I really like the perforated holes now, that looks like it will probably solve the LOP problem others have seen. Progress is always good.
- Thread starter oda175365
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Noice. What can are you running?
It’s a YHM Resonator, cheap and cheerful can for moving between guns.
Have a DA Nomad Ti in BATF jail that I’ll direct thread and leave on the Cross.
I almost went with the Nomad Ti for this one, but decided on the Rugged Mini30, so I can scale it back to a shorter config. It’ll be in jail for another 4 months or so.
I was running a 56mm Trijicon scope in high rings, which would be right around 1” from the top of the rail to center of the optic and there was a 1/4” gap under the front of it. Will depend on the length of the scope and your ideal eye relief, but you will probably be fine.
A friend of mine has a Rugged and runs it short most of the time, but it’s nice to be able to make it quieter. Likes it so well he’s got another one in jail for his wife.
My Cross enjoying stretching its legs the night before Father's Day...
Edit to add details: Cross 6.5cm with ZCO 527 in Spuhr SP6602 mount and DA Nomad Ti.
Edit to add details: Cross 6.5cm with ZCO 527 in Spuhr SP6602 mount and DA Nomad Ti.
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How are the extentions coming along? Do you have a install video to watch? I keep telling myself to wait for the extentions, but it's getting harder.
extensions are slower going than i like. the manufacturing is more complex than anticipated.
I just parted with mine in favor of a custom heavy 6.5CM for NRL open heavy class vs factory and a lighter 7SS for hunting. Seeing all these subtle little changes and lack of barrel support kind of turned me off.
Don't get me wrong, I bought one to use last fall when my custom wasn't going to be done and it worked awesome and I even used to run my first NRL Hunter match this spring with no functional complaint.
I'll definitely still be keeping an eye on development and will not hesitate to pick a gen 3 or whatever it's on when my kids get to hunting age.
Don't get me wrong, I bought one to use last fall when my custom wasn't going to be done and it worked awesome and I even used to run my first NRL Hunter match this spring with no functional complaint.
I'll definitely still be keeping an eye on development and will not hesitate to pick a gen 3 or whatever it's on when my kids get to hunting age.
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Small update, called Sig customer support and they'd need the entire rifle. SMH. So...I offered to send photos in for evaluation. Sent them two photos along with the PDF of my shipping receipt showing original purchase date and ship date/receiving by my FFL. Likely won't hear back for a few days. He recommended just shooting it which you and I know is just fine but I'd like to see how this'll affect it long-term.
I did ask about buying just a bolt head and they are not available at this time but will be in the future (uh huh). Wondering if it's a head space/liability issue they're afraid of? Not sure if Sig sells just bolts for their gas guns or not. Depending on how it goes, this may be the last Sig product I purchase. I can't condone sending an entire rifle in for small parts that should be available separately. I can buy an entire bolt assembly but I'm not spending another $400 to fix their lapse in quality control.
Will try to get out and shoot it tomorrow and break the stock barrel in. I did bore scope both the stock barrel and Schnee's 20" carbon barrel. The Sig had a bit of carbon in there from the test rounds (assuming). I cleaned the barrel last night and should probably bore scope it again. The Schnee's carbon barrel was like a mirror inside in comparison and I believe they're lapped from the factory.
I did ask about buying just a bolt head and they are not available at this time but will be in the future (uh huh). Wondering if it's a head space/liability issue they're afraid of? Not sure if Sig sells just bolts for their gas guns or not. Depending on how it goes, this may be the last Sig product I purchase. I can't condone sending an entire rifle in for small parts that should be available separately. I can buy an entire bolt assembly but I'm not spending another $400 to fix their lapse in quality control.
Will try to get out and shoot it tomorrow and break the stock barrel in. I did bore scope both the stock barrel and Schnee's 20" carbon barrel. The Sig had a bit of carbon in there from the test rounds (assuming). I cleaned the barrel last night and should probably bore scope it again. The Schnee's carbon barrel was like a mirror inside in comparison and I believe they're lapped from the factory.
Sig replied back. This is a direct quote.
"After evaluating the Bolt face wear and it’s on the same side as the ejector this is pretty normal and will wear while shooting. This gun was also tested before leaving the factory."
So if your brand new, never fired by you, Cross shows up and your bolt looks like the below, completely normal! Definitely passes their QC. WTF.
I guess if it causes problems down the road, at least I've documented it with them.
"After evaluating the Bolt face wear and it’s on the same side as the ejector this is pretty normal and will wear while shooting. This gun was also tested before leaving the factory."
So if your brand new, never fired by you, Cross shows up and your bolt looks like the below, completely normal! Definitely passes their QC. WTF.
I guess if it causes problems down the road, at least I've documented it with them.
If you’re not happy why not just send the whole rifle back?
Seems obvious but for the most part, I'm happy with it and excited to shoot it. Put a lot of effort into research and didn't order it lightly. Just wish the bolt face like that didn't pass QC and get passed on to the customer. Plus I have an engagement at the range in two weeks and I know the rifle wouldn't be back by then.
It will look worse than that after your first range session of 50+ rounds... Just saying. I'd be surprised if there was any finish still on the inside of the bolt face.
I'm actually a bit confused why they would even finish that part of the bolt head? Most companies don't do that with bolt-actions...They leave it raw stainless or nitrided, and not some sort of coated paint-like finish that could chip (like yours is).
Sig replied back. This is a direct quote.
"After evaluating the Bolt face wear and it’s on the same side as the ejector this is pretty normal and will wear while shooting. This gun was also tested before leaving the factory."
So if your brand new, never fired by you, Cross shows up and your bolt looks like the below, completely normal! Definitely passes their QC. WTF.
I guess if it causes problems down the road, at least I've documented it with them.
They leave the factory with a thread protector that doesn’t even cover the threads all sealed up with their bullshit “inspected” tape on the box, you really think they would catch that? The QC guys give zero fucks what they send out the door to consumers.
Shot 40 rounds through the Cross and the stock barrel today, bolt head pic below, no cleaning. Was hot as dogs balls in Alabama out there today but enjoyed shooting it none the less. A bit different than the AR10 and this'll take some rethinking on shooting technique. It's brutal compared to the gas gun but I like it! I started to get the hang of it towards the end and will be ordering a few 10 round mags so I'm loading less and shooting more, LOL. Needed a bigger rear bag too. Groups were all over the place and it almost made sighting in the scope pointless. The last 20 started to see the group sizes fall but I'm not there yet. I can now see why adding weight on a chassis gun makes a difference.
Just did a mild carbon clean on the barrel and bore scoped it. No real copper buildup that I can tell but I don't have the best bore scope. I can see copper in the grooves but not in the rest of the barrel. Looks more "polished" than it did fresh out of the box when I scoped it.
On the bolt head coating, I assumed it was an advanced nitriding process like what Rubber City Armory uses on their BCG's transforms the surface of the metal. So no idea what Sig is using. The rest of the bolt assembly is pretty slick and sort of reminded me of a cheap DLC but maybe it's just some sort of high temp paint. I washed everything and lubed per the factory manual prior to hitting the range and the action was great. Trigger too...I have it adjusted on the light end and dry firing, I honestly couldn't tell the difference adjusting it to extremes. But on the firing range, it's definitely lighter and more "precise" than my gas gun triggers which are set at 4 pounds. I like it. Totally get the two-stage trigger now.
Oh, my safety has the "in between" position as well. Almost like they originally designed it to be a 60 degree throw. There's a definite detent halfway through its travel.
If you notice, the chipping appears to be getting worse. Now it’s also behind the ejector and the face of the ejector, as well. Sooner or later, it will probably all chip off where the case heads touch it. I wouldn’t worry about it.Shot 40 rounds through the Cross and the stock barrel today, bolt head pic below, no cleaning. Was hot as dogs balls in Alabama out there today but enjoyed shooting it none the less. A bit different than the AR10 and this'll take some rethinking on shooting technique. It's brutal compared to the gas gun but I like it! I started to get the hang of it towards the end and will be ordering a few 10 round mags so I'm loading less and shooting more, LOL. Needed a bigger rear bag too. Groups were all over the place and it almost made sighting in the scope pointless. The last 20 started to see the group sizes fall but I'm not there yet. I can now see why adding weight on a chassis gun makes a difference.
Just did a mild carbon clean on the barrel and bore scoped it. No real copper buildup that I can tell but I don't have the best bore scope. I can see copper in the grooves but not in the rest of the barrel. Looks more "polished" than it did fresh out of the box when I scoped it.
On the bolt head coating, I assumed it was an advanced nitriding process like what Rubber City Armory uses on their BCG's transforms the surface of the metal. So no idea what Sig is using. The rest of the bolt assembly is pretty slick and sort of reminded me of a cheap DLC but maybe it's just some sort of high temp paint. I washed everything and lubed per the factory manual prior to hitting the range and the action was great. Trigger too...I have it adjusted on the light end and dry firing, I honestly couldn't tell the difference adjusting it to extremes. But on the firing range, it's definitely lighter and more "precise" than my gas gun triggers which are set at 4 pounds. I like it. Totally get the two-stage trigger now.
Oh, my safety has the "in between" position as well. Almost like they originally designed it to be a 60 degree throw. There's a definite detent halfway through its travel.
What store in Alabama did you get it at? Just curious, as I’m also in Bama, and familiar with most of the prominent outdoors stores in the state.
Family Firearms in Troy.
I bought one just because. I’ve run out of excuses to buy another gun. It’s marketed as a “Cross” between a light packable hunting rifle and a precision rifle. My take is it’s a great handling hunting gun. I can’t imagine a sub 7 pound gun for precision shooting.
It’s supposed to be a switch barrel setup so I did a search and found out Carbon Six makes barrels for it. It is very adjustable, has a folding stock, a three lug bolt and a ss barrel. Trigger is great on it also.
I haven’t gotten it to the range yet but reviews show very good accuracy and fun to shoot. Even with the Vortex HST 6-24x50 it’s not heavy at all.
Pic of the Carbon Six barrel a few posts up which is proprietary to Schnees.com for the next year (they're working on barrel extensions as well). Currently waiting on the barrel removal tool that's back ordered but may get impatient and get a barrel vice. Definitely agree with you (now) on the light weight/precision thing. Looking for m-lock weights that aren't inappropriately expensive for what they are. If I can't find em, I'll make them myself out of tungsten or brass stock.
So have you shot yours yet or are you gonna post in the WTS? The people need to know.
Not yet. I've got a Razor LHT showing up today and rings tomorrow. I'll take it and shoot it next week. Not selling the turd until I know that I can at least deliver someone an acceptable shooting rifle, but it's probably going back to Sig before hand first regardless of how it shoots.
Possum Hollow bore guide arrived. It's bore guide #72 and was $20 shipped. Exceptional deal. Came with two extra o-rings.
I dropped the Cross off along with the Schees/Carbon Six barrel at a local gunsmith this morning as I got impatient waiting for the tool to arrive. Should have it back by Thursday and will shoot it over the weekend. Measured headspace with the stock barrel and fired cartridges and it's identical to my AR10.
I also ordered a Cronus Gen 2 4-29x56 with the APRS6 reticle. I came really close to getting the Meopta Optika 6 5-30x56 as my AR10 scope is the Meopta Optika6 3-18 and I can get essentially the same reticle in both. BUT...having severe issues seeing anything up close without glasses and the Cronus has a few features (like arrows for direction on both windage and elevation) I liked and everyone had great things to say about the glass. I'm actually very happy with the Meopta glass. It was a big step up from a PA GLX scope. I've not compared it to anything high end though.
I dropped the Cross off along with the Schees/Carbon Six barrel at a local gunsmith this morning as I got impatient waiting for the tool to arrive. Should have it back by Thursday and will shoot it over the weekend. Measured headspace with the stock barrel and fired cartridges and it's identical to my AR10.
I also ordered a Cronus Gen 2 4-29x56 with the APRS6 reticle. I came really close to getting the Meopta Optika 6 5-30x56 as my AR10 scope is the Meopta Optika6 3-18 and I can get essentially the same reticle in both. BUT...having severe issues seeing anything up close without glasses and the Cronus has a few features (like arrows for direction on both windage and elevation) I liked and everyone had great things to say about the glass. I'm actually very happy with the Meopta glass. It was a big step up from a PA GLX scope. I've not compared it to anything high end though.
What gunsmith ate you using? Just curious, I’m down towards Dothan.
Mission Ridge on 1604 North. They have a barrel removal tool that works with the Cross. Know they're about 10-14 days out with a serious back log. I should have mine back on Thursday.
Just got a call from gunsmith...they can't get the headspace with the Scheels CarbonSix barrel to factory specification (too big). They tried with the stock barrel and could set headspace correctly. They think the chamber was cut wrong. Bought the barrel off another forum member, wonder if he was aware of the chamber issue. They are calling Scheels just to make sure they're not missing some magic adjustment.
How do you feel about that place? Haven’t been but been wanting to check it out.
Definitely full service with a lot of long (gas) gun inventory. Only place I've seen an FN Scar-17 on the shelf or half a dozen of the same precision rifle on a rack. Very friendly overall, clean, well organized store and they have an indoor range. I didn't check prices carefully but they're definitely not way overpriced like some from what I looked at. They have hand gun and long gun rentals too. I almost never shoot at their indoor range though since I hand load. But it's a pleasant enough place and I'm surprised I haven't gone there more.
I also really like Dury's off of 410 and that's where I bought my Sig P322 from. Incredibly friendly and helpful staff that aren't too pushy. Just the right balance and they processed my purchase really quickly. Lots of inventory. Adelbridge has a TON of stock but they're about $200 high on every gun in the store and ammo prices are stupid. But they do have some really cool stuff in there, especially 1911's, gas and precision guns. I find the staff to be a bit too hipster bro thug roids w/tats overall but hey, to each their own. I've dealt with a few people there that were extremely patient and helpful so there's that. Nagel's is just old, disorganized and dirty. They are ramping up prices on stuff, especially primers, bullets and powder with unreasonable demands like can't buy primers without purchasing bullets or powder. Didn't check the gun prices there, it's just a bit too dark overall and it's hard to see what they have on that bottom shelf behind the dirty glass in a case with no lighting. Just my .02 cents!
I also really like Dury's off of 410 and that's where I bought my Sig P322 from. Incredibly friendly and helpful staff that aren't too pushy. Just the right balance and they processed my purchase really quickly. Lots of inventory. Adelbridge has a TON of stock but they're about $200 high on every gun in the store and ammo prices are stupid. But they do have some really cool stuff in there, especially 1911's, gas and precision guns. I find the staff to be a bit too hipster bro thug roids w/tats overall but hey, to each their own. I've dealt with a few people there that were extremely patient and helpful so there's that. Nagel's is just old, disorganized and dirty. They are ramping up prices on stuff, especially primers, bullets and powder with unreasonable demands like can't buy primers without purchasing bullets or powder. Didn't check the gun prices there, it's just a bit too dark overall and it's hard to see what they have on that bottom shelf behind the dirty glass in a case with no lighting. Just my .02 cents!
That’s cool to hear, do you have base access? Cause I know a gun counter with many(maybe not anymore) SCAR-17’s haha
I definitely don't have that sort of access but my niece is stationed here in SA which is quite cool. Really proud she's serving her country.
Brief update. I stopped in to check on the rifle as I hadn't heard anything. The gunsmith there said that within half an hour of him calling, both Schnee's and CarbonSix called (lead engineer from CarbonSix) and they're sending an RMA and label to have the barrel shipped back. They most definitely want to look at it and no expense out of my pocket. So excellent customer service! I was really shocked as was the gunsmith. He went over how they set headspace and everyone on the line agreed it was done correctly. The way they cut the chamber (and this is above my pay grade) it should be impossible to overcut. So they want to see the barrel.
So now the not so good. I wanted to swing by and pick up the rifle and shoot it at the range this holiday weekend with the original barrel. I have a brand new Cronus BTR to put on it and I want to see how well I like it. Anyway...he double checks head space and barrel nut torque and shoots two rounds at their indoor range to make sure everything is working perfectly. Brass looks perfect. Handing me the rifle, I go to close the stock and it won't close. Looking at the bolt handle, it's not rotating all the way down as I can see a gap at the base. It's just enough the stock won't lay flat and it hits the handle. Anyone ever experience this? I'm guessing it's a headspace issue but he fired two rounds and the brass looked fine. I have the cases and there don't appear to be any issues. I haven't slapped the comparator on them as I have fired brass I shot pre-barrel swap attempt. I ended up leaving the rifle so they could double check headspace. Any other ideas? They did take the bolt apart while setting headspace but it really only goes back together one way.
Any ideas?
So now the not so good. I wanted to swing by and pick up the rifle and shoot it at the range this holiday weekend with the original barrel. I have a brand new Cronus BTR to put on it and I want to see how well I like it. Anyway...he double checks head space and barrel nut torque and shoots two rounds at their indoor range to make sure everything is working perfectly. Brass looks perfect. Handing me the rifle, I go to close the stock and it won't close. Looking at the bolt handle, it's not rotating all the way down as I can see a gap at the base. It's just enough the stock won't lay flat and it hits the handle. Anyone ever experience this? I'm guessing it's a headspace issue but he fired two rounds and the brass looked fine. I have the cases and there don't appear to be any issues. I haven't slapped the comparator on them as I have fired brass I shot pre-barrel swap attempt. I ended up leaving the rifle so they could double check headspace. Any other ideas? They did take the bolt apart while setting headspace but it really only goes back together one way.
Any ideas?
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Wow! Was this purchase direct from Sig? If from a lgs or online retailer, it’s definitely used. Well, someone used it along the lines. If that was through testing, that’s way more then 100 rounds. Other then that, go shoot it and it’ll probably bring a smile to your face.Sig replied back. This is a direct quote.
"After evaluating the Bolt face wear and it’s on the same side as the ejector this is pretty normal and will wear while shooting. This gun was also tested before leaving the factory."
So if your brand new, never fired by you, Cross shows up and your bolt looks like the below, completely normal! Definitely passes their QC. WTF.
I guess if it causes problems down the road, at least I've documented it with them.
Bought online from a retail outfit. No way there was 100 rounds through the gun, it would have shown more wear in other places and there wasn't any nor was there any lube in the recommended places. I disassembled, cleaned off the manufacturing/shipping oil and lubed per the factory manual and shot 40 more rounds and could see the additional dirt/wear those rounds put on the bolt face. So very confident it wasn't a used gun. Plus you could tell the way it was packaged that it hadn't been taken out since being boxed up at the factory.
Maybe a few SC owners here can chime in with some pictures of their bolt to compare.
Issue solved thanks to the Facebook Cross group. The bolt handle was installed upside down. God I hope they caught that prior to taking the barrel off and head spacing the barrel again! I should have caught it too but haven't spent enough time to catch that visually.
Rifle is back with me while I wait on CarbonSix to check on my barrel and possibly send a new one out. I didn't install the muzzle brake/suppressor mount so will shoot as-is. Scope is a Cronos BTR II with massive lens hood, LOL. The MK Machining caps can't get here soon enough.
Going to chrono the stock barrel and compare to the 20" carbon barrel once I get it installed.
Going to chrono the stock barrel and compare to the 20" carbon barrel once I get it installed.
Hope your day went better than mine. Went to get some velocity numbers with the stock barrel and dial in the new scope. Temps hit 105F and it was brutal out there. Short version, the recoil of the 308 was enough to move the scope in the mount despite being torqued correctly and used blue thread locker as well. Ended up chasing my tail for quite a bit as a result.
Using PMC X-Tac to break in the barrel and get chrono numbers before switching over to the CarbonSIX 20" barrel. They state 2800fps but no idea what barrel length they're using to achieve those numbers. Averaged 2676 over 27 shots.
Using PMC X-Tac to break in the barrel and get chrono numbers before switching over to the CarbonSIX 20" barrel. They state 2800fps but no idea what barrel length they're using to achieve those numbers. Averaged 2676 over 27 shots.
Did you get acceptable accuracy or did the scope moving and such eliminate that ?Hope your day went better than mine. Went to get some velocity numbers with the stock barrel and dial in the new scope. Temps hit 105F and it was brutal out there. Short version, the recoil of the 308 was enough to move the scope in the mount despite being torqued correctly and used blue thread locker as well. Ended up chasing my tail for quite a bit as a result.
Using PMC X-Tac to break in the barrel and get chrono numbers before switching over to the CarbonSIX 20" barrel. They state 2800fps but no idea what barrel length they're using to achieve those numbers. Averaged 2676 over 27 shots.
Your cheek piece lever isn't locked to the rear. Might want to complain about that as well. Lol. All joking aside a 16" barrel is going to shoot slower then a 24" barrel. I think I'm around 2,495fps with 168gr eldm ammo.Hope your day went better than mine. Went to get some velocity numbers with the stock barrel and dial in the new scope. Temps hit 105F and it was brutal out there. Short version, the recoil of the 308 was enough to move the scope in the mount despite being torqued correctly and used blue thread locker as well. Ended up chasing my tail for quite a bit as a result.
Using PMC X-Tac to break in the barrel and get chrono numbers before switching over to the CarbonSIX 20" barrel. They state 2800fps but no idea what barrel length they're using to achieve those numbers. Averaged 2676 over 27 shots.
Was messing with the cheek weld actually...so I like to keep it unlocked until I find that sweet spot. Aware the 16" will shoot a bit slower but I wanted a baseline for the new 20" barrel when it gets installed so I could see the difference in velocity. Some of the Facebook Sig Cross group members were asking.
Accuracy is yet to be determined. I'm still in the break-in phase. I cleaned the barrel tonight using bore tech and it was filthy. With that said, once I adjusted the scope forward again and tightened everything down at the range, I had to re-zero the scope at 100 yards. Due to the heat, I didn't notice I was putting bullets through basically the same hole. So I shot the first group of two shots which were side by side but plainly visible as two holes. I adjusted the scope, shot two more, same hole. Didn't realize and thought I had a scope movement issue again with a flyer that didn't register on target. So I shot two more. Same thing, both pretty much through the same hole but again. I couldn't tell, even at 29X due to the mirage effect. It wasn't until I walked up to the target and noticed the holes were touching/overlapping. I called it a day as it was just too hot at that point and I wanted to save some of the PMC for the 20" barrel.
I laser sighted in the scope the night before and started out at the 50 yard range. It was within two clicks out of the box and the groups were very, very small so everything seemed promising until the scope moved. My initial thought was I'd bumped the windage and/or elevation knobs carrying the gun to the 100 yard range (Cronos has non-locking turrets). Looking hard at the Spuhr mounts but it's tough to swallow $400+ at this point. Considering the ADM mounts as well.
Accuracy is yet to be determined. I'm still in the break-in phase. I cleaned the barrel tonight using bore tech and it was filthy. With that said, once I adjusted the scope forward again and tightened everything down at the range, I had to re-zero the scope at 100 yards. Due to the heat, I didn't notice I was putting bullets through basically the same hole. So I shot the first group of two shots which were side by side but plainly visible as two holes. I adjusted the scope, shot two more, same hole. Didn't realize and thought I had a scope movement issue again with a flyer that didn't register on target. So I shot two more. Same thing, both pretty much through the same hole but again. I couldn't tell, even at 29X due to the mirage effect. It wasn't until I walked up to the target and noticed the holes were touching/overlapping. I called it a day as it was just too hot at that point and I wanted to save some of the PMC for the 20" barrel.
I laser sighted in the scope the night before and started out at the 50 yard range. It was within two clicks out of the box and the groups were very, very small so everything seemed promising until the scope moved. My initial thought was I'd bumped the windage and/or elevation knobs carrying the gun to the 100 yard range (Cronos has non-locking turrets). Looking hard at the Spuhr mounts but it's tough to swallow $400+ at this point. Considering the ADM mounts as well.
I also have had issues with scopes walking. Light rifle + .308 = a lot of torque on the scope. I torqued everything back down and with my suppressor on it seems to have stopped.
I did some position shooting practice at home yesterday. 300 and 360 yards from prone and supported standing. The prone shots were just using my Wilderness Tactical Rhodesian shooting sling. No forend support. My supported standing was pretty bad. Time to ramp up dry fire practice.
I'm afraid to go too far with the torque so I emailed Athlon to see what max torque should be. I'll give it one more whirl before trying another brand.
I have an extra muzzle brake I could throw on there for the time being until the new barrel is back. I'll then run a suppressor full time.
