Vudoo 1000 rounds before Lapua testing. Bulk or match ammo?

IamJoHo

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    What did everyone use to break in their Vudoos? Part of me says burn a bunch of cheap bulk but the boojie part of me says put nothing down the pipe but higher end match ammo. Give me your thoughts.
     

    Skok3y

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    No cheap stuff. Mine also had hard time closing on CCI and Eley. Stuck with SK/Lapua. I didn’t need break in, but I see why you ask since they do request that. First shots were as good as ever, and better than anything else I’ve shot.
     

    littlepod

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    No cheap stuff. Mine also had hard time closing on CCI and Eley. Stuck with SK/Lapua. I didn’t need break in, but I see why you ask since they do request that. First shots were as good as ever, and better than anything else I’ve shot.

    These were my first few shots with SK+. E-E so I subtracted .221 for final group sizes. Rifle doesn't disappoint.

    1603405965801.png
     
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    Jefe's Dope

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    For break in, go w/ any SK, Eley, or Lapua that feeds well. You shouldn't really need 1000 rounds for break in, but if you're gonna send it to Lapua and they suggest it, then listen.

    I do buy the Midas because I need all the help I can get. Center X is just the same ammo after all the Midas is done. Midas is gonna be slightly more consistent box to box, round to round. It's not much more than Center X and I've got A LOT of money already tied up in my Vudoo set up so why count pennies between Midas and Center X? I'm certainly willing to try different ammo and I have a range of SK waiting to be shot. The Lapua test center is the way to go though. Lot testing in a very controlled environment by someone who does it every day and is not emotionally invested in your rifle. Then buy 10,000 rounds of that lot number. Send it back after 10,000 as the throat may have opened up a bit and may like something different.
     

    EddieE

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    I thought when I talked to Vudoo they said just shoot the thing. No break in required. My first range trip looks alot like what was posted above.
     

    IamJoHo

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    I thought when I talked to Vudoo they said just shoot the thing. No break in required. My first range trip looks alot like what was posted above.

    That is what they said. But Lapua asks for 1000 before coming to them. I have also seen many reports of people getting better groups the more they shot.
     

    phlegethon

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    Send it back after 10,000 as the throat may have opened up a bit and may like something different.
    Yeah that’s not happening with rimfire. As for Midas, we tested a few lots with my Vudoo when I was at the test center in Ohio, and they weren’t as good as the best lot of Center-X.
     
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    Kadams1563

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    My vudoo actually feeds CCI SV wel and it shoot great. It has flyers every once in awhile but I have shot a lot of it at 330 yards lol.

    I would get whatever you can find to run through it.

    I have shot Aguilla, CCI, Federal, Lapua, SK, Eley. Bulk federal white box lol. All of it will chamber most of the time just might not extract a loaded round. Pull the trigger and your fine.
     

    Dthomas3523

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    Just buy sk standard plus in the 5k cases and go shoot.

    If you’re shooting prs/Nrl, sending off to the test center won’t be the make or break of winning a match.
     

    Gjmen22

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    . It has flyers every once in awhile but I have shot a lot of it at 330 yards lol.

    I would get whatever you can find to run through it.

    I have shot Aguilla, CCI, Federal, Lapua, SK, Eley. Bulk federal white box lol. All of it will chamber most of the time just might not extract a loaded round. Pull the trigger and your fine.

    "My vudoo actually feeds CCI SV wel and it shoot great" I find it odd that some people have no problems with CCI-SV and others do. It makes me wonder about the Vudoo chambers and how close they are from one to the next. I have roughly 4500 rounds of one lot of CCI-SV that shoots pretty darn good. The only problem is closing the bolt. I feel like I'm damaging something with it so hard to close. :unsure:
     

    Dthomas3523

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    "My vudoo actually feeds CCI SV wel and it shoot great" I find it odd that some people have no problems with CCI-SV and others do. It makes me wonder about the Vudoo chambers and how close they are from one to the next. I have roughly 4500 rounds of one lot of CCI-SV that shoots pretty darn good. The only problem is closing the bolt. I feel like I'm damaging something with it so hard to close. :unsure:

    I’d be much more suspect of the super cheap ammo rather than the vudoo chamber.....
     
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    Sieg

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    My gun shoots CCI SV well, occasional tight round chambering. SK+ is good, SK Rifle Match in the right lot very good, Center-X hasn't overly impressed. But...... take what you can get right now. Good Shooting has 3 different lots of Center-X in stock right now at around $1040 a case which is a steal compared to the prices I was seeing on Ammoseek.com..... wholly shit the market prices are absolutely STUPID!
     
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    Kadams1563

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    I’m sure some lots of CCI SV don’t feed worth a damn but I have been lucky so far. I’ve never had a round that was really hard to close the bolt on.
     
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    JMcQ

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    My V-22 does well with CCi SV
    It’s my tin can shooting ammo when I have some friends over.
     

    Tim7139

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    That makes sense. Do you really think the CCI dimensions are that inconsistent?

    Have you, or for instance, checked your throat to see how much lead/ carbon got built up.
    For the guys mystified about “break in” of a new 22 with a SS match barrel, this is what your breaking in primarily.
    Some would consider it ctitical.
     

    justin amateur

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    Rimfire barrel break in?

    Why 1000 rounds before verifying accuracy?

    Ye'r polishing the bore, from leade to crown.
    The primer in rimfire is lead styphanate.
    It contains powdered silica as a frictive agent.
    Firing pin crushes the rim, silica generates heat, primer ignites.
    The silica residue, basically powdered glass, is blown into the bore.
    Each successive shot the silica is dragged at high speed and temperature,
    through the bore, polishing out any imperfections until the rifling
    polishes to a mirror finish.
    A high end hand lapped custom barrel won't show much improvement,
    but ye'r typical hammer forged production barrel can require substantially more than 1k rounds.
    I had a CZ barrel that needed 4k downrange before it settled down.
     

    Nfrantz87

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    That makes sense. Do you really think the CCI dimensions are that inconsistent?
    I just got a box of CCI SV to try in my RimX with Proof prefit barrel. I thought something was wrong at first. It was extremely hard to close the bolt on some and not on others. But they shot like absolute shit so not buying anymore anyway.
     

    OutThere

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    Would it be that the Test Center guys require the "break-in" to ensure that the gun is 100% reliable so they don't have to worry about fussing around with it?

    Just a thought.
     

    IamJoHo

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    Would it be that the Test Center guys require the "break-in" to ensure that the gun is 100% reliable so they don't have to worry about fussing around with it?

    Just a thought.

    This is off of their website.

    Preparing your rifle for testing
    • Unless otherwise requested, your rifle will be removed from the stock and mounted on a machined bedding block to fit in the return to battery fixture.
    • If you prefer to have your rifle tested in the stock, please specify this in the notes section on your appointment form.
    • If your action is glued in to your stock (like many bench rest rifles), you must let us know before hand or you risk damage being done to the rifle.
    • We recommend you leave tuners, bloop tubes, and front sights mounted on firearms for the testing process.
    • If you have a new rifle/barrel, you must have 1,000 rounds through the barrel before sending it in for testing. A barrel that is not worn in will not give you accurate results.
     

    themightytimmah

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    Yeah, I’m with MB on this one. The best groups my Vudoo ever shot were right after I got it. I ran out of that lot of ammo and switched to a new lot, any improvement in barrel break in has been more than negated by the lot to lot ammo difference.
     

    DownhillFromHere

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    Midas is gonna be slightly more consistent box to box, round to round. It's not much more than Center X and I've got A LOT of money already tied up in my Vudoo set up so why count pennies between Midas and Center X?
    Wrt consistency - probably. Accuracy? Probably. But return on investment correlated with use case is a different question. "Not much more than Center-X?" Uh, I consider 40% ($10.50 vs $14.70 at Good Shooting), to be more than "not much."

    Lapua's AZ test center went above & beyond expectations in testing my Vudoo, and the best lot of Center-X performed within a bullet's width of the best lot of Midas+ at 100 meters. I'm shooting steel / PRS-style competition out to 300 yards, not benchrest, and I'll give up 1/4" at 109 yards to save 40%.

    At the matches I shoot, wind is the deciding factor, not pinpoint accuracy. At one monthly match, one of the top-tier competitors uses Lapua X-Act ($23 per 50-round box). If the wind is completely calm (I think that's happened a couple times in last few years), he might have a slight advantage on the smallest 150-yard targets... but in the wind, he's in the same boat as us plebeian Center-X or Std+ folk.
    ----
    Wrt CCI SV: It's not consistent in physical dimensions compared with "the good stuff." It is, however, really cheap if one shops carefully (like $250/case). The current case I have is satisfactory for positional practice on 2MOA targets out to 100 yards. Its inconsistent rim thickness and skirt length and too-thick wax lube are, um, incompatible with smooth operation, but I have it on reliable authority (some guy named Bush ;-) that a hard bolt close won't hurt the rifle.
    ---
    Wrt barrel break-in: Not every rifle Lapua tests is a Vudoo or similarly top-rung rifle, so it makes sense that they would set up procedures to get the best results from lesser rifles. Why start the break-in arguments again?
     
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    Jefe's Dope

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    Wrt consistency - probably. Accuracy? Probably. But return on investment correlated with use case is a different question. "Not much more than Center-X?" Uh, I consider 40% ($10.50 vs $14.70 at Good Shooting), to be more than "not much."


    When you say a 40% increase, that does sound like quite a bit. But when you take away your hyperbole and realize it's $.21 vs. $.29 or in my use case $.24 vs. $.29 then it just sounds silly. I have $700 in just magazines. $2000+ in a scope, $1800 in a barreled action, $300 in the trigger, etc, etc. I invested in a $160 NV bride I'll likely never use just to help balance the rifle. I think the $.05 extra per round for better works for me. It's approx. $250 extra per year. I certainly understand if you need to pinch pennies and this is excessive for you. For me when shooting golf balls at 210 yards, I appreciate the extra consistency Midas brings. Larger targets not so much.
     

    littlepod

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    Wrt consistency - probably. Accuracy? Probably. But return on investment correlated with use case is a different question. "Not much more than Center-X?" Uh, I consider 40% ($10.50 vs $14.70 at Good Shooting), to be more than "not much."

    Lapua's AZ test center went above & beyond expectations in testing my Vudoo, and the best lot of Center-X performed within a bullet's width of the best lot of Midas+ at 100 meters. I'm shooting steel / PRS-style competition out to 300 yards, not benchrest, and I'll give up 1/4" at 109 yards to save 40%.

    At the matches I shoot, wind is the deciding factor, not pinpoint accuracy. At one monthly match, one of the top-tier competitors uses Lapua X-Act ($23 per 50-round box). If the wind is completely calm (I think that's happened a couple times in last few years), he might have a slight advantage on the smallest 150-yard targets... but in the wind, he's in the same boat as us plebeian Center-X or Std+ folk.
    ----
    Wrt CCI SV: It's not consistent in physical dimensions compared with "the good stuff." It is, however, really cheap if one shops carefully (like $250/case). The current case I have is satisfactory for positional practice on 2MOA targets out to 100 yards. Its inconsistent rim thickness and skirt length and too-thick wax lube are, um, incompatible with smooth operation, but I have it on reliable authority (some guy named Bush ;-) that a hard bolt close won't hurt the rifle.
    ---
    Wrt barrel break-in: Not every rifle Lapua tests is a Vudoo or similarly top-rung rifle, so it makes sense that they would set up procedures to get the best results from lesser rifles. Why start the break-in arguments again?

    +100

    I run SK+ 80% of the time, as it shots about 80% of Center-X for me, and at half the cost. Most NRL22 competitions will run target sizes at 1.5-2MOA and I know SK+ will hold fine and if I miss it's on me. Yes there are stacking wobble zone methodology. If my wobble zone is 1.5moa and my ammo is 1moa, then I'm at 2.5moa, versus my ammo is a 1/2 moa ammo and I'm at 2moa total fluctuation.

    When I started getting better and started hitting into the 90% hit rate and the top scores were only a difference between 1-3 hits, I switched to Center-X. SK+ had a flyer about 1 out every 10 rounds, not enough to miss a 2moa target, but definitely enough to miss the 1/4" at 50yds. I haven't seen any requirements in PRS/NRL22 that would require me to go to X-Act yet...

    I shoot in about 3 comps a month, so I'm burning about 700 rounds a month when you factor in practice + matches. Matches are usually about 120-150 rounds, and then I'll do drills and other things, so close to about 700 rounds, so 14 boxes a month. I bought 3 cases of Center-X as I can stomach that price, but still don't think I'd stomach the price of X-Act.

    Now at the same time my 6GT costs me $1.50 a round to shoot copper creek.... and a single PRS match at 150 rounds is more ammo than I shoot any rimfire for months. So I guess 🤷‍♂️
     

    phlegethon

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    Yes there are stacking wobble zone methodology. If my wobble zone is 1.5moa and my ammo is 1moa, then I'm at 2.5moa, versus my ammo is a 1/2 moa ammo and I'm at 2moa total fluctuation.
    It's not even that bad, because error doesn't add like that. It grows as the root mean squared, so the combination of a 1.5 MOA and 1 MOA error is 1.8 MOA, and 0.5 MOA + 1.5 MOA is 1.58 MOA.
     

    Tim7139

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    Rimfire barrel break in?

    Why 1000 rounds before verifying accuracy?

    Ye'r polishing the bore, from leade to crown.
    The primer in rimfire is lead styphanate.
    It contains powdered silica as a frictive agent.
    Firing pin crushes the rim, silica generates heat, primer ignites.
    The silica residue, basically powdered glass, is blown into the bore.
    Each successive shot the silica is dragged at high speed and temperature,
    through the bore, polishing out any imperfections until the rifling
    polishes to a mirror finish.
    A high end hand lapped custom barrel won't show much improvement,
    but ye'r typical hammer forged production barrel can require substantially more than 1k rounds.
    I had a CZ barrel that needed 4k downrange before it settled down.

    Other than the fact that priming contains silica, there ain’t Anything getting polished by it, Stainless or CM.
    First off, the silica usually ends up @6 o’clock in the barrel and polishes zero,it will however pit a SS barrel bore on the bottom which is why ELEY changed to a smaller matrix some time ago.
    the
    The primary “break in” is in the chamber and if not done, or done badly, ends up in a barrel never performing at optimal levels.
     

    justin amateur

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    Interesting, silica won't act as an abrasive or polish steel?

    Check the Mohs hardness scale, steel rates a 5, silica a 7, diamond a 10.

    Yep the silica is blown into the rifling, much on the bottom.
    Operative word...rifling...twist, remember?
    So the silica ends up on the surface of the bullet,
    mixed in the lube, spinning down the bore,
    leaving lube and silica coating on all the rifling, right?

    So silica will polish the bore, but it takes time.
    Not like hand lapping by a skilled technician,
    but still smooths the imperfections.

    I know, mouthy, contentious, old coot. ;)
     
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