Rifle Scopes Re: David Tubb DTR Scopes ?

[AZhiker]

Hello All...I have been a believer in the BDC Christmas Tree Grid for a long time. As I understand the history, it was first designed by Micky Fowler, and licensed to Zeiss for their excellent Rapid-Z 600/800/1000 reticles. I owned an early, US made Conquest scope and loved it. However, it was SFP, and non-illuminated. Since then I have been on the hunt for a FFP, illuminated, robust scope for .308 165/178 rounds.

Have looked into the David Tubb reticle and his excellent website where you can demo/game play the reticle. There do seem to be advantages to his
reticle, however I have a few questions for those of you who have actually used it.

Personally, I am a great admirer of those who blaze trails and dream up new concepts. However, many of these dreams look great on paper but
after you use them in the field, disappoint.

I appreciate any experience the community may have about this scope.

1. In practice, is the reticle useful, or overly busy?
2. These are custom made scopes. What does anyone know about Premier Scopes [now defunct?]
3. Would you buy a used Premier Scope? Why? Why not? [warranty and repair would be one obvious issue]


My thanks in advance and stay healthy.

Bill

 

[goosed]

Hello All...I have been a believer in the BDC Christmas Tree Grid for a long time. As I understand the history, it was first designed by Micky Fowler, and licensed to Zeiss for their excellent Rapid-Z 600/800/1000 reticles. I owned an early, US made Conquest scope and loved it. However, it was SFP, and non-illuminated. Since then I have been on the hunt for a FFP, illuminated, robust scope for .308 165/178 rounds.

Have looked into the David Tubb reticle and his excellent website where you can demo/game play the reticle. There do seem to be advantages to his
reticle, however I have a few questions for those of you who have actually used it.

Personally, I am a great admirer of those who blaze trails and dream up new concepts. However, many of these dreams look great on paper but
after you use them in the field, disappoint.

I appreciate any experience the community may have about this scope.

1. In practice, is the reticle useful, or overly busy?
2. These are custom made scopes. What does anyone know about Premier Scopes [now defunct?]
3. Would you buy a used Premier Scope? Why? Why not? [warranty and repair would be one obvious issue]


My thanks in advance and stay healthy.

Bill

1. Overly busy, far too easy to end up the wrong line.
2. Great scopes, built well.
3. Tangent Theta bought out Premier, they warranty some based on serial number range.


Whether I would buy one or not should have no impact on you. We have different wants/needs.

 

[AZhiker]

Thank you very much....one thing that the DTR addresses that none other does is target movement

Many of these scopes, NF, Zeiss, PFI, Primary Arms... have dots/hash marks to compensate for wind.

The DTR has the W and R to compensate for moving targets.


I hunt coyotes in Arizona....long shots, sneaky targets.

It would seem that you have to integrate your movement + your wind in the selection of hold

And that would make it even more 'busy'?

 

[goosed]

Thank you very much....one thing that the DTR addresses that none other does is target movement

Many of these scopes, NF, Zeiss, PFI, Primary Arms... have dots/hash marks to compensate for wind.

The DTR has the W and R to compensate for moving targets.


I hunt coyotes in Arizona....long shots, sneaky targets.

It would seem that you have to integrate your movement + your wind in the selection of hold

And that would make it even more 'busy'?

That only lines up with one bullet going one specific speed. Use a different bullet, caliber or have a different muzzle velocity and it all becomes a guessing game anyways.

The dots/hash marks in most scopes can be used to account for wind + movement. There is plenty of info on the formulas out there if you're interested. You just have search a little.

 

[ubettcha]

You would also get the app to use the reticle with many different rifles. When you watch some of his videos baboon hunting it is incredibly fast on rapidly changing distances as the baboons run up the mountains.

 

[AZhiker]

wild
Thanks!

 

[mpl2353]

It’s no more complex than a tremor reticle, only it accounts for spin drift of similar bullets (depending on which scope you get). It’s actually pretty easy to use and you learn fast. It comes with an app if you want to treat it like a kestrel only use yards/meters and wind speed as opposed to mils.
While it is primarily designed around the 6xc, it is very easy to adjust for changing density altitudes and various bullets and speeds with no use of the app and without the need for a kestrel beyond knowing what the DA is(which the app also gives you based on your nearest weather station).
It’s not too complex. People just make it more than it is.

 

[acudaowner]

Id bet he knows more about what ever he is saying than I do , but all I really heard was charlie brown's teacher talking I latterly understood almost none of that except something about Egyptian cartouches and the word recitals maybe something about mils and moa lol what can I say its 4 am and its been a long long day .

 

[Conrad]

Quoted below is a much more informed answer. I've used the reticle pretty much since its inception. It's another tool in the tool box. It can be extremely fast, it is intuitive, and it can be used for a variety of bullets (BC's don't have to be exactly the same) within an appropriate velocity range for the given reticle version.

It can also be tuned for DA, and finally it has it's own solver app if needed.

Is it as universal as mils, NO.

Can it be faster in various scenarios, YES....PRS stage, not necessarily....steel safari, coyote hunting, etc--definitely will reduce some time and clutter. Are there other ways/tools to skin those cats quickly with mils too...sure are.

I like mils, and I like the DTR....tools in the toolbox.

It’s no more complex than a tremor reticle, only it accounts for spin drift of similar bullets (depending on which scope you get). It’s actually pretty easy to use and you learn fast. It comes with an app if you want to treat it like a kestrel only use yards/meters and wind speed as opposed to mils.
While it is primarily designed around the 6xc, it is very easy to adjust for changing density altitudes and various bullets and speeds with no use of the app and without the need for a kestrel beyond knowing what the DA is(which the app also gives you based on your nearest weather station).
It’s not too complex. People just make it more than it is.

 

[AZhiker]

Thank you all very much.

Without having one in hand, I greatly appreciate the input of others who have actually used the reticle and the scopes.