Gunsmithing Tikka 7 SAUM COAL

[Mxracer532]

I'm about to make up a dummy rou d and send to Smith, I'm thinking long throat to maximize cartridge I should be around 3.1 COAL with a 180g ELDM.
HC mag is 3.380 so I still have some room. Opinions???

 

[Dobbs02si]

This combo may not help you as I'm still waiting on the eld's to show up, but... I'm running 180 hybrids in a 7/300 wsm. Case length is 2.1, nsj is 1.823+-, and coal touching the lands is 3.09+-. This puts the heel inside of the nsj by just a few thou. That should easily put them in the neck of the saum, given these are bergers.

If you have the elds on hand, can you give up some numbers on where the bearing surface is and how long?

Hope that helps in any way.

 

[Mxracer532]

This combo may not help you as I'm still waiting on the eld's to show up, but... I'm running 180 hybrids in a 7/300 wsm. Case length is 2.1, nsj is 1.823+-, and coal touching the lands is 3.09+-. This puts the heel inside of the nsj by just a few thou. That should easily put them in the neck of the saum, given these are bergers.

If you have the elds on hand, can you give up some numbers on where the bearing surface is and how long?

Hope that helps in any way.

I will see what I can do when I get home. Thanks.

 

[Dobbs02si]

Just to keep it legit.

Comparator ID .275
Berger .284 180h
Oal 1.531
BTH .212
Bearing .545
TTO .755

So to be exact the heel of these sit .053 below the NSJ in my case. So on a perfect day that puts the heel .056 above the NSJ of the saum at a 3.1coal.

 

[want2learn]

don't mean to sidetrack the discussion but is "NSJ" the neck shoulder junction? thanks

 

[Mxracer532]

Just to keep it legit.

Comparator ID .275
Berger .284 180h
Oal 1.531
BTH .212
Bearing .545
TTO .755

So to be exact the heel of these sit .053 below the NSJ in my case. So on a perfect day that puts the heel .056 above the NSJ of the saum at a 3.1coal.

Found this on another forum
180 ELDM
1.535" length
Bearing surface .535
Tip length .175

 

[Steel head]

Here are jam lengths on a brand new saami chamber I have sitting here with a .090 freebore.
180 ELD and 185 RDF 2.99
190 hybrid 3.082
168 classic hunter 2.828
190 A tip 3.078
175SMK 2.968

To get a 180 bearing end at the neck junction is 3.078 so your probably looking at a .17 freebore at that point.

Good luck with the 180 ELDM’s.

 

[Dobbs02si]

Found this on another forum
180 ELDM
1.535" length
Bearing surface .535
Tip length .175

Assuming that tip length is the poly only? The similar bearing surfaces explains charge weights being similar/same between the hybrid vs eld from what other have said.

 

[Mxracer532]

Here are jam lengths on a brand new saami chamber I have sitting here with a .090 freebore.
180 ELD and 185 RDF 2.99
190 hybrid 3.082
168 classic hunter 2.828
190 A tip 3.078
175SMK 2.968

To get a 180 bearing end at the neck junction is 3.078 so your probably looking at a .17 freebore at that point.

Good luck with the 180 ELDM’s.

So with that said, the smith has a Sammi spec reamer which is why I am sending him a dummy round. Would you say loading the dummy round with a COAL of 3.100 would be a good length? (First time doing one of these so I obviously need to be sure to get it right. Thanks.

 

[Dobbs02si]

Some like to keep the heel above the nsj so they never have to deal with the donut that can form after several shoulder bumps. Would need to know where the bearing surface lies on the eld to figure that into the equation.

It's pretty safe to say loading under 3" would put the heel below the junction, and 3.1 SHOULD be above it.

Either way, if you want more room for magic go dust, have it throated long(er).

 

[Steel head]

So with that said, the smith has a Sammi spec reamer which is why I am sending him a dummy round. Would you say loading the dummy round with a COAL of 3.100 would be a good length? (First time doing one of these so I obviously need to be sure to get it right. Thanks.

Yea, he’s probably just going to throat it to your desired length so 3.1 should be GTG with the eldm as on my chamber the heel clears the shoulder at a bit below 3.10, you may want to look into how that works with other 180’s and 190’s.
I from personal experience wouldn’t lock myself down to the 180eldm.

 

[Mxracer532]

Yea, he’s probably just going to throat it to your desired length so 3.1 should be GTG.

Agree, I'm just trying to figure out what the best COAL would be to maximize the case.

 

[FisherT&C]

You guys should listen to the Modern Day Sniper podcast episode 14, featuring Scott Satterlee.

 

[Steel head]

You guys should listen to the Modern Day Sniper podcast episode 14, featuring Scott Satterlee.

Lol
I listened to that.
I feel pretty good about my system and laziness now.

 

[Mxracer532]

Working on a dummy round. I listened to the podcast.
This is 3.141 COAL.

 

[Steel head]

Looks good
Not sure why your neck junction OAL is different than mine, double checked my measurements and they repeated.
Looks like your possible a bit further out.

I can tell you the 180 ELDM’s absolutely loved jump.
I was mag feeding them in a short action and jumping an eighth of an inch and they hammered with excellent vertical.

I really wish that bullet worked out for me as that load was awesome and loved the price per bullet for the performance.

 

[Mxracer532]

Looks good
Not sure why your neck junction OAL is different than mine, double checked my measurements and they repeated.
Looks like your possible a bit further out.

I can tell you the 180 ELDM’s absolutely loved jump.
I was mag feeding them in a short action and jumping an eighth of an inch and they hammered with excellent vertical.

I really wish that bullet worked out for me as that load was awesome and loved the price per bullet for the performance.

I am just a tiny bit outside the neck junction, I'm not sure if I should seat them slightly more or not. Never done this before and the Smith is chambering off this dummy. So does he chamber it to this exact length so this load would be just kissing the lands? Or does he add some freebore? I'm a newb at how this is done.
Why didn't the bullet work out for you???
The cost of these compared to Berger's is exactly why I went this route. $10 a box more for Berger's is rediculous.

 

[Steel head]

I am just a tiny bit outside the neck junction, I'm not sure if I should seat them slightly more or not. Never done this before and the Smith is chambering off this dummy. So does he chamber it to this exact length so this load would be just kissing the lands? Or does he add some freebore? I'm a newb at how this is done.
Why didn't the bullet work out for you???
The cost of these compared to Berger's is exactly why I went this route. $10 a box more for Berger's is rediculous.

Personally I’d put the base right at the junction and call for .02-.03 extra jump.
Reasons being your possibly gonna wear some throat quickly then it will settle in with steady growth( sometimes you just get steady growth) and secondly if you keep it tight if you have to switch to a Berger Hybrid 180 or 190 or A tip 190 it should absolutely work out fine without running out of neck.
As a note The RDF is almost a direct replacement for the ELDM and is just as consistent with a BC just barely below the ELDM
With that setup H1000 and 7977 are excellent options as you’ll have the case capacity to get full speed and excellent case fill.

Yea the price is nice,,,,,until the ELDM’s start blowing up on you like thy did for me.
Last time I shot them 4 out of 10 didn’t make it to the target,,,so much for savings!

Range Report - 7mm 180 ELDM blow ups.

So I dropped my current load of R26 in my 7 saum that was at 2950 yesterday .8 of a grain to see if blow ups stopped. Not sure of speed but I’m guessing 2850-2870ish. They were still occasionally popping:( I’m going elsewhere now, It’s too bad because their performance to price was awesome...

www.snipershide.com

Also if your gonna shoot a mile + the Berger consistency is definitely superior to the ELDM’s even when they are working well.
The A Tip 190 is even more expensive but it has the consistency and a redonkulus BC!

 

[Mxracer532]

Personally I’d put the base right at the junction and call for .02-.03 extra jump.
Reasons being your possibly gonna wear some throat quickly then it will settle in with steady growth( sometimes you just get steady growth) and secondly if you keep it tight if you have to switch to a Berger Hybrid 180 or 190 or A tip 190 it should absolutely work out fine without running out of neck.
As a note The RDF is almost a direct replacement for the ELDM and is just as consistent with a BC just barely below the ELDM
With that setup H1000 and 7977 are excellent options as you’ll have the case capacity to get full speed and excellent case fill.

Yea the price is nice,,,,,until the ELDM’s start blowing up on you like thy did for me.
Last time I shot them 4 out of 10 didn’t make it to the target,,,so much for savings!

Range Report - 7mm 180 ELDM blow ups.

So I dropped my current load of R26 in my 7 saum that was at 2950 yesterday .8 of a grain to see if blow ups stopped. Not sure of speed but I’m guessing 2850-2870ish. They were still occasionally popping:( I’m going elsewhere now, It’s too bad because their performance to price was awesome...

www.snipershide.com

By base at the neck are you saying the bottom(base) of the bullet not the bearing surface? So seat them longer??
That's very interesting, what's the cost difference in the RDF?

 

[Steel head]

By base at the neck are you saying the bottom(base) of the bullet not the bearing surface? So seat them longer??
That's very interesting, what's the cost difference in the RDF?

Base of bearing surface just above the neck/shoulder junction.

RDF’s are cheap.
I’d try the ELDM’s but definitely keep the RDF in mind as an option If you have issues

 

[Mxracer532]

So pretty much right where I'm at?
Also is this what the smith Chambers exactly to this dummy round? So it would kiss the lands at exactly this length?

 

[dustingaunder]

Tell the smith what you want. Send the dummy round you want and tell him how much jump you want from there.