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Maggie’s Where is your back in a Bar, Restaurant, Coffee Shop or Café?

When I'm in a bar, restaurant, coffee shop or cafe I like to sit...

  • with my back against the wall looking toward the entrance(s).

    Votes: 29 20.0%
  • where I can see the entrances but not necessarily with my back against a wall.

    Votes: 71 49.0%
  • where I can see the most likely entrance that a threat would enter for more than one doorway.

    Votes: 29 20.0%
  • If I'm with someone who is just as alert, or armed as I am, then it doesn't matter.

    Votes: 6 4.1%
  • Any of the above.

    Votes: 27 18.6%
  • anywhere. I am not worried about unexpected threats in places that I patronize.

    Votes: 9 6.2%
  • Other... Please explain below.

    Votes: 5 3.4%

  • Total voters
    145

Longshot231

Four Star General
Full Member
Minuteman
  • Mar 8, 2018
    10,944
    37,784
    I've always been the type of person that hates to sit in a public place with my back to a doorway. I've been attacked from behind before and it's not fun.

    Wild Bill Hickok lost his life because his back was to the door. I don't want to end up like him.

    So I was wondering if I'm one of the few that feels this way or are there others that take similar precautionary measures.

    Your answers to the poll would be appreciated.
     
    Option 2 is exactly what I do. Potential entrances (and exits) are within view but I am also in a position where in case shit goes south, I can move around if need be, whether to engage a threat, get the fuck out unnoticed, in the case of unwanted drama, or get as many people as possible with me safely out of there. The Station Nightclub fire which killed 104 people happened when I was in high school, saw the coverage on the news. And then I saw the TRUE horror of the whole thing on the Internet. Scared the absolute shit out of me. Fire, water, gas, and bombs are threats that you cannot engage no matter how armed you are.
     
    I’m not always about engaging the threat. If I can identify a problem and leave with who ever I care about, I’m good with that. If I’m wearing a badge and gun then it’s my job to step up. Big difference. Dead or wounded is not something to risk lightly. I can’t save all the idiots in the world.
     
    Sometimes i go into restaurants that have 2 separate entrances and the order line is in the middle. Sometimes there is no good way to watch all sides. I was in a subway one time and as soon as i left and when next door(ace hardware) it got robbed at gunpoint. Cops were outside when i came back outside in less than 5 minutes. That told me that the perp was likely inside at the same time i was, maybe in the bathroom trying to sack up. This was a nice area. I do not recall seeing anyone who i would have suspected to do such a thing, but ya never know.

    Another time i was in a gun store at closing. Front door was locked. Minutes after they locked the door the neighbor chick at the sunglass place came pounding on the glass crying. They opened the door and was screaming that two hispanics just robbed her at gunpoint. Pretty brazen.

    Just goes to show you whether you are in a good neighborhood or someplace that should have low crime, doesn’t mean it will.

    I try to place myself where someone cannot get behind me and attack me, as not all attacks will be barging through the front door as they could come in quietly and slip into the bathroom, come out of the kitchen back door as most places don’t lock it, or could be a patron or someone who works there.


    I just eat at home, locked in my closet wearing a vest, 15 guns and a rope. Why a rope? Watch boondock saints.
     
    Usually in the back corner away from the main entrance where I can see everything. Not because Im paranoid but because I like to watch people.
     
    Fortunately, my local, I can see the side door plain as day, and somewhat see the main door. I'm a bit less worried at my local; however, if I go out to my non-usual locations, I always try as much as I can to face the door at all times so I can see what walks in. So with the exception of the place I'm most likely to be (kind of stupid of me actually) I like having the door in plain sight right in front.
     
    Back to the wall by the door is not a bad position at all, it gives you first opportunity to set one in the back of the perps head. That way your dinner doesn't really get that cold if your a good shot, mostly likely your blood pressure will be jacked but a nice after dinner cordial should take the edge off. Tip the waiter well especially if he picks up your spent brass .
     
    It’s the last thing on my mind when being seated.
     
    wife always knows to let me have the seat facing the front door and try to get back to wall vs being in the middle of 5 tables during a shootout... good call about also seeing where someone could come in the back door/kitchen.
     
    • Like
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    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.

    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.
     

    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.

    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.
    That's the side effect of having been a victim of crime.
     
    A predator will naturally key on on other predators. Those who insist on sitting facing the door for one. I want to be the least threatening person in the room, while I assess the situation and make my move, IF warranted. Then I want my violence of action to be a shock, reseting the perp’s OODA loop.

    But that’s just me…..🤠
     
    • Like
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    My wife knows take a seat leaving the doors for me to see.

    She assesses the place same as me from her training classes.

    She knows I hate chairs with backs that catch on pistols.

    I always make note of if she is on person carry or purse. Sometimes she answers "yup" when asked.

    Got to love those Texas women.
     
    My wife knows take a seat leaving the doors for me to see.

    She assesses the place same as me from her training classes.

    She knows I hate chairs with backs that catch on pistols.

    I always make note of if she is on person carry or purse. Sometimes she answers "yup" when asked.

    Got to love those Texas women.
    Womens-Concealed-Carry-Thigh-Holster_Tan-1.jpg


    Sometimes the wife carries for me but when I get the gun back it smells like a reel on a tuna boat on a hot summer day.
     
    I prefer to sit next to the door, with my back toward that wall. My thinking is that a threat is not going to stand at the entrance, nor will they necessarily appear to be a threat when they enter. They will move into the establishment before doing whatever they are going to do. At that point, they are not between me and the exit, and I have the opportunity to see their actions.

    This strat may not apply in restaurants with host/ess stations and waiting areas.

    I know, restaurants have at least 2 exits. True, but only the main customer entrance is known to me upon entering.

    And, I know, sit facing the door so that you see the threat. Yeah, that’s great except s/he is now between me and the exit I know about.

    The above notwithstanding, I’m with MtnCreek about the biggest threat being parking lot pirates. Sit where you can see your vehicle.
     
    • Like
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    Back to the wall, or at least watching the main seating area or travel area. Outside seat on the booth. If needed, would scoop up kids and go out through the kitchen.
     
    When going through the drive thru , always backseat passenger side for a better shot angle.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: TACC

    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.

    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.

    The person that wrote that has never been attacked or had anyone try to kill them. It is not paranoia if someone is REALLY out to get you.
     
    • Like
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    I prefer a spot that's out of sight of the cash register, and far enough away from the entrance so if the girl I'm with is disappointing, then I can cover the bill on the sly, and have enough time to bounce and get my vehicle moving before she finds out, lol.
     
    • Haha
    Reactions: Makinchips208
    The front door is worthy of watching. But I like to be able to view the whole room if possible.

    Wife used to get pissed at me for wanting to sit in a certain place. Tough shit, she's gotten over it, & now will set us up most of the time.

    I don't want to be a hero, but I don't want to be hit from behind either.
     
    I try to sit where I can see my vehicle. Most likely 'threat' is someone stealing something out of the back of my truck.
    Same. If my wife gets to the table before I do she knows to take the seat that gives me the best view. To be fair, this is not just for security reasons, I've driven some real shitboxes where the chance of it jumping out of gear and rolling away is significant..
     
    Funny you bring this up as I was just admiring my wife this evening at dinner and how when we are being seated, she waits until I show her where I’d like her to sit.

    It’s not automatic for her just yet and looks to me for confirmation, but I like that she is aware enough to have me say where I’d like her to sit so I have the best view of the doors.
     
    • Like
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    For those of you with no NPE experience you really need to spend some time studying this guy, the skills and insights Ed offers can definitely help you not only watch your back but more importantly blend in better. That guy that has to have his back to a wall in any public place usually sticks out like a sore thumb if you know how to look for indicators.

     
    For those of you with no NPE experience you really need to spend some time studying this guy, the skills and insights Ed offers can definitely help you not only watch your back but more importantly blend in better. That guy that has to have his back to a wall in any public place usually sticks out like a sore thumb if you know how to look for indicators.


    Forgive my ignorance but what does NPE mean? I obviously don't have experience with it as I don't know what it means.
     
    I usually find a barstool that is well exposed to the room . I often wear daisy dukes and want people to enjoy the view of my ample twigs n berries .
     
    • Haha
    Reactions: Threadcutter308
    For those of you with no NPE experience you really need to spend some time studying this guy, the skills and insights Ed offers can definitely help you not only watch your back but more importantly blend in better. That guy that has to have his back to a wall in any public place usually sticks out like a sore thumb if you know how to look for indicators.

    Shawn Ryan just did a interview with Ed, super interesting and insightful. It is on the youtube.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: TACC and Dirty D

    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.
    Just cause your paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t trying to kill ya…
    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.
     
    Forgive my ignorance but what does NPE mean? I obviously don't have experience with it as I don't know what it means.
    NPE is an acronym for Non Permissive Environment, what I did and where I was is child’s play compared to Ed’s time as a plain clothes Federale in northern Mexico investigating the cartels. Ed is so good the more than a few SpeOps units send people to train with him. Ed teaches a mindset that the best fight is the one that you avoid or choose on your own time and terms.
     
    I always request a booth. Never take a table, unless I absolutely have to. I'm lucky, my wifey understands situational awareness, and watches my back, whether, at a booth, or table. I always scan wherever I/we are at. BUT, situations do arise un-expectantly. Like a door, hallway, parking lot, etc., you did not catch on the way in. Mac
     
    From the expert. Word.

    Gecko45 writes:

    hello friends,

    Last year I made the decision to trust my life on the street to Second Chance body armor. I got the level IIa because it stops the most rounds. plus I got the Trauma Plate for the front.

    What scares me is that, although I can fit an extra trauma plate in the front, I cannot fit a second one in back. As of late I have taken to duct-taping a second trauma plate to the area of my back where the heart and vital organs are located. Then I put my vest on.

    Here is the questions. The ducttape solution, although tactically sound, is hot and painful to remove. I would like to go to the single-plate solution in back. What I am worried about is repeated hits to that area with .308 ammunition. I have a high-risk security job and I fear that I would be the target for repeated long-distance shots to my back.

    Are any of you aware of a thicker plate that could stop, say, .338 Lapua or something like that? Is there a better way to do the second plate?

    BTW, I am, of course, usually carrying a pair of ceramic plates in my briefcase so that I can shield my head. My SO (we work as a team when necessary) has a similar accessory containing a breakdown NEF single-shot 300 WinMag with an 18″ bbl. The plan is that I shield us with my body and “catch the rounds” while she assembles the NEF. I lay down covering fire with my 23 (Bar-Sto .357 Sig barrel) and she makes the long shots. I will then throw smoke grenades to obscure the area while continuing to lay covering fire. The problem, of course, is when I have to turn my back to run, and then the problem crops up.

    Thanks!

     

    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.

    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.
    As a buddy of mine often says. Paranoia is nothing more than heightened situational awareness. :)
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Milf Dots and TACC

    Paranoid Personality Disorder​

    The Paranoid Personality Disorder* is characterized by a pervasive distrust and suspiciousness of other people.

    • People with this disorder assume that others are out to harm them, take advantage of them, or humiliate them in some way.
    • They put a lot of effort into protecting themselves and keeping their distance from others.
    • They are known to preemptively attack others whom they feel threatened by.
    • They tend to hold grudges, are litigious, and display pathological jealously.
    • Distorted thinking is evident. Their perception of the environment includes reading malevolent intentions into genuinely harmless, innocuous comments or behavior, and dwelling on past slights.
      • For these reasons, they do not confide in others and do not allow themselves to develop close relationships.
    • Their emotional life tends to be dominated by distrust and hostility.

    SO how does this labeling of Democrats help us??
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Longshot231