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so... Grendel it is

A

Aces&Eights

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Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 14, 2010
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Wisconsin
I've commited to myself that my next build will be a grendel. I know the Barrel options are more or less limited to Alexander Arms and Sabre Defence. In my dreams Noveske will eventually produce something chamberd in 6.5 Grendel (as rumored) but even in my dreams I am not connected enough to get anything close to en early run...

So help me out as I have not found much helpful info and I am looking for advice on barrel length and twist rate as well as who's barrel I should go with. This will be on an AR platform for extended range target shooting. Ideally I would like the shotest barell possible for efficiant ballistic performance.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I have the Grendel DMR, bought from Alexander arms. Looks basically like yours.

I have a 7.62SD AAC supressor on mine with a QD. I use it on several weapons and it works great. From suppressed to non supressed I get about.5 MOA change and in my weapon that is down.

Make sure you use a 30 cal can and not a .223. I have four different suppressors and the AAC works as well as the Gem Tech and the SWR, and my buddies surefire. Cannot tell the difference.

The 6.5 is one great round. Ammo availability at stores is poor but the round is very flat shooting.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I purchased a Grendle 19.5 upper from Alexander with the Shilen barrel upgrade. The barrel brokein in only 12 rounds. The accuracy at 100 yards ranged from 1 moa to just a tick over 1/2 moa. I was shooting Alexander Arms loaded ammo 123 HP Lapua Scenar. Assuming my chrony was giving me good data, MV averaged 2600. All and all I am pleased with accuracy/function of the rifle. The only down side was the wait for the upper, about 8 months. The excuse was Shilen was running slow on getting their barrels out. Oh yeah, if memory serves barrel is a 1-8 twist.

I did shoot it to only 250 yards 0.9 mils and 300 yards 1.4 mils was spot on with those comeups. Will take her farther out when I get a chance.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I would say this 6.5 Grendle should be great round for hogs, hope to find out soon. Need to find a good huntin bullet for it though.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I have killed four hogs using the exact round you are shooting-the 123 Lapua, although I am sure there are better.

None of those hogs moved more than ten feet.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hogrider</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have killed four hogs using the exact round you are shooting-the 123 Lapua, although I am sure there are better.

None of those hogs moved more than ten feet. </div></div>
Ok thanks , I will try them out on a hog when I get a chance.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is


The 6.5 Grendel is an awesome cartridge,
you will be VERY happy with your decision, I'm sure.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

308crosshairs said:
The only down side was the wait for the upper, about 8 months. The excuse was Shilen was running slow on getting their barrels out. Oh yeah, if memory serves barrel is a 1-8 twist.

I thought I read that a standard AR .223 upper can be used with the Grendel Barrel? Please correct me if I am wrong.
Click to expand...
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I thought I read that a standard AR .223 upper can be used with the Grendel Barrel? Please correct me if I am wrong.
</div></div>

Yes you can use an AR upper reciever. Without the barrel of course. You would have to use a 6.5 grendel barrel. I bought my barrel from Midway. I think it is a Shaw barrel. It is accurate with my handloads. I also had GAP build me an upper. It also shoots GREAT. 6.5 grendel is a good caliber.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

A&E,

You can get the barrel and bolt from AA. They may even have some in stock. I would just send them an email to be sure. I've been corresponding with Jen and she has been very helpful.

-Pat
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pete, don't you need a new BCG as well? </div></div>

You will need a bolt, but not the bolt carrier. When I built my first one I used quite a few AR parts. I got the barrel with a bolt. Now finding just a bolt for my second build was a chore. I had two bolts on order from Alexnder Arms. It took about 9 months to get them. Those I have as spares.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Best value on the barrel is a Lothar Walther produced by CSS. They don't call it a grendel because of licensing but thats what it is. Satern is considered the best grendel barrel you can get, but the customer service sucks and you'll wait 4-5 months for the barrel, the LW in most peoples opinion is just as good as the Satern and cost $50-75 less and is readily available.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Les Baer makes a Grendel upper though he calls it a .264-LBC. I have one from Precision firearms and a beautiful upper. It fires 6.5 grendel and the .264 LBC! Les Baer is right up there with Sabre and Saturn!
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I have only shot 20 rounds through mine but I am loving it already.

You just missed a good deal on a barrel and bolt here on the hide yesterday I think.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Go here for great Grendel info. http://www.65grendel.com/forum/

Lothar Walther/CSS are great to deal with: http://www.competitionshooting.com/catalogue/category33/p1612

Here's mine not quite done, with a LW/CSS 22" Med contour barrel. I havent shot it yet but Ive got brass comeing this week.. The Hornady ammo and black hills grendel/264LBC ammo hitting the store shelves right about now, will hopefully put an end the the grendel ammo problems.
100_2873.jpg
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

There are now several advertisers on the 65grendel site offering
barrels. Les Baer at www.lesbaer.com is also offering barrels of his version of the Grendel.
I have had two LW Grendel barrels and for the cost they have been
great high quality barrels and the best buy I have found. I would
rate them a top of the line barrel at a discount price.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The new guy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Best value on the barrel is a Lothar Walther produced by CSS. They don't call it a grendel because of licensing but thats what it is. Satern is considered the best grendel barrel you can get, but the customer service sucks and you'll wait 4-5 months for the barrel, the LW in most peoples opinion is just as good as the Satern and cost $50-75 less and is readily available.</div></div>


The CSS chamber is not exactly the same as the 6.5 Grendel chamber. People have been trying to run grendel ammo in CSS chambers and have been having some issues. Just something you may want to keep in mind. It doesn't have to be an AA barrel as long as it's a grendel chamber your good to go.

Yeah, I know ...... low post count. But, I've been around the forums for a while. Just recently joined this forum. Getting into long range shooting with my Grendel and though I could learn some stuff here.

Mutt
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Mutt-

6.5 CSS, 6.5 BPC, and 6.5 LBC chamber reamers (from Kiff) are ALL 6.5 G chambers they just have minor diferences in the throat and freebore from AA's design and you do not have to pay Bill Royalties.

By your logic, all the .308 match variations reamers are not .308 Win because they are not on the big side of SAMMI spec.

I encourage you to make a chamber casting and a get a damn good micrometer and try to compare your AA spec chamber to one of the prints above that Dave Kiff will e-mail you. If you get real good measurements you will find the neck on a AA chamber is .300" compared to say .296" on BPC chamber, Now measure your OD on your loaded ammo, if you have more than .004 you are more than GTG provided you are not jamming projectiles into the lands (too short a throat).
Bill at Alexander Arms subscribes to a larger throat and longer freebore promote accuracy in a semi-auto. I am of the opinion as long as you have proper clearances for your ammo things like care taking in chambering barrel and barrel blank quality matter a whole lot more.....
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I just made a similar post on another thread. But I've got an ER Shaw barrel from Model 1 Sales on my Grendel. They have them in stock on their website and at $235 can't beat the price. They call it the "6.5 Sporter" but it's a Grendel. I have a 16" medium contour barrel with 1:9 twist. It shoots great! Took a while to break in but shoots well under MOA now. Even though the twist is a little slower than optimal for the grendel it shoots really well. My favorite bullet for accuracy is the 108 gr Scenar. Despite low grain weight I have put MOA groups on steel in 13 mph 90 deg wind at 600 yards. The 123 has better ballistics but because of the slow twist my rifle doesn't shoot it as well. And for hunting I'm using the 120gr TTSX. But Barnes just came out with a 100 gr TTSX which I'm going to try shortly which should be amazing for the grendel.

Hope that helped!
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<span style="font-weight: bold">Cant go wrong with a 6.5 Grendel!!</span>

Here's mine.

speedy019.jpg
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

the Satern bbl is worth the wait but u dont need it for hunting
at any normal range--i use an AA 14.5 for hunting deer and hogs
and the 22" Satern for anything long-range--a 14.5 with a slick-side receiver is a great saddle/truck gun for just about anything
on the ranch--got my 1st Grendel a few yrs back to reach those
400+ yd coyotes in the windy TX conditions--dont care for the
AR10 but do own 1
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

hogrider,

did your QD make your un-canned shots brutally loud for either you or others on the line? I'm contemplating having my new (as yet to be ordered) LW match varmit barrel threaded for the 762sd.

thanks
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Too bad the 65grendel.com site went away.

Anyone know if there's a replacement/equivalent forum out there?
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 308crosshairs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I would say this 6.5 Grendle should be great round for hogs, hope to find out soon. Need to find a good huntin bullet for it though. </div></div>

120 Nosler ballistic tip.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

My Grendel is being assembled as we speak. I'm still awaiting the mount/rings and the stock.

I received (7 days from order) the AA Entry upper with a 19.5" Shilen barrel 1:8 twist, composite free float tube (sling studs have been removed in favor of the Seekins SRS Picatinny Rail[/url] - the one designed for the HS Stocks fit <span style="font-weight: bold">PERFECTLY</span>, though I had to find alternate screws), gas buster charging handle, warp industries muzzle brake, American Defense Recon-SW mount/rings, IOR Valdada 3.5-18x50 FFP, Magpul PRS stock, Atlas bi-pod, DPMS lower, Chip McCormick trigger, Magupul trigger guard bottom, Panther tactical grip.

I'll get some pics up when she's done (perhaps by the weekend).
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PolishHandgunner</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I ordered a Les Baer upper in 6.5 Grendel and Les fit it to my Rock River Arms National Match lower.

It has a 24" bull barrel so it is not light but very accurate using 2520 powder and either 123grain Hornadies or Sierras.
</div></div>

You should try the 123 Scenars.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: texasgrunt</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Eleaf - I wanna see some photos when your done. I'm getting close myself. Hopefully by mid February... </div></div>

I'll get them up in the next day or so. My mount has arrived and I'll be mounting the optics in a few minutes.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I looked at some 6.5 Grendel uppers/barrels from www.precisionfirearms.com at the SAR west show. They said they are using Lothar-Walther blanks.

Been hunting with the 6.5 Grendel off and on this year. For inexpensive plinking projos, Grafs has 139gr 6.5mm FMJ Privi projos dirt cheap.

It is surprisingly harsher unsuppressed than an equivalent length barrel AR in 5.56.

Haven't got as much time to work with this 16" carbine as I would like, but it is looking pretty good. I waited for 6 months for the barrel/bolt/receiver/dies/gages after ordering them a year or so ago.

BREVIS-Suppressor-Gun.jpg


The only mags going seem to be the C-mag. Several of the first batch I ordered failed at the spot welds. They replaced them immediately and have not had any problems with the replacements.

Delta P Design 6.5 BREVIS
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Not a great pic, but she's (almost) done as of about 30 minutes ago. The only things left to do are enhanced trigger guard install and PRI gas buster handle exchange (both are sitting under the tree, and neither necessary to shoot her!). I'll get her outside tomorrow and get some better light. That one little CFL over my bench is terrible for pics.

<ul style="list-style-type: disc">[*]Alexander Arms Entry Upper [*]Shilen Match barrel 19.5" 1:8 twist threaded at 3/4"x 28 tpi [*]Warped Consulting Inc muzzle brake [*]Composite free float tube handguards (took off sling studs and installed the Seekins SRS picatinny rail for HS stocks) [*]Magpul PRS [*]American Defense Recon-SW mount [*]IOR Valdada 3.5-18x50 ffp [*]Atlas bipod v7[*]DPMS Tactical Grip[*]DPMS Lower[*]Chip McCormick drop-in Trigger [*]Titanium firing pin [/list]

grendel1.png
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Does anyone want to bet me eleaf wasn't wearing any pants when he took that pic? LMFAO! That baby looks sweet man, really nice set-up.

-Pat
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: He_Shoot _Me</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does anyone want to bet me eleaf wasn't wearing any pants when he took that pic? LMFAO! That baby looks sweet man, really nice set-up.

-Pat </div></div>

Actually I was wearing pants.

It's fucking cold in the basement this time of year.

But that shouldn't preclude me from playing a little pocket pool.
laugh.gif
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

So not to highjack the thread, but I'm also building a Grendel upper. I got a AA upper receiver, Sabre Defense 18" barrel/bolt, low pro block/tube, Hogue free float tube, and the a muzzle brake. Is there anything special to putting these together, as in different from building a typical 223 upper? I also ordered an upper reciever action block and multi-tool for the barrel nut. Am I missing anything? It should be a simple bolt together project for the most part, I think. Oh yeah forgot, picked up a used bolt carrier and charging handle. Hope it turns out well!
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

All the guys who make the 6.5 are good quality builders. The cartridge works very well, I'm shooting my own in our local matches and doing quite well. I have a match this sunday where we shoot out to 700yds.

Good luck with whoever you go with, ask how long the wait is on builds before dropping down the cash so your not surprised.

Post up some pics when you get it done.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

/\
|
|
|

This is the man you want to speak with about building you a Grendel.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

Guys-

I need some HELP.
I'm shooting a sniper match in late FEB and I'm the spotter. I need a semi-auto precision rig and I'm looking to upgrade my 5.56. I'm looking for a Grendel (I shot a 6.5mm bolt so it makes sense for reloading); what is the best route for getting a MOA/sub MOA Grendel by early FEB???
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I shoot a JP that is very consistant, probably couldn't get it by Feb. (but maybe).
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesBailey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys-

I need some HELP.
I'm shooting a sniper match in late FEB and I'm the spotter. I need a semi-auto precision rig and I'm looking to upgrade my 5.56. I'm looking for a Grendel (I shot a 6.5mm bolt so it makes sense for reloading); what is the best route for getting a MOA/sub MOA Grendel by early FEB???

</div></div>

Order an upper from Alexander Arms, throw it on your current 5.56 lower, go to match and shoot. It's an MOA/sub MOA gun out of the box, especially if you go with the shilen barrel upgrade (which cost me an extra $150).

I ordered mine on a Friday (with the barrel upgrade) and had it in my hands the following Friday.

AA uses top notch parts and has great CS. You might want to call and see if they can do a different thread pitch (assuming that they are already pre-threaded) because the 3/4"x28 tpi is very uncommon and you won't find many 3rd party brakes/suppressors that will fit it.

You can use AA factory ammo though it's expensive, or you can get the upper sooner than later and build your own load for it. 123 Amax (BC of .510) with AA2520 works great. You can also get the 123 scenar (with a BC of .547) load data with VV powder from lapua's site. Either should get you to 1000 with no problems. It's more efficient than 7.62, hits harder when it gets there (especially past 400 yards), lighter, and has less recoil.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesBailey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys-

I need some HELP.
I'm shooting a sniper match in late FEB and I'm the spotter. I need a semi-auto precision rig and I'm looking to upgrade my 5.56. I'm looking for a Grendel (I shot a 6.5mm bolt so it makes sense for reloading); what is the best route for getting a MOA/sub MOA Grendel by early FEB???

</div></div>

Order all the parts online and build it yourself.

I have done 2 Grendels this way.

Rainierarms and Midway USA have Sabre Defense and Satern 6.5 Grendel barrels In Stock, any .233/5.56 Upper and Lower will work (I prefer the Vltor MUR Upper) with the Grendel, get a Handgaurd, Trigger, Stock, and glass and go shoot!


You could find all your parts for your build online and have them within a week unless you order stuff from Alexander Arms and then you might be waiting months.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: longrange30</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rainierarms and Midway USA have Sabre Defense and Satern 6.5 Grendel barrels In Stock, any .233/5.56 Upper and Lower will work (I prefer the Vltor MUR Upper) with the Grendel, get a Handgaurd, Trigger, Stock, and glass and go shoot!
</div></div>

Longrang30-
that is an interesting idea. I'm interested. If I bought the Satern 6.5 Grendel barrel, 20"'er from Midway, it looks like I would need a .875" gas block. What length gas tube would I need? This would go on my Vltor MUR Upper (that currently has the 5.56mm 18" barrel).
I will call AA on Monday and see what their wait is for a Shilen barrel upgraded upper.
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesBailey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys-

I need some HELP.
I'm shooting a sniper match in late FEB and I'm the spotter. I need a semi-auto precision rig and I'm looking to upgrade my 5.56. I'm looking for a Grendel (I shot a 6.5mm bolt so it makes sense for reloading); what is the best route for getting a MOA/sub MOA Grendel by early FEB???

</div></div>

My only suggestion would be to get the barrel threaded 9/16-24 instead of a larger proprietary thread. When I talked with AA they said they could offer it either way. With their proprietary thread, you are limited. You can get an A2 flash hider from AA, a couple othersfrom their site, or one of the Vltor flash hiders from many sources to fit the 9/16-24...and we offer the a dedicated 6.5mm BREVIS suppressor in 9/16-24 thread mount. With their 3/4-28 thread you are kind of stuck.


Here is a link showing some of their their barrel thread specs.
http://www.alexanderarms.com/gtech.htm

IMG_9182.jpg
 
Re: so... Grendel it is

I had a Grendel with a 24 inch barrel, and eventually swapped it out for an Alexander Arms 19,5 inch one. I figured the shorter barrel worked better for the practical rifle ,and type of precision rifle matches I wanted to shoot. I just didn't need that long and heavy of a tube.

I also have an Lothar Walther 18 inch Grendel. Both rifles shoot .5 inch sometimes, usually more like .65-.75, and very consistent.

Most of the issues I have with reliability were related to how much I set back the shoulder after firing. The chambers were only about 2 thou different in headspace. Once I started setting the shoulders back about 3-4 thou from the short chamber, rounds worked great in both rifles, and accuracy was the same in both of the rifles. I'm pretty sure I could get a little better accuracy if I tailored loads for each rifle, but I would rather be able to grab Grendel ammo and know it will work well in either rifle.

The rifles are accurate enough that they have each won local precision rifle (sort of civilian sniper type matches) matches here that go out to 500-600 yards max. Usually a 10 inch plate at about 500 yards from awkward field positions is sort of "standard".

Either Grendel will shoot well, but my experience with Alexander is that their customer service is really top notch. Twice I have called there and actually ended up talking with Mr. Alexander. I felt sort of like I was asking Einstein questions about high school algebra. But he was really nice and a complete gentleman. Really a class fellow.
 
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