F T/R Competition .223 ammo suggestions

[UIUCPPQ]

Hey all, I shot in my first F class competition recently and had a great time but I didn't plan ahead and didn't have ammo that was even close to match grade. Right now I am limited to factory ammo so I'm wondering what you may have had success with?

I'm only shooting to 300 yards, if that makes a difference.

I'm considering trying some Hornady match rounds or Black Hills and I'll have to get a range of weights to find out what my rifle likes, but I'd appreciate tips in the right direction.

edit: 1 in 8 twist

Thanks

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

This could be a good compromise between cost and capability. The 55 should work OK, the 75 may work better, especially if the winds are significant. Training loads. When I buy factory ammo, a lot of it is Hornady.

There's also this, which has reloadable brass. It's not Fed Gold Medal, but it's also not as costly. It works pretty well in my Stag Super Varminter AR, and the brass reloads fine for me.

Greg

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

To be competitive at F-class you need something better than match-grade ammo, you need world-class grade stuff, tuned to your rifle.

For 300 yards in a .223, the only valid choice is 80gr bullets, Bergers, JLK, and in a pinch, Sierra or Nosler. However, you are not going to find any 80gr factory loaded. You might want to look for 75gr or 69gr reman ammo from Black-hills.com. I never considered the 77gr SMK to be an accurate bullet, not like what I could get from a 69gr, The 75gr that BHA uses is from Nosler, I believe, and it works pretty well.

 

[HighRez]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

I haven't shot my first match yet, but for what it's worth, here's my experience the past Saturday with a .223. I was shooting the 69 gr. Federal GMM in my Rock River AR SPR with 18" varmint barrel. At 500 yards the gun held 1 MOA accuracy consistently. Admittedly winds were of little consequence. Again, for what it's worth. Good luck.

 

[UIUCPPQ]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Denys</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To be competitive at F-class you need something better than match-grade ammo, you need world-class grade stuff, tuned to your rifle.
</div></div>

Unfortunately I am economically unable to be truly competitive at F-class at this moment, I just want to enjoy the atmosphere and even if I don't win it's a great opportunity to make friends in the community and get good experience.

I'll look up the ammo suggested above, thanks all

 

[You-Two]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Have you bought anything from the CMP before? Or can you qualify too? They are selling 200rd cases of Hornady Match 75gr BTHP ammo for $128.95 delivered. Which is considerably cheaper than I have seen elsewhere online, and just a little more than the Privi. Shoots well in both my Bushmaster 1-8 and WOA 1-7 service rifle uppers.

You will want a 68/69gr at the minimum for 300.

Good luck!

 

[lal357]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

my son shoots my savage 223 1-8t in 300 yd f class whille i prefer 75gr.amax bullets the old mcqowen barrel i had on it would only shoot 69gr heads which it did nicely i have shot it with 53gr match bullets and it did shoot good but the wind was something to be played with i had to wait for it to die down then shoot fast unitl it picked up. for 300yd shooting first choice is 75-80 gr bullets (new barrel shoots them well while doing barrel break in) then 69gr. (son has shot these with a 18mph wind and still shot in the high 180's low 190's out of 200) anythin lower and you have to watch the wind. it can be done just take more practice reading the wind and listening to your spotter.

 

[UIUCPPQ]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: You-Two</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Have you bought anything from the CMP before? Or can you qualify too? They are selling 200rd cases of Hornady Match 75gr BTHP ammo for $128.95 delivered. Which is considerably cheaper than I have seen elsewhere online, and just a little more than the Privi. Shoots well in both my Bushmaster 1-8 and WOA 1-7 service rifle uppers.

You will want a 68/69gr at the minimum for 300.

Good luck! </div></div>

I think I qualify for CMP assuming one of the rifle associations I belong to or programs are supported, although I'm not sure how you find that out.

I'll definitely get that Hornady ammo if possible, that's exactly the stuff I was aiming to get and this is much more cost efficient.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think I qualify for CMP assuming one of the rifle associations I belong to or programs are supported, although I'm not sure how you find that out.</div></div>

Here is a list of CMP clubs by state:

http://www.odcmp.com/Clubs/searchclubs.htm

 

[RStewart]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Denys</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To be competitive at F-class you need something better than match-grade ammo, you need world-class grade stuff, tuned to your rifle.

For 300 yards in a .223, the only valid choice is 80gr bullets, Bergers, JLK, and in a pinch, Sierra or Nosler. However, you are not going to find any 80gr factory loaded. You might want to look for 75gr or 69gr reman ammo from Black-hills.com. I never considered the 77gr SMK to be an accurate bullet, not like what I could get from a 69gr, The 75gr that BHA uses is from Nosler, I believe, and it works pretty well. </div></div>



In a pinch you can use Sierra? Like they're inferior? 80 SMK's do just fine at 600 yards. Just ask some I the folks I shoot with.
Rick

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Yeah, sometimes, I had to slum it and use Sierras; they're ok out of the box at 300.

I just never wanted to get into meplat trimming and pointing bullets so I use other brands at the longer distances.

 

[RStewart]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Denys</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yeah, sometimes, I had to slum it and use Sierras; they're ok out of the box at 300.

I just never wanted to get into meplat trimming and pointing bullets so I use other brands at the longer distances. </div></div>

You appear to be one of those folks that puts down others unless they use what you use. Not a very nice thing to do when a new shooter is asking for advice. But anyone can say want they want behind a keyboard. How about posting your NRA number so we can look up your classification. If its higher than mine and you compete with a .223, I'll concede your point.

Sierrras neither require pointing or meplat trimming to be accurate and I have shot several thousand.

 

[kraigWY]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

I don't shoot much F-Class but I do shoot 223s in High Power.

It dosen't take much of a bullet at 200 & 300, but at 600 & 1000 I use 80 SMKs, they work pretty good in my White Oak.

Must not be too bad, most HP shooters I know use the 80 SMKs.

 

[scotharr]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RStewart</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Denys</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yeah, sometimes, I had to slum it and use Sierras; they're ok out of the box at 300.

I just never wanted to get into meplat trimming and pointing bullets so I use other brands at the longer distances. </div></div>

You appear to be one of those folks that puts down others unless they use what you use. Not a very nice thing to do when a new shooter is asking for advice. But anyone can say want they want behind a keyboard. How about posting your NRA number so we can look up your classification. If its higher than mine and you compete with a .223, I'll concede your point.

Sierrras neither require pointing or meplat trimming to be accurate and I have shot several thousand. </div></div>
My thoughts exactly.

I've had really good luck with Hornady 75-Amax's. But, at 300 yards, there are a variety of bullets that should work really well because it is not far enough to demand a super High BC bullet. Hornady 68,75 HPBT, any of the Amax's, any Sierra bullet weight 69 gr or more...any of those would be competitive at 300 yards. In fact, you could use a flat base bullet at that distance and you'd be surprised how accurate they are.

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Wow, a penis-measuring contest! How cool is that?

I will not post my NRA number here on anywhere as that would be a stupid thing to do and quite unnecessary. There are people here with whom I shoot and compete and who can verify that I use an AR-15 with a 26 inch barrel in .223 to compete in F-T/R and that I have reached HM classification at mid-range with that combo. At long range, the highest I have achieved with it was Sharpshooter but could not break out of that one. This was what prompted me to switch to a bolt rifle in .308 with a 32 inch barrel and I was able to reach Expert soon after the change. I am crowding the Master class at times since then, but have not yet been able to put together the number of matches to achieve that.

I disagree with you about the Sierras not needing trimming and pointing, especially at the longer distances. I use a different brand of bullet and for the added cost, the bullet all have the same clean meplat which does not require trimming or pointing.

BTW, the need for meplat cleanup is really only felt at long distance where the small variations in BC values, bullet to bullet, show up as an increased vertical dispersion, without getting into varying wind deflection. So, Scooter-pie, while this is not as critical with the large highpower targets, it does come into play when using the F-class targets, which happen to be what we shoot in this "F-Class - F /TR Competition" forum.

There are plenty of people who trim and point or only point meplats, even on other brands, but I have not gotten to that point. I know some of the very best shooters do that and that's probably at least a small part of the reason they are such top shooters.

 

[SNAFU_]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

I can vouche for Deny's about his AR....

I shoot the Berger 80g bullets to 1k in my bolt gun. I do point them with the Whidden die, but I do not trim. I am still struggling in the Expert class at 1k, but will continue with my setup till the bbl is shot out.

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Hey, aren't you supposed to be at the match this morning? I wanted to go but I can't; swim season and father's day. Bummer.

 

[SNAFU_]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Father's Day pampering trumps pit duty in the hot Texas sun....every time

especially for just a 300yd match

 

[RStewart]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

So, what you're saying is you have no real experience shooting Sierras at longer ranges and had to go to a .308 to be competitive. I shoot a .223 at 600 with current classification of Expert. 'Nuff said. I shoot bolt and AR at that range.
Have a good Father's Day!

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

Of course I have used the Sierras at longer ranges, but I moved on from there and have been using another brand for the exact reasons listed above.

When I came to the painful realization that my 26inch AR-15 in .223 was not going to get me further than Sharpshooter, I thought long and hard about building what I was already calling my "long range upper." It was going to be a 28 or 30 inch barrel with the gas system disconnected and a side bolt handle. I talked to a few builders and they all pretty much said that I had already reached the top end of performance for an AR-15. So I put that project to the side and instead rebarreled an old Ruger rifle I had lying around and turned it into my .308 F-T/R rifle.

I still use the AR for 300-600 yards, but for LR, it's the .308.

And a good father's day to you as well.

 

[Denys]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SNAFUBAR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Father's Day pampering trumps pit duty in the hot Texas sun....every time

especially for just a 300yd match </div></div>

I was in the sun all day yesterday at the swim meet watching my girls. More of the same this afternoon, but it's indoors this time.

 

[msflyer]

Re: .223 ammo suggestions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: UIUCPPQ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey all, I shot in my first F class competition recently and had a great time but I didn't plan ahead and didn't have ammo that was even close to match grade. Right now I am limited to factory ammo so I'm wondering what you may have had success with?

I'm only shooting to 300 yards, if that makes a difference.

I'm considering trying some Hornady match rounds or Black Hills and I'll have to get a range of weights to find out what my rifle likes, but I'd appreciate tips in the right direction.

edit: 1 in 8 twist

Thanks </div></div>

I shoot an AR Krieger 24" 1/7.7 twist set up as a match gun. For economy I use Black Hills remans 77 grain sierra and for precision move up to factory new Black Hills 77. My rifle holds 1/2 or better moa out to 600 yards. If you sort the remans by year and type of brass, they shoots more consistent but still not as well as the new stuff. To really save you can use Hornady steel match to practice fundamentals. It holds about 3/4 to 1 moa out to 300 yards with my gun. Yes; shooting for the F-class win you can do a little better with hand loads, but at 600 and closer it's hard to beat Black Hills red box. At 100 yards with BH red box if my groups exceed 1/2" (1/4" on a real good day) it's me having a bad day, not the ammo.