Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked it.

[CDiPrecision]

It is news now that they have a recall or something.. dont have one.

They played a 911 tape of a CHP officer and his family that had the time to dial 911, while the car was accelerating to 120 MPH plus, while the gas pedal was jammed under the floormat.

Why the fuck didn't the guy just turn the damn car off??.. Put it in Neutral, or something. Just gonna go along for the ride and call 911 for a minute and then pray for a good outcome(they were all killed).

Don't they train LE better than that?? I could understand a 70 year old lady not having the forethought to just turn off the ignition, but a off duty CHP??.. I'm sad for their families for such a senseless and unnecessary crash.

 

[seporith]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

Glad you had the same questions about neutral or key off. Anthony

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

They made my wife sign a waiver to have floormats in hers.....

Priuses don't have keys, and I don't know if the "Power" button will turn off underway, same with the electronic shifter.

Hard to imagine he wouldn't have tried something.....

 

[paraman1]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Hard to imagine he wouldn't have tried something.....
</div></div>

Like the Brakes maybe ?

 

[CDiPrecision]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

I have a pushbutton start car(Dodge Challenger).. it shuts off if you push the button. All cars will go to Neutral while in drive(Reverse is usually locked out) I would think 2 feet on the brake pedal with all your might will slow you down alot.

What a terrible thing..

 

[Balldboy]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

Rented my first keyless car in LA this summer...maybe if they gave you 2 keys I'dda felt more secure.

Spent more time checking for the key than I cared to.

Pete

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CDiPrecision</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a pushbutton start car(Dodge Challenger) </div></div>

Just another machine of yours I'm envious of......

Wife won't let me drive her spacecar so I wouldn't know how all the functions work.
I refer my 2500HD GMC or scooter anyway.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

I just read that Toyota, unlike most manufacturer's, does not have a feature in the computer to have the brake override/kick out the throttle.
Also noticed riding to the inlaws for turkey that the Prius can be nudged into neutral under power, but its not an intuitive manipulation of the shifter, but kind of an "over, then down and up" jiggle of the stick, not like the markings show.

Toyota will be notifying owners to bring their cars affected in starting in December.

 

[JRose]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

Kick it in neutral, save your family.... Or blame it on the floor mats.

 

[Revenge Seeker]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

When you put the right amount of pressure on a modern brake pedal (computer, not mechanically operated) it will bypass standard brakes if the vehicles speed isnt significantly decreased, and engage the emergency break.

 

[exedotbat]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

This situation reminds me of Fight club, I guess X was more than the cost of a recall.

 

[Guest]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

That guy was 45 years old and an experienced LE officer.
A real tragedy, but 100% avoidable.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Creeter2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you put the right amount of pressure on a modern brake pedal (computer, not mechanically operated) it will bypass standard brakes if the vehicles speed isnt significantly decreased, and engage the emergency break. </div></div>
Not on Toyotas per the LA Times article.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LA Times 11/26/09</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Perhaps the most important change will be the modification of software in the vehicles' engine control system that will override the throttle any time the brake is applied. The remedy will be made initially in the Camry, Avalon, Lexus ES and Lexus IS sedans but eventually in all models.

That software, often called a smart pedal, is in use by many other manufacturers as a protection against unintended acceleration but has never been used in Toyota vehicles.</div></div>
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-toyota-recall26-2009nov26,0,7792141,full.story

 

[lh3]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

I have a 2007 tundra with aftermarket floormats. I think anyone who drives should know how to safely shut their vehicle down in an emergency. Toyota or not.

 

[Guest]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lh3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a 2007 tundra with aftermarket floormats. I think anyone who drives should know how to safely shut their vehicle down in an emergency. Toyota or not. </div></div>

The vehicle was a loaner, so I'll give him some consideration with not being familiar with it. But it still has to be pretty familiar stuff.

 

[HighCotton]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

Put it in to neutral. It will just bang off rev limiter till some thing gives. Turning off key is bad idea bc it could cause steering column to lock. Trying to shove the brake pedal through the floor board is hit or miss. If throttle stuck at WFO with any speed not much chance of stoping. The pads will overheat and glaze. I have had throttle stick once its scary to say the least.

 

[TacticalSasquach]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

what about sideswiping guardrail or jersey wall, the driver could have easily scrubbed off alot of speed like that?

hard to say, but the auto industry will examine the car without a key theory a little more in depth, I think all cars should have a key, and in this case may have prevented a tragedy.

isnt there already laws in place about the standardization of automotive controls anyway?

 

[The Mechanic]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

When I can talk about this I will let you guys know the details

 

[vwhugger]

Re: Toyota Gas pedal recall and Crash that sparked

When I can talk about this I will let you guys know the details

Wondering what you came up with.

 

[Clearlight]

I really like my 60's era car for above reasons . Mechanical steering , carburettors , simple ignition system ( magneto ) .
It is the cockroach of the automotive world , hard to kill , impossible to hack ….

 

[308220]

Technology is only making us less safe.

 

[Maggot]

I really like my 60's era car for above reasons . Mechanical steering , carburettors , simple ignition system ( magneto ) .
It is the cockroach of the automotive world , hard to kill , impossible to hack ….

Maybe not so much after you watch this.

 

[Maggot]

As an aside, do you know how to pronounce 'Prius'?

Its like..."They has to 'pry us' out of that Toyota after the gas pedal stuck."

 

[supercorndogs]

Maybe not so much after you watch this.

Not just protection, longevity and reliability. You were adjusting points every 10k, doing valve jobs at 50k , and rebuilding at 100k if you were lucky enough to get that far in the 60s. They truly make them way better than they used to.

 

[JMGlasgow]

Not to mention that carburetors suck in general. So does adjusting points, adjusting valves, etc. I don't like replacing timing belts either, so there is one negative to most modern OHC engines.

I also don't like push button starting on today's vehicles. I want a mechanical link to a switch, not a computer to tell me when it's ok to turn a vehicle off and on. Another major flaw with the Pious... I mean Prius.

 

[supercorndogs]

Not to mention that carburetors suck in general. So does adjusting points, adjusting valves, etc. I don't like replacing timing belts either, so there is one negative to most modern OHC engines.

I also don't like push button starting on today's vehicles. I want a mechanical link to a switch, not a computer to tell me when it's ok to turn a vehicle off and on. Another major flaw with the Pious... I mean Prius.

I bet you someone is already thinking about a saftey feature to shut down a car with these new ignitions.[that I dont like either] pious prius LOL

https://youtu.be/ZTpgqqLyAs8

 

[Maggot]

Not just protection, longevity and reliability. You were adjusting points every 10k, doing valve jobs at 50k , and rebuilding at 100k if you were lucky enough to get that far in the 60s. They truly make them way better than they used to.

Yep, my Chevy van has 244,000 on it and the only repairs other than brakes and a tune up at 150 K, were a fuel pump at 180 K and just did an alternator at 240 K.

 

[supercorndogs]

Yep, my Chevy van has 244,000 on it and the only repairs other than brakes and a tune up at 150 K, were a fuel pump at 180 K and just did an alternator at 240 K.

Just did the 240k oil change on my GMC pickup, and put the second set of ball joints in. Roads can get rough out here in country some dont even like to fly over.

 

[JMGlasgow]

I have a 2000 Ranger with 233k miles, an '05 Explorer Sport Trac with 140k miles, and a 1993 Mustang with I'm assuming 172k miles. I also had a 2003 Expedition that went 320k on the original drivetrain, and still ran strong when I sold it. Fuel injection is far more reliable than carb, brakes are better today, suspension is better, etc. I don't like all the creature comfort gadgets and whizbang features in today's cars though. Almost all of which will be obsolete in 5 years. It also adds a tremendous amount of weight and complexity.

 

[Slash0311]

At least this has me thinking. I just bought a 2017 Mustang. It has no key, just push to start and shut off engine. I will be looking into these questions for it.

I would also agree in trying to scrub off speed on a barrier or something. Hell even trying to take out a utility pole could be an option. Very sad in deed.

 

[Clearlight]

Maybe not so much after you watch this.

Didn't say it was an American car : ) . It currently has over 700 000 k's on the original motor . I rolled another version of
the same car at 70 mph into a forest , not a scratch on me , should have bought a lotto ticket that night …
Also all carburettors and ignition systems are not created equal ; Weber vs Holley , Bosch vs Ac …

 

[JMGlasgow]

No they aren't equal, but they ALL suck (carburetors).

 

[packratt]

The only way i can think of is sell the car and buy one with a manual transmission. Problem solved.

That might not work. These new manual trans are shift by wire. Shifting is done by electric servos.

 

[Clearlight]

No they aren't equal, but they ALL suck (carburetors).

Have to disagree there , Lectron motorcycle carbs work very well , and the ' big four ' Japanese motorcycle manufacturers are
churning out millions of engines a year that run just fine on carbs .

 

[Sean the Nailer]

Have to disagree there , Lectron motorcycle carbs work very well , and the ' big four ' Japanese motorcycle manufacturers are
churning out millions of engines a year that run just fine on carbs .

You're missing the joke. It's a "venturi" thing.....

 

[Roddd]

Thought I'd add to this, as I knew Mark (the driver of the Prius). I worked with him in my last career. He wasn't a friend, I can't say I cared for him as a person but at work, he knew his stuff. He supervised the civilian technicians that CHP employeed to inspect buses, tow trucks, semi-trucks, etc. I've watched him personally inspect air, air over hydraulic brakes, ball joints, King pins, steering components, you name it. He was quite mechanically inclined. He was driving a car unfamiliar to him, with about a wonky set up as a set up can get and had quite the FUBAR. Where he and his family were driving, there were no guard rails, K rails, phone poles, nothing of the sort that could have slowed them down. I can say, with 100% confidence, that he did everything he could to try to keep his family safe. It was a tragedy. Fortunately, Toyota has reengineered the design flaws of that Prius and paid his estate a pretty penny.

That model year of Prius could not be simply shifted to neutral like the cars that are designed with keys and normal gear shifters and the brakes would not override the application of the gas pedal.

Hopefully this helps clear up some topics in this resurrected thread.

 

[JMGlasgow]

Yeah, Toyota paid after trying to cover it up and blame it on floor mats. A tragedy that should have been avoided had the engineers done their job and had fail-safes in place.

 

[The Mechanic]

Hi guys been a while since I have posted on this. Well here we go time for the wild ride. I worked at the dealer that was connected to the Lexus dealer that killed the Saylor family. I trained some of the mechanics that worked there. When Lexus first arrived in the U.S. market there really was no one that could work on them. I just happen to be a driveability guy that specialized in using high end equipment of the time like scan tools, DSO's etc that are now required tools on today's vehicles. Anyways. Since this is past a statute of limitations I think I am pretty free to talk. Also since Bob Baker Chevrolet is no longer as well as Bob Baker Lexus being sold and Toyota settling the law suit brought by NON BLOOD relatives and Bob Baker settling the law suit as well I guess I can be free to say what I believe happened. Do I have proof? Nope. Not a shred. Just the opinion of a 25 year master tech 20 year platinum GM tech 10 year Toyo tech and 10 year Subaru certified tech and also someone that was there that day and talked to a few employee's next door. Do I think Toyota had a failure of software? Meh... Unlikely. Do I think the floor mats were the cause of the accident? 50/50.
Here is some background. At the time Lexus was doing their certified used cars. Lexus wanted those used cars to be REALLY good. They would fix EVERYTHING on them. Brake jobs on all of them, serviced transmissions, diffs, P/S, A/C service the whole 9 yards. Well here is the 50% part. Lexus had 2 floor mats. One was winter one was summer. The winter one was thick rubber. the summer was thin carpet. Well the detail guys would stack them with the winter on the bottom and the summer on the top. This stack would often get a pedal to stick. Had it happen to me a few times. Had it happen in Pontiac Fiero's too. Same reason. I believe the that the pedal stuck on the carpet. I really do.
OK your asking why the other 50% right? This is were it gets a little sticky. A little shitty on my part also but hey I'm an asshole. Great mechanic but I tell the truth and that make me an asshole. I think the driver was the other 50%. Listen for a sec. The driver was a CHP officer. At my dealership I used to get a lot of CHP vehicles as well as local PD and a bunch of Border Patrol vehicle in so I got to talk to some in the know. The driver was a CHP officer. I was told by a couple of them that they train on vehicles that can induce slides, stuck throttles, low traction, all kinds of shit to get a CHP used to all the bad crap that can happen on the road. This guy would not and could not become a CHP without the training on what to do with a stuck throttle. All you do is put it in neutral. That still gives you power steering. Still gives you brakes EVEN if you have vacuum booster because Lexus has a rev limiter built into the ECM so as the rpm goes over revs the ECM will shut injectors off thereby creating some vacuum for a booster. Anyways here is where I become the asshole. I think the guy was thinking lawsuit. If you listen to the tape he had a lot of time to put this in neutral and get off to the side of the road. Enough time to call 911 and have a conversation. The Highway they were on is a pretty steep grade. Traveled the exact route 1,000 times since I was a grew up in the area. I think he glazed the shit out of the brakes and then put it in neutral but the grade was so steep it was to late. He went through the lights at the end of the highway doing 50 or 60 I would guess and it was an un-survivable crash. I feel bad for him and his family. Not so much for the people that brought of the lawsuits for a total of 50 MILLION. From what I understand from some insiders Toyo settled in the neighborhood of $14 million and Bob Baker for around $10 million. I have NO love loss for Bob Baker. He screwed over every single employee at both of those dealerships me included. Last but not least. Do I have any proof of this? Not a single bit. So flame away or ask a question or two if you like.