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Rifle Scopes Poll - Scopes you have used and scopes you have broken.

Poll - Scopes you have used and scopes you have broken.

  • I own Bushnell Tactical and have never had a problem.

    Votes: 83 23.6%
  • I own Bushnell Tactical and have had issues.

    Votes: 30 8.5%
  • I own Leupold and have never had a problem.

    Votes: 131 37.3%
  • I own Leupold and have had issues.

    Votes: 63 17.9%
  • I own Nightforce and have never had a problem.

    Votes: 137 39.0%
  • I own Nightforce and have had issues.

    Votes: 18 5.1%
  • I own Schmidt and Bender and have never had a problem.

    Votes: 58 16.5%
  • I own Schmidt and Bender and have had issues.

    Votes: 22 6.3%
  • I own Vortex and have never had a problem.

    Votes: 99 28.2%
  • I own Vortex and have had issues.

    Votes: 48 13.7%

  • Total voters
    351

XOR

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Oct 2, 2009
309
69
52
Oregon
Please read before answering the poll:

Purpose

To get an idea what scopes people own and whether they've been reliable.

Please choose your answer based on your most used scope brand. You can select whether you've used the scope without problems, or you use the scope and have had problems.

What should I answer?

Answer with the brand of scope you most commonly use on your precision rifle and whether it has been reliable or if you've had a mechanical issue that made it not work. This may not be the scope you have mounted on your deer rifle, but it may be if that's your primary rifle. For instance, I own a Leupold hunting scope that is very reliable on a hunting rifle. But, I'm not going to answer that I'm a Leupold user, because on my precision rifle I run something else. That something else is what I'd answer.

I do own a scope and I've had a problem. What then?

If you own a scope, and you've had a problem with it, you can optionally post something about it that others may find useful. For instance:

What the scope was.
How long you owned it/when you bought it.
What broke on it.
Other details like rifle caliber, number of rounds, etc.

This poll isn't scientific.

Yep. It is polling for people that answer internet polls on shooting forums. But at the same time maybe it will be useful because the poll participants here tend to run their gear and will likely find out if it holds up. Scopes are complicated mechanical devices and they do break. What I'm trying to determine is a general feel for the brand of scopes people own vs. the number that had a problem.

For instance, if someone says that they own Acme Scope and have never had a problem that's fine. But if Acme Scope only represents 0.01% of the scopes people are using the failure rate being low doesn't mean much because people don't use them anyway. However if someone owns a major brand of scope, and many people are reporting problems, then perhaps it's a red flag.

My scope isn't listed!

The polling system only supports 10 options at a time. So that means only five makers. I selected the biggest names for mid-range to high-end. Maybe another poll will be done with other makers.

What about low-end scopes, hunting scopes, non-tactical scopes, etc.?

Bushnell, Leupold and other lower-end scope and hunting scope brands - We know that many companies make low-end stuff that we have all probably used at one time. We also know that these scopes may not be the best, but are what they are at a low price point. This poll is only for their higher end products (Elite Tactical, Mark 4, etc.), not their low end scopes.
 
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Wow, I don't own any of those scopes. My oldest scopes are a Redfield 4X wideview on a 30.06. Not a lot of round through that on the last 30 years.

My next oldest was a Weaver 4X that was on several 30.06's over the years and broke a horizontal cross hair on the top of a 10/22 about 3 years ago. Evidently .22's are hard on scopes.

My best scope is an old Busnell 4X12 (again, over 30 years old) with thousands of round on it between my M1A and M700 Rem. Still the best scope I've ever had on a rifle. Brightness is just amazing.

No other broken scopes among several Weavers (2.5, 4 and 10X).
 
4 S&Bs no problems.
2 NF no problems, sold them to fund a S&B
2 leupold no problems, MOA knobs, mil reticle sold these
1 Vortex Razor HD 5-25, the eye relief for positional was terrible. I understand they have fix this problem. Might get another when I need a new scope.
 
I own a S&B, two Nightforce (one NXS, one BR), and two Vortexes (Vortices?) PSTs.

No issues with the NFs, my S&B, or one of my PSTs. However I did have an issue with one of the PSTs (4-16x50 FFP) where the reticle would rotate 1-2 degrees when you twisted the magnification knob. I emailed Vortex about it and I had it back in my hands about a week after I dropped it off at the post office. Excellent turn around time. Also since then I have put a few hundred rounds (if not a thousand) with no issues.

I did have a question about my S&B shortly after it arrived and PMed Jerry R on here. He was also extremely knowledgeable and helpful in getting it sorted out. It was a noob mistake and everything has been working perfectly for over a year now.
 
It would be nice to know what the "problems" were with some of these.
+1

Also, how many of each scope type were owned vs. how many had problems. For example, I have three of one type, but my vote could give the impression of only being one. None have had problems and I'm willing to bet that the number of them with problems is far outweighed by those without, but that's not really reflected in the numbers above. Still an interesting poll, though.
 
Admittedly this poll has severe limitations due to what the forum can do. It would be better if the person could indicate what brand they owned and what kind of problem it was (mechanical, usability, etc.). Also it may be better to ask if they ever had to send their scope in for service, turnaround times, etc.

Looking at the numbers I can't believe Leupold is as bad as it is being shown for instance. It would be hard for a company to stay in business with a near 40% defect rate. Yet, maybe it's reporting accurately what the forum members have experienced, but this may not reflect the market in general. Doing a good poll is always a tricky thing, and what the forum allows has limitations so we should keep that in mind as well.
 
+1

Also, how many of each scope type were owned vs. how many had problems. For example, I have three of one type, but my vote could give the impression of only being one. None have had problems and I'm willing to bet that the number of them with problems is far outweighed by those without, but that's not really reflected in the numbers above. Still an interesting poll, though.

Wouldn't taking the poll once for every scope you have on a precision rifle give us that? I am new to long range shooting and I am very surprised at Leupold's ratio of scope issues!
 
Own 15 S&B of several different varieties

2006 - Special Build Klein Model 4-16x parallax was not working returned to be fixed

2010 4-16x on a Predator Custom 300WM went off the rails like the 5-25x below, replaced erector, and changed from Mil / MOA to Mil - Mil

2012 New MTC Locking Turret 5-25x, Turret was grabbing and not spinning free
2012 Same order as the 5-25x, this one a 3-20x MTC Locking turret, turret was not captured came off and parallax was off
2012 Old S&B 5-25x, Using it at Gunsite XLR Class, last day, 1000m+ shot, .2 right dialed in shot went .7 so I dialed in .7 then the shot went 1.5 left, finally held 1.5 and shot went into the woods to the left.

I have had other scopes go down, as well as been witness to many break during classes and competitions, but that is my S&B Adventure so far. The last 3 were really the most telling as well as seeing the reports of the issues with the locking turrets happen more and more.

So far Nightforce has been my only personally owned brand that has withstood the test of time. (4+ years of use without incident) But that is not to say I don't own everything from Super Snipers to Leupolds to Hensoldts etc. I have at least 1 of the most popular
 
You need to add:

U.S. Optics
Burris
IOR
Meopta
and
Zeiss

I know this isn't a scientific survey but this is an apples to kumquat comparison. Schmitt & Bender is so far ahead of Bushnell it isn't even a comparison. Yet, I didn't like them. I tried one scope. Many here DO like them.

Also, what issues? Most of my issues were a lack of something rather than breakage. But, it was still an issue that led to me selling the scope.
 
I had a Bushnell 3-15x50 Tactical. Every range trip I had to allow for more wind and elevation for similar conditions and ranges. When my windage was maxed out one day , I sent it back to Bushnell. They fixed it ( re-centered ) the cross-hairs and sent it back. Same problem when re-mounted and multiple range trips later.

I bought a Leupold mk4. Returns to zero every time. Wind and elevation are the same (per/conditions) every time. I now also own a Leupold LR w/target turrets. One day I will bite the bullet and get a NF.
 
Own 15 S&B of several different varieties

2006 - Special Build Klein Model 4-16x parallax was not working returned to be fixed

2010 4-16x on a Predator Custom 300WM went off the rails like the 5-25x below, replaced erector, and changed from Mil / MOA to Mil - Mil

2012 New MTC Locking Turret 5-25x, Turret was grabbing and not spinning free
2012 Same order as the 5-25x, this one a 3-20x MTC Locking turret, turret was not captured came off and parallax was off
2012 Old S&B 5-25x, Using it at Gunsite XLR Class, last day, 1000m+ shot, .2 right dialed in shot went .7 so I dialed in .7 then the shot went 1.5 left, finally held 1.5 and shot went into the woods to the left.

I have had other scopes go down, as well as been witness to many break during classes and competitions, but that is my S&B Adventure so far. The last 3 were really the most telling as well as seeing the reports of the issues with the locking turrets happen more and more.

So far Nightforce has been my only personally owned brand that has withstood the test of time. (4+ years of use without incident) But that is not to say I don't own everything from Super Snipers to Leupolds to Hensoldts etc. I have at least 1 of the most popular

Plenty (3) early SBs with no issues.
2009 4-16x worked fine, then wouldn't track. It was fixed properly and no more issues. Still have it.
2012 5-25x MTC, MSR reticle wasn't centered in the eyebox and shadow resulted at high power. Returned as new in box.
2013 5-52x MTC, MSR reticle had horrible reticle jump. Returned as new in box.

Gave up on trying to get a new SB 5-25x that works and bought another Bushnell.

NOTE: I've never had an issue with any of my four NFs.

..... And USO - Don't get me started.
 
Ok what I'm seeing so far with 130 votes:

Bushnell
Total: 42
Reported Issues: 10
Percent with Issues: 23.8%


Leupold
Total: 68
Reported Issues: 25
Percent with Issues: 36.7%


Nightforce
Total: 62
Reported Issues: 4
Percent with Issues: 6.5%


Schmidt and Bender
Total: 36
Reported Issues: 10
Percent with Issues: 27.7%


Vortex
Total: 59
Reported Issues: 18
Percent with Issues: 30.5%


Some of these numbers are higher than I thought they'd be. I have a hard time believing that Leupold is shipping scopes with almost 40% failure rates for instance! Yet the reputation of NF as being very reliable is holding up. Maybe Sniper's Hide people are running their gear much harder than average users? Tactical matches and similar training is very hard on equipment. Then there is military use which is hardest of all.
 
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I have two Vortex for a total of 3 problems requiring work. Wish there was a way to tally up multiple issues with one brand and number of scopes of each. I'm with Lowlight, Nightforce is the only scope brand that had yet to fail me.
 
I have a Bushnell elite Tact 2.5-16x42. The problem.....Tried to unscrew the sunshade and the objective housing started to unscrew (not good) went to a BR shoot and the scope wouldnt hold zero. Ended up having to hold 2 mil-dots over at 100 yards to finish the competition(which I did average in). Bushnell said the scope was fine, but obviously it wasnt. I have a replacement coming (that will be for sale soon), after many hours and emails during the last 3 months. Poor customer service on Bushnells part, but what should I expect from a family of companies that have their hand in a little bit of everything. I replaced it with a NF NXS and am not looking back.
 
I guess I'm one of the few who have had problems with NightForce.

Bought a 5.5-22 NXS and it had what appeared to be a yellowish haze (almost like I was looking through a very sheer curtain) at higher magnification but was clear at lower magnifications. Told NF customer service about the problem and they told me to send it in. I did, but they told me they could not find anything wrong with the scope and could not see the haze to which I was referring. I was very unsatisfied with this since I found the problem to be very obvious and so did several other shooters I had look through it. I did a side by side comparison with my Zeiss Conquest 6.5-20 and the difference was night and day, no "haze" what so ever. I asked NF to exchange the scope but they refused since it was "mechanically sound".

Dispite my first experience with NF being less than stellar, I bought another one based on their strong reputation. This time an 8x32x56 benchrest model. Thankfully, the glass on this one is MUCH better. No issues with haze. However, when I first got it, the paralax objective was very tight and difficult to turn (benchrest models are front paralax). Now, the objective has become very easy to turn, but the focus doesn't always work. I have to keep turning it left and right through the full range of motion before it seems to grab and come into focus. I haven't returned it yet, but I plan to soon.

So, I'm 0 for 2 with NightForce. I was considering trying one more for my TRG-22, but decided to bite the bullet and spend a little more for a Steiner. So far, I have been very happy with that decision. Doubtful there will be any more NightForce scopes in my future.
 
Own 5 N/F, 4-NXS, 1 B/R. On 2 of the N/F, Elevation marks did not line up correctly after several years of use. N/F fixed with no issues. 1 S&B-No issues, 1 Bushnell XRS-too new to make determination. 3 Leupold Target Scopes-No Issues, 1 tactical Scope-No issues.
 
Price point(s) are a huge limitation,this poll compares S&Bs (not cheap) with the least $$$ bushy, a better market comparison would be between price points, for example: $1000-$1500, $1501-$2000 etc. What kind of problems? If the problem was "not enough magnification" or "wasn't FFP" is quite different from "wouldn't track" or "fogged-up" etc.. As XOR points out, it is hard to believe that Leupold has a 40% "problem" rate, and has stayed in business 50 years.
 
You need to add:

U.S. Optics
Burris
IOR
Meopta
and
Zeiss

This is a very interesting thread so far. Seems like a valuable concept and I am surprised how quick significant amounts of data have been generated. I think you have hit on something very valuable and that perhaps a database of some kind should be constructed as we clearly have enough raw data to make that worthwhile.

I think what we are really angling at is the mean time between failure of a scope. If a data collection process is made where each user has a section in their profile to enter each scope they have owned, how many times it has needed repair, and how many shooting outings they would guess that they have had it on, the database, (which would not allow you to find out individual information, only global statistics) would be a valuable resource for understanding the relative reliability of different models and brands.

Even in just this simple format this survey already has enough data do be quite interesting.
 
I have the Vortex Viper PST 4-16 and sent it in to repair a battery drain issue. I also havea Vortex Diamondback 4-12 and also sent it into have debris removed from the lenses in the eyepiece. Top notch warranty and super fast turnaround time.
 
Some in-house statistics, Military scopes only but sgill quite a few brands included.. NF NXS ended up to be clear winner.
1.3 or 1.6% failure rate, cant remember. Or actually German Steiner Military -series was even better but comparsion is not fair as Steiner has been available less than a year.
 
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Re: price point and vendors

The price point difference I actually selected on purpose. I wanted to see if the "good glass" people paid for resulted in lower failure rates of the mechanics vs. lower priced alternatives. The vendors picked were simply what I felt were most popular based on what I see people posting here. If a moderator can make a poll with 40 choices, I have 20 common scope vendors we can insert and ask the question again.

I wanted to find out relative number of users of a scope brand vs. number that had a problem. This is the only way to really find out some kind of failure rate measure. Again I'm not sure of some of the numbers we are seeing, but it clearly indicates a trend in these scope brands.

Re: Scope issues

I was hoping people would only answer if the scope mechanically failed. Hopefully people answering will only say they had an issue if they actually had a problem and not because they didn't like the focus ring, turret clicks, etc.

Re: Steiner, Kahles, etc.

I would like to find out more information about them, but market penetration for their tactical scopes is still limited compared to the others. I think Steiner is coming in at an aggressive price point to establish themselves. We'll have to see how they do.

Re: Better poll

Again there are better ways to collect the data with online survey systems, but then you start to get too much time being taken to answer and that will lose people. I agree that there is other data we could use. For instance, when was the scope bought, number of rounds fired, etc. But again I'm thinking many people may not bother to answer such level of detail.
 
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I have a 3-21 gdmr and a Vortex PST, and a March, each for less than a year. No Problems so far. The scope I use the most, like the most, works best for all around shooting, hunting is an IOR 3-18x42. Had it around 4 years and the only problem is it fogged once. Sent it back for repair and they said the fogging was gone! Wasn't aware it could evaporate inside the scope. Looked clear upon return but hasn't been mounted again yet.
 
I have had issues with my NF scopes.
The first one was not sealed against water. It fogged up then frosted over
The second one had elevation issues. It would not go up all the way. That is how I found out they do not guarantee the full amount of travel.
A third one I had was sent in but I do not remember why any more.
NF customer support was very good to work with. Granted they were a little slow but still good to work with. I guess three out of 5 is not good odds.

Leupold I had one where the reticle started jumping around when it was hot. They also fixed my scope and were fast.
 
I've had a few problems with NF scopes. My first was a fixed 15x that had one of the lenses shift. I gave them additional money and traded up to a 4 x 16 which did the same thing. In the mean time I had purchased a second 4 x 16 that had a problem with one of the knobs not working. I was offered to trade both straight across for a 5 x 22 and as soon as I got it in I sold it. This was a long time ago( late 80's/early 90's) and I have since been told that there scopes are very good. Their customer service people were good each time and handeled things very quickly.
 
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I had issues with a new Nightforce NXS. The windage turret did not "click" on a small section of the turret knob travel.

The bronze wheel or whatever it is, which is inside the turret was all dented from the factory...

It was pretty bad. I can't imagine how it got pase quality control.
 
I used to run Redfield's on my hunting rifles, but when they went out of business years ago I switched to Leupold Vari X III in varies power levels. Usually 3-9 or 2-10x, in the area. One of the 2-10s on my 338 Win Mag constantly lost it's ability to maintain accurate tracking. It was mailed back to Leupold 3 times correcting the problem. On the 3rd attempt at fixing it, it broke once again and I have since trashed all Leupolds and gone to Vortex for hunting rifles. No problems with any of the Vortex series I have and nothing but good comments on them. Equal to or better glass, true tracking, and priced noticeably lower than the Leupolds offering a better deal.

Precision rifles sport USO or SWFA, no problems on any of them.
 
I had a Leupold 6.5-20x50mm m1 illum that the internals for the illuminated reticle came apart. a small piece of metal popped out when I was replacing the battery, and it has not worked since. If you dont mind the illum, the scope still worked perfectly.
 
NF F1 3.5-15 no issues at all
NF 2.5-10 no issues at all
Leupold Mark 4 3.5-10 M2 no issues (just could not easily pick up the white elevation/windage lines in sunlight on the FDE turret)
Leupold Mark 4 3.5-10 M3 no issues
Leupold Mark 4 4.5-15 had very imprecise/gummy turret clicks
Vortex Crossfire PST 6-24x50 (on my 22LR) had a recent issue where I went to adjust the elevation and it hit a very gummy hard spot. After that the elevation adjustment was way off and would not track properly.
Hensoldt/Zeiss 'Zielsechs' fixed 6x (1912 manufacturer date) still going strong and the clearest optic I have.
 
Leupold Mark 4 10x40 M3 knobs- Scope worked, knobs were mushy.

Nightforce 5-22x56 NPR-1 "low speed" knobs, clicks were great, glass was great. Bell was huge.

Nightforce 4-22x56 MLR Scope had some major use on it. Still, worked perfect.

Nightforce F1 3-15x50 MD2. Great glass, high speed turrets, fast reticle. Worked great.

Premier 5-25x56 Gen 2XR 15 mil turrets. MTC Wow, amazing glass, the most solid click click clank turrets ever. I really miss this one.

Bushnell HDMR/G2DMR 3.5-21x50. Nice turrets, great feel, SOLID scope. Wish it had zero stop, and 10 mils per turn. Did get some flakes in the glass, but after shooting it they fell right off. I thought I was having issues with it before, but they turned out to be issues w/ my stock.

Bushnell ERS w/ G2 reticle. It's arriving today, so I'll have to let you know. It takes care of the features I wish I had in the G2DMR.
 
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Bushnell tactical elite 6-24x50 FFP g2dmr. Chased a scope problem thru 300 rounds of ammo thinking it was 1) hot barrel; 2) bedding; 3) scope mount; and lastly, the scope. Excellent customer service, they jumped immediately to the scope being the problem.

Problem was evidenced by the gun shooting two and sometimes three tight groups. Several times the tagret would have three .3" groups at 100yds. One time I shot a perfect triangle with each two shot group being on the points in sequential order in that it shot first one point, then the next, finally making a complete round. The next round covered the same holes. The gun is a .300 win mag without a muzzle brake. The scope was purchased as new but had been returned to amazon, refurbed by Bushnell. Amazon took it back initially wanting 20% restock but I easily talked them out of it. New scope fixed our problem.

Only thing that could have contributed to the failure was that the front screw of the one-piece mount was loose as it bedded against the barrel. Pulling the mount off, I noticed thread marks on the front of the mount holes meaning that the scope stayed inertialy in place as the gun kicked back. The sudden jolt of the scope then catching up might have contributed to the failure.

Beautiful scope, clear glass, smooth variable power, nice clicks, etc. so I bought another.
 
Ok so far then for self-reported problem rates (rounded to nearest whole number):

Bushnell
Total: 84
Reported Issues: 21
Percent with Issues: 25%


Leupold
Total: 148
Reported Issues: 49
Percent with Issues: 33%


Nightforce
Total: 121
Reported Issues: 13
Percent with Issues: 11%


Schmidt and Bender
Total: 62
Reported Issues: 17
Percent with Issues: 27%


Vortex
Total: 112
Reported Issues: 39
Percent with Issues: 35%

Well I know this isn't scientific, but I can't believe we're seeing scope failures in the 1/3rd range for some of these brands. But maybe so. In any event even if not a total mechanical failure in the scope the data is still interesting. NightForce clearly is running away with this with a reported problem rate that is 1/3rd that of the other brands here. So even if not scientific, I still think it's somewhat telling. I had one vendor report that their RMA rates for NightForce was around 1/2 that of other brands. So what we're seeing here matches up at least with that other data point.

I'm going to have to call this for NightForce as most reliable scope in this (admittedly unscientific) poll. There is enough of a sample size there that I think the data is forming a pretty good trend.
 
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The polling system is limited. If we want to do this right we'd have to use a proper survey system. But maybe enough people would do it to make it worth trying. I tried to pick scopes that I thought had most market penetration to get the most responses. So a mix of mid-range to higher end S&B. In particular I thought it would be interesting to see how mid-range scopes like Bushnell would fare against big name brands like S&B. And it seems they do at least as well in this survey...
 
I would like to see this keep going and watch how the numbers develop over time. Also would like to see how many Millet scopes have failure. There is a whole site/group that I know of that are complete Millet diehards and think they are the best scope around...
 
I'm probably going to put together a proper survey offsite. Here are the brands I will include. Who did I forget?

Bausch and Lomb
Burris
Bushnell Tactical
Hensholdt
IOR
Kahles
Leica
Leupold
March
Millet
Nightforce
Nikon
Premier
Schmidt and Bender
Steiner
Swarovski
SWFA
Trijicon
USO
Vortex
Zeiss

Obviously there are very low-end brands I could put in. But I'm really looking for scopes that typical long ranger/tactical shooters would be using.
 
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Nikon?

What about adding time owned and time to failure?

Good points. I put in Nikon. I'll think about the format of this.

I was also considering asking if people owning the gear were sponsored as well. We have the tactical competition gear list on the forum, but without knowing who was sponsored and given the gear vs. went out and bought it the results get skewed.

Right now I'm thinking:

1) List of all the scope brands and people can select if they ever had a failure or not.

If they had a failure:

1) How long did you own the scope before it failed?
2) What caliber rifle were you shooting with the failed optic?

Misc:

1) Were you sponsored by any of these companies to shoot their scopes?

Then there is trying to weed out failure from normal shooting, or did they launch it off their balcony onto the concrete driveway below, etc.

But the problem is if too many questions are asked you'll get fewer responses. So I need to think on this for a bit. If anyone has other questions that would be useful to know throw them out here.