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Suppressors Plastic guns and sand?

J

JimT

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 13, 2004
226
1
Sterling, AK
#1
I was wondering if anyone has knowledge of plastic guns (Glock, etc) being used in the sandbox and issues directly related to sand interacting with plastic.

Our range is one big sandbox and the mags in particular aren't very happy with it. Lots of malfunctions related to it. A couple of speed loads and it's time for an air hose. Magazine followers are sticking so that it appears that the mag spring broke.
 
#3
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

I had zero problems. I carried a Glock in theater for a good amount of time. Without derailing this thread and going off into a discussion of how, I'll share my experience.

A Glock DOES need to be lubricated. Dry Glocks will run for a few rounds before they start to hick up when they are full of dust. How many depends on how much Jesus hates you and how much crap you have in there. If they are properly lubed, they will continue to run. This means grease, not oil. Oil sucks unless you use a lot. I had much better luck with oil in rifles than in sidearms. Using enough oil in a sidearm seemed impossible or a damn mess.

Just because it is a Glock, some people feel they can forgo regular cleaning and daily detailing. This is a mistake. The issue becomes exacerbated after harsh exposure. Holster design can really help keep the crap out. Not rolling around on the ground or standing like a dunce in a dust storm does little to help things.

I'm told the HK's are even more tolerant because of the hollowed out slide giving the crud a place to go and not get in the way. I have no first hand experience with this. I can say the HK's make better suppressor hosts than the glocks. I suspect the reason is the same.

What problems are you having?
What is it that you are doing?
How are they retained?

I can ASSURE you, I've not seen anything all metal run better in that environment. If I find myself there again I will have another glock at my side.
 
#6
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BachelorJack</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> This means grease, not oil. Oil sucks unless you use a lot. I had much better luck with oil in rifles than in sidearms. Using enough oil in a sidearm seemed impossible or a damn mess. </div></div>

Good point! Grease in service rifles isn't a bad idea either in those types of conditions when you may not have the opportunity to clean your weapons as often as you might like to.
 
#7
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

Nothing takes the place of proper maintenance including the magazines. If you are dropping empty mags directly into sand consider placing them in a dump pouch to preserve their capability.
Glocks come from the factory with grease for lube. Take their lead. Their armorers course details where to lube.
Glocks and HK's used in sandy areas exhibit(ed) a clear ability to function properly when dusty over any Beretta, although with the "sand-resistant" Beretta made mags they come up a notch. However, the 92 needs to be lubed more so than a comparable Glock or HK to function reliably. You should not run a Glock/HK dry, if you do you are playing the odds for a malfunction. But they run better dry statistically than other systems if you have to go there.
If it need be, field or detail strip/clean every day including mags to keep them running reliably. It's your life and your buddies on the line plus mission success.
 
#8
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

Larry Vickers did a sand test on a rack grade 1911, custom 1911, HK USP and a Glock 21 a few years back checking function after immersing in fine sand. Glock failed miserably. Trigger failed to reset. HK was best. FWIW
 
#9
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JoeRe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Larry Vickers did a sand test on a rack grade 1911, custom 1911, HK USP and a Glock 21 a few years back checking function after immersing in fine sand. Glock failed miserably. Trigger failed to reset. HK was best. FWIW </div></div>

Like this one?
http://www.theprepared.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=90
 
#10
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JoeRe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Larry Vickers did a sand test on a rack grade 1911, custom 1911, HK USP and a Glock 21 a few years back checking function after immersing in fine sand. Glock failed miserably. Trigger failed to reset. HK was best. FWIW </div></div>

The problem with someone like Larry Vickers is he knows a lot about all of those guns personally.

I can make any of those guns fail the same test. Each has their strong point and each their weakness. All it would take is the location I poured sand on them, or what end I buried first.

Not banging on Larry. Just a fact.
 
#12
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

Bachelor Jack, you should look at the procedure of Larry's test before you knock the way he did the test. No sand was "poured" on the pistols. Sand and holstered pistols were placed in a plastic bag and shaken for ten seconds. Test was done with both dry and lubricated pistols. He was not attempting to make the pistols fail and most did not. BTW, Larry is a fan of 9mm Glocks.
 
#19
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BachelorJack</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outsydlooknin75</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://www.mygtul.com/

Made by a Glock shooter for Glock shooters.

</div></div>

What's the point?

A toothbrush works just as well... </div></div>

The point is if you make a product with a specific function then people will buy it just because someone mentioned it.

Plus I dont know .... someone was saying how they are so great and I figured that I would throw it in this thread.
 
#20
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

First off all guns will fail if the conditions are too bad! Some just worst than others. Well maintained gun is a must if your life is depending on it. Glock is in the top 5 for sure when is come to surviving Harsh conditions. My only Bitch is that the plastic inside the Magwell will scratch and scar from dirt and sand debri. I have had to take a stone to mine more than once to keep it to where it will drop a mag free. Someone once told me to use Armorol dash cleaner for cars on the mags and magwell. It does seem to help and does not collect debri like oil would. Overall I think glock & hk take the cake for be a robust reliable service pistol... -brandon
 
#23
Re: Plastic guns and sand?

Im not a big fan of 9mm but I have learned to like the Glock pistols having carried one on duty for the last 9 yrs. Before that Sig, Baretta, S&W Colt H&K so I'm fairly familiar with all of them and if I had to say what pistol is the toughest I think I'd have to say the 1911 Colt 45acp is mainly because the parts are less delicate. The Glock is amazingly accurate and it is amazing how the majority of them are actually on sight right out of the box.
 
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