Suppressors TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

R

raider1v1

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Mar 16, 2010
357
49
Kansas City, MO
#1
I am really torn between these three. They are all highly regarded, but im not sure on the material I need it to be made out of or what one to get. I have been looking around and I dont really see people comparing these.

I have talked to Shane @TBAC and Rob @ Liberty and I still am not 100% sure.

The hosts will be a 308 bolt, AR 6.5 Grendel, and AR 223. They will be used for prairie dog hunting and range use. The most I see them being used is about 90 rounds in 30 minutes, not exactly dumping magazines, but I dont want to have to worry about damaging the titanium with some extra shots.
 
#3
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The 30P1 has a great reputation for accuracy, minimal point of impact shift, and sound reduction.

What you are describing sounds like it would be more than fine for the can. </div></div>

have you heard or have any experience with the liberty cans? I am also a bit worried that TI wont be able to take the amount of shooting that I will be doing.

I wont be doing mag dumps, but shooting 90 rounds in 30 minutes is the usual.
 
#4
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

i've held a couple liberty's & shot one, the weight of their Ti can feels like it should be a SS can... sound suppression for claiming there 223 varminter is the quietest in the industry, eh... not so much, @ least to my ears.
 
#6
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Raider1v1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The 30P1 has a great reputation for accuracy, minimal point of impact shift, and sound reduction.

What you are describing sounds like it would be more than fine for the can. </div></div>

have you heard or have any experience with the liberty cans? I am also a bit worried that TI wont be able to take the amount of shooting that I will be doing.

I wont be doing mag dumps, but shooting 90 rounds in 30 minutes is the usual. </div></div>

I've met David Saylors at the Knob Creek Machine Gun Shoot- he's a pretty nice guy. I haven't ever heard any of the Liberty cans shot. I saw a few under glass on the www.classIIIdealers.com website owner's table (he was allowing suppressor companies to display their products at his table).

The Liberty product according to the Youtube videos should meter very well.
 
#7
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

YouTube should not be a reference for sound quality of a can.... Its either from a shitty camera or a cell phone video and it does not due the suppressor its justice. I have always found it near impossible to gauge sound and tone in a video format.

Just sayin'
 
#8
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If it's for precision work, get the 30P-1. </div></div>

do you have any measure of the practical accuracy difference in something like the 30p-1 and the liberty or a thundertrap?

when people say its more accurate are they referring to shooting groups w/ the can on, or referring to POI shift?
 
#10
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">YouTube should not be a reference for sound quality of a can.... Its either from a shitty camera or a cell phone video and it does not due the suppressor its justice. I have always found it near impossible to gauge sound and tone in a video format.

Just sayin' </div></div>


Yeah the sound meter is in most of the Liberty videos, so you have access to the actual data from the meter to use as a means of interpreting performance.

It's not an attempt to decide how the suppressor sounds from listening to it on video.
 
#11
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">YouTube should not be a reference for sound quality of a can.... Its either from a shitty camera or a cell phone video and it does not due the suppressor its justice. I have always found it near impossible to gauge sound and tone in a video format.

Just sayin' </div></div>


Yeah the sound meter is in most of the Liberty videos, so you have access to the actual data from the meter to use as a means of interpreting performance.

It's not an attempt to decide how the suppressor sounds from listening to it on video.
</div></div>

I'm aware of that. I am just letting the new users know that you should never base your sound/tone selection from a youtube video. You can look at the meter but nothing is better than being there and hearing it for yourself.
 
#12
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

IMO, There is not even a shred of similarity between them. If that is your choice, your are not buying the Liberty.

If you read my earlier piece on your now numerous threads, I think you should now stop worrying about Ti in any application that your suppressor will encounter.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2848280#




 
#13
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

I recently did a test, with several Ti cans (not the liberty) But pretty much most others on the market.

I have tested the TBAC 30P-1 next to a Gemtech Sandstorm and Shark .30 on a professional pressure meter and they were within 1db or so of each other. <span style="font-style: italic">(personally I have not found the variation to be much more than 3db using full power loads, so in my opinion talking about sound is a waste of everyone's time)</span>

Now with my recent test I tried using a commercial sound meter at the target to try an get a idea of the cans' sound signature at the target. Unfortunately the ambient noise at the range I had to use was much stronger than I would have thought. So the signature part of the test needed to be thrown out. However I did test accuracy again, with the following Ti cans,

Shark,
Sandstorm
Jet
AWC
TBAC

again the clear winner was the TBAC 30P-1 giving me the very best down range accuracy of any of the others.

Because of the location I was not happy enough to publish this, and I hoping to be able to get to MY range which is well off the beaten path. The issue was the AWC was still in the Dealers care so we used his local range. Because of this I feel to be fair I need to redo the entire test.

This said, time after time, to including having Ti cans since 2004, <span style="font-style: italic">(my 1st 3 cans transferred to me were Ti) </span> the ThunderBeast continues to prove itself the best of the bunch.

I haven't used the Liberty, so you're mileage may vary.
 
#14
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> so in my opinion talking about sound is a waste of everyone's time) </div></div>

I agree with that. The 30P1 is lighter, it is shorter, I believe the sound performance is very close if not better. From all angles the 30P1 is hard to beat.
 
#15
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

With regard to the durability, what you describe should not be an issue. If you have a thermal cover you will probably start to melt that way before you can do damage. During some prairie-dog shooting, we've shot .308 rounds through my AI-AWP as fast as a loader could throw another round in the port and we could acquire the next PD.

Be aware that shooting with the can will cause your rifle to retain more heat- most people don't like their precision rifle barrels to get that hot. Eventually the mirage off the barrel itself will cause sight picture problems.

Here's a thread with some accuracy and shift numbers
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2096234&page=1

Hope this helps
Zak

ETA- Going to our .223 suppressors, 3 mags in 30 minutes is nothing for the 223P-1, which is mostly Ti. I use that on my (non FA) SBR 12" and it's fine.
 
#16
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

wow. so now the evidence is overwhelming. the last thing is, is the 30p-1 able to be upgraded (for a fee of course) when newer revisions come out?

if so, the decision is set and ill order that along with the rimfire on Monday.
 
#17
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

Though Zak should answer that for his benefit, I would say that you would be buying a can that is welded and sealed. This is exactly what you want for a number of important reasons. In my opinion, no centerfire can needs to come apart, nor should it as there are a great number of very real sacrifices made when they do. Your buying fully machined and featured baffles that are circumferentially welded as opposed to the Liberty can that was to have been, as I understand it, a monocore. Two very different products.

As to upgrading, whereas many/most high end sealed can companies can "crack" their cans, with the can you are considering, I honestly doubt you would ever have a reason to unless you fail to manage its mounting and strike a baffle.
 
#18
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

When the product is performing at the edge of the market (135DB, and not shifting POI, and producing the best accuracy (per Lowlights test), why would you want to upgrade?

What is the manufacturer supposed to work on improving?
 
#19
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When the product is performing at the edge of the market (135DB, and not shifting POI, and producing the best accuracy (per Lowlights test), why would you want to upgrade?

What is the manufacturer supposed to work on improving?

</div></div>

I dont know...125DB? I am just wondering since this has been out a while, if they have a version 2 or something how that would work or if it would be possible at all.
 
#20
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

well crap. I have been emailing back and forth with Zak and I cant decide on the Brake attach version or not. What do you guys think? The way that I see it is

pros - no chance of damaging the barrel threads.
cons - cost of the brakes vs thread adapters

Am I missing anything?

Thanks for all the help so far guys!
 
#21
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

The cost of a new brake would be less then threading a barrel for the can but that is kind of funny because you have to thread the barrel in order to use the brake. Your kind F'ed either way.

Personally I prefer thread on cans for bolt guns. But Im never opposed to running a well respected and proven QD model.

You have to pick your poison. We can't make up your mind for you completely.
 
#22
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The cost of a new brake would be less then threading a barrel for the can but that is kind of funny because you have to thread the barrel in order to use the brake. Your kind F'ed either way.

Personally I prefer thread on cans for bolt guns. But Im never opposed to running a well respected and proven QD model.

You have to pick your poison. We can't make up your mind for you completely. </div></div>

well after thinking about it a bit more, heres my line of thought.

1. i dont need a brake on the rifles that im shooting. I have a savage 10fp 308, AR 6.5 Grendel, .223, and 204 Ruger.

2. I will need to thread the 223. The savage has the 5/8-24. the 204 ruger has 1/2-28, and the 6.5 has 3/4-28.

3. The deciding factor for me is that I dont like that style of brake. I prefer the vias/pepper style brake.

5. What makes me pause is the unthreading/threading and the possibility of damaging the barrel.
 
#23
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

Threaded on properly you cannot damage those threads by just screwing on a can. I only take mine off to clean the rifle....

You are going to need a lot of adapters to make one can work with all those different thread patterns.
 
#24
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Threaded on properly you cannot damage those threads by just screwing on a can. I only take mine off to clean the rifle....

You are going to need a lot of adapters to make one can work with all those different thread patterns. </div></div>

ill need 2. a 1/2-28 and a 3/4-28 if available.

the other way, ill need 4 brakes regardless if they are already threaded and i am not a fan of that brake style. i thought about it for quite a while, and im going to go with the thread on can.

another bonus, is if i dont get the performance from the 30p-1 that i want i can buy a dedicated can for the 223 and 204 and im not stuck with 2 brakes that i cant use.
 
#26
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yep! </div></div>

now i just need to find someone who makes the 3/4-28 to 5/9-24 adapter. if its even possible.
 
#28
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Delta P Designs makes adapters, I know he had 3/4-24, but contact Byron. </div></div>

This is a fact. If Byron doesn't have any left, I have one in stock.
 
#29
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

+1 for the TBAC 30p-1. I use one on my 20in .308 and I shoot quick 20rd strings....the suppressor may be smoking a bit but you can't damage TI unless you get it well over 1000 degrees which I doubt you will be doing. I get very little if an POI/POA shift. Just zero your rifle with the can on it and repeatability will be a non-issue.

It's a well made can and Ive shot pretty much all of them. Best part is, Zak who owns and makes the TBAC cans is a professional shooter and knows his stuff inside and out...just check out www.demigodllc.com and do some reading. He wins competitions regularly with his rifles and his cans. Can't go wrong with them.
 
#30
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 762frmafr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Delta P Designs makes adapters, I know he had 3/4-24, but contact Byron. </div></div>

This is a fact. If Byron doesn't have any left, I have one in stock. </div></div>

I just called and talked to Byron (awesome guy BTW) and he doesn't have one. Do you have one in stock the 3/4-28 to 5/8-24?
 
#31
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

Got 2 libertys on the way,they don't get much love here,but I heard one at a tactical class and saw the dots on the dot drill.I ordered 2 less than a month later.david sailors is tip top. Removeable end caps,my decision was made easy!
 
#32
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

Thanks for the help guys. Just got back from the dealer and I have an essence from liberty as well as a 30p-1 on the way...now i need to just hang out and forget about the waiting!
 
#33
Re: TBAC 30p-1 vs Liberty Victory vs Liberty Freedom

Shark is also a good choice if you want a can that come apart for service and Ti. He also has the option of different tale caps to suit many different threads.
 
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