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Rifle Scopes Premier - holy shit

Re: Premier - holy shit

Brand, things were fine... until a few decided to dick it up. Its usually the same names, over and over again. Why nothing is done about it, still amazes me.

As for substance, I do hope that I've come across as objective, because I truly do not care one way or the other about the money spent. Just because I bought it, doesn't mean I will ignore crappy quality. So far, I don't have any real dislikes. There are some annoyances, like the parallax not being marked, and the ocular lens cap being shitty.

If it can continue to be exactly how it is now, it is the perfect scope for me.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

More power to you Orkan. I really liked your Razor thread. I really don't care if you have a ton of experience or not, you gave your honest assessment of the Razor. I liked it.

Understand me, I'm not trying to shit on your thread or your recent purchase. They are really innovative designs (PH) and evidently the USMC thinks they will stand the test of duty.

I look forward to reading your eval of the PH, a scope I may never be able to own.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Thanks. I will end up doing a nice write up on it. Notice I didn't call this thread a review.
smile.gif
It isn't often that I open a box and get hit with the "wow" factor. This is the first time its happened on an optic in a long time.

It was due to the turrets, more than anything else. As you said, they are very innovative. Now, if they mush out on me in a few weeks/months... well I'll be singing a different tune.
wink.gif
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

If you use the turrets enough, they will eventually "mush out". Premier has serviced Premier/S&B M8541 SSDS scopes that were returned with virtually no clicks because marines wore them out.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: brand692</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">wow thanks for adding such informative information ass clown
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: brand692</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This thread sucks. I am now dumber for reading it. </div></div> </div></div>

<span style="font-weight: bold"> I've never owned a PH and now, with the price increase, I probably won't.</span> I just don't have a dog in the fight, so nothing beneficial to add. <span style="font-weight: bold">But to consider this tread beneficial? Please. The thread reads like a soap.</span>
There isn't anything new here. Someone spend a huge chunk of change on a mechanical man made device. Mechanical man made shit breaks. S&B, Premier, USO, Stiller, whatever. S&B put wrong elevation caps on some of their 3k dollar scopes. Vortex has mismarked turrets and screws without lock tite. Stiller handles break break off. Premier had shitty clickers. Leupolds have canted reticles. Its a never ending story.

With the knowledge base of players involved in the thread, it could have been SOOO much better. Have you gained anything from it? What I'm saying is I haven't. </div></div>

So the fact you dont have a dog in the fight and have absolutely no firsthand experience with the scope being discussed, seems like a worthy thread to post in. Also I dont need to take anything away from this thread, i had a Premier 5-25 and it shit the bed on me. What do i need to take away from this other than the scope thats being discussed died on me and i have no interest in them anymore. I think that the "usual" players in this thread have given some really good insight into the shortcomings of the scope, maybe if its not positive information on something you deem it "beneficial". And i do believe that some of the problem is people spend a huge chunk of money on something and then get emotionally attached to it, and fail to see or acknowledge the flaws and problems that come with said item. In this thread alone, lets see so far i have counted 5 or 6 scopes from Premier that people have first hand experience in failing or going tits up. Beneficial, you bet your ass it is.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

3 of us have 5-25s, they have all been perfect so far, I expect them to break, I expect all scopes to break, one of us has beat his on phone books everynight after work for 1-4 hours for 2 weeks, turned the knobs stop to stop for hours, let it bounce around the back of his truck to at and from the deer lease, he then mounted and has continued to torture his, this has gone on for 6 months, tracks perfect, holds zero, paralex works as advertised, after hearing how Toddacguy abused his, CKA and me both bought 5-25s, I have not shot with mine yet, but CKA is putting his thru the ringer training with Todd for the Cup, like I said I expect optics to break, and break at the worst time, as long as the company will fix the scopes ASAP Is what I care about.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: One-Eyed Jack</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you use the turrets enough, they will eventually "mush out". Premier has serviced Premier/S&B M8541 SSDS scopes that were returned with virtually no clicks because marines wore them out. </div></div>

In Schmidt & Benders defense I have to disagree with that statement. I have seen quite a few of the afformentioned S&Bs and I never saw one with the click mechanisms "worn out". A couple may have been replaced for various reasons due to abuse or misuse but worn out,<span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold"> never</span></span>.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So the fact you dont have a dog in the fight and have absolutely no firsthand experience with the scope being discussed, seems like a worthy thread to post in. Also I dont need to take anything away from this thread, i had a Premier 5-25 and it shit the bed on me. What do i need to take away from this other than the scope thats being discussed died on me and i have no interest in them anymore. I think that the "usual" players in this thread have given some really good insight into the shortcomings of the scope, maybe if its not positive information on something you deem it "beneficial". And i do believe that some of the problem is people spend a huge chunk of money on something and then get emotionally attached to it, and fail to see or acknowledge the flaws and problems that come with said item. In this thread alone, lets see so far i have counted 5 or 6 scopes from Premier that people have first hand experience in failing or going tits up. Beneficial, you bet your ass it is. </div></div>

Who's to say that in 5-10 years I won't own a PH? 10 years ago, the holy grail of optics for me was a MK4! Now, I own USOs. I would have told you 10 years ago that I'd never be able to own a USO, let alone several. I would have also said I'd never be married or have kids. Well things change.

I couldn't agree with you more on the fact that some people get wound around the axle on high ticket items and fail to notice, or worse-admit, flaws in operation/design.

I couldn't agree with you less on the fact that this thread is beneficial. Other than the 3-15 PH that went tits up on 23 Jan 10, really everything here has been said before. All we have to do is read-read about the clickers, the CS, NUNYA, complete failures, etc etc. Until recently, there were a lot of people who felt that PR's really only redeeming quality what the product (which some felt that wasn't even a redeeming quality).

If this thread had offered something new (like the lit reticle issue, or shadowing issue that the Razor has) I'd gladly agree its beneficial and would influence a future potential decision. Rehashing old failures doesn't.

But arguing about how "beneficial" a thread is, that in and of itself is adding to problem. So I'll let it lie.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: brand692</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If this thread had offered something new (like the lit reticle issue, or shadowing issue that the Razor has) I'd gladly agree its beneficial and would influence a future potential decision. </div></div>

So because I had nothing truly negative to say about it, it wasn't beneficial? Am I suppose to make bad shit up or something?

Fact is, thus far I have nothing bad to say about it. Not because I don't want to... but because I can't really find anything bad. If that doesn't influence a purchasing decision, I'm not sure what does.

It will make for a boring and drama-free review... but I damn sure would rather have a scope that works than one that doesn't. Out of the box, this scope is impressive.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I would assume that with a high dollar scope, it shouldn't have any gripes. It better impress out of the box! Everything should be top notch. I would hope its a boring review.

What I didn't expect was a rehashing of other peoples bad experiences with PR (with the exception of the 23 Jan failure).
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The NorCal boys run an assload of Premiers now, so there will be lots of good data coming from them.

The clarity is fine and about on par with most in its range (subjective anyway), and I'm not sure what to make of the comment about .30 holes at 500 yards.......</div></div>

I'm not the only one who has seen .30 cal holes @ 500....
grin.gif
Got three matches on it now, and about 500 rds behind it and I'm startin to settle into it ( Switched from a NF NXS NPR1 MOA SFP). Eye relief is a bit touchy @ the upper end, but I do most of my shooting with the PH @ about 17X now. Overall I'm real happy with this scope. Probably gonna p/u an ARD b4 summer though...

 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glad you like your scope!

I almost bought one when they first came out, but decided to wait until they've hung around a bit.

As for failure, failure is just a unavoidable occurrence in mechanical devices... There's been a few PR's that's bit the dust too, and if you look at the numbers, b/c of their relatively low numbers of scopes out there, I bet their failure percentages are a lot higher than most... Should that factor into your buying? Sure. What's more important though, is how the company takes care of the problems as they arise, which PR seems to be doing.

<span style="font-weight: bold">I know a guy that wouldn't use a NF as a hammer, and he's a well respected shooter. Just had too many problems with his. My experience is different, as is many others. He will never own another NF product, which I think is the wrong stance to take based on such a small sample, but it's his money, his prerogative. </span>

USO has went through their share of problems, but I think John has them well sorted out now, and is on track to have a stellar year. The new SN3 I got yesterday is very nice, and I see a lot of changes in it from my SN3 I bought just a year and a half ago.

Thing is, once there's a problem, some people condemn the brand for life. No company is infallible though. I hope you enjoy the shit out of your PR and it's a good scope for you, and if something goes wrong with it, I hope they square you away. </div></div>

What kind of problems? Just curious.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Heavy Haulin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm not the only one who has seen .30 cal holes @ 500....
grin.gif
</div></div>

I can see 30 cal holes at 450 with my USO.... so what?
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: chpprguy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Heavy Haulin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm not the only one who has seen .30 cal holes @ 500....
grin.gif
</div></div>

I can see 30 cal holes at 450 with my USO.... so what? </div></div>

My point exactly....
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I still love my 5x25. I bought it over the s and b and the hensoldt which I had the opportunity to use and thought that the price and capability of the scope was better than the other 2. I do not know if I would by another one at the almost 3k that it would take to buy another one and surely would not buy anything above 3k when nightforce is out there and I know those are bad ass tough at a fairly decent price. I do not think that any of them are worth 3k. I have the stash to buy them but I am not out there defending life and country with any of my stuff and I doubt that many of us are. For the guys that are, they deserve the best and I hope they are able to use the best to do what they do.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Rundm, thats pretty much the exact situation I found myself in. It was between premier, S&B, and hensoldt. I've never looked through a hensoldt, much less shot behind one. The S&B's I've used were great, and everyone said the premier's glass and package was up to par. The turrets are what put me over the edge. I would be happy with 11 mils in the first revolution, but I settled with 15. Something tells me if they would have just went to 11 and not tried to pack 15 in there, they might be having less turret issues.
wink.gif


I'll be the first to know if mine give out. Until then, I'm gonna shoot the hell out of this thing.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The NorCal boy run an assload of Premiers now, so there will be lots of good data coming from them.</div></div></div></div>

Yes, you can say we run a few of them on the West. Mainly the 5-25s but there are a few 3-15s.

None of these are safe queens and we run em out to distance 2 to 3 times a month in practice or matches.

I think we getting close to 30 of these circulating around the club. Have we had issues? Yup..and they were fixed. Mine was one of the very first 5-25s and it had a tracking problem, it was fixed and has been bomb proof since.

Marc had the other Premier with an issue..fixed and been bomber since.

Premier.jpg


Every scope maker has issues. Ask Mike Cecil about his S&B 4-16 that dumped yesterday...for the fucken 5th time! That thing has spent more time in Germany than it has in the US.

If it is made by man..it will break sooner or later. Only safe queens never have issues.

Vu

 
Re: Premier - holy shit

This kind of reminds me of the scene in Rain Man when Dustin Hoffman's Character would only fly Quantis because it was the only airline without a wreck. Trouble was Quantis wasn't flying to where they needed to go. In fact, the reason that Quantis didn't have any wrecks is because it was an obscure airline in Australia.

I do think this thread is informative, because most of the crap on PR threads do not recount actual incidents of failure. This one does. BS like "I drove by PR and saw only 2 cars parked there, so they must be out of business" is crap. Real users recounting real failures is not the same as the sewing circle BS. So I disagree with a lot of the bashing of this thread, other than pointing out that Orkan was reviewing the scope before he shot with it... but I understand the excitement of getting a new purchase in the mail and being impressed... a lot of enthusiasm there.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I still have my 3-15 and my clicks are all but gone. I am going to start shooting again this week, so i am going to call in for replacemetn parts to fix it. Im still running original clickers that jerry installed

Honestly i like the scope My only complaint is how heavy it is.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: orkan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thats saying something right there vu. Thanks for posting. I agree with your last statements.

Impressive picture! </div></div>

Thanks. I own 4 5-25s myself. A few other guys in our club own 2 to 3 a piece.

This was the latest one I tested on Saturday. New out of the box.

Mounted and didn't bother to bore site. First shot was 2 mil low, 1 mil left. Made my correction and that is the single shot you see @ 6 oclock.

Made my correction and centered up. I zero my knobs and then proceeded to twist both the elevation and windage as fast as I can from 0 to 15 mils, left and right 4 mils each way. Fired shot 2, cranked the shit out of the knobs some more, fired shot 3, repeat, fired 4, repeat, fired shot 5.

4th Seal was there to witness all this.

Rifle is a KMW 260rem with 2650 rounds down the pipe.

DSC00116.jpg
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Olin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RussW1911</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

You are a fool and have no idea who you are talking to.
</div></div>


It wouldn't matter if Shaggys the Pope or you're the President. Everyone keeping their statements to what they would say if face to face would solve this problem. </div></div>


Dude you have NO idea...

Russ knows me, and Shaggy is a very good friend of mine. Trust me when I say this: If you view it in text, you can damn well believe it would come out of his mouth in person... face to face, nose to nose.

Best you sit this one out, 'fore you get bit.

-Wil
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

... and I can feel the badass coming out of my screen. Can you tell me what place it has in this thread?

Suppose shaggy is the badass to end all badasses. It doesn't pertain to this thread. Ever read about the escalation of war?

I've met plenty of asshole that act the part simply because their physical size/strength can stand for what comes out of their mouth. Didn't stop a few of them from getting tore up. ... and at least one payed the ultimate price. Humans are fragile.

So now that we've established that shaggy isn't afraid to behave in public the way he behaves here because he's the ultimate badass... can we be done with the dick measuring for a little bit?
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> This one does. BS like "I drove by PR and saw only 2 cars parked there, <span style="font-weight: bold">so they must be out of business</span>" is crap. </div></div>

I believe the original quote was 'it kind of makes you wonder". Evidently "so they must be out of business" was your observation.

If you're going to quote someones post please do it accurately.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jerry R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> This one does. BS like "I drove by PR and saw only 2 cars parked there, <span style="font-weight: bold">so they must be out of business</span>" is crap. </div></div>

I believe the original quote was 'it kind of makes you wonder". Evidently "so they must be out of business" was your observation.

If you're going to quote someones post please do it accurately.

</div></div>

Jerry, I wasn't quoting you, but point well taken.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: orkan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hardly what I'd call a review. Just sharing a little excitement and first impressions really.
</div></div>

And to be fair, I posted to a thread when mine first came in the mail as well just based on looking through it and running the turrets... which is why I said I understand the excitement.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I'll contribute to the non-helpful posts, since those are so common in this thread...

It really shouldn't be so hard to grasp that our esteemed OP was giving a limited first impression post.

He said so more than once, in more than one way.

Perhaps some remedial reading lessons are in order for the impatient ones so eager to call someone a shill. The number of questions/challenges on what Orkan had NOT done, when he had already said he hadn't been to the range yet, is laughable.

He's earned a lot more of my respect in this thread than some others with far more vast experience than I have, but only half-vast recognition of what this thread is NOT even advertised to be.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: orkan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hardly what I'd call a review. Just sharing a little excitement and first impressions really.
</div></div>

And to be fair, I posted to a thread when mine first came in the mail as well just based on looking through it and running the turrets... which is why I said I understand the excitement.</div></div>

I felt the exact same way when I opened mine. It's an understandable excitement.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

delete double post.

browser kept timing out, said the site was taking too long to respond.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: orkan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Vu, that is quite impressive.

Any chance you can run a full box test to the full adjustment range? I will be, but not till the weather allows. </div></div>

I would but no time this week..scope tracked fine out to 600 for me.

Rifle goes to AZ in 3 days for Scott's TPRC and I do not have time for a box test.

We have box tested quite a few of these scopes using my APA 22 trainer @ 50 yards in 0 wind and they track perfect. Honestly I don't know wtf is the big deal is with folks that don't like premier or have issues with folks that like the scope. If you dont like the scope or have issues..MOVE ON. If you like it or have data to post...do so.

 
Re: Premier - holy shit

To sum up all of these optics threads... the decision about which rifle scope to buy is personal, highly subjective, and based on the application. Unless it is a brand that I don't like in which case you are a blithering idiot who doesn't know crap about glass or shooting.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Well said carter. HAHAH!

Quite a few "all business" types that like to rip people apart in here. Everyone needs a hobby I guess. I am not discouraged. I'll continue to have fun with the boxes the mailman brings, and post my experiences for all to read.
smile.gif
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Did you take your own advice Orkan?
wink.gif


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: orkan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In the future, when you pick up a new optic and want to see what its capable of at first glance... here is some things you can do so you don't sound like a fool:

Run the turrets completely out, and completely in. Look for any loose or tight spots when doing so. Look through the scope to see what the image looks like when you are at both ends of the spectrum compared to mechanical center. Check both the high and low power ranges at all settings in the process. Check the parallax too. Do so while looking at various objects with various lighting at various distances. This doesn't take very long and will give you a decent idea of the real world capabilities of the optic. Look around on the internet... there are a lot more involved tests out there as well.

Now look, don't go getting all pissy and take this the wrong way. I'm trying to help you. You just should be a little more responsible for the things you say. You can't expect people to take you seriously when you talk about a scope... when all you did was pick it up and look through it a couple times. Do your diligence, and THEN talk about it. </div></div>

When you do, your "Holy shit" comment may turn to an "Oh shit!" comment as mine did when I found backlash and return-to-zero problems with mine. Premier did take care of me with good turn around time, however. I hope they've taken care of the problem on the 5-25s as mine was the 3-15. I worked with Jerry exclusively the 2 times I had to send mine back and the service was great. Bummer he's gone. After having mine fixed, it tracked great. I just decided to go a different route as I can't afford to put Premiers on all my rifles like Vu.
smile.gif

 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I can't tell you that I can see bullet holes at 500 yards from my premier 5x25 or whether or not it won't track 4 or 5 months from now but I can tell you that I have had it for around 6 months now and have shot with it for that amount of time and it has done everything that I need it to do. I have a fair amount of other high end scopes and this one seems to be the best built, best put together scope that I have and or used. I am not saying it will outlast or out perform those in the long run. I will have to wait and see but it seems to be an extremely well built instrument that can and will take abuse. I will still never abuse it or use it nor will 99% of the other guys on this forum what someone whose life depends on these things will. If it does break, then that is what the company is for, to fix it. I would rather send my scope back to a company here in the states and get it back in a couple of weeks then over seas and wait a few months to get it back. That being said, it looks utterly amazing sitting on top of my AI. What can I say, I love the damn thing.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

rksimple... as I've tried to state so many times in this thread... I fully intend to test the shit out of this thing, when WEATHER and TIME allows. I wouldn't be shooting my best in a 30mph -15 degree wind, so I figure I'll wait till its nicer. I have nothing to prove to anyone but myself... and myself can wait for nicer days.

For the record, I did do everything listed in that quote. So for a "first glance" yeah I'm impressed.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rundm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If it does break, then that is what the company is for, to fix it. <span style="font-weight: bold">I would rather send my scope back to a company here in the states</span> and get it back in a couple of weeks then over seas and wait a few months to get it back. </div></div> So do we:

Schmidt & Bender, Inc.
P.O. Box 134
438 Willow Brook Road
Meriden, NH 03770
U.S.A.
(800) 468-3450 toll free
(603) 469-3471 fax
[email protected]
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Premier was purchased by a German entity?

When did <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">that</span> </span>happen??
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

Don't put words in my mouth. Know what... fucksake... I'm just going to delete that post.

Spread the rumors as you see fit. There are no shortage of premier rumors. I'm sure the owners get a good laugh.
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

They built scopes for SB using their parts.Hence the German. I would assume that they dont build crap as the SB USMC scope is the most wanted of all scopes and put most likely together by Premier ...Orkan I wouldn't sweat it.

Glad you like your scope ....enjoy it
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

I like my Premier

no your Premier sucks

No it doesnt

Yes it does

Well your scope sucks too

why?

because I said so!

Fuck You!

Fuck You back!

You parts are made in China

So are yours!

Fuck you!

Im tellin.

ect.

Typical day in the SH optic section.....
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ZOMBIE101</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I like my Premier

no your Premier sucks

No it doesnt

Yes it does

Well your scope sucks too

why?

because I said so!

Fuck You!

Fuck You back!

You parts are made in China

So are yours!

Fuck you!

Im tellin.

ect.

Typical day in the SH optic section..... </div></div>

How about this...

"I'll buy your scope, I'm selling all sorts of stuff to get it. I'll send the money first thing tomorrow morning when I get to the bank"

"OK, I'll hold it until tomorrow morning"
"Hey, did you get to the bank?"
"Hello... do you still want the scope or not?"
"Hello...?"

look to your own behavior mate before you decry the actions of others...
 
Re: Premier - holy shit

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ZOMBIE101</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> </div></div>

</div></div>

Ouch!
 
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