Rifle Scopes your opinions on mid tier optics like XTR3 vs XRS3/DMR3 vs Cronus Gen2

best scope $1k-1500


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Jerzey1

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Just got my XRS3 and spent the last half hour with it and the XTR3 and Trijicon 5-50 - furthest spot is ~4K yards with trees and hills of varying colors, deer and horses in between. XTR3 is still king IMHO. Glass is very similar, but feel the Bushnell and Trijicon are a touch less contrast than the Burris, which was in turn less contrast than the MK5. Absolute IQ the Trijicon is still 1st, and the Bushy and Burris switching places for 2nd as I looked at different things at different distances. We are talking 3-5% advantage to Trijicon, but the FOV of the Burris makes up for it and then some. Bushnell FOV is better than Trij, but still quite a bit behind the Burris. Reticle, obviously subjective, but I love the SCR2 mil in the Burris because it doesn't obscure the view. Trijicon MRAD is even better, with fewer lines and SFP, and the Bushnell is better than, say, the thick lines in the ZCO, but doesn't fade away as easily as the XTR3.

Controls: Parallax is less finicky on the Bushnell than the Burris, but once dialed, DOF is equivalent. Turret clicks are basically the same. Knobs are even tighter on the Bushnell than they are on the Burris. Both feel like a car with no power steering compared to 1 finger steering of the 1980 Cadillac that is the ZCO.

So, Bushnell is going back unless someone wants it for what I paid - otherwise sending her back tomorrow.

Now, the only question is whether to jump on the HebrewHammer deal for more Burrii, or wait for Shot for the new models. I now have 2 naked rifles...
Thanks for the honest review......can you tell us more about the Busnell XRS3?
 

Chickentoast

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Anything specific? I boxed it back up but if it's something specific... I can do some more checking at first light tomorrow.
 

Jerzey1

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Anything specific? I boxed it back up but if it's something specific... I can do some more checking at first light tomorrow.
Not really, just overall if it's worth the $$$. I got a good deal from Bushnell VIP so cost was quite a bit lower than advertized
 

Chickentoast

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Not really, just overall if it's worth the $$$. I got a good deal from Bushnell VIP so cost was quite a bit lower than advertized

Oh, definitely worth the money, fantastic scope. We're basically a bunch of women saying our jeans don't fit right. :D I could be happy for the rest of my life with it, and I could see a soda can, albeit a bit fuzzy, at ~3700 yds.

For comparison, the ZCO at that same range has less, almost no fuzz around the soda can. ZCO you can also see deer eyes and ears and antlers, not well enough to count points, but much clearer than the best of the 2K range. But anything inside of the most unethical of hunting ranges, say 1500 yds, the 2K class of scopes gives you all the detail on an animal, or a soda can, that you would need to make the shot. Color and contrast and mirage is also much better with ZCO, but again, didn't impact my ability to shoot - and to standardize across half a dozen rifles, I'd rather do something else with that ~15K cost difference.

Nutshell: I happen to value FOV and prefer the SCR2 enough to prefer the XTR3 over the Bushnell, and I already have 2 of them, so more transferability by sticking with the platform.
 

Jerzey1

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Oh, definitely worth the money, fantastic scope. We're basically a bunch of women saying our jeans don't fit right. :D I could be happy for the rest of my life with it, and I could see a soda can, albeit a bit fuzzy, at ~3700 yds.

For comparison, the ZCO at that same range has less, almost no fuzz around the soda can. ZCO you can also see deer eyes and ears and antlers, not well enough to count points, but much clearer than the best of the 2K range. But anything inside of the most unethical of hunting ranges, say 1500 yds, the 2K class of scopes gives you all the detail on an animal, or a soda can, that you would need to make the shot. Color and contrast and mirage is also much better with ZCO, but again, didn't impact my ability to shoot - and to standardize across half a dozen rifles, I'd rather do something else with that ~15K cost difference.

Nutshell: I happen to value FOV and prefer the SCR2 enough to prefer the XTR3 over the Bushnell, and I already have 2 of them, so more transferability by sticking with the platform.
Good to go! Thanks for the update. I'm excited to get this scope. My Fed Ex tracking for my scope seems "lost"
 

beetroot

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Haha, what timeliness are those exactly..

They haven't been in any big hurry to make an illuminated XTR3, but at no point have they unveiled it and set a date that they didn't deliver on. They just haven't produced it yet.

So if they do unveil new products at Shot and don't ever bring them to market, it would be fair at that point to make fun of their "timelines" 😂
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Whilst Burris haven't given us exact dates, they and their "influencers" have kept us holding our breath for this illusive illuminated version.

Good news is the new rumoured Razor should be outsoon, so long as it doesn't weight 300lbs might not need to wait for my illuminated 3.3-18x50.
 

Birddog6424

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    giphy.gif


    Whilst Burris haven't given us exact dates, they and their "influencers" have kept us holding our breath for this illusive illuminated version.

    Good news is the new rumoured Razor should be outsoon, so long as it doesn't weight 300lbs might not need to wait for my illuminated 3.3-18x50.
    I would agree with that (not the Vortex part).

    Burris has had the illuminated version on and off again. I think they initially were thinking they would roll it out a year or so after, then decided they didn't like their current illumination components and wanted to redesign from the ground up. Then the existing XTR3 started blowing out the door and the already limited production space had to go into overdrive, so illuminated went on the back burner. There was simply no opportunity to work it into the production schedule and keep up with current demand.

    I think those bugs are worked out and I think they are ready to bring these to market. Ive seen the early run prototypes, and I'm pretty sure folks are going to like them. Its my very strong suspicion we will see some interesting announcements for Shot Show, and possibly at that point a market release date.

    Then we'll be on the hook for hitting our timeline 😉
     

    Jerzey1

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    I would agree with that (not the Vortex part).

    Burris has had the illuminated version on and off again. I think they initially were thinking they would roll it out a year or so after, then decided they didn't like their current illumination components and wanted to redesign from the ground up. Then the existing XTR3 started blowing out the door and the already limited production space had to go into overdrive, so illuminated went on the back burner. There was simply no opportunity to work it into the production schedule and keep up with current demand.

    I think those bugs are worked out and I think they are ready to bring these to market. Ive seen the early run prototypes, and I'm pretty sure folks are going to like them. Its my very strong suspicion we will see some interesting announcements for Shot Show, and possibly at that point a market release date.

    Then we'll be on the hook for hitting our timeline 😉
    I was reading a post (I think here) a while ago about some people complaining about the lack of illunimation options for scopes. Then somebody in the "know" or the industry jumped on and explained why alot of companies don't offer illumination because it costs more and like 80% of people just dont want it, need it or want to pay extra for it, makes sense.
     

    Birddog6424

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    I was reading a post (I think here) a while ago about some people complaining about the lack of illunimation options for scopes. Then somebody in the "know" or the industry jumped on and explained why alot of companies don't offer illumination because it costs more and like 80% of people just dont want it, need it or want to pay extra for it, makes sense.
    Its the truth. I've had this conversation with Burris management. They've said as much to me directly.

    I know there are a lot of people these days who use tactical scopes as crossover hunting optics. And out of those people there are some of them who want illumination. And I get that.

    But from a scope company perspective, the hunting line ups that are purpose built for that guy sell in exponentially greater numbers. I'm sure if people could see illuminated versus non illuminated sales numbers on the MK5, which is one of the few mid tier tactical optics to make illumination optional for a price, they would see that in these line ups, demand for illumination isn't great. And people complain about the cost of adding it.

    I've hunted big game all over the northwest for 40 years, I've had illuminated reticles for the last 8. I've never used it. But even having said that, I'm excited to see the illuminated XTR3. If there are some guys out there that want it, then I'm glad Burris is finally able to bring it to market for them. I love my 18x optic, I think the illuminated version of that will be the bomb.
     

    Solo 43

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    I've done several night shoots (in training) with my NON-illuminated PMII and had no issues once my eyes acclimated with targets out to 575. Now, this was before illuminated reticles were available but the scope I have with an illum ret, even on low, seems bright. I'd be worried about screwing up my night vision, regardless of the color of illum. You guys that have more experience then me at night, please weigh in.
     
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    srt-4_uk

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    You don't turn up the illumination so that it blinds you. You turn on the illumination so that it adds contrast. It's very easy for a thin black reticle to get lost in a black and brown tree line.
    For me, that's the biggest drawback of the 3.3-18 SCR2. unless you have perfect contrast, the reticle is invisible until 5 or 6x
     

    Solo 43

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    The illumination doesn't make the target disappear somewhat? Like I said, I've never used an illum so I don't know.
    My partner had another 'top' tier tactical scope and couldn't see shit. My PMII was....all that it was suppose to be.
     

    MarshallDodge

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    Kinda hard for people to compare the new Bushnell DMR3 and XRS3 becausse very little people have them. The XRS3 was literally just released yesterday. I can say this because I like the Bushnell Elites, they are solid, glass is really good, turrets are really good, numbers on the turrets are big, zero stop is easy, price is great and they are tough...they are reliable and they track, period. I have a DMR3 now for a couple of months and really like it. Just ordered the XRS3 yesterday, looking foward to using it asap

    Personally I think the Bushnell Elite's and Burris XTR's are very underrated
    That is my issue, I have an XRSII and the XTRII. The XRS is a really nice piece of glass but I paid about 25% more for it over the XTR. No idea on the Gen III optics.
     

    FLguy55

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    That is my issue, I have an XRSII and the XTRII. The XRS is a really nice piece of glass but I paid about 25% more for it over the XTR. No idea on the Gen III optics.

    As you’ve already experienced, the XRS2 smokes the glass on the xtr2. Frankly that doesn’t take much though.

    Having had both the XRS2 and the XRS3, I’d say there is a small upgrade in glass but it’s tough to quantify since it’s been a couple years since running my xrs2. What I can tell you is I took my xrs3 out, side by side with my zco and my razor G3 and the difference at a mile is negligible. I was actually a little shocked. I will say I sold my atacr 7-35 in favor of keeping the xrs3 on my mile gun if that tells you anything. I’m only speaking about glass here though, and not things like turrets, fov, reticle, eye box, blah blah blah.
     

    Chickentoast

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    How did these scopes Fair? All 3 of them are on my short list?

    I still have the 5-50 on my airgun - great scope, great glass, but not the greatest FOV. I still have 2 XTR3's and love them. I was going to upgrade to XTR Pro's, but they were taking forever, so I tried a G3 Razor and ended up buying a second one. The G3 is a noticeable step up from the XTR3, so even though it's more expensive, it's still a great value. Only downside is that it's really heavy. The XRS3 did nothing for me over the XTR3, so I sent it back.
     

    FLguy55

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    I still have the 5-50 on my airgun - great scope, great glass, but not the greatest FOV. I still have 2 XTR3's and love them. I was going to upgrade to XTR Pro's, but they were taking forever, so I tried a G3 Razor and ended up buying a second one. The G3 is a noticeable step up from the XTR3, so even though it's more expensive, it's still a great value. Only downside is that it's really heavy. The XRS3 did nothing for me over the XTR3, so I sent it back.

    I’ll second this. I’m a long time vortex hater but grabbed a razor G3 to try out and they really did knock this thing out of the park. I’ve ordered a 2nd in fact. I’m actually contemplating selling my zco to order a 3rd and pocketing like a grand in the process.
     

    Cpg3

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    I still have the 5-50 on my airgun - great scope, great glass, but not the greatest FOV. I still have 2 XTR3's and love them. I was going to upgrade to XTR Pro's, but they were taking forever, so I tried a G3 Razor and ended up buying a second one. The G3 is a noticeable step up from the XTR3, so even though it's more expensive, it's still a great value. Only downside is that it's really heavy. The XRS3 did nothing for me over the XTR3, so I sent it back.
    Thank you for that review! I think that will help me decide some.
     
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