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Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Read about it a while back, and I think putting the father on trial is ridiculous. I don't think anyone can hurt him more than what has already happened.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

That is horrible. The accident, the trial...all bad.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

There are things in life that you can't unsee. I respectfully suggest you edit your post and delete the link to the video.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MrLowandSlow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are things in life that you can't unsee. I respectfully suggest you edit your post and delete the link to the video.</div></div>
The video doesn't show the kid getting hurt, It's 95% the dad talking. You only see him holding the uzi, it's a video they showed on the news. If seeing that little bit disturbed you, I'm sorry, but they show it on television. It's safe for the forum.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BALLISTIC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Read about it a while back, and I think putting the father on trial is ridiculous. I don't think anyone can hurt him more than what has already happened.</div></div>
Agreed. In the video, you can clearly see who they say was a professional standing right next to the kid. They also said that he had assisted other children shoot the weapon. 8 may be young, and I'm not an uzi expert or anything, but this was in no way the dad's fault. It was an accident, a very tragic one.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

No worries. I actually only watched the first few seconds of the video, then closed the window. I figured it would be similar to the Daniel Pearl video; I'll never forget that, and not in a good way.

You have good judgement. Sorry if I sounded like a tool.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

It's cool, I just figured maybe you are super sensitive, haha. But no, for everyone else who hasn't watched, the video is not graphic at all.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Tragic. As a father I can only imagine the pain that the boys dad must feel every single day. I truly feel for everyone involved in the event, none of them will ever be the same.

The above being said, I think it's a little BS. Everything we do involves some amount of risk, some things more than others, but risk all the same. How many kids have been killed or paralyzed playing football at a young age? Do you think their parents or coaches were put on trial for letting them play football? I'd bet that there are a lot more deaths to minors from team sports than self inflicted gun wounds every year, but what makes good news?
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

I guess I'm going to be slammed as the liberal bleeding heart bla blah but I say throw the book at them both. You have to be an idiot of epic proportions to put a fully automatic weapon, especially one with the rate of fire of an Uzi in a third graders hands. Really? Someone thought that was a good idea?! Just the kid dying is bad enough, easily it could have been others as well.

I feel sorry for the family of the boy, especially the mother. The dad..?

Just fucking stupid.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess I'm ...the liberal bleeding heart...</div></div>

The first step in realizing you have a problem is admitting it to yourself, Congratulations!
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess I'm going to be slammed as the liberal bleeding heart bla blah but I say throw the book at them both. You have to be an idiot of epic proportions to put a fully automatic weapon, especially one with the rate of fire of an Uzi in a third graders hands. Really? Someone thought that was a good idea?! Just the kid dying is bad enough, easily it could have been others as well.

I feel sorry for the family of the boy, especially the mother. The dad..?

Just fucking stupid. </div></div>

I saw a kid younger than that fire a saw. I've seen little girls shoot 30-06 rifles. My girlfriend is about 110 lbs. and not at all strong in any way and she loves MP5's and saw's. I've seen 6'+ 300 lbs. idiots hurt them selves with 9mm's and .308's. So your argument doesn't work. Shit happens.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Tragedies happen every day to good people and you can't stop risk. It just so happens that when guns are involved there is a very big lobby that uses these tragedies to limit one more notch on the rung on the way to total gun control.

The killing of the child could have just as easily happened on the way home from the machine gun shoot in a traffic accident or ran over at home on his bicycle but there would not be an uproar to ban bicycles or cars...it is a tragedy and I feel for his father but as what was said above about risk is a part of the frailty of the human condition.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

A friend of mine was at this shoot when it happened, and said it was the most horrific scene he has ever seen, real life or movies. I agree with some here that say the father should not be punished by the law because he has already suffered one of the greatest losses. But on the other side I would never let my 8 year old handle a weapon like that.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess I'm going to be slammed as the liberal bleeding heart bla blah but I say throw the book at them both. You have to be an idiot of epic proportions to put a fully automatic weapon, especially one with the rate of fire of an Uzi in a third graders hands. Really? Someone thought that was a good idea?! Just the kid dying is bad enough, easily it could have been others as well.

I feel sorry for the family of the boy, especially the mother. The dad..?

Just fucking stupid. </div></div>

No the very definition of "Idiot of Epic Proportions" is you with a computer and internet access.

Just Fucking Stupid !
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr blasty</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess I'm going to be slammed as the liberal bleeding heart bla blah but I say throw the book at them both. You have to be an idiot of epic proportions to put a fully automatic weapon, especially one with the rate of fire of an Uzi in a third graders hands. Really? Someone thought that was a good idea?! Just the kid dying is bad enough, easily it could have been others as well.

I feel sorry for the family of the boy, especially the mother. The dad..?

Just fucking stupid. </div></div>

I saw a kid younger than that fire a saw. I've seen little girls shoot 30-06 rifles. My girlfriend is about 110 lbs. and not at all strong in any way and she loves MP5's and saw's. I've seen 6'+ 300 lbs. idiots hurt them selves with 9mm's and .308's. So your argument doesn't work. Shit happens. </div></div>

My argument is logical and obvious to the point of redundant. Shit happens when there's a lot of stupid about.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smokshwn</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I guess I'm going to be slammed as the liberal bleeding heart bla blah but I say throw the book at them both. You have to be an idiot of epic proportions to put a fully automatic weapon, especially one with the rate of fire of an Uzi in a third graders hands. Really? Someone thought that was a good idea?! Just the kid dying is bad enough, easily it could have been others as well.

I feel sorry for the family of the boy, especially the mother. The dad..?

Just fucking stupid. </div></div>

No the very definition of "Idiot of Epic Proportions" is you with a computer and internet access.

Just Fucking Stupid !
</div></div>

You're one of those inbreds on YouTube we all shake our heads at and say, "see, it's morons like this that gives us responsible gun owners a bad name".

Just imagine the conversation:

"Honey, I have terrible news."
"What is it? Where's the boy?"
"he's dead, he got shot at the gun show today"
"What!? How?"
"I gave him a fully automatic and loaded Uzi sub-machinegun".
"You did WHAT? Are you out of your mind?"
"It was an accident, he pulled the trigger before he was supposed to."
"HE WAS 8 YEARS OLD!"

and so on...

There's common sense, and then there's just plain ignorance and stupid. Ignoring the fact that the probabilities of something going horribly wrong when you mix youngsters and loaded automatic firearms is stupid. The dad and the 'expert' should be charged with negligent homicide.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Your assumptions drawn off your perception of what a comment implies is as valid as someone pointing to the fact that you live in CA and dropping a dumb fuck stereotype on your head. Smokeshwn has a point I think.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

You're one of those inbreds on YouTube we all shake our heads at and say, "see, it's morons like this that gives us responsible gun owners a bad name".

</div></div>
<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/7eWSCcQnNbE"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/7eWSCcQnNbE" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>


Here I am in all of my youtube or make that nationally televised glory.....

Ya....I'm definitely one of those inbreds giving responsible gun owners a bad name. Hope my sponsors don't find out
wink.gif


Once again further proof that you are unable to accurately assess any situation or person and form an opinion other than the utter stupidity you consistently put forth in your posts.





 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smokshwn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
No the very definition of "Idiot of Epic Proportions" is you with a computer and internet access.

Just Fucking Stupid ! </div></div>

You're one of those inbreds on YouTube we all shake our heads at and say, "see, it's morons like this that gives us responsible gun owners a bad name". </div></div>

Pretty sure this thread is about a little kid that got hurt in an accident, regardless of whomever it is you believe is responsible and whether it could have been prevented or not. Not a thread for you guys to bitch at each other and try to make personal shots about who is more stupid like you're 5. Just saying.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Minx</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smokshwn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
No the very definition of "Idiot of Epic Proportions" is you with a computer and internet access.

Just Fucking Stupid ! </div></div>

You're one of those inbreds on YouTube we all shake our heads at and say, "see, it's morons like this that gives us responsible gun owners a bad name". </div></div>

Pretty sure this thread is about a little kid that got hurt in an accident, regardless of whomever it is you believe is responsible and whether it could have been prevented or not. Not a thread for you guys to bitch at each other and try to make personal shots about who is more stupid like you're 5. Just saying.

</div></div>

Not to be disrespectful but this event took place in 2008 and was hashed over and again on the board so any relevant discussion has come and gone. Try not to get to wadded up over it.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Minx</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm willing to bet somebody already posted this, if they did and I find it, I'll delete this thread, but seriously.. what a sad story.</div></div>
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

I can see it now, my Daddy being carted off by DFS for turning his 8 yr. old son loose on the farm with his 10/22, "back in the day".
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Res Ipsa Loquitor;

Noun 1. res ipsa loquitur - a rule of evidence whereby the negligence of an alleged wrongdoer can be inferred from the fact that the accident happened.</div></div>

8 year olds shouldn't be left to wield a nail gun without an adult hand alongside, let alone a submachine gun.

For Christ's sake we look like imbeciles when every time a fire arm tragedy, or atrocity, occurs, we go into "What's going to happen to us?" mode.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: patriotoutlaw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I can see it now, my Daddy being carted off by DFS for turning his 8 yr. old son loose on the farm with his 10/22, "back in the day". </div></div>

Comparing a .22LR to an Uzi... really? I don't think it's wise in any regards to let an 8 year old be alone with a loaded firearm - of any calibre. Kids play, their imaginations and whims are what rules them. Guns are not toys to be played with by kids who do not yet understand or appreciate the idea of 'permanent consequences' to their actions. It seems neither do some people here...
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

I recall when this tragedy originally occurred and this same debate came up, Boltripper played a video of one of his boys, about the same age, shooting a full-auto, with appropriate supervision.

This was just so sad all around, that father will never have his son back, but as he said, he was under the impression it would be safe and supervision would be age-appropriate.

Firearms are not toys, and one of the very first lessions that should be ingrained in any childs mind before they are behind a trigger is how destructive they are, whether it be witnessing a hunt, or seeing a watermelon explode and the analogy that could be a person...
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: queequeg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

For Christ's sake we look like imbeciles when every time a fire arm tragedy, or atrocity, occurs, we go into "What's going to happen to us?" mode.
</div></div>

Agreed, when somebody acts like EH it only continues to exacerbate our own problems.

Why we don't recognize that however tragic and preventable this may have been it is no different than a trampoline, backyard pool, bicycle, skateboard, etc etc. Any of which kills many times the number of unattended children as firearms.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
My argument is logical and obvious to the point of redundant. Shit happens when there's a lot of stupid about. </div></div>

You're logic is completely faulty on so many levels it would be very time consuming to point them out.

You should be proud however of your second statement which shows that you are grasping the dangers of your unsupervised expression of ill formed opinions.

Which leads me to ask, by putting your head in the sand and ignoring myresponse to your accusation of being a "youtube inbred", are you hoping your stupidity will disappear, or do you intend to address my response at a later time ?
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Well , my view that you seem to insinuate is a threat to the 2nd is that 8 year old and Uzis should not mix. You think a trampoline is more dangerous than an Uzi. If you stop to think you'll realize that more kids get hurt by trampolines than Uzis because hardly any kids have parents reckless enough to let them play with Uzis.

Neither your posts or your vid show me any evidence that I was wrong about you and the paucity of branches on the family tree.

Good day to you sir.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Event, here in America when I was growing up we ALL had guns real and toy. We did then, and continue to know the difference. I never implied that an Uzi and a 10/22 were the same thing. My point was, that if this father is prosecuted, what a hey day they would have with my Daddy, today. My son killed his 1st deer at 6 yrs. old, with HIS OWN rifle. He got his 1st handgun at age 10. His maturity level was not to the point that I would let him use either, unsupervised, at those respective ages. BUT that is MY decision to make as a parent, not some governmental Dept. Does that make me a criminal because I've taught my kids to handle guns safely and to know how to use them? This is AMERICA and WE are part of the gun culture. If you don't like it then move back to whereverinthehell you came from!
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: patriotoutlaw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Event, here in America when I was growing up we ALL had guns real and toy. We did then, and continue to know the difference. I never implied that an Uzi and a 10/22 were the same thing. My point was, that if this father is prosecuted, what a hey day they would have with my Daddy, today. My son killed his 1st deer at 6 yrs. old, with HIS OWN rifle. He got his 1st handgun at age 10. His maturity level was not to the point that I would let him use either, unsupervised, at those respective ages. BUT that is MY decision to make as a parent, not some governmental Dept. Does that make me a criminal because I've taught my kids to handle guns safely and to know how to use them? This is AMERICA and WE are part of the gun culture. If you don't like it then move back to whereverinthehell you came from! </div></div>

Good grief! Where and when did I advocate legislation? Where did I say the govt. should legislate this or that? Nowhere.

Do you know the difference between punishment in a court and legislation?

There is a world of difference between teaching, supervising and allowing a youngster to shoot with a rifle (as you and your father have done) and letting an untrained, excited, 8 year old handle a fully auto sub machinegun.

I have every intention of teaching my son to shoot as soon as he's old enough to properly handle a rifle. I have every intention of taking him out and letting him hunt and I can't wait for the time to deem him responsible enough to own his own firearm.

What you've described your father as doing with you is perfectly sane, responsible and a model I myself intend to follow - because it's common sense and good parenting (really obvious!). What that idiot did that resulted in the death of his son is a completely different matter. What's worse is that so called man is refusing to take any responsibility. I'm sure he's torn up and feels guilty, but the lawsuit just shows it for what it is. If you disagree with me on that then I guess that's that.

For the record, I know where I am, what the culture is and the fact that I can live anywhere I damn well want. What I don't need is a bunch of wahoos with their heads up their asses using their abject stupidity as a lightening rod to give further cause to the anti-gunners to infringe on our rights. Yeah, mine, my son's, my family's as well as yours.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Boltripper, I really thought you were taller...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BOLTRIPPER</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Evan_Boiko_runnin_the_Uzi_07_30_06.jpg
</div></div>
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: E3C3H3O3</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But on the other side I would never let my 8 year old handle a weapon like that. </div></div>

At age 8 my older boy fired a full auto MP5, a full auto Ak74 Krink, and a full auto M4. I stood right next to him ready to grab the gun if it seemed to go out of control, but there was no problem.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

I've sent Smokshwn a PM saying the same thing, but I also want to say in the open that this thread suffered for the histrionics injected into it. My first post was out of anger at what I thought was a senseless and easily preventable death. The subsequent ones were me mostly acting my shoe size. Apologies for that and I'm sure no one here wants to ever read a story like this about any other parent and child.

In light of the recent event in Arizona, we who value our rights should be able to parse emotion from judgement and have our discourse focused on maximizing the common good without losing our freedoms and rights.

Good luck to all.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

8 year olds shouldn't be left to wield a nail gun without an adult hand alongside, let alone a submachine gun.

</div></div>

I have to disagree with this. When I was age 7 I went hunting (alone) for chipmunks and squirrels almost every day after school with either my chopped down Mossberg 22 or a Beretta single shot .410. The .22 was more fun. That continued until age 11 and we moved to a more urban area. At age 13 we moved to a rural area again and my after school hunting resumed.

I would agree that WITHOUT EXTENSIVE TRAINING, it would be unwise to let a 7 year old kid out with a shotgun or rifle. But if a kid can be trained to ride a 50 cc motorcycle, he can be trained to handle a .22 safely.

But you must TRAIN your kid, not just let him play video games. Without training, most adults who pickup a gun are wildly unsafe.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 500grains</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

8 year olds shouldn't be left to wield a nail gun without an adult hand alongside, let alone a submachine gun.

</div></div>

I have to disagree with this. When I was age 7 I went hunting (alone) for chipmunks and squirrels almost every day after school with either my chopped down Mossberg 22 or a Beretta single shot .410. The .22 was more fun. That continued until age 11 and we moved to a more urban area. At age 13 we moved to a rural area again and my after school hunting resumed.

I would agree that WITHOUT EXTENSIVE TRAINING, it would be unwise to let a 7 year old kid out with a shotgun or rifle. But if a kid can be trained to ride a 50 cc motorcycle, he can be trained to handle a .22 safely.

But you must TRAIN your kid, not just let him play video games. Without training, most adults who pickup a gun are wildly unsafe.</div></div>

That's true. My dad used to race motocross and had me on dirtbikes as young as 6-7. I had to be taught, of course, and I was supervised, but again mortorcycles are dangerous, just the way guns are dangerous. This whole uzi and an 8 year old kid thing is an <span style="font-weight: bold">accident</span>. With proper supervision and training, I don't see why kids shouldn't be able to use guns. Sure, it's risky, but so is almost everything else.
 
Re: Uzi Recoil Kills 8y/o

Guns and motorcycles are NOT dangerous. They are inanimate objects that will just SIT THERE for ALL ETERNITY without a PERSON to pick them up and use them.

Individual responsibility begins the day we are born. Like it, don't like it... that is the way it is.

That kid obviously did not know how to shoot an uzi, and is no longer here as a result. Sure, it is adults prerogative to keep kids out of harmful situations, but accidents can and will happen even when the child has been properly instructed. When I was a kid, I was responsible for feeding my dog. If I did not do it, no one else would. The dog would starve. I was taught VERY early that responsibility for one's actions is paramount to being a man.

This country is nothing but a big blame game. No one is accountable and no one is responsible. It DISGUSTS me to the point of nausea.

How many kids have fired machine guns? I would bet hundreds of thousands if not millions. How many incidents happened as a result? Not many that come to mind. Statistically speaking you are probably more likely to win the powerball jackpot than to see this happen again in our lifetimes.

RATIONAL thinking is what is required in situations like this, and unfortunately people cannot be rational when there are emotions involved. Everyone wants to blame everyone else, and the judicial system is all too happy to facilitate the shifting of blame. There is good money in that practice.

Fact is, every single person on the face of this earth is responsible for their actions. NO ONE ELSE. If you accidentally shoot someone, YOU are to blame. If you accidentally shoot yourself, YOU are to blame.

It was not the gun.
It was not the organizers.
It was not the weather.
It was not the moon.
It was not anyone else.
It was YOU.

This is one of the main reasons I like shooting so very much. It is one of the FEW things in this country that is still an intimately personal experience. The responsibility of what happens when you have that gun in your hands is NO ONE ELSE's but your own. No matter the circumstance.

The father feels his share of the blame. The organizers feel theirs. Everyone involved feels blame. NOT because it was "assigned" to them by some asshole judge in a corrupt seat, but because human beings feel loss.

If half as much focus would be put on FIREARM EDUCATION as they put on "GUN CONTROL" none of this shit would ever happen in the first place. Instead of an outcry for MORE firearm education so that children are taught about guns and how to safely and accurately shoot them, they use incidents like this to restrict firearm ownership. By their thinking, the gun is at fault, and if not for guns that child would have lived a life free of pain.

The entire argument disgusts me anymore. Rarely can I even talk about the subject with people, as it always comes down to the same thing:

No one wants to be responsible for their actions. Ever.
 
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