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Rifle Scopes what power scope?

bigsal5353

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Nov 21, 2004
38
1
n.w. pennsylvania
Just bought a DPMS lr-308, plan out taking this gun to to 600+yds on paper, coyotes, and groundhogs..

pretty sure Im gonna buy a mark4, but also looking at zeiss conquest and sightron III.

DO you think a 4.5-14 is enought magnification to shoot paper and ground hogs at 600 yds???

should I go with the 6.5-20???
 
Re: what power scope?

I shot a big bodied wt buck at 450 with my 4.5-14 on 14x last season. Wasn't bad but I would not have been pissed if the dial kept turning to zoom in a little more. I think I would want higher magnification for ground hogs, especially at the range you are talking. Seems like a pretty small target at 600 especially with an AR. I've never done it though so thats just a guess.

If it's mainly for long range, and cost/weight doesn't matter then I would vote 6.5-20x for what you are wanting to do. I usually get too many close range shots here for 6x to be my lowest setting. A moving coyote at short range might be tough on 6x, never tried that either. Just got an XTR 6-24x for the 308 to hunt on the powerlines though so I will know soon enough
 
Re: what power scope?

redirt78, thanks for your reply... unless people change my mind I think i'll probably spend a few more bucks and buy the 6.5-20, even though this gun is an ar platform.. its a 24'' bull barrel and should shoot somewhere around 1/2 moa
 
Re: what power scope?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bigsal5353</div><div class="ubbcode-body">redirt78, thanks for your reply... unless people change my mind I think i'll probably spend a few more bucks and buy the 6.5-20, even though this gun is an ar platform.. its a 24'' bull barrel and should shoot somewhere around 1/2 moa </div></div>

With the rifle shooting 0.5" groups and if most of your shooting is at longer ranges I'd go with the 6.5-20X50 scope. That's what I have on my 24" Colt 6721. Almost all my shooting is 100 yards or more.
 
Re: what power scope?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt. obvious</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think people get spoiled on high magnification scopes. I shoot out to 500 regularly and at 600 on occasions and im using a fixed 10x.</div></div>

Yup, its a common misconception that high power is needed to shoot at distance. Not true, high power is a luxury for target identification but is by no means necessary for precision LR shooting... heck plenty of dudes out there shoot MOA or sub MOA with irons out to a grand. In my book, good quality glass comes first, then a usable reticle, then magnification.
 
Re: what power scope?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redirt78</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've never shot at groundhogs. I'm wondering, at 600yds + how easy it is to pick one out since they are tan and usually the backdrop is also tan.</div></div>

Hmmm... might wanna use a good spotting scope to find em and get on target from there.
 
Re: what power scope?

Folks buy scopes because they perceive with a scope they'll hit what they're aiming at. They know they can't hit with irons, at any distance beyond the distance a target could be hit intuitively; and, therefore, they think the scope is the answer to hits at distance. After all, they can see the distant target better with the scope; plus, with the scope, they can recognize an exact target/reticle relationship. What they don't know is the target/reticle relationship may not describe where the rifle is pointed, or that after getting a relationship there's anything else which needs to be summoned for a good hit.

Leaving the range without a good hit at distance, these folks are heard to say, "that gun don't shoot"," my scopes' broke", or, "that gun shoots better than I do". They don't seem to ever think their problem has anything to do with not knowing anything about good shooting, or that the scope is not a substitute for not knowing anything about good shooting. Fact is, these folks can leave the range and still hold on to the notion that they're big time marksmen. The tiny groups they shot with their scope earlier in the day at 100 yards convinced them of that.

These folks have been deceived by the scope, and it has distracted them from what's really important-knowing where the barrel is pointed. Instead these folks think, perhaps, with just a little more magnification their groups could be even smaller.

With iron sights, a shooter has no delusions that he's a marksman. He will miss at any distance. But, it's this recognition of not being able to do it that, when the scope is not tempting such a shooter, will force the shooter to learn how to get the job done with irons. And, when the shooter finally realizes he can get good hits with irons to as distant a target as can be seen, the scope looses much of its appeal.

Sure, magnification can be an aid, but at some point, setting the power ring all the way up does not assure a better result. For example, with a 16 power scope you could locate a golf ball at 600 meters, and, if the reticle did not cover the ball, a shooter could certainly aim at it with confidence he indeed was aiming exactly. However, that golf ball is less than a 1/4 MOA at such a distance, so, unless the shooter has an amazingly accurate rifle, the only value in magnification is in revealing to the shooter that he did not hit the target.
 
Re: what power scope?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Folks buy scopes because they perceive with a scope they'll hit what they're aiming at. They know they can't hit with irons, at any distance beyond the distance a target could be hit intuitively; and, therefore, they think the scope is the answer to hits at distance. After all, they can see the distant target better with the scope; plus, with the scope, they can recognize an exact target/reticle relationship. What they don't know is the target/reticle relationship may not describe where the rifle is pointed, or that after getting a relationship there's anything else which needs to be summoned for a good hit.

Leaving the range without a good hit at distance, these folks are heard to say, "that gun don't shoot"," my scopes' broke", or, "that gun shoots better than I do". They don't seem to ever think their problem has anything to do with not knowing anything about good shooting, or that the scope is not a substitute for not knowing anything about good shooting. Fact is, these folks can leave the range and still hold on to the notion that they're big time marksmen. The tiny groups they shot with their scope earlier in the day at 100 yards convinced them of that.

These folks have been deceived by the scope, and it has distracted them from what's really important-knowing where the barrel is pointed. Instead these folks think, perhaps, with just a little more magnification their groups could be even smaller.

With iron sights, a shooter has no delusions that he's a marksman. He will miss at any distance. But, it's this recognition of not being able to do it that, when the scope is not tempting such a shooter, will force the shooter to learn how to get the job done with irons. And, when the shooter finally realizes he can get good hits with irons to as distant a target as can be seen, the scope looses much of its appeal.

Sure, magnification can be an aid, but at some point, setting the power ring all the way up does not assure a better result. For example, with a 16 power scope you could locate a golf ball at 600 meters, and, if the reticle did not cover the ball, a shooter could certainly aim at it with confidence he indeed was aiming exactly. However, that golf ball is less than a 1/4 MOA at such a distance, so, unless the shooter has an amazingly accurate rifle, the only value in magnification is in revealing to the shooter that he did not hit the target. </div></div>

Wow.....words of wisdom right there.....
 
Re: what power scope?

I have a RRA Varminter with a 24" barrel and hunt rock chucks and prairie dogs with it. I normally wears a Leupold 6.5-20 VXIII or the same power Vortex Viper. I seldom use them above 16X because of the limited field of view but have switched up to 20X to locate a varmint in tall grass. The 20X is handy but not essential. The target below was shot with that rifle while I was seeing what my SWFA SS 1-4X24 HD scope was capable of. It worked for steel at 700 yards.

[img

Uploaded with ImageShack.usimg]
 
Re: what power scope?

Comes down to target size. You can't hit what you can't see. With a small target like a ground hog at 600+ yards if you can't see it then you can't hit it. People shoot 1000 yards with iron sights but they are also shooting big targets with bigger backers which are easy to get a good sight picture on.

A scope is a tool and you need to pick the right tool for the right job.

My advice would be to get the 6.5-20x scope. You can always dial down if you don't need the higher power.
 
Re: what power scope?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rob01</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Comes down to target size. You can't hit what you can't see. With a small target like a ground hog at 600+ yards if you can't see it then you can't hit it. People shoot 1000 yards with iron sights but they are also shooting big targets with bigger backers which are easy to get a good sight picture on.

A scope is a tool and you need to pick the right tool for the right job.

My advice would be to get the 6.5-20x scope. You can always dial down if you don't need the higher power.</div></div>

Rob01 is right, ya can't hit it unless you can see it. Finding IT is another thing, then, a spotting scope, or binoculars may be handier and safer too.
 
Re: what power scope?

If someone is shooting a safe place with his rock chuck rifle, using a binocular or spotting scope will not be any safer. He already has a safe back stop and knows the surroundings.

When I shoot grounds quirrels in Centeral Oregon with a scope which goes to 20X it is on 20X for shooting them out to 300 yards. If they are more like 350 or 400 yards I would turn the scope up to 25 or maybe even 30X. Squirrels are mighty small with a huge trophy class one standing 8" tall and only 2 1/4" across.

Like one poster says, "You can't hit what you can't see."