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tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

That statement should be a clear warning to everybody on the firing line that the guy next to you may be an idiot.

From reading your post I would hate to be the guy next to you at the firing line!
In this case it is the smiths fault and only the smiths fault. You pay a professional to do a job and it sould be done correctly!
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

I dont know who installed it, but everyone here jumping to conclusions and wanting the gunsmiths head on a plate is not really smart. 2 other things could have caused this.

1. Bad bullet seperating at the muzzle. (or too much velocity for a good bullet)

or even more likly

2. A cleaning patch left in the bore at the muzzle, That brake is known for catching patches its got sharp corners on the insides. (Works great on recoil I might add)

There is enough of the original hole left with opposing sides to measure and find out if the hole was reamed to the correct clearance. I would sugest having it checked before asuming blame on the guy that installed it.

My point being none of us know for sure what happened from looking at a picture sitting behind a keybord.

At any rate glad to hear your smith is taking care of it.


 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

This isn't a game people. Stick to the fundamentals of shooting and you will realize that the shooter could have avoided this mishap. If I was the range master I would have kicked his ass off the range in front of everybody. There are too many people that feel they are not responsible for their own weapon. You people can come up with all the excuses you want but this is a clear case of the shooter failing to properly shoot that rifle for the first time after he put a muzzle break on it. #1 he shouldn't have shot that rifle with somebody next to him that assumed he knew what he was doing because the shooter knew the gunsmith didn't test fire the weapon. #2, If so, he should have informed the guy next to him what he was about to do. And #3, all he had to do was use a little common sense and ask the gunsmith to show him the break had the proper clearance. Why? Because he should have thought of that himself. This bullshit about taking shit to a professional doesn't get you off the hook. If you have never seen anyone get their ass properly reamed out on a range for making a mistake than you haven't been shooting long enough and need to go back and read the basics because one of these days it is going to be you. I promise you that.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style="font-weight: bold"> this is a clear case of the shooter failing to properly shoot that rifle for the first time after he put a muzzle break on it.</span> #1 he shouldn't have shot that rifle with somebody next to him that assumed he knew what he was doing because the shooter knew the gunsmith didn't test fire the weapon. #2, If so, he should have informed the guy next to him what he was about to do. <span style="font-weight: bold">And #3, all he had to do was use a little common sense and ask the gunsmith to show him the break had the proper clearance.</span> </div></div>

whatever man. you seem to have it all figured out. i paid the smith to do a job i did not know how to do. what makes you think i would have know enough about the intricacies and tolerances of precision machine work to do a q/a check on the work?

i bet you blame yourself when you tax man fucks you and you owe uncle sam.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This isn't a game people. Stick to the fundamentals of shooting and you will realize that the shooter could have avoided this mishap. If I was the range master I would have kicked his ass off the range in front of everybody. There are too many people that feel they are not responsible for their own weapon. You people can come up with all the excuses you want but this is a clear case of the shooter failing to properly shoot that rifle for the first time after he put a muzzle break on it. #1 he shouldn't have shot that rifle with somebody next to him that assumed he knew what he was doing because the shooter knew the gunsmith didn't test fire the weapon. #2, If so, he should have informed the guy next to him what he was about to do. And #3, all he had to do was use a little common sense and ask the gunsmith to show him the break had the proper clearance. Why? Because he should have thought of that himself. This bullshit about taking shit to a professional doesn't get you off the hook. If you have never seen anyone get their ass properly reamed out on a range for making a mistake than you haven't been shooting long enough and need to go back and read the basics because one of these days it is going to be you. I promise you that. </div></div>


I am so mind boggled by your ignorance that I cant even type a suitable comment to you. Remove your head from the South and please rethink what you are saying. By your words the professionals work needs to be rechecked by the laymen. NIce!
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

I'll be honest that from this point forward I will "check", to the best of my ability, any work that I have done by a gunsmith, but hindsight is 20/20!!!!

How the hell is this guy at fault? He's not! What if he doesn't reload? So now he's going to go buy a caliper to measure the opening after paying a smith to do the work for him.....give me a break.

There is always someone to tell you that your a whinny moron that should just accept fault when we all know that if it was them in the same situation they'd be bitching like a teenage schoolgirl that just dropped her pink cell phone in the toilet while changing her tampon.

Hillarious.......

Good luck trying to get your money back and next time pay a smith to do your work and then promtly take the gun to another smith to check all the work.......
grin.gif


I'd like to edit this post to say that my sentiments are only applicable if the smith that did the work failed to open up the brake or installed it off of center. If this failure was caused by a patch or a failed bullet then its another story altogether.

 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">people take guns to gunsmiths because they don't have the knowledge or tooling to do the work themselves. </div></div>

That statement should be a clear warning to everybody on the firing line that the guy next to you may be an idiot. Check your muzzle clearance before firing your weapon. Especially, if you go so far as to stick something in front of it. Also, if I hand you a weapon and tell you it is unloaded you're going to believe me, right? Because I know how to shoot, right? Because I've been to the range before, right? Because I have the fundamentals of shooting safety tattooed on my ass, right?

This has very little to do with the gunsmith once the owner failed to check the muzzle clearance of his own rifle, loaded the rifle, and went so far as to shoot it. </div></div>

so before you drive off in you car after having tires installed, you break out your torque wrench and double check that they did their job correctly?

we pay people to do the work we can't do ourselves. if we had the knowledge and tooling to do it our selves, instead of checking someone else's work, we would have just done the job ourselves in the first place.

probably 99% of the people on this site don't have the tools and/or knowledge to properly install a muzzle brake. you seem to be faulting them for this.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Actually, knowing who did the work the only that suprises me is that they are going to make things right.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This isn't a game people. Stick to the fundamentals of shooting and you will realize that the shooter could have avoided this mishap. If I was the range master I would have kicked his ass off the range in front of everybody. There are too many people that feel they are not responsible for their own weapon. You people can come up with all the excuses you want but this is a clear case of the shooter failing to properly shoot that rifle for the first time after he put a muzzle break on it. #1 he shouldn't have shot that rifle with somebody next to him that assumed he knew what he was doing because the shooter knew the gunsmith didn't test fire the weapon. #2, If so, he should have informed the guy next to him what he was about to do. And #3, all he had to do was use a little common sense and ask the gunsmith to show him the break had the proper clearance. Why? Because he should have thought of that himself. This bullshit about taking shit to a professional doesn't get you off the hook. If you have never seen anyone get their ass properly reamed out on a range for making a mistake than you haven't been shooting long enough and need to go back and read the basics because one of these days it is going to be you. I promise you that.</div></div>


Culpeper, While your position on this is interesting at best, The only way I could place any blame on the shooter is if the smith told him that it had not been test fired and to use caution. Otherwise the guy would only assume the smith did his job and checked his work and test fired it already.


Scares me more at the range shooting next to guys with big magnums working up handloads, basicly a possible grenade going off next to you at any moment.


<span style="font-weight: bold">Smboudreaux, measure or have measured the distance (size) between the undamaged part at the muzzle. It should be .020 to .030 over bullet dia. If its smaller than that then your smith owes you a new brake and work. If its proper then I guess a patch was left near the muzzle or in the brake. </span>


 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This isn't a game people. Stick to the fundamentals of shooting and you will realize that the shooter could have avoided this mishap. If I was the range master I would have kicked his ass off the range in front of everybody. There are too many people that feel they are not responsible for their own weapon. You people can come up with all the excuses you want but this is a clear case of the shooter failing to properly shoot that rifle for the first time after he put a muzzle break on it. #1 he shouldn't have shot that rifle with somebody next to him that assumed he knew what he was doing because the shooter knew the gunsmith didn't test fire the weapon. #2, If so, he should have informed the guy next to him what he was about to do. And #3, all he had to do was use a little common sense and ask the gunsmith to show him the break had the proper clearance. Why? Because he should have thought of that himself. This bullshit about taking shit to a professional doesn't get you off the hook. If you have never seen anyone get their ass properly reamed out on a range for making a mistake than you haven't been shooting long enough and need to go back and read the basics because one of these days it is going to be you. I promise you that. </div></div>

And the World's Biggest Ass Clown Award goes to...
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

If you look very close, there appears to be burrs protruding into the muzzle brake from the bore / exit hole. This would tend to make you think that the brake was opened with a drill bit forcing metal into the bore of the brake. Not saying that's the culprit, only that the bore of the brake may have been opened.

Still a piss poor installation no matter how you look at it.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Damn, that's gay!
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

I can also atest to the fact that the manufacturer did not install that muzzlebrake. I've seen their work and it's amongst the best.

Also, I almost missed Culpepers address to the peasant majority from his throne of righteousness. Obviously you aren't aware of the liability that a "gunsmith" places himself in just by accepting work and getting paid for it.

For the most part, the title "Gunsmith" is thrown around too freely these days and is largely self appointed. The degree of incompetence illustrated in the photos above is highly apparent and does not fall on the shoulders of the gun owner.

All firearms should be range tested by the "gunsmith" that did the work....Period....That's how these mishaps are avoided. This responsibility does not and should not in any way fall on the shoulders of someone that paid the gunsmith to do the work.

The gun owner obviously has a level of responsibility but it pertains to boundaries of safe firearms handling and storage and be competent enough not to kill someone with negligent discharges (because there's no such thing as an "accidental" discharge) or other acts of stupidity. Come down off your high horse Culpeper and stop wagging the wrathful finger of ignorance.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

After reading through all of this thread, and watching a guy next to me at the range yesterday fire a 9mm round into the wood benchtop when he was trying to unload his pistol after a cease fire was called (luckily it was pointing mostly down and downrange at least). He was the one "teaching" two girls how to shoot....

It brings up always wearing <span style="font-weight: bold">good</span> eye protection all the time, you just do not know what is going to happen around you at any moment.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

That incident would fall under this statement:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The gun owner obviously has a level of responsibility but it pertains to boundaries of safe firearms handling and storage and be competent enough not to kill someone with negligent discharges (because there's no such thing as an "accidental" discharge) or other acts of stupidity.</div></div>

Because I've seen it all too often....
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the guy in the lane next to me said my rifle just threw crap at him.</div></div>

I'm surprised the guy next to you didn't kick your ass or take your rifle and wrap it around a pole. Blame the gunsmith all you want but it's your rifle, your mistake.
</div></div>

Are you fucking serious??? How is it "his mistake"? If he installed the brake himself incorrectly and it blew up, then yes, it would be his mistake/fault. He took the rifle to a <span style="font-style: italic">professional gunsmith</span> because he wanted it done correctly! Not opening up the brake to the correct caliber is the gunsmith's mistake, and so is not function testing the finished rifle!
What, exactly, do you feel the OP should have done differently?
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smboudreaux</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the smith owned up to not opening her up. </div></div>

Yikes. Not sure I'd be willing to let him do any more work if it were my rifle. At least he owned his mistake.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smboudreaux</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This happened on the absolute first round fired through this rifle. the guy in the lane next to me said my rifle just threw crap at him. When I looked at the brake this is what I found.</div></div>


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: billf</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After watching a guy next to me at the range yesterday fire a 9mm round into the wood bench top when he was trying to unload his pistol after a cease fire was called.</div></div>


Makes me glad I shoot where I do.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

MUZZLE BRAKE RULE OF THUMB

take a loaded round that is supposed to be able to be shot through your brake,
insert it in the end of the muzzlebrake
if the bullet, plus the kneck doesn't enter
take it back to the guy who installed it and ask why.

0.02" is the minimum clearance.

0.02" is fine if the same reputable smith inslalled brake and cut the thread.

but if you are selling brakes, you need to accomodate for all eventualities.
not all threads are true.
not all bullets are stable.

our University of Applied Science doploma study results proved that the recoil reduction is the same ( at least on our brakes) wether there is 0.02"( near enough 0.5mm) or 2mm ( 0.2") or near enough.


Like George said.. you'd be suprised what gets left in a barrel.

Ive cleared:
bits of DBU
Bits or army blanket
felt tip pens
Q tips
airgun pellets
several layers of Balistol
plus some other shit.

the more QC steps the better,, smiths are human, and an occasional mistake WILL happen. the mor e that check the lesser the problem. but dont jump to conclusions before hand.


We had a guy, shot his clamp on C21 brake up ( very much like the pics above)
was calling his lawyer, his mother and his god and everyone else he could think of.. we had a shit brake, were a bunch or assholes, money back, free replacement etc.

anyhow, i insisted the brake was returned.

turns out he didnt even tighten the clamping screws.,. its easy to tell, the screws leave whitness marks.
he owned up.
we replaced the brake. but we would have done so with a smile if he had said guys i fucked up, help..

not saying who is at fault here, but dont jump to conclusions.
no one was hurt.
problem needs solving,
this time i'm sure smith and owner will be very vigilant towards brake bore size.

bet there wasn't mich recoil though.

Pete
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Glad to hear you and the guy next to you got out of this unscaved Smboudreaux.
I would have to agree with those that suspect the muzzle brake wasn't opend up to the correct diameter, with the damaged sustained at the end of the muzzle brake I imagined the bullet hitting the "gas deflecting wings at 12 and 6 o'clock" (hope you guys know what I mean)on the way though scoring/squeezing the copper jacket and eventually causing the bullet to start seperating.You can see this damage to the "Wings" is more pronounced at the last baffle in last picture.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pete Lincoln</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

bet there wasn't mich recoil though.



</div></div>

that an understatement. 223 like. at first i was extremely impressed with the recoil reduction. then the fella in the lane next to informed me of the shrapnel he felt
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dimar1492</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who was the smith?
</div></div>

I regress to the comments by Dorothy and Barbara. The gunsmith "was" the guy you blame for your own fuck ups. Don't worry about a thing. You get all the fuck ups you want at the range. It's a great place to spend an afternoon socializing, eating cheese, drinking wine, you know.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">at first i was extremely impressed with the recoil reduction. then the fella in the lane next to informed me of the shrapnel he felt</div></div>

I give up.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">bet you blame yourself when you tax man fucks you and you owe uncle sam.</div></div>

P.S. You do have some redeeming value. I am the tax man. So, lets take that statement and look at it. Even if your tax preparer fucked up your return you still have to pay the extra tax. It's your responsibility.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYshooter338$</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I would be pretty upset with that smith.

As the points have been brought up:

1) It was not opened up to the correct OD
2) It was not test fired by the smith
3) That is a VERY dangerous situation for you and the people around you
4) You will have to pay for a new muzzle brake.

I would find a new and reputable smith to do the new brake. Make your old smith pay for the work. </div></div>


you mean ID not OD the inside diameter should have been around .330 for a 308.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">bet you blame yourself when you tax man fucks you and you owe uncle sam.</div></div>

P.S. You do have some redeeming value. I am the tax man. So, lets take that statement and look at it. Even if your tax preparer fucked up your return you still have to pay the extra tax. It's your responsibility. </div></div>

how about you look at the tire installer comparison i made. do you install your own tires too?
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">bet you blame yourself when you tax man fucks you and you owe uncle sam.</div></div>

P.S. You do have some redeeming value. I am the tax man. So, lets take that statement and look at it. Even if your tax preparer fucked up your return you still have to pay the extra tax. It's your responsibility.</div></div>

Most people have a calculator, however most do not have the necessary tools to check the inside diameter of a bore... if I hire a gunsmith to true my action, how would I test that... a mechanic to replace a valve, do you pull your head off to check. There are hundreds of professions where people hire someone to do a job because they simply don't have the skill set.

As many have said, you're pretty much alone on this, and foolish in your logic. I would hang it up, cause you make absolutely no sense.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KNIGHT11B4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Id say you have a problem. Im no smith, but something appears to be a little off. </div></div>

This is such a deep thought I had to lay down and recover form the energy it took to comprehend .

Now that I have , i'd say you put a bullet that was bigger than the hole into the hole at a high rate of speed .

But wtf do I know ??
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

To be honest this is a avoidable accident. Yes there are probably a decent amount of good local gun smith guns in everyones area but wouldn't you feel even slightly safer sending your gun to anyone of the major gun smiths like GAP, Will, SaC, Skunkworks, TacOps, APA and etc. Safety should be everyones main priority what if that piece of shrapnel went into that guys eye.

The wait and the bit off extra money you spend is defiantly worth the piece of mind.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Pete L, thanks il keep the brake testing in mind next time I decide to add a brake however im 100% confident in my smith.

To the OP, man those results are unacceptable... I would bring down a shit storm on a smith if that happened. How can it not be their fault? Once the work is done all thats left to do is shoot it which you have done and thats the result!

I would have steam pouring out of my ears if i were in your shoes
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Well at least tell me how one could check the clearance of a muzzle break without a gunsmith. Maybe a cleaning rod for a .22 bore not passing cleanly through could be an indicator? I just don't see the logic of sticking something in front of your muzzle and not doing something yourself. Anything. Something. Other than firing a live round through it with a person right next to you.

Lowlight, what would you have done if you was the other guy? The one that got shrapnel sprayed at him.

I'm a little surprised on the faith people put into a gunsmith. And I'm not referring to examples like working on your rifle action. I'm just looking at something somebody put in front of a barrel muzzle. You can pull the bolt out and look down the barrel. Both ways. And just because I'm alone doesn't make me wrong. I'm not trying to start a flame war. I'm trying to understand why he fired that round through the muzzle break. He did absolutely nothing to check it. It is right there where he can see it.

In hindsight, the gunsmith should have fired this weapon himself. Maybe one should ask the question before taking it to the range. The lesson I'm taking from this incident is to have the gunsmith show me there is proper clearance whether or not I have the tools to do it myself. Especially, if the gunsmith didn't test fire it.

And I'm not disrespecting the shooter as well. It is a good thing he took the time to start this thread. Last thing I want to do is discourage people from reporting these sorts of incidents.

I apologize to the shooter. This isn't the range. It's the Internet. I could have easily posted something along the line of this post rather than my first post.

Hell, I took my rifle out today after taking the scope off and back on without bore sighting it. I knew I fucked up after the first shot.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smboudreaux</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This happened on the absolute first round fired through this rifle. the guy in the lane next to me said my rifle just threw crap at him. When I looked at the brake this is what I found.</div></div>


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: billf</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After watching a guy next to me at the range yesterday fire a 9mm round into the wood bench top when he was trying to unload his pistol after a cease fire was called.</div></div>


Makes me glad I shoot where I do. </div></div>

Me too...the only thing that might get me at my range is a cow stepping on me.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

How many times do you hear of people having baffle strikes with suppressors ? Quite often in fact... I always check my muzzle when using a suppressor but it doesn't take much.

A rod wouldnt' have helped, look at how small the amount they need to open up the brake is... rods are undersized to begin with. Pete's thoughts are valid but not common knowledge enough and it doesn't help further inside, like where the first strike happened. The first strike was between the 1st and second chamber, he's not equipped to check that far down inside the brake.

I wouldn't guarantee looking from the chamber end would have helped... but I haven't read through the entire thread.

There are certain things you can function check, and there are things you have to take on faith.

and FYI, I have been on the other end, ASC a shooter didn't account for his mechanical offset and hit the rocks 3ft in front of us with a 7WSM, shrapnel hit a lot of us, its up to the match directors to remove the shooter or do something. You can call him an asshole, but that doesn't change the fact, it happened. You hope people are safe, but they also have to be able to have faith in a paid professional.

Whether it is a squib round that blows a barrel or action, something like this, there are always exception, and honestly what if out of the gate this guy bought a custom stick from this gunsmith instead of settling on a 700 first and this was his first precision rifle experience -- can you still blame him as you been doing.

Really, you're being a dick for the sake of it, and acting high and mighty on the subject, like was said, when you get your tires rotated do you check the torque on the lug nuts or take it for granted your family is safe when they drive the car ?
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

"And I'm not disrespecting the shooter as well. It is a good thing he took the time to start this thread. Last thing I want to do is discourage people from reporting these sorts of incidents."

You could have made a point without being such a dick.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

When I fly I usually ask one of the mechanics to take me down to show me the wear on the tires, that the lugs are torqued properly, that all flight surfaces are free to move and functional.......

It's one thing to be wrong and admit it, it's a completely different story when you hang on to being wrong because you just can't admit it. I've always thought that the ability to say I'm wrong/sorry is a great litmus test for a mature adult.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LarryB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is there some reason other than asthetics why a break should be blended? </div></div>

Don't know why a brake has to be "blended", could someone please tell me?

But as to threading brakes that will be used to mount suppressors: my understanding is that when any barrel blank is first drilled, there’s almost always some deviation of the bore from a perfectly straight line centered on the barrel’s axis. In other words, the concentricity of the bore (relative to barrel OD) is rarely perfect, and the bullet leaves the muzzle at a very slight angle. This is not detrimental on an unsuppressed rifle since variances are dealt with in the sighting-in process. But a suppressor is a relatively long extension of the barrel (compared to a brake), and to achieve maximum accuracy/projectile stability, the bore of the suppressor needs to perfectly align with the trajectory of the bullet as it exits the rifle. So threads cut for a brake that will mount a suppressor need to be indexed to the bore NOT the outside of the barrel.

That's not the issue here, but I am interested in learning what value is gained by "blending" the brake.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Really, you're being a dick for the sake of it, and acting high and mighty on the subject, like was said, when you get your tires rotated do you check the torque on the lug nuts or take it for granted your family is safe when they drive the car ? </div></div>

I check the lug nuts because my brother-in-law owns the tire store and his mechanics are idiots. They have sent cars off without lugs nuts tightened down. And this is a GoodYear store. It happens more than you think and I've been avoiding answering that stupid question because of such. But it has been used several times and so I'll answer it. Yes, you should check your lug nuts after you know somebody has removed the tire. Absolutely.

I'm still trying to figure out why it is okay to shoot through a muzzle break for the first time with a stranger in the lane next to the shooter.

And I like the pilot's preflight check. Pilots do it all the time. I find it reassuring when I see the pilot walking around his plane checking shit out. I would find it reassuring if a shooter tells me he just installed a muzzle break if I would mind standing out of the way while he tests it.

I'm beginning to think there are personalities before principles working this thread. That's the problem with group think.

The only mistake I made was overreacting. It's interesting watching the company language unfold. I apologized but I'm sticking to the principles of safety first. Common sense prevails. I learned something from this mistake rather than fucking blaming it on the goddamn gunsmith. Over and over again.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

So your brother in laws mechanics are idiots because they forget to tighten down lug nuts but a gunsmith is not an idiot for forgetting to open up a muzzle brake and not test firing the weapon. The gunsmith failed to do his job anyway you look at. I agree that it would have been a good idea to check the muzzle brake first, but that doesn't take away from the fact that the gunsmith fucked up.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Apparently I must be an idiot, when I pay professionals to do their job I simply assume they did it right. If I had the time and skills to double check every job I pay others to do then I'd likely do them myself the first time.

I'm happy to report that I've always chosen the right professionals to pay!
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Baffle strikes from loose cans or brakes is one thing. No clearance for the intended round or a misalignment is another thing entirely. The brake pictured I would say fits into the latter two.

As to someone standing to the side of a brake equipped rifle, it's a loud place to be with high velocity gas being ported your way. It's not the ideal place to be. A shooter with a Colt Python drew blood from the side of my head from lead spitting from the side of the revolver. Pythons are notorious for being out of time and that is the result sometimes. I pay closer attention to who and what is being lit up next to me. No fault of the shooter but shit happens.

Not sure exactly what happened with that brake but it's fixable (replace it) and if no one was hurt seriously its a learning experience. An extra set of eyes and redundant check prevent things like this *sometimes from happening.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm still trying to figure out why it is okay to shoot through a muzzle break for the first time with a stranger in the lane next to the shooter.</div></div>

Never heard of a public range.. I supposed it is the shooter's fault for not going to a private range and separating himself. How would you control who is next to you at a public range ?

As far as baffle strikes not all are associated to cans that loosen up, some are due to poor threading... first round strikes happen, which is why I always check a new can.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> And I like the pilot's preflight check. Pilots do it all the time. I find it reassuring when I see the pilot walking around his plane checking shit out. I would find it reassuring if a shooter tells me he just installed a muzzle break if I would mind standing out of the way while he tests it.
</div></div>

Yeah, the <span style="font-weight: bold">PILOT</span> does the pre-flight checks. You know, the <span style="font-weight: bold">PROFESSIONAL</span> in that particular situation. Just like the <span style="font-weight: bold">SMITH</span> is the <span style="font-weight: bold">PROFESSIONAL</span> in the situation the OP is having. Have you ever done the pre-flight check??? No!!! Dude, seriously just let it be.

I would bet my life's worth that if we were talking about your gun you wouldn't be so righteous.





 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I check the lug nuts because my brother-in-law owns the tire store and his mechanics are idiots. They have sent cars off without lugs nuts tightened down. And this is a GoodYear store. It happens more than you think and I've been avoiding answering that stupid question because of such. But it has been used several times and so I'll answer it. Yes, you should check your lug nuts after you know somebody has removed the tire. Absolutely. </div></div>

lol. so everyone and their grandma needs to carry around a torque wrench, the proper torque specs for their vehicle's wheels and the knowledge on how to use it when ever they get new tires on their cars?

i think now i may have finally heard it all
laugh.gif
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Culpeper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm beginning to think there are personalities before principles working this thread. That's the problem with group think.
</div></div>

So basically what you are saying is that you are right and everyone else is wrong because we are agreeing with Lowlight? Because of course there is no way anyone would disagree with your almighty opinion unless we are being influenced by a site "personality"?

Set the shovel down, you're just digging yourself deeper.
Click to expand...
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dimar1492</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So your brother in laws mechanics are idiots because they forget to tighten down lug nuts but a gunsmith is not an idiot for forgetting to open up a muzzle brake and not test firing the weapon. The gunsmith failed to do his job anyway you look at. I agree that it would have been a good idea to check the muzzle brake first, but that doesn't take away from the fact that the gunsmith fucked up. </div></div>

I didn't say the gunsmith isn't an idiot. I'm saying the shooter could have done something to protect the shooter next to him. Like tell him to get the fuck out of the way. Again, we keep going back to the gunsmith and professionals, and blah blah blah. What about the shooter? What did he do wrong in this case? <span style="text-decoration: underline">Personally, I'm not going to take the time to listen to the shooter next to me blame the gunsmith after splattering me with bullshit from his broken muzzle break.</span> Again, common sense prevails. Safety first. The shooter could have done something to protect the safety of others.

Anyhow, I can't believe what I'm reading on some of these posts. That the shooter did nothing wrong? That because you pay somebody to do the job you have no responsibility on the range? Even having an action worked on would be nice to inform the shooter next to you that this rifle was just worked on by a GUNSMITH is common courtesy. There are no accidents. Everything happens for a reason. I'm to believe that I'm at the mercy of the gunsmith because I paid him to do something right? That the person next to me is also at the mercy of MY gunsmith because I paid him to do it right? Come on? Give me a break. Tell the motherfucker next to you to please move for a moment. My whole premise all along has been the shooter next door. Not the shooter with the muzzle break installed improperly. Not the gunsmith. There is nothing high and mighty about taking the position of the other guy. The guy whose only mistake was going to the range and assuming the new shooter next to him knows his rifle is safe to fire.

Personally, I'm glad to now know that most people at the range really don't give a shit about your safety. It will be no skin off my ass to move myself out of the way when a new shooter sits down next to me to test his new muzzle break that is about to blow up in his face. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

I might add that there has never been a serious incident at my gun range in the fifty years it has been in operation. Why? Because we don't do shit like blow up a muzzle breaks and say, Ooops! Sorry, the gunsmith just worked on it. We don't even talk like that.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

So to your way of thinking every time you are at the range you ask the guy next to you if he is shooting a gun that has been worked on lately, a new gun, a new box of ammo, if he's a handloader? Would you then check to make sure that all his ammo is to SAAMI specs?

If the OP is at fault for not checking the smith's work then the shooter next to the OP is just as at fault for not checking the OP's ammo and hell ,for that matter, the inner diameter of the brake. Definitely more respnsible than the smith.....

I love arguing with people like you, it makes me feel really smart. Thanks for the selfesteem boost.

 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

LOL! Based on this thread I'm beginning to think I need to ask the guy next to me if he just got back from the gunsmith.

Yeah, something like that. That's the message I'm getting on this thread. That the guy next to the OP was just in the wrong place at the wrong time because we're all professionals around here. I'm sure he was a gentleman and understood completely that shit happens. Even if he had to leave the range in an ambulance or a hearse. After all, we pay somebody to think for us. I for one am glad to see we promote that way of thinking when it comes to basic safety. Safety only means us. I get it now. I think it is funny how you "purpusely" misspelled self-esteem. I get the irony. I like you. You're smart too. You didn't misspell selfesteem. I misspelled purposely. More irony.
 
Re: tore up muzzle brake. any ideas what happened?

Hehe...well I for one am going to check my next muzzle brake install!

I used to throw the tire iron on after having tires rotated -- didn't torque em -- just made sure they were tight, but overtime I've gotten lax on that drill. I usually check the oil level after visiting Jiffylube, and I make sure to see the old filter. The first 1911 I built I put a glove on and shot it around a thick tree.

But honestly, the only reason I do those things is because I learned from my previous mistakes (yes, I'm the guy who had a wheel come loose). It's hard to be perfect with everything. Pilots have a checklist because that's SOP for flying and the consequences of not doing so are absolute. Start applying that level of detail to everything and you'll run out of time quick.

SOP is to clear the barrel, function check, and check torque. Now I'll add checking new brakes for function.

Thanks for sharing your learning experience.
 
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