bit undersized.

Well they were tight going in. I've never had any issues with them. They've always gave me better accuracy and SD over CCI 200s anyway.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

I missed it in the notes, I knew exactly what the issue was as soon as I saw those primer leaks which is why I asked. That’s not brass, it’s shitty WLR primers. I had the same problem with them, it actually etched my bolt face from it happening. I switched primers and the issue went away completely. Years later I used some again in another rifle because I was in a pinch and same damn thing. Other people have had it happen too and now you can add yourself to the list.

The Peterson brass isn’t the problem, you should make sure you’ve diagnosed the actual problem before you start throwing shade.

 

[kyotekiller25]

I missed it in the notes, I knew exactly what the issue was as soon as I saw those primer leaks which is why I asked. That’s not brass, it’s shitty WLR primers. I had the same problem with them, it actually etched my bolt face from it happening. I switched primers and the issue went away completely. Years later I used some again in another rifle because I was in a pinch and same damn thing. Other people have had it happen too and now you can add yourself to the list.

The Peterson brass isn’t the problem, you should make sure you’ve diagnosed the actual problem before you start throwing shade.

Never had an issue with them in 20 years and 100 rifles but maybe...who knows. Haven't had anymore issues with them since I backed off the charge at 3000fps. If it happens again, then I might consider them the problem...Since you're the only one here saying it's the Primer choice...Maybe it's just you

 

[redneckbmxer24]

They 100% are the problem but believe what you want. I had the same thing happen and others have too, all with WLR’s.

 

[kyotekiller25]

They 100% are the problem but believe what you want. I had the same thing happen and others have too, all with WLR’s.

I will definitely keep that in mind, and keep an eye on it. Thank you.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

There are many cases of WLR primers leaking and causing issues. I don't know if that's the case here, but I do remember that and it wasn't just one guy. Just FYI

 

[BigdaddyWSM]

I have been using the Gunwerks 6mm CM brass large primer & it is working good in cold temps in my rifle , my sons small primer Lapua 6.5 brass did have issues in very cold while coyote hunting , click no boom. Sometimes

 

[Jakeweb09]

Wow hornady appears to be quite a bit thicker in the web area than Peterson. That's honestly very surprising!!

But remember thicker doesn’t always translate. Hornady is known to have soft brass. Peterson known to have fairly hard brass. They all use their own alloys and that is a huge factor as well

 

[kyotekiller25]

I have been using the Gunwerks 6mm CM brass large primer & it is working good in cold temps in my rifle , my sons small primer Lapua 6.5 brass did have issues in very cold while coyote hunting , click no boom. Sometimes

Exactly why I'm not sold on SRP in a case that burns 40g of slower burning powder in sub freezing temps...SRP are designed for 223 cases that burn 30g or less of faster burning powder in my opinion.

 

[6brshooter]

I've gotten along fine with br4 and 450 primers on srp brass in 6.5creed and 6 creed. Also use br2 in my 6.5prc with 59gr powder. Never had any issue at 20ish degrees, but I should never say never, lol.

 

[kyotekiller25]

I've gotten along fine with br4 and 450 primers on srp brass in 6.5creed and 6 creed. Also use br2 in my 6.5prc with 59gr powder. Never had any issue at 20ish degrees, but I should never say never, lol.

I'd just rather not even have to worry about it and be safe than sorry...srps do nothing for me in a hunting rifle.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

I'd just rather not even have to worry about it and be safe than sorry...srps do nothing for me in a hunting rifle.

Yeah that's been my thinking too which is why is shoot LRP in my 6.5cm. That said, it sure is tempting to switch em over to SRP. That would mean I'd have 223, 6cm, and 6.5cm all in SRP and I wouldn't have to change out anything on my dillon to run practice ammo, but more importantly, I have more SRP than LRP, though I have a decent amount of both. LRP have been much harder to come by at a decent price, and I can't being myself to pay 120/1000 for em.... yet

 

[kyotekiller25]

Yeah that's been my thinking too which is why is shoot LRP in my 6.5cm. That said, it sure is tempting to switch em over to SRP. That would mean I'd have 223, 6cm, and 6.5cm all in SRP and I wouldn't have to change out anything on my dillon to run practice ammo, but more importantly, I have more SRP than LRP, though I have a decent amount of both. LRP have been much harder to come by at a decent price, and I can't being myself to pay 120/1000 for em.... yet

It's the total opposite where I'm at. I can find LRP and LRPMs all day locally. SRPs are like non existent and have been ever since ding dong biden and covid started...The only rifle I have that uses srp is my triple deuce. I'd just rather use lrp and lrpm for my hunting rifles. I have 10 bricks of lrps and only 2 bricks of srp.

 

[IronOperator87]

They 100% are the problem but believe what you want. I had the same thing happen and others have too, all with WLR’s.

Glad someone brought this up. Saw the “WLR” in the pic on one of the notes and thought there’s the problem. I have a f’d up bolt face from using Winchester primers also. It’s kind of a known thing.

 

[wind gypsy]

You’re using smaller capacity brass. Brux are typically .236 bores, wouldn’t be surprised if hornady data is based upon .237 bore, and using shitty primers. Pretending like the book data is still valid is ignorant.

 

[BuildingConceptsllc]

It's the total opposite where I'm at. I can find LRP and LRPMs all day locally. SRPs are like non existent and have been ever since ding dong biden and covid started...The only rifle I have that uses srp is my triple deuce. I'd just rather use lrp and lrpm for my hunting rifles. I have 10 bricks of lrps and only 2 bricks of srp.

Dang. Well, hopefully both will be everywhere for a decent price soon enough

 

[kyotekiller25]

You’re using smaller capacity brass. Brux are typically .236 bores, wouldn’t be surprised if hornady data is based upon .237 bore, and using shitty primers. Pretending like the book data is still valid is ignorant.

Fair enough then. Going to start looking for some BR2s...Thanks

 

[viking78]

Just a thought here.
How fast the carbon ring can be build up?
I have 2 different .260REM rifles, and i used some times neck down 308win cases on my rifles.
First dozen works well, and then the over pressure issues starts.
The reason is, that the 308win case is shorter than the .260Rem, and it quickly build the carbon ring over the case mouth.

If you have a bore scope, you could check that in minutes.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Just a thought here.
How fast the carbon ring can be build up?
I have 2 different .260REM rifles, and i used some times neck down 308win cases on my rifles.
First dozen works well, and then the over pressure issues starts.
The reason is, that the 308win case is shorter than the .260Rem, and it quickly build the carbon ring over the case mouth.

If you have a bore scope, you could check that in minutes.

I do have a teslong. But I'm not having any issues associated with a carbon ring yet. It is something to keep an eye on though. I only clean my rifles when they noticeably start to open up. I have well over 250 rounds through my bartlein 7-300 Win mag and it still shoots 3/8-1/2 MOA. 6 Creed maybe a little different, but I doubt it. Same speeds and half the powder being burnt.

 

[RUN8]

So you could try to give it a good cleaning and see if that helps?

 

[kyotekiller25]

So you could try to give it a good cleaning and see if that helps?

For what reason exactly? It's shooting 3/8 MOA right now. I don't have any problems with accuracy...

 

[redneckbmxer24]

So you could try to give it a good cleaning and see if that helps?

Unless you mean clean out the stash of WLR primers and toss them in the trash then cleaning is going to do jack shit for his problem. He doesn't have a dirty barrel, he doesn't have a carbon ring. He's experiencing a known issue with primers that other people have had the same issue with and has even damaged rifles.

 

[RUN8]

Accuracy no, carbon ring build up possibly.

I had a discussion on the phone a couple of days ago with Frank Green at Bartlein Barrels. He was giving me some pointers on his reloading practices, and brought up the 6.5 Creedmoor and 6 Creedmoor and cleaning barrels. I’m running one of their barrels in 6.5 Creedmoor so it was pertinent information for me.

He flatly stated that necking down the .308 sized (well technically the parent case is .30 TC) case to 6.5mm or 6mm essentially creates an over bore magnum cartridge, and you shouldn’t expect to treat them like a .308 or .223. They’re going to form more carbon, the barrel life is going to be shorter, and they demand more maintenance. He said he gets calls all the time from guys trying shoot a 2 day match of 240-300 rounds that run into issues the 2nd day, and his first question is “did you clean it the night after day 1?” almost always the answer is “no”. When those shooters implement more regular cleaning they stop having issues.

Give it a try, you probably have all the equipment and supplies you need. Just costs you some time.

 

[RUN8]

Unless you mean clean out the stash of WLR primers and toss them in the trash then cleaning is going to do jack shit for his problem. He doesn't have a dirty barrel, he doesn't have a carbon ring. He's experiencing a known issue with primers that other people have had the same issue with and has even damaged rifles.

Yeah I’d change up primers too. But it costs nothing but time and effort to clean the barrel. Eliminating one more variable.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Unless you mean clean out the stash of WLR primers and toss them in the trash then cleaning is going to do jack shit for his problem. He doesn't have a dirty barrel, he doesn't have a carbon ring. He's experiencing a known issue with primers that other people have had the same issue with and has even damaged rifles.

Accuracy no, carbon ring build up possibly.

I had a discussion on the phone a couple of days ago with Frank Green at Bartlein Barrels. He was giving me some pointers on his reloading practices, and brought up the 6.5 Creedmoor and 6 Creedmoor and cleaning barrels. I’m running one of their barrels in 6.5 Creedmoor so it was pertinent information for me.

He flatly stated that necking down the .308 sized (well technically the parent case is .30 TC) case to 6.5mm or 6mm essentially creates an over bore magnum cartridge, and you shouldn’t expect to treat them like a .308 or .223. They’re going to form more carbon, the barrel life is going to be shorter, and they demand more maintenance. He said he gets calls all the time from guys trying shoot a 2 day match of 240-300 rounds that run into issues the 2nd day, and his first question is “did you clean it the night after day 1?” almost always the answer is “no”. When those shooters implement more regular cleaning they stop having issues.

Give it a try, you probably have all the equipment and supplies you need. Just costs you some time.

Peterson doesnt neck down their 6.5 brass. They did all new tooling fir the 6 creed from my understanding.

I'll probably clean it every 100-150 rounds, or sooner if I notice it opening up drastically.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Unless you mean clean out the stash of WLR primers and toss them in the trash then cleaning is going to do jack shit for his problem. He doesn't have a dirty barrel, he doesn't have a carbon ring. He's experiencing a known issue with primers that other people have had the same issue with and has even damaged rifles.

Going to save them for a shortage or apocalypse. You've convinced me...Got some CCI 200s and BR2s on the way. Thanks.

 

[RUN8]

Peterson doesnt neck down their 6.5 brass. They did all new tooling fir the 6 creed from my understanding.

I'll probably clean it every 100-150 rounds, or sooner if I notice it opening up drastically.

Just throwing ideas out.

How many rounds total on the barrel?

 

[kyotekiller25]

Just throwing ideas out.

How many rounds total on the barrel?

As of now, right at 78...And I just cleaned it for the 1st time at 50 rounds. Wasn't very dirty at all. Few patches and it was clean. I'll probably borescope it around 100-150 to see if any carbons built up.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Yeah I’d change up primers too. But it costs nothing but time and effort to clean the barrel. Eliminating one more variable.

Yeah, unbolt the action from the stock and the barrel from the action. Drive an hour past the range and then drive back. Might as well do a bunch of other pointless shit while he's at it that has nothing to do with the actual problem because it's only time.

 

[RUN8]

Wow, over react much? It takes maybe 15-20 minutes.

Stop acting like I fucked your sister and your mom.

I mean I might have. How old are you? I could theoretically have adult children.

 

[RUN8]

As of now, right at 78...And I just cleaned it for the 1st time at 50 rounds. Wasn't very dirty at all. Few patches and it was clean. I'll probably borescope it around 100-150 to see if any carbons built up.

Roger that. I doubt you have any carbon build up or excessive copper, or anything else wrong. Unless headspace is off, but a reputable smith wouldn’t send it out the door like that.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

The shit retards say when you point out that they're retarded LOL

 

[RUN8]

Goddamit the doctor said I was special!

Get it right.

 

[Supersubes]

Peterson doesnt neck down their 6.5 brass. They did all new tooling fir the 6 creed from my understanding.

I'll probably clean it every 100-150 rounds, or sooner if I notice it opening up drastically.

The point frank green was making to @RUN8 was not literally run a 6.5 into a die and make a 6mm, but a case of that size (40 ish grains of powder) through a 6mm bore, and 60k psi. Its magnum like, and hammers barrels, where a 30 cal with the same powder charge isnt.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Just throwing ideas out.

How many rounds total on the barrel?

As of now right at 78...And I just cleaned it for the 1st time at 50 rounds. Wasn't very dirty at all. Few patches and it was clean.

 

[kyotekiller25]

Yeah, unbolt the action from the stock and the barrel from the action. Drive an hour past the range and then drive back. Might as well do a bunch of other pointless shit while he's at it that has nothing to do with the actual problem because it's only time.

Good thing the range is only a 5 minute drive from my house

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Good thing the range is only a 5 minute drive from my house

Turn that 10m round trip into a 2hr 10m, it's only time.

 

[Grim's Reapers]

Unless you mean clean out the stash of WLR primers and toss them in the trash then cleaning is going to do jack shit for his problem. He doesn't have a dirty barrel, he doesn't have a carbon ring. He's experiencing a known issue with primers that other people have had the same issue with and has even damaged rifles.

Son of a bitch!!!!! I was having issues with Rem 9 1/2's seating well in my 22-250 Rem brass without reaming the hell out of my primer pockets, so I just bought a brick of WLR primers. If those suckers start popping on me, I'm gonna be beyond pissed. I've never used WLR's before and didn't know they had issues.

 

[RUN8]

I’ve used WLR’s in .280 AI with no issues, but mine were bought like 10 years ago. I’ve also run a lot of WSR’s in .223/5.56 with no issues.

 

[Supersubes]

I’ve used WLR’s in .280 AI with no issues, but mine were bought like 10 years ago. I’ve also run a lot of WSR’s in .223/5.56 with no issues.

Thats the time frame they got their reputation.

 

[kyotekiller25]

I've been using these WLRs for 15 years or so in A LOT of different rifles and this is the first time I've ran into the issue myself. I think most of it was me starting middle of the road and going straight to max with the Peterson brass, which has less capacity than the rem and win brass I was using for everything else. They did seat pretty tight in this Peterson brass, but i thought that was always a good thing? Another guy also mentioned the 6mm bruxs having a tight bore, all adding up to more pressure. Lesson learned on my end. Learn something new everyday...I still have 2 bricks of these WLRs left but I just acquired some CCI 200s and BR2s. I'll save the WLRs for the next shortage coming up around the corner...or use as trade fodder for more CCIs haha.

 

[Grim's Reapers]

I've been using these WLRs for 15 years or so in A LOT of different rifles and this is the first time I've ran into the issue myself. I think most of it was me starting middle of the road and going straight to max with the Peterson brass, which has less capacity than the rem and win brass I was using for everything else. They did seat pretty tight in this Peterson brass, but i thought that was always a good thing? Another guy also mentioned the 6mm bruxs having a tight bore, all adding up to more pressure. Lesson learned on my end. Learn something new everyday...I still have 2 bricks of these WLRs left but I just acquired some CCI 200s and BR2s. I'll save the WLRs for the next shortage coming up around the corner...or use as trade fodder for more CCIs haha.

All of my 22-250 is 3-4x fired Remington brass through the same barrel. It's a 1:14 twist so I can load it up pretty hot with 50gr for coyote busting. I've used Rem 9 1/2s with no issues before until I bought some less than a year ago. Those suckers are tight and tall, but when I mic'd them they do barely fall within limits. I don't like having to take as much brass out of my primer pockets to accommodate whatever it is Remington did with that brick of primers I got. Figured I'd give the WLRs a go. CCIs work fine, but I'm out and can't find any. If the WLRs start some fuckery I'll just set them aside for a no win situation I suppose. Maybe use them to fire form some new brass loaded as lobbers. Or maybe they'll be fine. I always get skiddish when I hear bad things because I am indeed THAT guy who will get one out of a thousand of something bad. LOL

Edit: With "a 50gr" not 50 grains of powder.

 

[kyotekiller25]

All of my 22-250 is 3-4x fired Remington brass through the same barrel. It's a 1:14 twist so I can load it up pretty hot with 50gr for coyote busting. I've used Rem 9 1/2s with no issues before until I bought some less than a year ago. Those suckers are tight and tall, but when I mic'd them they do barely fall within limits. I don't like having to take as much brass out of my primer pockets to accommodate whatever it is Remington did with that brick of primers I got. Figured I'd give the WLRs a go. CCIs work fine, but I'm out and can't find any. If the WLRs start some fuckery I'll just set them aside for a no win situation I suppose. Maybe use them to fire form some new brass loaded as lobbers. Or maybe they'll be fine. I always get skiddish when I hear bad things because I am indeed THAT guy who will get one out of a thousand of something bad. LOL

Edit: With "a 50gr" not 50 grains of powder.

Ya, I seem to be that unlucky guy for a lot of things in life myself

I hope they work out for ya. I'm not having any issues with them anymore now that I've done a proper ladder test with them. Sitting at 40.2/40.5g of H4350 is getting me 3000-3025 fps and they look fine. No cratering, no sticky bolt, no gas leaks, and no popped primers the last 30 rounds...But I figured since it has been an issue for several others, better safe than sorry. I'll just sell or trade them off and replace with CCIs. Problem solved, except for maybe the guy who gets them next

 

[Grim's Reapers]

Ya, I seem to be that unlucky guy for a lot of things in life myself

I hope they work out for ya. I'm not having any issues with them anymore now that I've done a proper ladder test with them. Sitting at 40.2/40.5g of H4350 is getting me 3000-3025 fps and they look fine. No cratering, no sticky bolt, no gas leaks, and no popped primers the last 30 rounds...But I figured since it has been an issue for several others, better safe than sorry. I'll just sell or trade them off and replace with CCIs. Problem solved, except for maybe the guy who gets them next

One man's trash is another man's treasure. Pawn those things off!

 

[Edds]

Leaking Primers

Recently, I have been experiencing the odd round leaking around the primer seal. I can't find any reason for the ones that leak. Here is what I have: 300Wm 28" Kreiger 1-10" WW Brass, & WLRM primers 225gr Hor HPBT that I moly with Midway moly coat. H-1000 @ 74.1 gr. which gives 2865 fps...

www.snipershide.com

 

[wind gypsy]

I'd just be happy over 3k FPS. Sounds like you might not be through barrel speed up yet? You might get some more speed. On the flip side I've also heard of guys having to run slower once a .236 bore gets fire cracked and is building pressure faster.

Smaller capacity brass and tighter bore just means you probably wont have the same top end velocity capability as one would with say lapua brass and a 237 bore. It seems like guys who run the creeds under 3100 get more stability and barrel life out of them though. N555 could get you a little more speed at similar pressures and is now cheaper than H4350..